TheFifthSet
Legend
Memory problems?
You said hate in the post I quoted. I was responding to your usage of the word. Zagor's post featured absolutely zero hate towards Nadal.
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"Federer is focusing on the larger picture by skipping clay"
- Thread starter BeatlesFan
- Start date
Memory problems?
You said hate in the post I quoted. I was responding to your usage of the word. Zagor's post featured absolutely zero hate towards Nadal.
YellowFedBetter
Hall of Fame
Fed never had real mono. If he did he wouldn’t have even been playing period. I know people who have had it and it will knock you on your a—. Ask my mom. Or @TheGhostOfAgassi who's a doctor.
duaneeo
Legend
Because Nadal the opportunist took advantage of Roger in his worst form ever, that's how it even got to 23-10
Eleven of 20 Fedal meetings that happened during Roger's peak/prime years were on clay (55%), even though only 4 of the 14 big tournaments are clay (30%). Then they met 4 times in 2013...Federer's worst-ever (full) season. Federer finally decided: Hey, I'm going to be the opportunist for a change!
TheFifthSet
Legend
So, do you reckon that playing a full clay court season would not put a dent in his chances to win Wimbledon?
13 events a year at 36/37 is reasonable. As is skipping the part of the year where he has little chance to do well, especially when competing on clay hampers his chances in the events he would be favoured to win.
I wish some Humbalito's would quit it with the faux concern for the game or whatever. They know that the game is actually in a better place with Federer playing 13 tournaments a year at 36 rather than 17, because he's consequently fresh for most-all of those tournaments. Fed's detractors just want him dead tired by the time Wimbledon rolls around, which also allows for the faint hope that Federer will make it far enough into a clay court tourney to lose to Nadal.
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YellowFedBetter
Hall of Fame
If this was a story about any other player most here would rip the s—-out of them. But Dorian Gray fans suddenly get all pragmatic when it comes to their guy.
Many of these lauding him for his scheduling are the same ones that scream cheater when Nadal or Djokovic skip events due to injury.
But it does also say something about the state of the game that a 36 year old cherry picking events can still dominate.
Many of these lauding him for his scheduling are the same ones that scream cheater when Nadal or Djokovic skip events due to injury.
But it does also say something about the state of the game that a 36 year old cherry picking events can still dominate.
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
The bigger picture
Looks like the amount of chicken breast I get through in one week...
duaneeo
Legend
mike danny
Bionic Poster
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Roger wasn't really the opportunist as Nadal was once again back to his best in 2017Eleven of 20 Fedal meetings that happened during Roger's peak/prime years were on clay (55%), even though only 4 of the 14 big tournaments are clay (30%). Then they met 4 times in 2013...Federer's worst-ever (full) season. Federer finally decided: Hey, I'm going to be the opportunist for a change!
mike danny
Bionic Poster
And yes, he was a bit worse in 2009 than in 2007.
AO: pushed to 5 by Berdych in 2009, did not drop a set in 2007. And no, Berdych isn't a strong era player if that is what you want to imply.
FO: struggled against numerous players in 2009, dropped just 1 set before the final in 2007.
Wimb: nearly lost to Roddick in 2009
USO: lost to Delpo in a slam final. 2007 Fed doesn't lose to Delpo in a slam final.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
See, cherry-pickingNo he failed to do that In 08 at MC, Hamburg, RG, W , onto 2009 AO .
Both at a very good level then .
Then in 2013 , Rafas greatest ever season, he feasted on him 4 times also ( even at the WTF, Cinci, and IW ) .
Roger cant live with the best version of Rafa.
Fed was fine at AO 2012, but Rafa wasn't peak at AO 2017.
I rest my case.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
In that case, what was wring with Nadal at 2007 Wimb and 2017 AO? Was he suddenly not peak in those matches because he lost them?
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roleaux987
New User
Also kev 2013 is a beautiful example of nadals weak era vulturing wait for fed to get injured and djokovic to dip. Djomovic on form we know the script 7-0 7-0. No sets even. 2010, 2013, 2017 wow remarkable coincidence that these are some of the worst years weak era wise ever (certainly 2010)
Nope not by standards set by fed which we are discussing here. These are a good three months here and there primarily when djokovic has declined and in general weak eras and dips in forms of big players. When djokovic is playing well - 7-0 7-0 we all know the script.
2017 would have been a classic nadal wait for djokovic to go away so i can vulture but hey ho nadal thwarted by a 36 year old plus standard mugs who take out nadal of slams as per usual... mueller this time. Who knows who it will be next? Fognini? Pouille? Other guys you havent heard of?
Nope not by standards set by fed which we are discussing here. These are a good three months here and there primarily when djokovic has declined and in general weak eras and dips in forms of big players. When djokovic is playing well - 7-0 7-0 we all know the script.
2017 would have been a classic nadal wait for djokovic to go away so i can vulture but hey ho nadal thwarted by a 36 year old plus standard mugs who take out nadal of slams as per usual... mueller this time. Who knows who it will be next? Fognini? Pouille? Other guys you havent heard of?
SLD76
G.O.A.T.
This from a poster with nearly thirty comments in this thread alone!
This from a poster with nearly thirty comments in this thread alone!
yes because I am fascinated by idiots who are obsessed by H2H soap opera nonsense fantasies.
roleaux987
New User
Thanks another grrat example year. No djokovic and wait for fed to have a dip in form.
And lol fes did 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 and only had a marginal dip in form in 2008 - youd hardly even tell as he is that good. Nadal on other hand has 9 months and then will drop of a cliff. Imagine nadal doing a 2004, 05, 06, 07,08,09 like run hahahahahahahaha lets get 9 months first. Baby steps
SLD76
G.O.A.T.
roleaux987
New User
Forget those @kevaninho why is nadal 2-1 down to mueller at wimbledon? He was playing some of his best ever tennis too. 2-0 to dustin brown when nadal was at peak and had just won a slam? Fognini, pouille, davedenko i could go on.
Thats why nadal cant win wtf even if on clay. He cant beat top 8 players in a row. He can beat 6 mugs and put all eggs in basket for a final but cant if he needs to play only good players
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roleaux987
New User
Where is dustin brown in GOAT list due to his h2h v nadal? Would you say dustin brown is ATG due to h2h vs nadal?
Wait youre saying h2h doesnt get you squat? It isnt important? No dont be a hypocrite h2h is everything mate. Dustin brown is an ATG simply due to his perfect h2h vs nadal. In fact he is probably GOAT not even fed or djokovic managed a perfect record vs nadal
The writer seems to be drawing parallels in between the last and this year but I don't see it. Hasn''t Federer lost to Del Po in the final of Indian Wells (smashed his racket frustrated knowing what was in days/months to come) and given up on Miami this year? Me think there are reasons not to compare Roger's last to this year and why he has been unwilling to step on the clay. Anyhow, blaming such a great tennis player would be wrong as much as it is to put wrong comparisons forward or to look for one's excuses.
eldanger25
Hall of Fame
Nice is lovely in the springtime, I hear. Also lets him get a few matches in the week before RG, so he's a little more surface-ready for the slam but can be done with his clay season within a few weeks (since the premise is that Rog can still play very little clay, relatively speaking, while going for the CYGS).
duaneeo
Legend
You want us idiots to "get a life", but you're so fascinated by us idiots that now you have no life. Oh how sad.
zagor
Bionic Poster
Conversely, many of those ripping Fed for skipping clay don't bat an eye when Nadal skips IW/Miami and shows up in tremendous form for the CC season.
I also somehow don't see you start calling Nadal Mayweather as he inevitably trims downs his schedule further into his 30s (as any ATG who lasted that long did).
Remind me, who is #1 again? State of the field is indeed appaling (TBH I don't quite remember it ever being this bad) but "Dorian Gray" isn't the only one taking advantage.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
Don't you get bored?
I understand that a man needs to do what he needs to do, but I can see how it can get very tedious very quickly, and interfere with the pleasure of eating.
oldmanfan
Legend
More than one:
1) Play.
2) Not play.
3) Injured, so can't play.
4) Fake injury, so won't play.
5) Yo, I'm old, can't run like a rabbit every week.
Fed is in role #2 right now.
Maybe #5?
Both?
Its a stupid discussion as long as you just can say "im injured".More than one:
1) Play.
2) Not play.
3) Injured, so can't play.
4) Fake injury, so won't play.
5) Yo, I'm old, can't run like a rabbit every week.
Fed is in role #2 right now.
Maybe #5?
Both?
You can't prove an injury, so In tennis It means everything from being afraid, or not want to lose, or being careful, to being in a hospital.
If Roger just said he got injured vs the Kokk, then what? Everything is ok? Then he magically returns fit and ready in Stuttgart. Lol.
If you dont play you dont play. If you retire you retire. Come up with any excuse you want, i dont care. In my eyes there is NO difference in Fed skipping clay and Rafa skipping IW/Miami. They dont play, thats It, noone can know If they are honest or not.
Clay lover
Legend
Agreed.
oldmanfan
Legend
That's the catch. For Fed, whose best surface and slam is grass/Wimby, it's not really 'play RG at the expense of 1+ MS1000.' It's 'play RG, at the expense of 1+ MS1000, and have his chances at Wimby blown to smithereens.' RG is simply too close to Wimby, lacking recovery time from fatigue and/or injury. Case in point, 2016 clay + Wimby.
I'm aware he was newly returned from knee rehab during 2106 clay, but it's reasonable to say that 2016 clay screwed his grass chances royally. Heck, it was curtains for Fed's 2016 after Wimby. Had he been stubborn to play on after 2016 Wimby, his injury might've been worse.
Dolgopolov85
G.O.A.T.
The current state of the field is that Nishikori has made a strong comeback on clay. And he still won only in a close three setter over clay. Dimi, Goffin are all in reasonably good nick. Clay is off to a good start and promises to be better contested than the other parts of the season just like last year. Of course, things could still go wrong but for a while now, clay has shown a good level, albeit not a Nadal beating level. But it's a good enough level to dispel the Fed walkover to RG final fantasies that some of you seem to have invested so much in. No, it will be a hard grind to the final if at all he gets there and only to leave him exhausted for Wimbledon. Oh wait, I forgot you belong to the select club of Fed fans who actually hate Wimbledon and don't think Wimbledon's favourite son should be playing there anymore. Whatever.
oldmanfan
Legend
Sure. Move RG to 3 weeks earlier and I'm fairly certain he'll play it.
It's not that RG is clay (a part maybe), but it's proximity to Wimby. 3 weeks from RG end to Wimby start, then likely a grass prep (Halle) in between. Not enough time to recover from fatigue and/or injury. In other words, not worth the risk.
Fairly smart call from *******.
Dolgopolov85
G.O.A.T.
Basically. He is skipping the masters because he is really not interested in contending for clay masters at this stage of his career. He would only to play them as a tune up for a slam. Since the slam is too close to Wimbledon, he is not going to play RG in which playing MC/Madrid/Rome doesn't make sense either.
oldmanfan
Legend
Right? And Delpo is already 37yrs old! Unlike Fed.. Oh.. wait.... wrong Delpo?
heninfan99
Talk Tennis Guru
Delpo is much more brave than Scarederer
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
Don't you get bored?
I understand that a man needs to do what he needs to do, but I can see how it can get very tedious very quickly, and interfere with the pleasure of eating.
I am just too darn disciplined. I eat the same food at the same time, every day, year in year out...just hardwired to be that way.
The only time I don't is when I am traveling abroad, since I cannot have as much control then.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
The only one who is dying inside is you, buddy.
That is total nonsense. I love Wimbledon, but I love the other Slams as well. He just shouldn’t skip one Slam just to prepare for another. That’s all.
And for Nishikori and his great “comeback” against Federer would have no chance as you try to suggest: Just see how badly he gets beaten today and you’ll see how little “competition” he would be to Nadal AND Federer. One close win over Zverev of all people proves nothing.
Dolgopolov85
G.O.A.T.
Love the way you hyphenate Federer and Nadal on clay when they are so far apart on the surface. That is precisely the problem, you can't see how much he has declined on clay. Nishi losing to Nadal has no bearing on the possible outcome of a match between him and Fed on clay. Why? Because Nadal beats the field on clay and it's a long, long time since Fed did that on clay.
And if skipping one slam happens to improve his preparation for his favourite slam, by all means he should.
We never saw how he plays on clay after he improved again on other surfaces since the start of 2017. Also before Federer wasn’t that bad as you try to suggest. His last loss at RG was against Wawrinka in the form of his life. Shortly before he was in the Rome final. Yes, the Gulbis match in 2014 was bad, but he also had that kind of losses at the other Slams against Stakhovsky and Seppi.
Also in some way RG is not that hard to play as a clay Masters. At RG you have to play 3-5 sets every second day. At the final four days of a clay Masters you have to play 2-3 sets every day against great competition.
And for the preparation thing: I’m quite sure he would have won Wimbledon in 2017 anyway because he was as unbeatable as almost never before in his career.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
That is also the impression I get from you.
I was maybe hoping for an answer in the vein of what other protein source would be a good solution as an alternative to that, as I cannot imagine sacrificing the variation in my meal, especially if there are other alternatives.
Would you do a short list of what are according to you the best five protein sources of animal origin from the best to the worst (regardless of price and abundance/scarcity)?
Dolgopolov85
G.O.A.T.
Yes, one loss to Stakhovsky in his worst year since 2003 totally negates his chances on a surface where he's won 8 times!
Love the way you guys stoop down to denigrating his record at the other slams just to talk up his chances at the one slam where he's been least successful. As for the last para, considering he got drained at the WTF just playing Shanghai and Basel, I don't see how playing RG won't be taxing. You're right that RG itself won't be as taxing as the Masters but what realistically would his chances be just turning up for RG without playing any of the clay tune ups? Yes he did it last year at AO but (a) that was a miracle and (b) what worked on hard court won't necessarily work on clay.
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kevaninho
Hall of Fame
See, cherry-picking
Fed was fine at AO 2012, but Rafa wasn't peak at AO 2017.
I rest my case.
Being 'fine' and 'peak' are different things. Sorry to break that to you.
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
That is also the impression I get from you.
I was maybe hoping for an answer in the vein of what other protein source would be a good solution as an alternative to that, as I cannot imagine sacrificing the variation in my meal, especially if there are other alternatives.
Would you do a short list of what are according to you the best five protein sources of animal origin from the best to the worst (regardless of price and abundance/scarcity)?
Right.
I get my protein from various sources, each one I eat at specific times during the day. The chicken breast is normally by final meal. But, whole eggs, white fish, oily fish, chicken breast, turkey, lean cuts of beef, lamb, whey protein. These are my sources, so I while I eat the same stuff, the meals are different during the different times of the day. I try to optimize my hormonal activity, and of course what foods I need pre workout and post workout.
Dolgopolov85
G.O.A.T.
At any rate, Fed in 2012 was no stronger than Nadal in 2017. So if you want to count one match for the 'narrative', you have to count the other too
kevaninho
Hall of Fame
I don't claim those things. In 2007 Nadal wasn't as good on grass as Federer. That is simplifying it. Whats the problem?
In 2017 neither of them are at their best level, and it was a toss up on the day. Federer won, deservedly so.
Once again, no issues here.
Why are you attempting to put words into my mouth?
Tennis_Hands
Banned
Right.
I get my protein from various sources, each one I eat at specific times during the day. The chicken breast is normally by final meal. But, whole eggs, white fish, oily fish, chicken breast, turkey, lean cuts of beef, lamb, whey protein. These are my sources, so I while I eat the same stuff, the meals are different during the different times of the day. I try to optimize my hormonal activity, and of course what foods I need pre workout and post workout.
Thank you!
Always interesting to see what other people are doing to maximise their efforts, and learn something along the way.
zagor
Bionic Poster
Yes, one loss to Stakhovsky in his worst year since 2013 totally negates his chances on a surface where he's won 8 times!
Man, you might as well be talking to a wall at this point. If there are people who seriously believe that a near 37 year old can play a full schedule and have deep runs on both clay and grass then so be it.
Thankfully Fed isn't one of them and knows he has to prioritize if he still wants to remain on the tour.
kevaninho
Hall of Fame
I think the 3 times 5-0 streaks Nadal has against Federer is a lot worse .
Federer is supposed to be the GOAT, yet was on losing streaks 3 times in his career to his nearest rival. LOL That's baaaaaddddddd
mike danny
Bionic Poster
And what made Nadal in 2008 as good on grass as Fed all of a sudden? The fact that he won? It's way too convenient...
kevaninho
Hall of Fame
Youll have to explain what youre talking about, as you've jumped into a conversation and youre making no sense....
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
He actually was outplaying Federer from the baseline at W 2007, the quality of that match was insanely high. It was Federer's impeccable clutch serving that held Nadal off, that was the difference.
kevaninho
Hall of Fame
No, but clearly you could see from 2006 to 2007 the gap was closing. It was inevitable that eventually he would beat Fed on grass, no?
Whereas on clay Fed seemed to get worse against Nadal over time.
I mean wasn't Fed still in his supposed peak in 07 ? Yet he was mighty close to losing to a clay courter at his pet slam.
