Every year it rains at Flushing, Where is the ROOF??

situation needs to be fixed big time! McEnroe brought up interesting topic how they went for more capacity as opposed to roof, and how the boys who made the decision regret it now
 

sureshs

Bionic Poster
Haven't you read that the best civil engineers in the world have evaluated a roof on Ashe and found it impossible to build due to the size and soil issues?
 

tudwell

Legend
People complain when it rains and there's no roof, but then they criticize Federer for winning on "indoor" grass at Wimbledon.
 

AnotherTennisProdigy

Professional
Can they put a roof on the Louis Armstrong or grandstand, or is the ground still not good enough to support it? Would cost less and we could stop having these ridiculous monday finals.
 

Ico

Hall of Fame
Can they put a roof on the Louis Armstrong or grandstand, or is the ground still not good enough to support it? Would cost less and we could stop having these ridiculous monday finals.
How would you deal with tickets? Not everyone with an Ashe ticket could fit in Grandstand.
 

TennisA

Rookie
Can they put a roof on the Louis Armstrong or grandstand, or is the ground still not good enough to support it? Would cost less and we could stop having these ridiculous monday finals.
That has been suggested so many times, but the USTA's excuse is that it would be unfair to those who bought seats to a packed-house at Ashe, but couldn't get into Armstrong/Grandstand due to lack of space.
I sort of buy it, but on the other hand, match actually occurring > no match
 

TonyB

Hall of Fame
Haven't you read that the best civil engineers in the world have evaluated a roof on Ashe and found it impossible to build due to the size and soil issues?

I'm an Engineer and this is absolutely true. Just because people WANT a roof doesn't mean the stadium geometry and surrounding structure can support it.

That's not to say it CAN'T be done, but the cost would be unbelievable and the amount of reconstruction that would be needed for the stadium itself would take more than 1 year, so the US Open would have to be "deferred" from that stadium for at least 1 year, if not more.

It never ceases to amaze me that people complain about things that they know nothing about.


And yes, they most certainly could add a roof to one of the smaller stadiums. But as has already been mentioned, that would be a logistics nightmare, as the number of Ashe tickets far outnumbers the tickets for either (or both) smaller stadiums. So, some legitimate ticketholders would still be out of luck when it rains.
 
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Wuppy

Professional
Ridiculous not to a build a roof on a major stadium anywhere outside southern california or arizona.
 

The Meat

Hall of Fame
situation needs to be fixed big time! McEnroe brought up interesting topic how they went for more capacity as opposed to roof, and how the boys who made the decision regret it now
Possible 2 day delay at this point for this years US Open, time to petition!!!
 

The Meat

Hall of Fame
I'm an Engineer and this is absolutely true. Just because people WANT a roof doesn't mean the stadium geometry and surrounding structure can support it.

That's not to say it CAN'T be done, but the cost would be unbelievable and the amount of reconstruction that would be needed for the stadium itself would take more than 1 year, so the US Open would have to be "deferred" from that stadium for at least 1 year, if not more.

It never ceases to amaze me that people complain about things that they know nothing about.


And yes, they most certainly could add a roof to one of the smaller stadiums. But as has already been mentioned, that would be a logistics nightmare, as the number of Ashe tickets far outnumbers the tickets for either (or both) smaller stadiums. So, some legitimate ticketholders would still be out of luck when it rains.
Create a large inflatable balloon that would rise above the the stadium and catch the rain and divert it outside the arena, engineering problem solved. :)
 

PaulFCB

Semi-Pro
They should be able to built a roof "soft top" like in Bucharest or Warsaw.



Also, I doubt a roof like that on Centre Court is too heavy ( nothing comparable to Cowboys Stadium or Amsterdam ArenA ).

I think those "best engineers" might be paid frauds just to help the guys from the USTA come with easy excuses :evil:.
 

AnotherTennisProdigy

Professional
That has been suggested so many times, but the USTA's excuse is that it would be unfair to those who bought seats to a packed-house at Ashe, but couldn't get into Armstrong/Grandstand due to lack of space.
I sort of buy it, but on the other hand, match actually occurring > no match
Do ticket holders even get a refund? If not then at least some people get their money's worth instead of everybody going home with nothing.
 

Tammo

Banned
Ao is looking to have 3, Wimbledon has 1, RG will have one by 2016. So after 2016 USO will be the only roofless slam.
 

PaulFCB

Semi-Pro
And will they pay the people to get home ( taxi, subway, gas, ass or grass ) ?
I would be mad if they send me home for nothing, especially since some people might come from very far away.

Ao is looking to have 3, Wimbledon has 1, RG will have one by 2016. So after 2016 USO will be the only roofless slam.
Or move the US Open to Moscow, Dubai, Beijing, Shanghai, Tokyo or just choose a random civilized country, not USA, so old for this century this country... :twisted:
 
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West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
What a bunch of whiners. A drainage system and tarps - problem solved. Then not long after the rain stops they could restart play.
 

The Meat

Hall of Fame
Or move the US Open to Moscow, Dubai, Beijing, Shanghai, Tokyo or just choose a random civilized country, not in the USA, so old for this century this country... :twisted:
Fixed your sentence. :)

Also, why Moscow? They don't host any ATP 500 tournaments or better there...
 

PaulFCB

Semi-Pro
Mother Russia have been investing heavily in sport infrastructure lately.

Lots of Football Stadiums not only for the 2018 FIFA World Cup.
2014 Winter Olympics in Sochi
F1 Circuit in Sochi

Etc.

A tennis center with 3 big stadiums with retractable roofs is like nothing for Putin!
 

vsdtrek

Semi-Pro
That soft top in post 13 is interesting. Not being an engineer, I have no idea if that is plausible here at the Open.

Even if Ashe didn't get a roof, I would think roofs on some of the other big courts (assuming they are structurely able to have them) would be helpful just to keep the tournament going in the hopes that the weekend clears up. Of course, there might be some more back to back playing days or later matches to accomplish that.
 

TonyB

Hall of Fame
They should be able to built a roof "soft top" like in Bucharest or Warsaw.



Also, I doubt a roof like that on Centre Court is too heavy ( nothing comparable to Cowboys Stadium or Amsterdam ArenA ).

I think those "best engineers" might be paid frauds just to help the guys from the USTA come with easy excuses :evil:.

First off, that's a cartoon, not a real picture of a real roof. Secondly, they want a RETRACTABLE roof, not a tarp.

Of course, if it's possible to install a tarp, then that's one option. But if they really want (or need) a retractable roof, then that might make it impossible.

But I'm sick and tired of people who just say "build a roof" without understanding the challenges and limitations involved.
 

PaulFCB

Semi-Pro
First off, that's a cartoon, not a real picture of a real roof. Secondly, they want a RETRACTABLE roof, not a tarp.
Cartoon? :)
I understand Photoshop has made lots of progress lately, but not that much.



.


But I'm sick and tired of people who just say "build a roof" without understanding the challenges and limitations involved.
Biggest challenge is that New York is the rainiest of all 4 cities hosting a Grand Slam Tennis event.
Of course it's not a tragedy if you play the Final on Monday or even on Tuesday, but even though many are aware it's not easy, neither is the capacity of the arena something really necessary in such a sport. I mean, let's face it, I've seen games live on Ashe, including a final, up there...it's kinda silly to sit up there watching a game. They got it wrong from the beginning IMO. But it's surely not an impossibility to reduce the capacity a bit so the soft soil could accept a roof.
 
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TonyB

Hall of Fame
Cartoon? :)
I understand Photoshop has made lots of progress lately, but not that much.



.

Sorry, it just looked like a 3-D image, not a real picture.

But my point still stands. Maybe there are other issues with tarps, or they really need a retractable roof for some reason. Or maybe neither are options for Ashe stadium in particular. I don't really know.

Bottom line is that b!tching about it won't necessarily make it happen. There are monetary and/or engineering reasons that it can't happen right now. So deal with it.
 

The Meat

Hall of Fame
Just in: "Due to current weather conditions, tonight’s session 18 is officially cancelled. According to our weather policy, you may exchange tonight’s Session 18 ticket(s) for the same session in 2013. You may also exchange tonight’s ticket(s) for other sessions for this year’s Tournament."

Wow, just wow. Though the part about being able to exchange tickets for other sessions at this years tournament isn't too bad, you could get a ticket to a semifinals or finals night if they aren't sold out.
 

darrinbaker00

Professional
If the USTA doesn't make me pay more in membership, league and tournament fees to pay for it (assuming it's even possible from an engineering standpoint), then I'm in favor of it.
 

augustobt

Legend
Mother Russia have been investing heavily in sport infrastructure lately.

Lots of Football Stadiums not only for the 2018 FIFA World Cup.
2014 Winter Olympics in Sochi
F1 Circuit in Sochi

Etc.

A tennis center with 3 big stadiums with retractable roofs is like nothing for Putin!
I 140% agree with you.
 
I think people need to get real about the roof...It's only happening if they level Ashe completely and start from the ground (literally) up.

What is a much easier fix is scheduling...They take 3 days to play the men's first round, so that should become 2 days. They could even start first round play on Sunday, like the French Open, to give themselves more wiggle room in the schedule. Super Saturday is going away, so that will help as well in regards to the later stages of the tournament.
 

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
Its the USTA that keeps talking about putting a roof on the stadium and its prohibitive cost in order to distract attention from the fact that they should have built an entirely different, smaller and roofed stadium in the first place.




I'm an Engineer and this is absolutely true. Just because people WANT a roof doesn't mean the stadium geometry and surrounding structure can support it.

That's not to say it CAN'T be done, but the cost would be unbelievable and the amount of reconstruction that would be needed for the stadium itself would take more than 1 year, so the US Open would have to be "deferred" from that stadium for at least 1 year, if not more.

It never ceases to amaze me that people complain about things that they know nothing about.


And yes, they most certainly could add a roof to one of the smaller stadiums. But as has already been mentioned, that would be a logistics nightmare, as the number of Ashe tickets far outnumbers the tickets for either (or both) smaller stadiums. So, some legitimate ticketholders would still be out of luck when it rains.
 

SoBad

G.O.A.T.
Haven't these clown USO organizers picked up a clue yet? It rains EVERY YEAR at that dang place
The roof is in London. In New York it is wonderful when the rain breaks the heat wave. You just wander away and walk around Flushing for hours, past the fastfoods and brothels, drinking and arguing with various pushy old Chinese obachans about the quality and price of various goods and services. Sometimes it’s better than watching tennis.
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Since a full retractable roof that covers the entire top of Arthur Ashe stadium would be too heavy for both the structure itself and the soil beneath to support, why not just a partial roof that covers only the tennis court in the middle?

I'm thinking of a lightweight clear plastic roof that covers just the perimeter of the court surface (that is, the court boundaries itself plus the asphalt around it up the the first row of seats surrounding the surface). It would be supported by lightweight hollow fiberglass (or other lightweight but strong materials like graphite or something) beams that extend from the edge of the top of the stadium perimeter to the clear plastic roof in the middle, which would look like a canopy floating above the middle of the stadium that just covers around the court surface. It would have drainage built in which draws the rainwater through the hollow support beams to the outside of the stadium. And since this roof is clear plastic, there would be no need to retract it when it's sunny as the sun would shine right through this roof. A retractable roof would weigh much more than a fixed roof since all the motors, strengthening, mechanicals, and rails add a lot of weight.

Anyway, I think this may be one possible lightweight solution for a roof which will allow play to continue during rain. Since the roof itself would be rather small in relation the the entire "sky space" of the perimeter of the entire stadium and almost all of the stands would be still open air, the savings in weight of this roof solution should be significant. Yes, the spectators in the stands would still get rained on since this roof won't cover them, so they would be advised to bring rain gear to wear or umbrellas. But it's more important to have play continue since there are tens of millions more viewers on TV than spectators in the stands and the tournament needs to stay on schedule.

So that's my idea. I hope people understand what it is I'm describing.

Of course, another, maybe even easier, solution would be to just move the US Open to California where it never rains this time of the year and the weather temperature and humidity are perfect for tennis. :)
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Just in: "Due to current weather conditions, tonight’s session 18 is officially cancelled. According to our weather policy, you may exchange tonight’s Session 18 ticket(s) for the same session in 2013. You may also exchange tonight’s ticket(s) for other sessions for this year’s Tournament."

Wow, just wow. Though the part about being able to exchange tickets for other sessions at this years tournament isn't too bad, you could get a ticket to a semifinals or finals night if they aren't sold out.
Actually, you can't. The only tickets you can exchange tonight's tickets for are the Thursday or Friday DAY sessions:

"Exchange Tuesday's ticket(s) for either Thursday Day Session 21 or Friday Day Session 23."

http://www.usopen.org/en_US/news/weather.html
 
M

monfed

Guest
Eh this roof thing is not a big deal but the Stupid Saturday needs to go.
 

tennisboi007

New User
Haven't you read that the best civil engineers in the world have evaluated a roof on Ashe and found it impossible to build due to the size and soil issues?
I'm an Engineer and this is absolutely true. Just because people WANT a roof doesn't mean the stadium geometry and surrounding structure can support it.
That's not to say it CAN'T be done, but the cost would be unbelievable and the amount of reconstruction that would be needed for the stadium itself would take more than 1 year, so the US Open would have to be "deferred" from that stadium for at least 1 year, if not more.
It never ceases to amaze me that people complain about things that they know nothing about.
And yes, they most certainly could add a roof to one of the smaller stadiums. But as has already been mentioned, that would be a logistics nightmare, as the number of Ashe tickets far outnumbers the tickets for either (or both) smaller stadiums. So, some legitimate ticketholders would still be out of luck when it rains.
I think these two people answered your question.

-----------------------------------------------------

I just don't like how they play in New York in the first place.
Sure it's a great city and all but when it comes down to it the weather is terrible for tennis.

This whole rain thing and getting off schedule ruins the experience of the event not only for the players but for the fans as well.
I'm sure no one likes to start their tennis match at midnight, or have to wait until the next day b/c of a rain delay.

I realize now it's too late to change the location but other parts of the country would have been better at this time of the year.
 

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
They should just roof the other two main stadia and sell both a standard ticket plus the right amount of insurance tickets that guarantees a transfer to the roofed stadium.

Any unsold tickets can be sold to other patrons.

Standard ticket holders who can't transfer get a refund.
 

merlinpinpin

Hall of Fame
People complain when it rains and there's no roof, but then they criticize Federer for winning on "indoor" grass at Wimbledon.
That's okay, should they build a roof at the US Open, the VB will then insist on discounting all of Federer's wins there (including the ones he's already got), since it would now officially become a "meaningless year-end exo". And everyone would be happy. ;)
 

bluetrain4

G.O.A.T.
They should just roof the other two main stadia and sell both a standard ticket plus the right amount of insurance tickets that guarantees a transfer to the roofed stadium.

Any unsold tickets can be sold to other patrons.

Standard ticket holders who can't transfer get a refund.
I always thought that until the main stadium has a roof, they could put a roof on Armstrong, and then have a tiered ticketing system for the semis and finals, whereby a some (but not all) patrons' tickets would indicate two seats - one for Ashe, and one for Armstrong in case of rain.

Obviously, some ticket holders would not have two seating options since Armstrong is smaller, but they would know that beforehand and understand if a match got rained out on Ashe, they'd be out of luck. The Ashe tickets for those patrons would be amongst the cheapest.

But, I doubt this would ever happen. First, what about all those expensive luxury boxes. I'm sure the corporations and organizations that purchased those would not accept being left out in case a match transferred to Armstrong. And, it could be a logistical nightmare getting everyone moved if a match started on Ashe and unexpected weather occurred, and a match had to be moved to Armstrong. Finally, I simply don't think the USTA would allow the court with the roof to not be the main stadium.

A roof will happen eventually, when they build Ashe from scratch. And, I'm betting the USTA doesn't think it has got enough years out of Ashe quite yet. So, we'll have to deal with it for a bit longer. At least they moved the men's semis to Friday.
 
Arthur Ashe stadium is the greatest abomination in spectator tennis. I think most who have spent time in the monstrosity agree. The upper deck seats offer a worthless perspective on the tennis court. You're better off watching it on TV.
 

bluetrain4

G.O.A.T.
Arthur Ashe stadium is the greatest abomination in spectator tennis. I think most who have spent time in the monstrosity agree. The upper deck seats offer a worthless perspective on the tennis court. You're better off watching it on TV.
And, while the atmosphere can be electric if completely full, it's just not well designed and intimate. The lower bowl (basically the seats below the luxury boxes) just isn't big enough. The number of people really close to the court is too small, IMO.
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Arthur Ashe stadium is the greatest abomination in spectator tennis. I think most who have spent time in the monstrosity agree. The upper deck seats offer a worthless perspective on the tennis court. You're better off watching it on TV.
Frankly, I think you're better off watching it on TV no matter where you are inside Ashe, except maybe the front row. I've watched matches from inside the luxury suites and even there you could hardly see anything on the court. That's why when I used to go, I would always just buy a grounds pass, which still gets you into Armstrong and the Grandstand, and just avoid Ashe stadium altogether. It's a lot cheaper, too. :)
 

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Still raining again today. :(

With today's packed schedule they really don't need more rain.

OK, time to move the US Open to California. :)
 

PaulFCB

Semi-Pro
Marion and Sharapova were just getting ready to finish their warm-up and rain started again.

OK, time to move the US Open to California. :)
I think New York City would be willing to built a tennis center from scratch just to not let another side of the continent take that away from it.
Maybe they can make a cosmic effort and move everything somewhere inside the city.
How is the soil up there in Willets Point? It looks like a 3rd world zone anyway, maybe it can handle more weight, plus, it's just around the corner from Corona Park.

Rain is pouring now atleast hoping for a fed- berdy match
Hmm, the forecast is good for tonight. But aren't they going to use those hours for the Round 4 games and move Thomas Berdych-Roger Federer for tomorrow?
 
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