Ever got double bageled?
- Thread starter DonPepe
- Start date
sovertennis
Professional
A few years ago while visiting the city to which I eventually moved, I had entered a tournament (4.5 division) during a visit to search for a home. We had found the home we wanted and put a bid on it, then I went to play in the tourney. Less than an hour later, my focus squarely on the status of our bid and the details of moving, I walked off a love and love loser. The guy I played was very good (later, I checked and he was a four year college player who had won every tourney he had entered at 4.5 for the previous several years; he never entered the open division of any event). Even if I wasn't distracted with the bid on the house, he would have beaten me, although perhaps not as comprehensively.
Dartagnan64
G.O.A.T.
Only once. In a consolation doubles final where we went down 0-6 and then in the second set we got every game to deuce and lost every one of those deuces.
I always try to get at least one game a set even when I'm clearly overmatched.
Then if I can get one game, I try to get 3 games to at least make it respectable. And if I get 3 games, I try to get 5 to at least make them sweat. And if I get to 5 games I try to get to a tiebreaker where anything can happen.
I always try to get at least one game a set even when I'm clearly overmatched.
Then if I can get one game, I try to get 3 games to at least make it respectable. And if I get 3 games, I try to get 5 to at least make them sweat. And if I get to 5 games I try to get to a tiebreaker where anything can happen.
navigator
Hall of Fame
Twice in the last 5 years, both ITF veterans events. After one of them, my opponent - a very nice guy - said, "I don't know if you were keeping track, but you had an ad in 7 of the 12 games." (I hadn't kept track.) He was a good player, he had reached the top-20 of the ITF rankings in our age group. The second time was an odd one - guy was a left-handed version of me but obviously much, much better. Probably 5'4", no power at all but just the most beautiful game of touch and movement and shot selection I've ever played against. He lost one game the whole tournament - won the final 0/0. That was fun because it reinforced my belief that in the seniors divisions power is over-rated... sufficient skill is enough to get by just about anyone (which I don't have, obviously!).
Separate, but related, I lost a golden set as a junior. First set 6/0, won zero points. Second set, lost 6/3. You play enough, you'll see some strange results. That guy was pretty good. He went on to win the National Amateur Championship and was ranked in the top-10 of D1 as a senior. Funny enough, he doesn't even play tennis anymore. Hasn't played for many years from what I understand. Life is strange.
Separate, but related, I lost a golden set as a junior. First set 6/0, won zero points. Second set, lost 6/3. You play enough, you'll see some strange results. That guy was pretty good. He went on to win the National Amateur Championship and was ranked in the top-10 of D1 as a senior. Funny enough, he doesn't even play tennis anymore. Hasn't played for many years from what I understand. Life is strange.
navigator
Hall of Fame
In non-tournament tennis, I'd probably agree here (unless you're trying to make a point with someone, for whatever reason). But in a tournament, no way. I've lost a few tournament matches where I won the first set 6/0. Sometimes you take your foot off the gas and your opponent has time to figure out what you're doing. So, 0/0 is ok by me in a tournament. Just my view, of course.
Injured Again
Hall of Fame
A close friend was up 6-0 4-0 and decided to give a way a game or two. This player is pretty hit or miss - he goes aggressively at a lot of shots and took his foot off the gas. Unfortunately, he couldn't get his foot back on the gas and ended up losing the second set in a tiebreak and the third set by a break. It was the maddest I have ever seen this person, and he vowed never to do that again. Several months later in an open age group tournament, he got matched up against someone with a 3.5 USTA ranking and a losing record at that level. I kiddingly said you've got to give this guy a game or two. He glared and said "not a chance". He was merciless and when up 6-0 5-0 hit three clean service return winners. He told me afterwards that he explained to his opponent the reason for why he did that.
I've never been on the giving end but was once on the receiving end in a USTA match. I was injured and shouldn't have played but when lineups were exchanged I was okay and already slated for #1 singles at 40+ 4.5. I ran into an age grouper who just appealed down from 5.0. I might have lasted 30 minutes, but probably not. I did get my opponent to take off his warmups, about half way through the second set...
Yes. It happened recently. Was playing well. Just lost key points. Double bagled in like 45 minutes. It happened so fast I couldn't even be mad. Just git outplayed. Moved on. No biggie.
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
What other tennis "unwritten rules" should we be aware of if we visit Down Under? Horrors...are we expected to share a beer (or a "tinny") with our vanquished foe afterwards too?
Cashman
Hall of Fame
Just... don't let winning get in the way of being a good bloke, I guess.What other tennis "unwritten rules" should we be aware of if we visit Down Under? Horrors...are we expected to share a beer (or a "tinny") with our vanquished foe afterwards too?
I don't always have a beer with my opponent, but I never want him to walk away thinking he'd hate to have a beer with me.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
Getting double bageled wouldn't make me want to avoid the post-match beer. An opponent acting like a jerk would, win or lose. [And obviously, I'm not defining winning 0&0 "acting like a jerk".]
Cashman
Hall of Fame
I guess what I'm saying is that if I'm up 6-0 and 4-0, the other guy is probably having a pretty bad day. If he grabs a couple of games towards the end, he's going to finish the match on a more positive note. He's happy, I'm happy - great result. Everyone's smiling when we shake hands.
Of course it's possible that 4-0 turns into 4-6 and suddenly he's steamrolling me in the third but... it's unlikely. And if it happens - c'est la vie. It's not like we were playing for money.
I'm not saying everyone should play tennis like that. But generally I have more fun if everyone on the court is having a good time.
Pity games? No thank you!!!
Cashman
Hall of Fame
You wouldn’t know they’re pity games.
The good thing about tennis is that you only have to muff one or two critical shots, or take your intensity down just a fraction, to throw an entire game. It’s pretty easy to do without it looking like anything more than a momentary lapse in concentration.
There's another term for what you just described: match fixing. Again, no thank you.
Cashman
Hall of Fame
You take recreational tennis far too seriously.
You don't take honor and respect seriously enough.
I actually have a philosophy about league and especially tourney matches: Get the heck off the court. 1) from a practical standpoint, a weird injury can occur at any moment, any movement, and knock you out of the tourney or the next few weeks. 2) I'm not good enough to take my foot off the gas and just coast to win...always turns into some UE's, etc...and now I'm suddenly in a tie break when I should have been off the court a half hour ago. Sports are weird, and the gods often reward effort with odd bounces, etc...it takes one point to turn a whole match around. And finally, I personally want to earn every point. I never want an opponent giving me mercy...it's on me to figure it out and get better...I know they're trying to be nice, but it's almost more insulting to be 'given' a game. I'd rather get beaten down and learn what i can from it.
BTW -- i dont think I've ever given or received a double bagel...but given/received plenty of 1-2 game matches...
Whenever I've gotten double bageled, it hasn't ever bothered me because the opponent is always so much better that it's like a lesson. About 10 years ago, I entered an open tournament (I was a high level 4.0 league player at the time). I got a softball in the first round, a high school kid who wasn't very good, and got by a 4.5 in a long, tough match in a match tb in the semis and then played the #1 ranked open player in Eastern region in the finals. I played one of the highest level matches I've ever played but lost 6-0 6-0. There's just nothing more I could do to win. I had about 10 game points, including 40-0 on my serve once and one break point, so I had some chances to sneak away with one, but didn't convert any of them. He was a nice guy. I said thanks for the lesson and went home satisfied I did everything I could.
better question for me, "how many times have i been double bageled?" - many
how i handle... shake their hand, and play again the next day, and work on stuff i learned from the beating. even the #1 player in the world gets bageled!
my main concern when getting double bageled is usually, "will (s)he want to hit with me again?"
McLovin
Legend
Once, about 10-12 years ago in a local doubles 'fun' tournament between clubs. My partner was really good, around a 5.0 with a huge serve. I'm a 4.5 (with a brief 5.0 bump a few years ago). We were supposed to play a 4.5/4.0 combination, when the 4.0 suddenly had to pull out due to 'injury'. They subbed in one of their new summer pros at the last minute.
35 minutes later, we were wondering 'WTF just happened?'. I later learned that this 'summer pro' was just out of college, where he was ranked #1 in the country in doubles in the NAIA. According to his bio, he won the Gold Ball in doubles in 35s last year.
Four years ago I ran into him at the 35s National Grass court tournament in Philly. I asked him about it, and he laughed and remembered crushing us. Ironically, we (different partner) drew him in the 1st round, but did a little better this time, losing 2 & 2.
I now blame my old partner for the double bagel...
35 minutes later, we were wondering 'WTF just happened?'. I later learned that this 'summer pro' was just out of college, where he was ranked #1 in the country in doubles in the NAIA. According to his bio, he won the Gold Ball in doubles in 35s last year.
Four years ago I ran into him at the 35s National Grass court tournament in Philly. I asked him about it, and he laughed and remembered crushing us. Ironically, we (different partner) drew him in the 1st round, but did a little better this time, losing 2 & 2.
I now blame my old partner for the double bagel...
thehustler
Semi-Pro
I don't think I've ever had a double bagel against me, but I've had a double bread stick before. It's the funny thing about sports, a score doesn't always tell the whole story. I've been involved in matches where it might've been 6-0, 6-1 or 6-1, 6-2 or something like that and every game was close. It's just one of us was able to do better on the game/break points than the other. I do remember my first ever tournament match at 3.5 I won with the double bagel. The tournament organizers felt bad for my opponent, so they marked it down as 1 and 1. I didn't like that. I had just been playing tennis for a few months at that point and was excited by what I did.
I've also learned to never let off the gas, not even a little bit. It can bite you in the butt. I've been on both ends of a 5-1 set and have blown the lead before and come back as well. To me it doesn't matter if it's a league match or a friend, you play to win. You play to develop a strong mentality, to go for it, not just play soft because you're crushing your opponent. Should you expect your opponent to go soft on you if they're crushing you? Of course not.
I've also learned to never let off the gas, not even a little bit. It can bite you in the butt. I've been on both ends of a 5-1 set and have blown the lead before and come back as well. To me it doesn't matter if it's a league match or a friend, you play to win. You play to develop a strong mentality, to go for it, not just play soft because you're crushing your opponent. Should you expect your opponent to go soft on you if they're crushing you? Of course not.
Actually never had it happen. Narrowly avoided it in a 6.5 combo match once. Both the 3.5 and 3.0 opponents were on their way to 4.0 and 3.5. I was a brand new 3.5 and my partner was a perpetually average 3.0. We were getting smoked, down 6-0, 4-0 with me serving. I went to my partner and said, "I've never been double bageled and don't plan on that changing today." Won my serve and dropped the next two games. 6-0 6-1.
I don't remember ever being double bageled, but do remember several bagel-and-breadstick combo platters!
On the flip side, I've handed out a few bagel-and-breadsticks that could have been double bagels, but I lost focus once I knew I had it in the bag, and I dropped a game.
I can only remember one time that I handed out a double bagel, and ironically this was against an opponent that was stronger than many that have taken multiple games off me. I knew he had the potential to turn it around at any time so I was taking nothing for granted and had high intensity and focus right until the end. Basically I think that's the only way I would ever win 0&0 - it has to be against someone that I know has potential to beat me no matter what the score says.
On the flip side, I've handed out a few bagel-and-breadsticks that could have been double bagels, but I lost focus once I knew I had it in the bag, and I dropped a game.
I can only remember one time that I handed out a double bagel, and ironically this was against an opponent that was stronger than many that have taken multiple games off me. I knew he had the potential to turn it around at any time so I was taking nothing for granted and had high intensity and focus right until the end. Basically I think that's the only way I would ever win 0&0 - it has to be against someone that I know has potential to beat me no matter what the score says.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
At the rec level? Unless there's betting, I don't see how it's applicable.
And down to the game level [as opposed to just the match outcome]?
I think you and @Cashman are talking two different scenarios.
You perhaps could call it sandbagging if I deliberately lose games that I should win [although I don't see 2 games making a significant enough difference]. But I don't think that was the gist of what Cash was addressing.
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davidtennis123
Semi-Pro
My brother (a really talented player) triple bageled me once, but besides that I've only been bageled in a set before and not twice in a match. I have double bageled some people, however. I will sometimes feel a little bad, but as I always say, I don't go easy on people because I would never want someone to go easy on me.
I'm a competitor, I'm not taking my foot off the gas and I don't want anyone to take their foot off the gas for me. I get what y'all are saying, but for me, I would be insulted if someone gifted me a game or two in an attempt to be nice.
I'm a competitor, I'm not taking my foot off the gas and I don't want anyone to take their foot off the gas for me. I get what y'all are saying, but for me, I would be insulted if someone gifted me a game or two in an attempt to be nice.
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Really, it's more insulting and embarrassing for someone to let up and not try than to beat you 6-0 6-0.
The high school I went to (many years ago...) is currently ranked #2 in the state in football. They had one team cancel a game this year because they just didn't want to play and another game where the team had 18 players on the roster and were clearly overmatched. My high school played the starters for two series and was up 42-0 at half time mostly with backups. They got the second half kick off and then punted on first down without running a play. Why? Because they hadn't punted yet the whole season (4 games in) other than practice and wanted to do it in a live situation. I cringed a little for the other team, but our coach was very respectful when interviewed afterwards saying they are clearly undermanned and he had the utmost respect for them that they showed up to play anyway (I think that was a shot at the team that canceled...). Nevertheless, I'm sure their kids were a little embarrassed that this team was just out there using them as a practice.
ChrisG
Professional
never been double bageled in a competitive match. But I've already been in the situation where you play good but lost most of the ad point, and the final score is close to a bagel ...
it's so frustrating, and in the same time this kind of scenario is the one you learn the most from.
I explain : if you loose the match by a thin margin during the play but the score is more abrupt against you, then it means you're very close to revert the situation, so there are reason to be optimist as long as you identify what was lacking on that day.
was it mentally ? physically ?
those are the match that would improve you
it's so frustrating, and in the same time this kind of scenario is the one you learn the most from.
I explain : if you loose the match by a thin margin during the play but the score is more abrupt against you, then it means you're very close to revert the situation, so there are reason to be optimist as long as you identify what was lacking on that day.
was it mentally ? physically ?
those are the match that would improve you
OnTheLine
Hall of Fame
I have never been double bagelled ... I have dealt one exactly 1 time. It was a very competitive match and plenty of deuce points, that just all went my way. Walked away feeling quite good about myself.
I have a few 0 & 1 and 0 & 2 losses though .... those sting ... even on a match where you say "but I played well I thought" ... obviously I didn't!
I have a few 0 & 1 and 0 & 2 losses though .... those sting ... even on a match where you say "but I played well I thought" ... obviously I didn't!
Ugh, yes recently I lost to an opponent in a tournament 6-0 6-0. I was injured from my previous match of the tournament and couldn't bend my back leg. I should have just not played, but thought I would loosen up with adrenaline. Adrenaline couldn't get past the injury and I took my first double bagel in 10 years.
To add insult to injury, he lost his next match to someone I had beat the week prior. Such is life.
To add insult to injury, he lost his next match to someone I had beat the week prior. Such is life.
davidtennis123
Semi-Pro
Yep, I can't believe how many people in this thread are wanting to gift games. One game can turn to 6 or 7 real quick if you're not careful.
I recognize that when I go out there, I'm ready the possibility of winning 6-0, 6-0 or losing 6-0, 6-0. That's part of the sport.
I remember a coach telling me that if a player does one thing just a little better than you they may win in a close match. But if they do everything just a little better than you they will win handily. So the score may not always indicate the real difference in playing ability between the two players. It's just time to go to work.
DonPepe
Rookie
Thanks, I feel better after reading all your stories. Tennis is very mental, I have to admit I was not into that match and my opponent didn't let up at all , he committed no errors. I played him in a 4.5 flex league match 1 hour after work (not ready) / on clay( hate clay) / at night ( cant see the ball as well).
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
I won the first set and then got double bagelled about 15 years ago. About eight years ago, I lost a match 1 and 0 and since we had time left, we played a 3rd set and I got bagelled again. The memories sting and so, I still remember them vividly.
I’ve averaged about 120 singles matches a year in the past decade and I‘ve handed out 3 or 4 double bagels every year. I’m the type to try my best on every point from beginning to end and rarely make unforced errors due to losing focus. So, if you catch me on a good serving day when I’m holding serve easily and it’s easier to be more relaxed during return games, good things can happen. I’ve also handed out two triple bagels and so, I don’t ever take my foot off the gas pedal.
Opponents in the US are happy enough to share a beer with you and be friendly even if you beat them badly. It is understood to all be within the spirit of serious competition in an individual sport like tennis. So, there’s no culture of people expecting you to take it easy on them if you have a big lead in tennis and some might even not like it if you are overtly ‘tanking’ games as that‘s considered to be unsporting. However, we do have that kind of unwritten rule in team sports like baseball and football to take it easy with a big lead, especially at the junior and college levels.
At least in doubles, I’ve lost a set in which my team was up 5-0 and another time came back to win a set after being down two sets points at 1-5. So, it is always possible for your opponent to come back from a big deficit if they catch some positive momentum. If they come back to 3-5 after being down 0-5, all the pressure will switch onto the shoulders of the guy who had the big lead and he is likely to start choking. If a lead is 5-0 after a lot of deuce games, the difference between the players can be much smaller than the score indicates.
I’ve averaged about 120 singles matches a year in the past decade and I‘ve handed out 3 or 4 double bagels every year. I’m the type to try my best on every point from beginning to end and rarely make unforced errors due to losing focus. So, if you catch me on a good serving day when I’m holding serve easily and it’s easier to be more relaxed during return games, good things can happen. I’ve also handed out two triple bagels and so, I don’t ever take my foot off the gas pedal.
Opponents in the US are happy enough to share a beer with you and be friendly even if you beat them badly. It is understood to all be within the spirit of serious competition in an individual sport like tennis. So, there’s no culture of people expecting you to take it easy on them if you have a big lead in tennis and some might even not like it if you are overtly ‘tanking’ games as that‘s considered to be unsporting. However, we do have that kind of unwritten rule in team sports like baseball and football to take it easy with a big lead, especially at the junior and college levels.
At least in doubles, I’ve lost a set in which my team was up 5-0 and another time came back to win a set after being down two sets points at 1-5. So, it is always possible for your opponent to come back from a big deficit if they catch some positive momentum. If they come back to 3-5 after being down 0-5, all the pressure will switch onto the shoulders of the guy who had the big lead and he is likely to start choking. If a lead is 5-0 after a lot of deuce games, the difference between the players can be much smaller than the score indicates.
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NicoMK
Hall of Fame
Of course I have lol. I was very young and had what? Maybe 2 years of tennis behind me and overall, I wasn't playing good, for sure. It was one of my first matches ever in a team, at my local club. Certainly nothing big and my opponent wasn't much better than I was -- still, he was -- but, for some reasons, I wasn't able to win a single game. That was all mental of course and I felt pretty ashamed playing so poorly in front of my team-mates lol.
It reminds me of this famous and rather sad story of former pro player Thierry Champion being TRIPLE bageled in SIXTY -- yes 60 ! -- minutes in the 1st round of Roland-Garros in 1993. Center court, French crowd, live on TV… I remember him saying afterwards that [he] "had no excuses, Sergi (Bruguera) tried to give me a game but I wasn't even able to catch it". Poor Thierry.
It reminds me of this famous and rather sad story of former pro player Thierry Champion being TRIPLE bageled in SIXTY -- yes 60 ! -- minutes in the 1st round of Roland-Garros in 1993. Center court, French crowd, live on TV… I remember him saying afterwards that [he] "had no excuses, Sergi (Bruguera) tried to give me a game but I wasn't even able to catch it". Poor Thierry.
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Moveforwardalways
Hall of Fame
If you are a more serious type singles or tournament player, then there is no stigma to double bageling someone. So you can play all out. However, if you are talking about 3.0 ladies daytime tennis at the club, you better throw a few games and make it 6-2 6-2 or you are not going to be on the group text for the next match.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
My buddy Josh just beat me 0, 0, & 1 in 100 minutes...including warmup. That was a lot of carbs.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
When life hands me bagels, I look for the cream cheese and coffee.
Never in singles in almost 40 years, always managed to get at least a game. But in our last competitive womens doubles we got creamed. After the first set we were joking with my partner that were playing for points but to be honest we didn't get many of those either lol. At least it was over quickly and we could watch Djokovic Tsitsipas on a big screen in the clubhouse, so that was the silver lining, that and the winning team buying wine.
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
I do not recall ever receiving or giving out a double bagel in doubles. If the first set ended in a bagel in social doubles, we usually switch partners to make the matchup more even. If it is a USTA league match, very rarely do both players on the winning team have enough focus/intensity to not lose a single game. If a team is truly dominant in a USTA league doubles match, they would probably try to sandbag and lose some games to prevent being bumped up.
The only scenario where I can imagine a double bagel in doubles is in a tournament.
The only scenario where I can imagine a double bagel in doubles is in a tournament.
Lol, lucky you))
Of course in a tournament. We played against two ladies that have been playing together for 25 years. We played them last year (with a different partner) with the same result, but I was injured, and I was attacked a lot. This time it was our second match of the day as we had to cancel couple matches the previous week and that was the last day that we had to complete our matches, so I guess we were not really all there, just wanted to be done with it after so many matches in one week. We expected to lose anyway, but were hoping to get maybe a game lol. The first match we actually won, but it was our best chance for a win in that tournament from the very start. We lost 5 out of 6 matches in a RR format. The team we lost against went on to win the final, the team we lost the day before 0-6 1-6 were the finalists. We played better against everyone else. Our top teams have lot of experience in doubles and often with a fixed partner for many years, I think it counts a lot.
The system here is a little bit different. It's pretty much open especially the internal tournaments. They can separate R9-R6 and R5-R1 in the open tournaments and by age, but there is again a range. Under 30s are in the "Active" category. Then 30-45, 45-65 and then older. But it depends on a competition. Interclubs have "Active" teams, and 30+, the cups can be completely mixed. When a player first get their license they always start from the bottom and play whoever is available within certain limits to work their way up. If you are R9 but the rest of the field is at least R8 you will have to play against R8. There are no separate competitions just for a certain level as far as I know.
Our team have players from R9 to R6. R6 has to play the highest ranked opponents whatever they are. R9 will play the lowest ranked opponents. Which can be another R9, but not always and it may not be a true R9. But this is how it goes... We have 8 players, but there are 4 singles and 2 doubles matches in a fixture so 4 players are enough if only 4 can play on a given day. I have no idea how doubles are formed. There are probably some rules like when you guys have your 8 teams with 3.5 and 4.5 combined, but they are not set in stone. Only singles results count towards ranking, but in a team competition it's possible to be relegated to a lower league. Which doesn't mean that players in the teams in that league will necessarily be lower ranked. It's all for fun anyway so nobody is stressing. As a child it took me a year of competing to be able to lose in 3, not in straights, and this is was when I was taking things more seriously even that I never wanted a sports career, I just loved playing and of course winning felt nice but it took time. Getting upset now? lol. I had a mixed double partner who was very good and we got to the final of one tournament last year, but I don't want to play with him now as he gets too stressed as if he would lose his last cow not just a stupid match in a stupid tournament with two cans of balls and a bottle of wine as a prize.
I find doubles quite difficult, I haven't played a lot, only started playing doubles more or less regularly in the last 3-4 years. But formations etc. are a mystery to me, probably need to read a book lol. Singles are easier in comparison, one opponent and all court in front of you to use, what's not to love, just be fit, try to hit a clean ball, and don't try to do too much too soon. Doubles need more concentration and since we play a lot straight after work it can be difficult. Singles are liberating, the moment I start moving my head clears. It's like a rest only a physical one, and no-one gets upset with the result.
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