Fed, Hewitt push new scoring system? I do not like it

D

Deleted member 688153

Guest
For once I would disagree with Roger's usually wise words.
Changing the basic rules of the game is not on, in my book.
 
S

Strobe Lights

Semi-Pro
I see no quote from Fed discussing the format and Hewitt says he hopes it will take off, but that could easily be in reference to its impact at a recreational level.

It just seems to be a fun way of introducing this new format they want to push at club level.
 
Warmaster

Warmaster

Hall of Fame
"This new format will be initiated by Tennis Australia and it will hopefully help players at club level to fit with their busy schedules."

This is not about the pro game.
 
Enga

Enga

Hall of Fame
To me, service lets dont make much sense in the game today. It might have been introduced in the past to encourage people to "go for it", taking a lower trajectory over the net instead of just lobbing it in.

But why should pros be given that? If they touch the net, fault. These guys have so much topspin its so unlikely anyway, and is just a time waster.

Same thing could be said about hitting the netcord mid rally possibly. But in that case, it kinda adds and unexpected element to the game, the netcord interrupting play and making awkward situations that are fun to watch.
 
clayqueen

clayqueen

Talk Tennis Guru
Why is Fed so obsessed with speeding up the game? Does he think tennis fans are bored watching great tennis matches? Why not just play best of 21 if he really wants to speed things up? I agree with getting rid of service lets.

The beauty of tennis is the scoring system because the match is never lost until it's won. There is always a chance for the player trailing to turn a match around. Will they reduce the cost of the tickets, because I think the quicker matches will be short changing the fan, some of whom would have gone to great expense to be there, travelling across the world, and taking time off work.

Will the players get the same prize money for just a knockabout? How will we know who is the 'GOAT' with different scoring systems? :)

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
 
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veecee

veecee

Rookie
So the OP titles this thread in a certain way and everyone thinks it's fact?

C'mon people, read the links carefully before commenting. This is a Tennis Australia initiative to try and get more people playing tennis at the social and lower levels, and they've managed to get 2 former No 1's together to help promote it. This has nothing to do with the Pro game!

And Fed hasn't even commented on this scoring system yet and the haters have come out swinging???
 
clayqueen

clayqueen

Talk Tennis Guru
veecee said:
So the OP titles this thread in a certain way and everyone thinks it's fact?

C'mon people, read the links carefully before commenting. This is a Tennis Australia initiative to try and get more people playing tennis at the social and lower levels, and they've managed to get 2 former No 1's together to help promote it. This has nothing to do with the Pro game!

And Fed hasn't even commented on this scoring system yet and the haters have come out swinging???
Click to expand...

That's a relief!
 
TennisLovaLova

TennisLovaLova

Hall of Fame
4 innovations:

- no more "let" at the servive
- no more advantage at 40-40
- set won when you win 4 games
- TB if 3-3

Best of 5 sets.

Seems very good to boost tennis in clubs in my opinion.
 
jiddy-p

jiddy-p

Semi-Pro
clayqueen said:
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Click to expand...

The thing is, it is kinda broke. I don't know if you watched Basel this year, but attendance was shocking. Tennis is not in a healthy state, not at the club level, and not on the ATP. It's hard to find a vibrant rec club these days, and there are fewer and fewer young people taking up the game.

One of the reasons for this could certainly be the time factor. I'm like everyone else, I like to play for ages, I'm not satisfied with a session unless I've played 3 solid sets, or around 2 hours, and if I'm feeling good, I wanna go 5 sets. Add travel time, prep time, and that's easily 3 hours at least. I like to play twice a week if I can, thats 6-8 hours a week. A lot of time.

Anyways, I think it's good to evolve a bit and experiment. I definitely think net cords should be faults at the pro level, or just continue play, it's such a waste of time. No advantage is also interesting, though the ad deuce back and forth is a classic hallmark or tennis, I wouldn't want to get rid of that.
 
D

dominikk1985

Legend
jiddy-p said:
The thing is, it is kinda broke. I don't know if you watched Basel this year, but attendance was shocking. Tennis is not in a healthy state, not at the club level, and not on the ATP. It's hard to find a vibrant rec club these days, and there are fewer and fewer young people taking up the game.

One of the reasons for this could certainly be the time factor. I'm like everyone else, I like to play for ages, I'm not satisfied with a session unless I've played 3 solid sets, or around 2 hours, and if I'm feeling good, I wanna go 5 sets. Add travel time, prep time, and that's easily 3 hours at least. I like to play twice a week if I can, thats 6-8 hours a week. A lot of time.

Anyways, I think it's good to evolve a bit and experiment. I definitely think net cords should be faults at the pro level, or just continue play, it's such a waste of time. No advantage is also interesting, though the ad deuce back and forth is a classic hallmark or tennis, I wouldn't want to get rid of that.
Click to expand...

I agree. the top guys are still huge media stars and make more Money than ever but that is because the TV stations are bigger und everything concentrates on those stars.

at the lower Levels Tennis is struggling in many big countries (for example Germany and the USA).
 
jiddy-p

jiddy-p

Semi-Pro
dominikk1985 said:
at the lower Levels Tennis is struggling in many big countries (for example Germany and the USA).
Click to expand...

Yeah I agree, I moved to Germany this year and I was so excited about tennis, I thought it would be so vibrant here. It's dead! Just old geezers at the club drinking more beer than playing actual tennis. Literally no young people at the club I have been playing. Youngest is maybe 28.
 
RF-18

RF-18

Talk Tennis Guru
I think this is just a try and a ''thought''. Don't think Federer is that serious with changing it to this.

But I don't agree with this and hope it doesn't happen.
 
Gary Duane

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
RF-18 said:
I think this is just a try and a ''thought''. Don't think Federer is that serious with changing it to this.

But I don't agree with this and hope it doesn't happen.
Click to expand...
You are one of the people here who posts things I admire.

Do you know of Jimmy Van Alen?

Most of his ideas never got accepted, but the tie break was his idea.

All of his suggested changes were not adopted, but it's not a bad thing that ONE of them was.
 
RF-18

RF-18

Talk Tennis Guru
Gary Duane said:
You are one of the people here who posts things I admire.

Do you know of Jimmy Van Alen?

Most of his ideas never got accepted, but the tie break was his idea.

All of his suggested changes were not adopted, but it's not a bad thing that ONE of them was.
Click to expand...

Appriciate the nice comment. Right back at you.

I've heard that the tiebreaker was his idea wich has worked out pretty well, but what were the other suggestions?
 
Chico

Chico

Banned
The OP is completely misleading.

This is like saying Novak and Murray propose changing sets to be played until wining 8 games since they did that in WTF "final".

:roll:
 
Sentinel

Sentinel

Bionic Poster
The two friends will play an exhibition in Sydney with a completely new scoring system. The match will be played on a best of 5 sets with the following variations:

No advantage system
No service lets
Tiebreakers at 3-all
Sets of first to four games

This new format will be initiated by Tennis Australia and it will hopefully help players at club level to fit with their busy schedules.
Click to expand...

This is for THEIR EXHIBITION MATCH, not for the ATP tour, silly !!!
 
Surecatch

Surecatch

Semi-Pro
I like the superset format for club level, but the service let rule and the no-ad scoring system are just not good ideas in my opinion. Especially at the pro level.

I think it's human nature to look for ways to improve, but there is nothing wrong with tennis the way it is. Don't mess with it is what I say.
 
moonballs

moonballs

Hall of Fame
TennisLovaLova said:
4 innovations:

- no more "let" at the servive
- no more advantage at 40-40
- set won when you win 4 games
- TB if 3-3

Best of 5 sets.

Seems very good to boost tennis in clubs in my opinion.
Click to expand...

My thinking of club time management problem is that the main issue is the difference between long match and short match is too much. If the event reserve too much court time it leads to waste or under utilized resources in the economic sense. And if it reserve too little court time it can't finish. So no ad is in the right direction of making the match times more even. But the best of five is not as good as best of threes in time management. I think the best solution is no ad, no let in serve, regular sets for first 2 but supper TB for last.
 
Roddick85

Roddick85

Hall of Fame
Not a good idea. Even if this is aimed at the rec/club level, I doubt it will find any adopters save for maybe the old timers playing doubles maybe? Fact is, for most rec/club level player that are in decent shape, they would rather follow what the pro's do. I don't see the point in playing shorter 3 game sets when you usually need at least 3-4 games to get used to the playing style of your opponent if your competing in leagues. Actually the thing that bugs me the most at my club/league is that matches are sometimes too short (30-45 mins max) and if your opponent starts with the serve, you can be on the losing end even if you were never broken which doesn't make sense to me.
 
Bartelby

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
The scoring system is there to encourage recreational players to drop in for quick games, that is all.

I can't see it 'taking off' at any level.

Just another gimmick invented by a management always keen to show how innovative they are.
 
BHud

BHud

Hall of Fame
Pouet156 said:
So, if the ball touch the net but lands in, is it called fault or is it in play ?
Click to expand...

In play assuming they utilze the current D1 college rules. This was put in place several years back to curb the amount of cheating...too many players were calling good serves lets...
 
m2nk2

m2nk2

Hall of Fame
This was trialled in Futures about 15 years ago. It was horrible and didn't catch on. Lets hope it stays that way.
 
G

Gemini

Hall of Fame
I'm pretty sure this is only for the exhibition. It's very similar to the WTT format where they get in five matches in a very short period of time.
 
smalahove

smalahove

Hall of Fame
jiddy-p said:
No advantage is also interesting, though the ad deuce back and forth is a classic hallmark or tennis, I wouldn't want to get rid of that.
Click to expand...

I'm all for speeding things up, but I wholeheartedly agree that the deuce back-and-forth is a key part of tennis, both as a viewer and as a player (both serving and receiving) - I love the feeling of pulling two points together, and even if I loose the game, it's still been a good fight. I could live with best to 4 games set and no let, though.
 
Dan Z

Dan Z

Semi-Pro
kOaMaster said:
This sucks about as bad as the "new" Badminton scoring system.
Click to expand...

Not sure about that - the new badminton scoring system is indeed a horrible load of cr@p but I think whats proposed here for tennis may make the game a bit more exciting. That being said the current system is ok too... doesnt neccesarily always make exciting TV viewing though..
 
J

JMR

Hall of Fame
The service let rule contributes nothing to the game except delay. It should be abandoned. I've been arguing this for many years.

Some of these other "innovations" are hardly that. For example, no-ad scoring and shortened sets were used by top pros in World Team Tennis starting in 1974. These ideas are at least 40 years old!

I don't necessarily favor all these changes for the current pro tour, as opposed to recreational events, but they shouldn't be regarded as scandalous. Sometimes cumbersome, historically derived processes do need to be streamlined. What worked in 1894 may not be ideal for 2014. Table tennis spent most of its history with a 21-point game scoring system. In 2001, that changed to an 11-point system, but with more games in a match. Players got used to it.
 
M

merlinpinpin

Hall of Fame
Sentinel said:
At the pro level, just scrap the sets. Have a tie break only.
Click to expand...

This was actually done in the '80's, a whole tie-break tournament played in one night in Milan (the same day as the Bercy final, can't remember the year). Best of three tie-breaks, starting from the quarters. Lendl (who was #1 at the time) won it.

Edit: must have been 1986, as I seem to remember that Becker flew there as soon as he won Bercy, and Lendl beat him in Milan.
 
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S

sureshs

Bionic Poster
Wonderful idea. If cricket can move to 20/20, so can tennis. In the modern world, we don't have the time to watch long matches. Tennis is inherently a boring sport. We have to make it more attractive.
 
N

Netspirit

Hall of Fame
Good, TV-friendly scoring system.

Instead of "no lets" I would introduce a "net is out" rule, for perfect fairness.

In addition to short sets (1-2-3-set), I would change the scoring system within a game from 15-30-40-game to 1-2-3-game, for perfect symmetry.
 
S

sureshs

Bionic Poster
I would also look into new technology, like a sliding layer, which allows changing of surface type every set. It is really appalling that in today's world of customization, the surface type has to be fixed. We are talking artificial clay and grass, of course.
 
jaggy

jaggy

Talk Tennis Guru
I am torn, not necessarily about this one which I would need to examine closer. The game does seem to be losing fans and money, something probably needs to change. I tend to be a traditionalist about sport so I just don't know.
 
dlk

dlk

Hall of Fame
sureshs said:
I would also look into new technology, like a sliding layer, which allows changing of surface type every set. It is really appalling that in today's world of customization, the surface type has to be fixed. We are talking artificial clay and grass, of course.
Click to expand...

Interesting & cool concept; that would be wicked, then we would have a bunch of other stats we could debate. I guess we'd have to leave the slams 'as is' to retain a little tradition (USO & Aussie not so much).
 
anubis

anubis

Hall of Fame
Jeesh, it's just an exo match. Not like they're lobbying to rehab the ATP tour. #smallpotatoes
 
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