Does Serena have a better career than Federer?

[aman92]

Now before someone starts making it about men's vs women's tennis... I am only talking about achievements in their respective tours. Simply put, if we take all their career achievements currently, has Serena Williams had a better career in Women's tennis than Federer has had in Men's tennis?

 

[helterskelter]

Three extra Slam titles is big. I voted for that above things like Federer's greater overall titles tally, which I regard as less big. Serena also did end up overhauling Federer for time at #1, but that's more or less a toss up (319 weeks to 310, five year-ends each at #1).

 

[topher]

If men and women's tennis really are different sports, then this comparison is dumb. I've never liked comparing across sports, Jordan vs Gretzky vs. Federer vs. Ali vs. Babe Ruth vs. Bobby Fischer, they played different sports - so comparing them is impossible and a waste of time imo. Usually just brought up by people who want to beat their chest over their favorite player.

Of course, if you acknowledge that men and women's tennis are the same sport with gender restrictions on one, then the comparison is easy - Roger played in the higher/unrestricted league/division.

 

[Tostao80]

Has Serena been owned in tge Slams by any of her rivals? Shes the best of her era. Can Fed claim the same?

 

[Username_]

Serena has better achievements as she has been able to get the SJW army on her side every single time she has an outburst.

Kyrgios can't even do that

 

[ChaelAZ]

Fed is more respected and genuinely more of a champions character. Nubmers wise they are about the same I suppose.

 

[TennisLBC]

Both Serena and Federer have amazing careers. Federer does have tougher competition and is playing with two other ATGs that are nipping at his heels; Serena is only competing with history.

 

[Rosstour]

No

She ****ed around so much, dropping off the tour and looking totally disinterested at times over the years. She could be on 30+ Slams now if she had taken the game seriously instead of partying with LaLa Anthony, crashing weddings, and getting cosmetic surgery.

Only when Patrick picked her up off the floor and creepily assumed a Daddy/lover/guru role was she able to get back on the horse.

Fed took an injury break at the end of 2016, that was it.

 

[insideguy]

Serena has all the trophies and is single Olympic champion. Has more slams and more slam finals. Fed has more titles.

 

[cluckcluck]

Federer has had the better career, mostly because he has been far more consistent than Serena has. He has played full seasons for most of his career; whereas SW hardly plays mandatory tournament and shows up for the slams.
Additionally, RF is liked far more by his peers and fans than SW is.
Just my opinion....

 

[ScentOfDefeat]

Definitely.
Mother > father.

 

[Tostao80]

Federer has had the better career, mostly because he has been far more consistent than Serena has. He has played full seasons for most of his career; whereas SW hardly plays mandatory tournament and shows up for the slams.
Additionally, RF is liked far more by his peers and fans than SW is.
Just my opinion....

What does being liked have anything to do with achievements? Novak is less liked than Rafa and Roger. Do you think that would matter if he got more slams than both?

 

[RF-18]

Why compare woman to men and vice versa? Just stick to comparing their own fields and there will be no problems.

 

[icedevil0289]

yes, i dont know why its debatable and posts like this annoy me because its just set up to **** on the wta. roger is my fav, but his fanboys are a bit too much at times, they nearly lost it when roger himself said serena is the goat, which he said a few times.


i'm not a fan of either fanbase trying to denigrate what the other accomplished though.

 

[Tostao80]

yes, i dont know why its debatable and posts like this annoy me because its just set up to **** on the wta. roger is my fav, but his fanboys are a bit too much at times, they nearly lost it when roger himself said serena is the goat, which he said a few times.


i'm not a fan of either fanbase trying to denigrate what the other accomplished though.

A lot of them get internally triggered when they see the name Serena. All context considered, Rogers achievements are more impressive. Hes battling the 2 of the other 3 greatest players of all time.

 

[MajesticMoose]

Definitely.
Mother > father.

2 sets of twins > 1 girl

 

[MajesticMoose]

And to the OP:

 

[Deleted member 766172]

Federer has had the better career when you account for the fact that he had to compete with Nadal and Djokovic. I would take any of the Big 3 over Serena. However, Serena is the 4th greatest player I witnessed play so far (as far as I think).

 

[icedevil0289]

A lot of them get internally triggered when they see the name Serena. All context considered, Rogers achievements are more impressive. Hes battling the 2 of the other 3 greatest players of all time.

i'm not getting into this. to me what serena has accomplished in every sense of the way is more impressive and this is coming from someone whose no.1 fav is roger and i cant even say serena is a fav, despite liking her.

 

[icedevil0289]

Federer has had the better career when you account for the fact that he had to compete with Nadal and Djokovic. I would take any of the Big 3 over Serena. However, Serena is the 4th greatest player I witnessed play so far afaik.

competition is a weird thing imo considering one can also say the big 3 are allowed to be so good because the next generations suck. no one is trying to push out djokodal and therefore a 38 year old is still being competitive with them where as with the wta they are stepping up, please keep in mind that the other argument is, one saying serena has had no good competition through out her career is innacurate and the other is she is heads and shoulders above the rest competition or not.

 

[helterskelter]

Federer has had the better career when you account for the fact that he had to compete with Nadal and Djokovic. I would take any of the Big 3 over Serena. However, Serena is the 4th greatest player I witnessed play so far (as far as I think).

I think that relative competition is a valid factor, and so I can in principle see an argument for Federer with 20 Slams over Williams with 23 (or even 24) Slams. However, it's tricky in this particular case because we have to judge over the whole career. I think it would be hard to deny that for the first several years of their Slam-winning careers, Williams had tougher competition. The depth of the women's game at the time that she first won the "Serena Slam" was as great as it's ever been. It's true that after about 2008 the competition wasn't as tough. But it's at least arguable that it wasn't that tough for Federer until about then. Of course, both of them won most of their Slams during the period when the competition wasn't as tough - but that's of course to be expected.

And as @icedevil0289 noted while I was writing this post, it's always unclear whether competition really was weaker or just seemed weaker because of how good the player in question was.

 

[Mike Sams]

Roger Federer 6-0, 6-0 Serena Williams. Federer is far greater. End thread.

 

[ibbi]

No. Not even close. The only thing she has over him is majors, and extra longevity, though considering how much less she's probably played that doesn't mean much. The extra majors don't mean much either when you consider that if she had a Nadal and a Djokovic to compete with this deep into her career she might have about half the number she does now.

 

[Service Ace]

Serena's career has been objectively more impressive and dominant than Federer's. The only reason Serena's rivals aren't considered as "great" as the Big 3 is because she beat them all into the retirement, a credit to her longevity relative to her peers and her extended dominance reflected in her positive H2H against ALL her greatest rivals.

 

[icedevil0289]

No. Not even close. The only thing she has over him is majors, and extra longevity, though considering how much less she's probably played that doesn't mean much. The extra majors don't mean much either when you consider that if she had a Nadal and a Djokovic to compete with this deep into her career she might have about half the number she does now.

a steffi fan would say that

 

[heftylefty]

Why does Serena need to have a better career than any male tennis player?

Also, is Serena a never-in-shape ball basher with no skills of foot speed; or and an underachiever who should have 40 Slams?
Because she can't be both.

 

[icedevil0289]

Serena's career has been objectively more impressive and dominant than Federer's. The only reason Serena's rivals aren't considered as "great" as the Big 3 is because she beat them all into the retirement, a credit to her longevity relative to her peers and her extended dominance reflected in her positive H2H against ALL her greatest rivals.

mte. people give so much, deserved credit, to fed for his longevity but i think serena does not get nearly enough credit for it as well. yes she may have taken some time off, but for her to still do what she has been doing. ffs she was going for the ultimate grand slam in 2015, that is impressive no matter how you look at it.

 

[Service Ace]

LOL! All her rivals combined couldn't lace Novak's shoes. The hell are you blabbering about??

The only reason Nadal and the 3rd place guy are even in the conversation for greatness is because Fed is a bigger choker than Serena despite proving he has the game to beat them both. If he was half as clutch as Serena he'd have equal or more the Grand Slams. Any objective person would rather have Serena's career right now than Fed's.

 

[Mike Sams]

No. Not even close. The only thing she has over him is majors, and extra longevity, though considering how much less she's probably played that doesn't mean much. The extra majors don't mean much either when you consider that if she had a Nadal and a Djokovic to compete with this deep into her career she might have about half the number she does now.

Nadal hit a basic forehand to her during kid's day to commemorate the Australian Open a few years back and she couldn't even get a racquet on the ball, hollering "Oh My God!!! So Much Spin!!!"
She never beat anyone in the same universe as a Nadal or a Novak or a Federer on the women's side.

 

[aman92]

Well for me objectively speaking there is no debate..Serena is the de facto GOAT of Women's tennis whereas Federer is one of the GOATs but not an undisputed one. Also her doubles career itself has been extraordinarily good

 

[sureshs]

Of course Serena has the better career, with more Slams and Olympics singles gold

 

[icedevil0289]

The only reason Nadal and the 3rd place guy are even in the conversation for greatness is because Fed is a bigger choker than Serena despite proving he has the game to beat them both. If he was half as clutch as Serena he'd have equal or more the Grand Slams.

omg at the third place guy. whelp this is going to get some hits. if we are speaking strictly on that, can I just say i feel like conditions, style of play and how his game was when it first started, court speeds etc, i feel have all played a role. lets be real djokodal are much more suited for the modern game, credit to fed for hanging in there. I also need to say fed is not part of the djokodal generation despite what some djokodal fans like to promote.


but really on pure numbers serena>>>>roger. idek how one is trying to argue against that. forget numbers imo, just in general what she has done is amazing..


also idk how if this is unpopular opinion but i find nadal to now be the third place guy, he might have the second amount of slams but aside from his leading h2h against fed, he has the most holes in this resume amongst the three and has never dominated the sport teh way fed or djokovic have outside of clay. if nything djokovic has a more complete resume can give fed a bigger run for his money

 

[aman92]

Put her on the men's tour and see how quickly her career would've been over.

The comparison was never on this.... Why the hell make it a battle of sexes debate?

 

[Mike Sams]

Of course Serena has the better career, with more Slams and Olympics singles gold

Men's Slams are an entirely different beast to women's Slams...don't you think? LOL

 

[Mike Sams]

The comparison was never on this.... Why the hell make it a battle of sexes debate?

Because that's what this is. Saying that she is greater than Federer is an effing joke when the sports they play are completely different. The slams are different. The balls they use are different. The competition is entirely different.

 

[Mike Sams]

McEnroe: "Serena could probably compete with men outside of the top 200 I think."

Andy Murray: (laughing) "No no....I'd say outside of a thousand."

 

[a10best]

Has Serena been owned in tge Slams by any of her rivals? Shes the best of her era. Can Fed claim the same?

If two women from Belgium in their 20's didn't retire early she'd have less slams. That's fact. Clijsters and Henin gave her losses, fits and battles.
Serena has done extremely well without them.
Yet even then she had losses to Vinci, to donde esta' Muguruza, and Kerber. lots of one-offs to hot players, Not so much with Fed in finals
They are non-comparable careers because she didn't have two ATG's playing against her for 15 years.
Owned? Fed loses in 5 sets to Djokovic at Wimbledon twice.

 

[Service Ace]

The comparison was never on this.... Why the hell make it a battle of sexes debate?

Isn't it obvious? Any male that is compelled like this one to constantly remind people of men's physical superiority to women all pretty much have the same psychiatric diagnosis lol

 

[McEnroeisanartist]

Federer has lost to 3 guys in Grand Slam finals. 10 of his 11 Grand Slam final losses were to 2 of the 5 greatest players of the open era.

Serena has lost to 7 women in Grand Slam finals. None of have been to anyone near the GOAT discussion.

 

[ibbi]

a steffi fan would say that

What has Steffi got to do with it?

If Serena actually had half the majors she does those majors would probably mean more, but then also probably nobody would ever even ask this question because all that seems to matter to most people here is numbers entirely removed from any context.

 

[sureshs]

Men's Slams are an entirely different beast to women's Slams...don't you think? LOL

Tennis with wood racket with 65 sq inch head and gut is totally different from tennis today, but Federer still reveres Rod Laver, who with his height, would not have made it in the tour today.

What matters is achievement in your field, in your time, against your peers, and over a long period of time.

With Serena, the adversity she had to overcome puts her even more beyond the threshold of comparison.

 

[aman92]

Because that's what this is. Saying that she is greater than Federer is an effing joke when the sports they play are completely different. The slams are different. The balls they use are different. The competition is entirely different.

I am just talking who has had a better career within their sport if you like to call it...people compare sportspersons across sports all the time. Even if you consider Women's tennis a different sport, I am asking who has had a better career within their discipline. Justify your answer including all the variables you mentioned above instead of just dissing on Women's tennis

 

[Service Ace]

McEnroe: "Serena could probably compete with men outside of the top 200 I think."

Andy Murray: (laughing) "No no....I'd say outside of a thousand."

Serena then goes on to carry Murray's dead corpse thru the first two rounds of the Wimbledon mixed doubles, hitting return winners off of 138mph serves. But since Federer can run faster than her, he is somehow more accomplished in his field than she is in her own

 

[Phoenix1983]

I am just talking who has had a better career within their sport if you like to call it...people compare sportspersons across sports all the time. Even if you consider Women's tennis a different sport, I am asking who has had a better career within their discipline. Justify your answer including all the variables you mentioned above instead of just dissing on Women's tennis

Agree.

No one ever says when comparing, say, Federer/Nadal to Tiger Woods, “put them on a golf course with Tiger and let’s see who comes out on top”.

It’s the same with men’s and women’s tennis. No one is asking whether Serena would beat Federer if she played a match against him. They’re asking whether she is greater in her sport than he is in his.

And for the record - despite being much more of a Federer fan than a Serena one - I think she is.

 

[Mike Sams]

Obviously he can't. Mysoginist justify their positions by shouting "BLLAAHH TESTORONE BLLAAHH MEN ARE TOUGHER THAN WOMYN". Leave the facts, statistics, measurables to the nerds.

So I guess Laila Ali had a better career than Muhammad Ali based on records and dominance too? LOL

 

[Mike Sams]

Obviously he can't. Mysoginist justify their positions by shouting "BLLAAHH TESTORONE BLLAAHH MEN ARE TOUGHER THAN WOMYN". Leave the facts, statistics, measurables to the nerds.

Can't compare stats when you're doing half the work.

 

[Mike Sams]

I am just talking who has had a better career within their sport if you like to call it...people compare sportspersons across sports all the time. Even if you consider Women's tennis a different sport, I am asking who has had a better career within their discipline. Justify your answer including all the variables you mentioned above instead of just dissing on Women's tennis

People compare sports persons all the time. Very true. Nobody compares men's accomplishments to women's accomplishments in any sport.

 

[icedevil0289]

Serena then goes on to carry Murray's dead corpse thru the first two rounds of the Wimbledon mixed doubles, hitting return winners off of 138mph serves. But since Federer can run faster than her, he is somehow more accomplished in his field than she is in her own

omg literally the only reason they got as far as they did that doubles team

 

[Mike Sams]

Federer has lost to 3 guys in Grand Slam finals. 10 of his 11 Grand Slam final losses were to 2 of the 5 greatest players of the open era.

Serena has lost to 7 women in Grand Slam finals. None of have been to anyone near the GOAT discussion.

I don't see any man on the tour losing to Simona Halep in a Wimbledon match. Especially with a score of 6-2, 6-2

 

[Mike Sams]

Henin 3-0 lolliams in 2007 slams

SW is lucky Henin retired early, no?

And Henin was like 5'2, 110 lbs soaking wet! LOL