Ever play match better than opponent but lose?

[spirit]

Played doubles last night. I swear it seemed as if my partner and I played the better tennis, won the more spectacular points, and certainly played more agressively. In one game, we won at love and all the points were won by volley winners at the net by us - a wonderfu game. And in general we were the more agressive team, taking the net more often. We even were up on our opponents during the second set 4-0 before winning it close 6-4, and we were up on our opponents 3-0 in the third set, but let them pull even and then win it. At the end of the night, we lost 3-6, 6-4, 4-6. Now, since we lost, we must have made more errors than our opponents, because I know we hit more winners. But it just didn't seem that way to me. I still think we should have won the match.

Any of you have an experience like this? How do I more objectively analyze what happened? How do we play these guys next time?

 

[Slazenger]

IF you hit more winners than they did, then not only must you have made more errors than them, but your ratio of winners to losers must have been less than theirs for you to lose the match
.
You could still have a positive differential (more winners than errors) and still lose, as long as their differential is at least a point higher than yours.

The funny thing about differentials is that, say you play a one set match
and you have:
29 winners, 24 errors: +5 diff
and your opponent has
6 winners, 0 errors: +6 diff they would win the match.

This is an exaggerated case of beating yourself and I'm sure that's not what happened in your match, but it serves to illustrate a point.

In the above hypothetical match, the player with 29 winners may feel like he is playing better than the opponent (and at the moments of the winners, he might have), but he made a lot of errors as well, though less than his total winners.
His opponent made no errors (which usually goes unnoticed).

Bottomline:
Work on making less errors, than making more winners.

 

[spirit]

...
This is an exaggerated case of beating yourself and I'm sure that's not what happened in your match, but it serves to illustrate a point.
...
Bottomline:
Work on making less errors, than making more winners.

Very good advice. But there has to be a balance, unless you just want to become a "pusher" or just completely a counterpuncher. That would be too boring for me. And would run counter to one of the reasons I like to play tennis, to practice some legalized, controlled agression.

But I certainly have to work on increasing the ratio of winners to errors and the best way of going about that may be to reduce the number of errors.

 

[Koaske]

It's also possible to lose a tennis match even if you had won more points than the opponent. If all games won by you were something like 4 straight points and games won by opponents had situations like 40-40, you're likely to have won more points by the end of the match.

 

[Return_Ace]

Ever play match better than opponent but lose?

heh, try all the time mate........ i always play better but when it gets to the 'key' points, i seem to fall apart.........

 

[spirit]

It's also possible to lose a tennis match even if you had won more points than the opponent. If all games won by you were something like 4 straight points and games won by opponents had situations like 40-40, you're likely to have won more points by the end of the match.

Yeah, I think some of this happened in that match. We won most of our games by big margins, while they won a lot of close ones. Probably the reason why it felt like we played "better" but still lost.

Of course, since they won, by definition, they actually played the better tennis.

 

[Marius_Hancu]

i always play better but when it gets to the 'key' points, i seem to fall apart.........

guess that's the story in this case too ...

 

[Slazenger]

Very good advice. But there has to be a balance, unless you just want to become a "pusher" or just completely a counterpuncher.

Of course that goes without saying. I assumed you had the aggressive/put-away part down and was advising you work on reducing your errors.

 

[Slazenger]

It's also possible to lose a tennis match even if you had won more points than the opponent. If all games won by you were something like 4 straight points and games won by opponents had situations like 40-40, you're likely to have won more points by the end of the match.

Yes, if their diff is higher, even though you won more points you still lose.

It's all about the ratio.

 

[kevhen]

In tennis you can win more points than your opponent and still lose the match. Sounds like you were about even with them, with your team playing more aggressive but making errors probably on game points. Keep hitting but have a healthy respect for your opponent who did beat you despite not being flashy. But don't lose your confidence either.

 

[TENNIS_99]

I'm not sure this is what you experienced but I had some similar experiences I "thought" I played better but ended up lost the match.

I played a few times with those 'lock in " players - once they jump in front of me, or I gave them a chance to jump ahead of me,they never looked back. they just "lock in". I am a slow starter and suffer a lot from playing with those players. Once they "lock in", they will give me my share of winners but keep their service games. After the game I felt i played pretty well except for a couple of games, and that's the difference.

I am working toward to become one of them, and this is what i observed from them,

1.a cool head - i never heard those players asked , eh.. what's the scores? they know exactly where they stand.
2. Consistent is not enough - you need a weapon to jump ahead of your opponents, otherwise you rely on your opponent's mercy to make mistakes,
3. service game – you need to own this

 

[dmastous]

Big points.
That's what it ends up being about. Who wins the big points.
It's very easy to win more points than your opponent, a lot more, and still lose the match.
Let's say you lose a set 7-5. To amplify we'll say all the games you win you win at love. So you've got a total of 20 points on those games to 0 for your opponent. All the games they win go to one deuce (and only 1 deuce each for ease of addition). That's 28 more points for you and 35 for you opponent. Adding that up you've got 48 points to your opponents total of 35.
This is simplistic and very much unlikely, but an example of a situation where you've clearly played better, but lost.

 

[RiosTheGenius]

this is not a rare thing. I remember a match a few weeks ago where my oponent had such a good serve that he won all his serving games either at 0 or 15 or 30... but I never even had a break point. while I really struggled to hold my serve and managed to hold every time even though I saved at least 12 break points throughout the match. I ended up taking both tie-breakers ( 7-5, 7-3 I believe) and won the match, but he was clearly the better player that day with more winners, more aces, less UE. it's kinda funny , but stuff like that happens.

 

[arky-tennis]

every match... i have the mentality of a grapefruit and i get pissed off.

 

[james_R]

Sounds like you really enjoyed the match, playing how you like to play, and against good competition. As long as you had a great time...

 

[equinox]

You may have lost the big points. The major momentum shifting points and games. 7th game, 1st point, 30-30, ads..

 

[RiosTheGenius]

it is also nice when your opponent plays better but you end up winning.

 

[RiosTheGenius]

Brad Gilbert was the king of this.
I don't think he ever was the better player on a tennis court, but he managed to win matches..... not as often as he claims though

 

[goober]

this is not a rare thing. I remember a match a few weeks ago where my oponent had such a good serve that he won all his serving games either at 0 or 15 or 30... but I never even had a break point. while I really struggled to hold my serve and managed to hold every time even though I saved at least 12 break points throughout the match. I ended up taking both tie-breakers ( 7-5, 7-3 I believe) and won the match, but he was clearly the better player that day with more winners, more aces, less UE. it's kinda funny , but stuff like that happens.

yah I had a match just like this recently. This guy was bombing his serves in and playing real aggressive. His kick serve bounced above my shoulders. I could not break him. I usually got 0-2 points off him when he served. I held my serve but we had multiple deuces on most of my service games. I also ended winning in 2 tie breakers and my opponent was really pissed that he lost against me. His problem was that he played way too aggressive when I was serving. If he had thought about what he was doing, working on strategy and adjusting to my game he should be able to beat me easily like 6-2 6-1 because his strokes were definitely 4.5-5.0

 

[Kaptain Karl]

spirit - A few comments....

a) If this is a constant occurence ... you and your partner should ask a friend to "chart" one of your matches. This may help you identify what key points you guys are losing. (And point to a strategy to improve.)

b) If this is a rare occurence ... be encouraged. I would submit you and your partner are making progress toward reaching the next level. (Even when you play good strategic doubles, you will lose to teams more experienced at winning the key points.) Practice practice....

c) What kind of team are you two? When I am pairing my HS Boys teams, I look for two kinds of pairs: Touch & Power or Steady & Risk Taker. I believe they balance each other well in these teams. Sometimes you'll see teams of players who look like a "matched set" (skill & ability-wise) but in my experience, this is rare.

Interestingly, my pairings also frequently balance each other psychologically. And I always assign one of the two players to be the Captain of the team. (I believe "somebody" needs to be in charge.) Usually the Captain is the most psychologically stable personality -- the coolest under pressure. I have learned choosing the smartest player as Captain is usually a mistake. For me, the coolest player is almost always the better leader.

d) Lastly, a knowledgable friend ... a Coach ... an Instructor teaching you a series of doubles classes ... may be helpful.

(I remember two buddies who were in a tourney match against a guy about 6'5" and his partner, who was barely 5'4" tall. Every time my friends found themselves lobbing, they'd lob the tall guy. And "Mr. Giant" had a great overhead. On a changeover, my buddies asked me what I'd suggest and I sarcastically suggested they "keep lobbing the Giant. By all means *never* lob the short guy!" They "got" my message, changed that one tactic, and won the match.) Sometimes, the correction is really obvious to an observer....

- KK

 

[matchpoint]

Played doubles last night. I swear it seemed as if my partner and I played the better tennis, won the more spectacular points, and certainly played more agressively. In one game, we won at love and all the points were won by volley winners at the net by us - a wonderfu game. And in general we were the more agressive team, taking the net more often. We even were up on our opponents during the second set 4-0 before winning it close 6-4, and we were up on our opponents 3-0 in the third set, but let them pull even and then win it. At the end of the night, we lost 3-6, 6-4, 4-6. Now, since we lost, we must have made more errors than our opponents, because I know we hit more winners. But it just didn't seem that way to me. I still think we should have won the match.

Any of you have an experience like this? How do I more objectively analyze what happened? How do we play these guys next time?

This happens when you don't play smart. You have to know how to play the score. You have to know when you should go for the kill or play it safe. This doesn't mean that you have to push, it just means waiting for the opportunity.

No other pro player knows how to play the score better than Pete Sampras. He doesn't have to bagel you, he conserves his energy and waits for the opportunity. In the end he beats you 6-4, 6-4.

You should know how to play the score between games and between sets.

 

[RiosTheGenius]

true .....ten characters