Fed and Rafa shoe soles Aussie 2017

Discussion in 'Pros' Racquets and Gear' started by brownbearfalling, Feb 8, 2017.

  1. brownbearfalling

    brownbearfalling Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2006
    Messages:
    1,806
    Location:
    WA
    while watching the Aussie final there was a brief snap of both Rafa and Fed shoes. Looks like they have custom soles? Fed seems to have a carbon mid foot support plate. Anyone have more info on the shoes? Flyknit? Vapor speed sole?

    For Rafa looks like he has the sole of the courtballistec 1.3/2.3. Any news on why he reverted back to those soles? Not really new news since he was playing ballistic 4.3 painted to look like lunar ballistec
     
    #1
  2. mach2joe

    mach2joe New User

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2011
    Messages:
    90
    Federer has have carbon fiber shank plates in his shoes forever. Rafa shoes are just PJs as we know it :D
    [​IMG]
     
    #2
  3. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    This has been the case for all of their careers, ever since I think 2008 or 2009 they have had practically unchanged shoes just with different upper designs.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    #3
  4. xFullCourtTenniSx

    xFullCourtTenniSx Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,828
    I'm a scrub to shoes. Is there any real difference in different soles?
     
    #4
  5. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    Their personal foot shape for comfort. It's very personal
     
    #5
  6. xFullCourtTenniSx

    xFullCourtTenniSx Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,828
    Isn't the sole the bottom rubber part?...
     
    #6
  7. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    Yes, the shape and tread of it is custom made for them and their personal needs. The sole includes the shape of the bottom of the shoe.
     
    #7
  8. xFullCourtTenniSx

    xFullCourtTenniSx Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,828
    Okay, well what I meant was how much of a difference does the tread make?
     
    #8
  9. Rhino

    Rhino Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2005
    Messages:
    7,732
    Location:
    South of London, west of Moscow
    Heres the retail sole:
    [​IMG]

    And here's Federer's actual sole from the same colourway:
    [​IMG]
     
    #9
  10. xFullCourtTenniSx

    xFullCourtTenniSx Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,828
    But what's the difference in their performance?
     
    #10
  11. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    Personal preference, To Roger its the greatest shoe ever made, to you or me it could be a super wide, traction-less mess.
     
    #11
  12. xFullCourtTenniSx

    xFullCourtTenniSx Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,828
    But if I feel like it's a traction-less mess, then there's a difference.
     
    #12
  13. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    yes, to you. Essentially, find the shoe that works best for you, Roger found that a Zoom Vapor 6 was the best one for him so he is still using it to this day just with a different upper to match that of the retail. I personally like the Asics Gel Resolution 5 the best so I keep buying them (I own about 3 pairs at the moment), they won't last forever though and I will probably have to switch to the Resolution 6.
     
    #13
  14. kimguroo

    kimguroo Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    3,735
    A little surprised to see that it's not real carbon fiber...... it's just PJ.
     
    #14
  15. Rhino

    Rhino Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2005
    Messages:
    7,732
    Location:
    South of London, west of Moscow
    What makes you say that?
     
    #15
  16. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    I mean it's a vapor 6, im sure it's real with a clear plastic coat for protection.
     
    #16
  17. kimguroo

    kimguroo Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    3,735
    I don't know it's angle of pic since the light might create reflections and looks like there is a clear plastic.
    Or light reflection made looking like glossy carbon fiber?
    You should tell me since you have the shoes haha
    Protection for carbon fiber??? For what? Carbon fiber is strong material than clear plastic. Carbon fiber does not need protection. The reason for using carbon fiber is light and strong.
     
    #17
  18. British Tim

    British Tim New User

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2017
    Messages:
    95
    Location:
    Wiltshire, UK
    It does benefit from protection in lots of applications. Its impact resistance is pretty poor, and a combination of heat and oil will make it delaminate pretty quickly. (I'll let others decide if that's relevant on a tennis court)

    There are 2 parts to a carbon fibre composite (the clue is in the name ;-) ) the fibres themselves, and the (often resin) material that it site within.
    Often the resin is clear - this can make it look like there is a clear plastic layer over the top. And sometimes there is (a plastic layer that has better impact resistance - not offering structural strength but just stopping the resin getting scratched or cracked.

    Not for nothing are carbon fibre structures on aircraft not usually left bare.

    (I studied Aero Engineering, specialised in materials, and did 9 years in the RAF)

    No idea what the norm is in shoe making though.
     
    #18
  19. kimguroo

    kimguroo Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    3,735
    I thought using carbon materials to shoes is making lighter. At the same time, carbon material will give strong impact resistance (I am not an engineer haha). If plastic layer gives better impact resistance for shoes, why Nike put carbon material with a plastic layer instead of better quality plastic similar to retail version? Since there is nothing wrong with retail version and every pros use retail version except Fed himself.
     
    #19
  20. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    It's pretty dumb to just leave out carbon fiber exposed. Why do you think racquets have clear coats over their exposed carbon fiber like the hyper prostaff for example. Carbon fiber doesn't stand up well to pure friction with the ground. You cover it so it looks nice and glossy and so that it doesn't get destroyed after 3 matches.
     
    Ihatetennis likes this.
    #20
  21. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    Well, nike had the carbon material on retail shoes in the form of the vapor 6. They just change the model every few years to make you want to buy more. Federer wants the carbon fibre composite with clear resin so he gets it. The public doesn't have access to fully personal shoes so they can't choose the soleplate they specifically want.
     
    #21
  22. British Tim

    British Tim New User

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2017
    Messages:
    95
    Location:
    Wiltshire, UK
    CF is also an easy way to make very small runs of things rather than tooling up injection moulding for plastic (eg just the shoes for one specific player!) so that may be it. Perhaps his plate is shaped for his foot, and productions ones are generic?

    Or maybe it's just to drive fanboys wild and keep them buying every variation of RF gear chasing the high...
     
    Arti likes this.
    #22
  23. Seth

    Seth Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2009
    Messages:
    3,677
    Location:
    Shinbone Alley
    Just imagine the Air Oscillate with a Vapor 6 sole.
     
    FedLIKEnot likes this.
    #23
  24. Rhino

    Rhino Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2005
    Messages:
    7,732
    Location:
    South of London, west of Moscow
    It's carbon fibre.
     
    #24
  25. kimguroo

    kimguroo Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    3,735
    Always thought and believed that real carbon was used for Fed's actual shoes but light made some reflective spots on carbon material and thought it might be not real carbon hahaha.

    I still have vapor 6 and Nike did not used real carbon materials to retail vapor 6 shoes. Same thing goes to vapor 7 and 8. Middle part has carbon looking but it's just cheap plastic.
     
    #25
  26. teckid

    teckid Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2008
    Messages:
    146
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Part of that sole pattern originated with the Vapor Speed (the "second" vapor) from way way back. Mostly the hourglass or pill shaped pattern and circle cut outs.
     
    #26
  27. Rhino

    Rhino Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2005
    Messages:
    7,732
    Location:
    South of London, west of Moscow
    It's the truth Ruth

    [​IMG]
     
    #27
  28. Arti

    Arti Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    865
    Im sorry, its a composite of various sole patterns
     
    #28
  29. Dave1982

    Dave1982 Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2014
    Messages:
    1,301
    It's not the same as the V6 sole...yes, the carbon shank in Federer's PE shoes is the same shape as the shank found in the V6 but the tread pattern on Federer's shoes compared to that found on the retail version of the V6 is completely different....and the shank on the retail version is also just plastic as opposed to CF.

    As a few have indicated, Federer and Nadal have been using the same outsoles and tread patterns on their individual PE shoes since at least 2009, which coincided with release of V6 and Ballistec 1.3.
    Federer then used a paint job version of the V6 throughout the 2010 and 2011 seasons as for whatever reason he didn't warm to the V7's and V8's, obviously he then moved to the V9 upper in 2012 and has remained with these and V9.5's since.
    Rafa on the other hand moved with the times and wore the 1.3, 2.3 and 3.3 and 4.3 uppers - occasionally using a paint job of the previous model for first tournament or two of the season.

    Obviously in each case, the upper used by Rafa and Federer is not exactly like that of the retail models with a few features unique to each player found on their respective PE's...plenty of threads can be found on here detailing such differences.
     
    #29
  30. penguin

    penguin Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2014
    Messages:
    554
    Roger's not gonna be playing in the rain so doesn't need those channels from the retail shoe
     
    #30
  31. 70sStrokes

    70sStrokes New User

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2015
    Messages:
    8
    Carbon fiber also gets a clear coat for UV protection.
     
    #31

Share This Page