Doubles Racquet Help Needed for this Ex-Singles Player...

[rafafan20]

I like that, just because someone doesn't like to volley with your racket they can't volley well.

Or it could be the lack of stability in the frame when playing against people who hit hard, and I'm not a fan of using lead.

 

[LeeD]

Not a stability problem for volleys.
Volley technique takes care of that, firm wrist, firm elbow and shoulder, body solid.
Now mishits are a different animal entirely. When you mishit a volley, you can't expect the same results as a solid hit volley, can you?

 

[rafafan20]

Well Chris on TW said the same thing about the rackets, but you obviously are better at judging rackets than him so I'll take your word for it I'm just a crappy player.

 

[LeeD]

Doesn't Chris commit to a 12 oz racket with a moderately high SW?
As such, anything less will be lacking, in his point of view.
All these testers talk about "lack of plowthru" constantly.
Most are playing in the 4-5 levels. How much "plowthru" is needed to play at the higher high school levels?
And none of US play at 5.5 or Futures/Satalite/Q levels. We don't face the same balls, we don't hit the same balls.

 

[rafafan20]

how on earth do you know what level I play it? To each his own but I'll stick with the guy who tests rackets for a living rather than someone strangely attached to defending their own brand of rackets (weird...)

 

[LeeD]

you may do as you like, but you must know very little about tennis to just blindly believe in what ONE person says about how some racket's volley....
Maybe you should learn to volley yourself, then try the various rackets, THEN make your post.
Since you can't/don't/don't care to defend your position, your comments show very little credibility.

 

[rafafan20]

I've used the actual racket (300t and 400t as mentioned above) and I just don't find it stable. My tennis coach used it and didn't find it stable. I played at on one of the best university club teams in the country which is by no means consistent 5.5 but I know what I'm doing. But hey, I don't know how to volley.

you seem to need a little help with reading comprehension and manners, but to each his own.

 

[TripleB]

Tons of recommendations here, and in three pages of replies there were only TWO that suggested just using YOUR SAME RACQUET FOR DOUBLES THAT YOU DID FOR SINGLES. I'm 100% in that camp.

Why switch???

There are a few reasons but I guess the 2 main reasons are: 1) the last racquet I used (BLX Pro Open) caused me arm problems (finally feeling better after 8 weeks away from the game) and 2) I would really rather go to a thinner racquet with more feel (in dubs I'm more of a touch/feel/placement player).

Thanks for the input.

TripleB

 

[LeeD]

But what counts is, are you a solid consistent volleyer to begin with?
You might be a solid 5.5 baseliner, and volley at a much lower level..MIGHT.
If you were a solid volleyer, you'd know it's about your body preparation and stroke, not about the weight of a racket.
And not all passing shots are hit at 100mph. Lots are hit within human ranges, and some are hit with heavy spin and very slow pace (like 50 mph).
Lots of factors weigh in on what determines a good volleying racket. Heft is one, for sure, but quickness to allow solid preparation is just as important, while some players prefer a quicker rebound, some a slower feel.
As with groundies and overall, the heaviest YOU CAN HANDLE is the best volleying racket. And that means including body shots, half volleys, overheads, backhand overheads, besides the normal offensive volleys.

 

[retrograde]

I usually stayed at the baseline, used a great deal of spin on all shots, ran everything down keeping balls in play until my opponent made a mistake. Seldom came to the net and did my best to stay away from doubles.

I admire your drive to make a comeback from surgery. More power to you.

I play 75% doubles now and have a tender elbow. Fortunately, I learned how to play serve & volley when I was a kid, so I've always been comfy w/ dubs.

Since volleying hasn't been a big part of your game till now, I'd consider using your current stick and practicing volleys on a machine or with a buddy. Discovering how to move post-op/PT, learning strategy to take control of the net, and volleying technique will keep you plenty busy. In other words, consider minimizing the number of new variables to contend with post-op/PT.

Later, if you find your current stick deficient in serve & volley, you could do a search. My experience is more often than not, a good volleying stick has:

- Higher twistweight
- Larger Sweetspot / Power Zones
- Vibration frequency (I use to predict comfort)

Twistweight helps on reaction volleys or mishits by minimizing torquing of the frame in your hand. Larger sweetspot / power zone helps in this area too. The associated TW tools will help to narrow down demos to try:

http://twu.tennis-warehouse.com/learning_center/contours.php
http://twu.tennis-warehouse.com/cgi-bin/poweruniverse.cgi
http://twu.tennis-warehouse.com/cgi-bin/vibfrequency.cgi

I'd also consider looking more at swingweight than static weight. You'll be surprised how nicely a heavier yet head-light racquet can swing/maneuver compared to a lighter stick with the same swingweight. The mass of the heavier stick will help with volleys.

I've been using the PK7g for years now (great serve & volley stick) but have been actively demo'ing. You mentioned the Dunlop F3.0 - I found it volleys well and requires less work/precision to hit a good volley than a Bio 300 Tour (compare their twistweights and sweet/power zones).

 

[LeeD]

And big, sticky grips helps TONS for a volleying racket, which is why I use a 4 5/8th size with an overgrip for all my rackets.
I'm 5'11" and 147 lbs., with a size 10.5 shoe size.

 

[TripleB]

I admire your drive to make a comeback from surgery. More power to you.

Since volleying hasn't been a big part of your game till now, I'd consider using your current stick and practicing volleys on a machine or with a buddy.

Thank you...some of it has to do with being able to play tennis again but most has to do with the fact I want to be able to play with my kids (16 and 5) and eventually my grandkids.

As I mentioned above (you may have missed it with all the replies), my last racquet caused me arm pain (finally going away after 8 weeks away from tennis) and I would like to go to a thinner racquet that offers more feel than my Pro Open because when I did have to play doubles in the past I used more touch/feel/placement.

Thanks for the input.

TripleB

 

[LeeD]

And doubles is more about quickness and coordination, which seem to go together.
Big hitting singles players seem to do the worse in doubles.
So the equipement needs are different. Pure power for volleys is less needed than low placements over the lowest part of the net, just past service line depths, to allow you to close and the opponent to hit up.
On the other side, low passes are paramount, and reflex volleys almost as important, so quickness and control are more important than power.

 

[MikeHitsHard93]

And doubles is more about quickness and coordination, which seem to go together.
Big hitting singles players seem to do the worse in doubles.
So the equipement needs are different. Pure power for volleys is less needed than low placements over the lowest part of the net, just past service line depths, to allow you to close and the opponent to hit up.
On the other side, low passes are paramount, and reflex volleys almost as important, so quickness and control are more important than power.

I agree. In highschool I played doubles against a kid that was supposed to be first singles on the team (due to behavior issues, he was made to play doubles). He used a k90..and dear lord that kid could hit some good groundies. How about his serve or volley game?...pathetic. We beat him and his partner every time we played them. Racket isn't everything!!!

 

[retrograde]

As I mentioned above (you may have missed it with all the replies), my last racquet caused me arm pain (finally going away after 8 weeks away from tennis) and I would like to go to a thinner racquet that offers more feel than my Pro Open because when I did have to play doubles in the past I used more touch/feel/placement.

I did miss that. I've demo'd the Pro Open ... both my hitting partner and I found its comfort below average. You mentioned the PK Ki5 295 ... I encourage you to try the PK Ki5 315. Many TT members are reporting it's coming in at 310g. My strung demo was 11.45 oz which is much lighter than the 11.8 oz TW is stating. I demo'd it last week (along with the F3.0) and it is ultra-comfortable. I didn't think it volleyed quite as well as my PK7g or the F3.0 but still a great overall racquet.

I also agree with #63.

 

[NLBwell]

I'm really sorry you had to have surgery. I hope you recover quickly.

As far as doubles vs. singles, I think I have more trouble playing in doubles with my knee injuries because there are many more quick movements and starting and stopping are difficult. It is easier for me to anticipate where the ball will be and have more time to move to it once I get started in singles. Work really hard on your rehab building up your leg muscles once you are allowed to.

As far as the racket, Kennex technology really works for the arm.

However, you know that I always recommend the POG for you. You might go with the oversize or 100 for doubles.

(By the way, I pulled my POG out of mothballs today and beat a friend of mine 6-3, 6-3 that I hadn't beaten in quite a while.)

 

[LeeD]

Believe me, when your wheels go, you need a bigger racket to hit the ball somewhere within a district of the sweetspot.
Not only do you gimp to the ball, but you cannot drive off and just smack the ball. It's a whole new ballgame for the movement challenged.
All the while your eyesight keeps going S.
And your reflexes fell another year behind.
Right now, your racket thoughts are based on an active and healty leg, or two, and you get to the ball and set up.
You won't for another 2 years, now.

 

[TripleB]

Believe me, when your wheels go, you need a bigger racket.

Not only do you gimp to the ball, but you cannot drive off and just smack the ball.

All the while your eyesight keeps going S.

And your reflexes fell another year behind.

Right now, your racket thoughts are based on an active and healty leg, or two, and you get to the ball and set up.

Yea, that's why I'm mainly looking at 100-102 sq in racquets. This may change when I return to the game but ever since I left the Radical Oversize series over 10 years ago, I just no longer feel comfortable with anything larger than 100-102.

That's why I'm trying to find something similar to my AG 4D 200 Tour with a bit more pop, better maneuverability, without losing all the touch/feel the 200T gives me.

Eyesight is going much faster than I thought it would (especially for only being 45).

Actually I am trying to think about the limitations I'm going to have whe I return to the game and am trying to think about racquets that may help hide some of those limitations.

Thank you for all your help. It is much appreciated!!

TripleB

 

[Bartelby]

You should go back to your earlier passion for Yonex if doubles is now your main game. The current or future versions of the vcore 98 and 100 would suit.

 

[bertrevert]

Eyesight is going much faster than I thought it would (especially for only being 45).

Actually I am trying to think about the limitations I'm going to have whe I return to the game and am trying to think about racquets that may help hide some of those limitations.

If you're talking about eyesight for reading then I have found that its decrease hasn't really affected sighting a tennis ball in the middle distance. Other guys though have reported streaky or strobe-like effects...

I think above what LeeD says should introduce a note of caution - you won't really know what you need until back on court - and then maybe it will be 6 months before you can judge your level?

I too am using the Pro Open in doubles - I find it ok for comfort, not great, but I do use Klip gut mains - and agree it feels like more a singles stick.

Since you won't be using it, I reckon your instinct that you want to retain touch/feel is right for doubles.

The other aspect already pointed to is headlight-ness - you want maneuverability.

Given these two qualities I'd also add what several people have said about a bit of weight - leather grip or the Rad Pro

Also there is the fact that Doubles is a diff game and it all depends how you respond to it and play it.

Iwas going to say a 200g with gut in it, strung low!

 

[TripleB]

And big, sticky grips helps TONS for a volleying racket, which is why I use a 4 5/8th size with an overgrip for all my rackets.

That's interesting. Over the last couple of years I've worked my way down from 4 5/8" (probably larger because it was a Babolat racquet) plus an overgrip down to currently a 4 3/8" grip (Wilson) plus an overgrip.

I might have to make a move back up.

TripleB

 

[LeeD]

Why do people volley badly? They MISHIT!
What is the cause of a mishit...not hit center. What is the result? Ball goes weak or into the net.
Now what if the racket DOESN'T hit short and weak? Increase grip size, the mishits go over the net just like a HEAVIER racket would.
Heavier racket is slow for quick reflex volleys.
Going to smaller grips don't make sense. What is the gain? You serve the same with any grip size availible. You FEEL like you hit groundies harder with more RHS, the least important trait of doubles.
Volleys and returns of serve are important. Bigger grip helps both.
You've been evolving to smaller grips...WHY? Just because Federer is reputed to use 3/8th? Look at the racket grip in his hands. Does it look 3/8th to you?

 

[TripleB]

You've been evolving to smaller grips...WHY?

2 Main Reasons:

1) I believe my hand is shrinking...the 'empty space' on the handle used to be an index finger on a 4 5/8" grip plus an overgrip - now I have that same amount of space on a 4 1/2" grip.

2) To me it seems like I serve better (although still not great) with a smaller grip...more pop and more spin.

TripleB

 

[robbo1970]

I have tried larger grips and I never quite feel I have as much hold and control of the racket as I do with a slightly smaller grip.

Triple B, maybe light is the way to go. Easier manouvrability if the feet don't move as quick.

 

[TripleB]

Thanks for all the input so far.

I'm getting close...I've got it narrowed down to 21 racquets*!!! :mrgreen:

But only 9 have me really intrigued:
- Babolat Pure Storm Team GT
- Donnay XDual Silver 99
- Donnay X-P Dual Black 102
- Dunlop Biomimetic F3.0 Tour
- Head YouTek IG Speed 300
- Head YouTek IG Speed Elite
- Pacific XFeel Tour
- Pacific XForce
- Pro Kennex KI Q5 295

Again, I greatly appreciate all your help and advice.

TripleB

* Rest of the 21: Babolat Pure Storm GT '09, Babolat Pure Storm GT '11, Donnay XDual Gold 99, Dunlop AG 4D 300 Tour, Dunlop Biomimetic M3.0, Head MG Radical Midplus, Head YT IG Radical Midplus, Head MG Radical Oversize, Head YT Radical Oversize, Head YT IG Radical OS, Mantis Tour 305, Yonex RDiS 200 Lite

 

[athiker]

I predict you will like the Pacific X Feel Tour quite a bit. I pulled out my Fischer Mag Tour (same racquet, but heavier at about 12 oz strung...it still has a low 300s swingweight though) the last two times out in doubles and found great accuracy and feel.

I still think there is a place for oversized racquets in doubles but must admit the solid thunk of this racquet was a welcome feeling. I might save the lighter Ki15 for singles duty now when I need some extra power and a lighter stick for long matches.

The Mag Tour is pretty low powered so I string it fairly low. I think currently I have poly crosses at about 46 and multi mains at 48 or 50.

 

[Jim A]

Looks like it didn't make the cut, however the ability to customize the racquet would make the Radical MP a strong option for me. It's always felt vanilla to me, however the flex of the racquet will allow great feel and shouldn't tear up your arm. I think it's 57RA?