Arvind Sridhar
Semi-Pro
Yep feel the same. Almost numb. Guess it will start to sting more tomorrow. Feel I need a break from tennis at the moment.
- Status
Yep feel the same. Almost numb. Guess it will start to sting more tomorrow. Feel I need a break from tennis at the moment.
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
I agree with you here, and this must be why I am coping with this loss (albeit a devastating one), pretty well. Once the draw was announced, I wanted Roger to beat Rafa. Once he did that, the expectations were met for me. I never expected him to beat Djoker in the final and thought he'd lose in four sets. Djokovic isn't an immediate thread to get near Roger's 20 slams, Rafa is and he took care of business on that end at least.
TearTheRoofOff
G.O.A.T.
Didn't watch. I turned into the worst fan ever after the first set.
AceSalvo
Legend
Break?
USO just a month away. Get ready for another wild ride. Call it a day after that.
D
Deleted member 743561
Guest
All true.
I am really pretty adept at compartmentalizing and/or ID'ing silver linings, etc. And would usually have a solid recourse pretty readily.
The nature of this loss has thrown me for a loop, though. Haven't felt this way about a sporting event in forever.
D
Deleted member 743561
Guest
Yeah, after that third set, I went to scoreboard watching. Nausea had begun setting in.
ghostofMecir
Hall of Fame
This is only the second time in 28 years (time period that we have ATP data) that the losing player in a slam final won more total points, more return points, and the dominance ratio. The other... was the 2009 AO Final.
This is the most one player has been better than an opponent in a slam final and still lost from matches we have numbers for (since 1991). Basically, if you plug these numbers into an algorithm, the algorithm will tell you that thisnokayer has a 99%+ chance of winning.
In 2008...Nadal and Federer were pretty even and Nadal was playing his best ever game. This one...the 38 year old was so much better except for the TBs and that serve game when it was on his racket. Just crushing, really. The GOAT race and debate should have been over by now.
1999 RG Final
Total points: Medvedev, 152; Agassi, 145
Return points won: Agassi, 61; Sampras, 54
Dominance Ratio: Medvedev, 1.02
2001 Wimbledon Final
Total points: Ivanisevic, 153; Rafter, 150
Return points won: Rafter, 53; Ivanisevic, 42
Dominance Ratio: Rafter, 1.07
2008 Wimbledon Final
Total points: Nadal, 209; Federer, 204
Return points won: Federer, 71; Nadal, 69
Dominance Ratio: Federer, 1.02
2009 AO Final
Total points: Federer, 174, Nadal, 173
Return points won: Federer, 71; Nadal, 69
Dominance Ratio: Federer, 1.01
2015 USO Final
Total points: Djokovic, 147; Federer, 145
Return points won: Federer, 60; Djokovic, 52
Dominance Ratio: Federer, 1.02
All points other than break points: Federer, 134; Djokovic, 122.
2016 USO Final
Total points: Wawrinka, 144; Djokovic, 143
Return points won: Djokovic, 62; Wawrinka, 42
Dominance Ratio: Djokovic, 1.11
2019 Wimbledon Final
Total points: Federer, 218; Djokovic, 203
Return points won: Federer, 79; Djokovic, 64
Dominance Ratio: Federer, 1.15
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TearTheRoofOff
G.O.A.T.
Holy ****, 1.16??
Edhead-Fedhead
Hall of Fame
I felt that way until he came SOOOO close! Then I became overly invested in the win, and now need to get over it and become rational again!
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
NBC is replaying, It is 5th set. 7-7. Damn !
D
Deleted member 743561
Guest
Alright, this Animal Collective is slightly therapeutic.
Little MGMT-ish.
Recognized one of the tracks. Enjoying the album, overall.
D
Deleted member 743561
Guest
A loss like that is archived for me. Done.
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
Thanks, Ghost, this really puts it into perspective. I guess the one good thing about this is that no tennis loss can ever be this gutting again. A Wimbledon final while holding 2 MP's and then losing (on his serve)... can't get more devastating.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
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Arvind Sridhar
Semi-Pro
Break till Cincinnati I meant where I'll try to not think of today's outcome......Hard to give up on him even after this....Hope the NA circuit is kinder to him....
Im(moral) Winner
G.O.A.T.
@BeatlesFan Btw Fed joins your other fave Lendl with the most slam finals lost
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
Yes, I was thinking of that today. But the good news is Fed is 20-11, Ivan was 8-11, as you surely know.
Arvind Sridhar
Semi-Pro
Yeah...break until Cincy...Going to try to forget that this match was ever played....And I usually follow the Canada masters...But not this time...
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D
Deleted member 743561
Guest
It's just all well beyond the "impossible" stage at this point for me.A recommendation for those who feel a bit down: remeber how you felt immediately after the 2014/2015 final, and how you were able to appreciate that Federer was in those after some time? It will be the same, but this time even better.
The break point futility in that USO final was maddening, but it still didn't impact me anywhere near the way this one has. Wasn't it a four-setter? And with Djoker's futility at USO, I was like "alright, take it, you... you..."
Freaking Wimbledon. Crazy fifth set. Would have been the oldest major champion in the Open Era. Could almost taste the big "F. U." to AELTC for meddling the way they did.
Nadal15thslam
Hall of Fame
I'm a Rafa fan who wanted Djokovic to win today. I really feel for Roger and his fans. He was CLEARLY the better player today and, imo, could've won this match in straight sets. Huge respect for Federer and the way he is playing at nearly 38 yo. As a Rafa fan I know how bad this losses are (2012 AO, 2017 AO, 2018 Wimbledon Semi). It'll get better with time, trust me
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
If anything , Fed has bridged the gap in levels with Djoker and Nadal
Is it too much to ask for a little decline from them at this time ??
Seriously , Novak reminded me today of Fed of 2003-07 when no one could touch him in TB
I rewatched the 8-7 game now and Fed did not get the placement on serves after 40-15. Very unlucky after serving 2 aces. Once the placement of serve wasn’t good he was always on the back foot for those 4 points .
Anyway , I would have taken a 5th set 13-12 before this match . Normally I would have expected Novak to lead all stats and Fed to sneak the tiebreak but here it was otherwise . Shame Fed broke Novak 7 times yet ended up losing
Congrats to Novak . He is too solid
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
This is why I am saying that Federer IS going to win one more slam and it will be soon. That win against Nadal will raise his confidence levels up massively, he has beaten him on hard and grass now, and he knows he can beat Djokovic. The last two matches, Paris Indoors, and Wimbledon final, it was mere points that decided it. If he keeps putting himself in those positions he can do it.
VaporDude95
Banned
A recommendation for those who feel a bit down: remeber how you felt immediately after the 2014/2015 final, and how you were able to appreciate that Federer was in those after some time? It will be the same, but this time even better.
Nah
We knew Fed still had a couple more years after those matches. That isn’t so certain now.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
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tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
The 2 previous points were aces down the T.
Eren
Professional
I am not sure if it works like that. One can also be left devastated after a loss. Happened to lots of tennis players. Borg didn't have motivation left either, Sampras couldn't get his act together after a spell of bad results (before that USO win).
Tennisgods
Hall of Fame
Indeed. For large parts of today, it actually seemed like he would defend himself from both Rafa and Novak and move clear of both again. So close. But not to be.
MeatTornado
Talk Tennis Guru
I had the same expectations. And had he just lost in 4 I'd be lamenting the lost opportunities of the 1st & 3rd sets, but I wouldn't be overwhelmingly sad.
I was extremely relaxed as far as Fed major finals go. All day yesterday and even the first hour or two of this match I was in a great mood. Because I thought he did what he had to do and this Sunday would just be gravy if he could find a way to come home with the title too.
But that's not what happened. He didn't lose this match because he's 38 or because 'going thru Rafa & Novak is too much.' He lost because he got out-toughed mentally. AGAIN.
ghostofMecir
Hall of Fame
Man...what can you say. 99.9% of the time a player who does this wins and he did it at just about 38 years old agaisnt a 6 years younger ATG.
Last 28 years (115 matches), runner-up in a slam final winning the dominance ratio
Last 28 years (115 matches), runner-up in a slam final winning the dominance ratio
- 2019 Wimbledon: Federer, 1.15 over Djokovic
- 2016 USO: Djokovic, 1.11 over Wawrinka
- 2001 Wimbledon: Rafter, 1.07 over Ivanisevic
- 2015 USO: Federer, 1.02 over Djokovic
- 1999 RG: Medvedev, 1.02 over Agassi
- 2008 Wimbledon: Federer 1.02 over Nadal
- 2009 AO: Federer 1.01 over Nadal
- 2019 Wimbledon: Federer +15 over Djokovic
- 1999 RG: Medvedev +7 over Agassi
- 2009 AO: Federer +1 over Nadal
- 2016 USO: Djokovic +20 over Wawrinka
- 2019 Wimbledon: Federer +15 over Djokovic
- 2001 Wimbledon: Rafter +11 over Ivanisevic
- 2008 Wimbledon: Federer +9 over Nadal
- 2015 USO: Federer +8 over Djokovic
- 2009 AO: Federer +2over Nadal
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MeatTornado
Talk Tennis Guru
How'd that work out in 2015? He proved he could actually win (not just compete) at Dubai & Cincinnati. Played him tough the previous year at Wimbledon. And in 15-16 it meant nothing.
He has a block against Novak at slams that's become even worse than the one with Rafa 10 years ago.
Tennisgods
Hall of Fame
With respect Hitman, I think the low bounce really helped Fed here. USO is virtually impossible for him to win these days and AO is Djokovic’s place. He won’t win FO.
That leaves Wimbledon. A year older, a year slower. No guarantee that he’ll be in this beautiful form.
Do you know the worst thing? You say if he keeps putting himself there he can do it. Well I felt really positive throughout the match that the chances would come. He played the better tennis, by a bit of a distance actually. My real fear was him getting over the line.
Didn’t do it, can’t do it and will most likely never beat Djokovic again, for that reason. And no beating Djokovic means no slams. You know that as well as we do.
I don’t think he’ll win another slam, but i’ll continue to root for him every time he tries. Just think this was the one last golden opportunity.
Tennisgods
Hall of Fame
Yep. And at his age, that kind of block is one he cannot afford.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Yes. In 2014-2015 I agree he lost because he wasn't fit enough and Djokovic had a clear physical advantage due to age. This year I'm not buying that. This time he was ready for a long match but he just kept losing all the big points.
Tennisgods
Hall of Fame
Cheers. Feels like Novak needs a few more tough losses to even things out huh?
MeatTornado
Talk Tennis Guru
Get outta here with that.
He's in good enough shape to survive and extended 5th set and then is too old to convert 2 chances on his own serve?
I'm not having the age excuses today.
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
I agree with you here. Fed could still have played another solid half hour. His stamina today was outstanding, but it wasn't enough. Missing those big chances isn't gonna cut it against another ATG in a slam final,
D
Deleted member 77403
Guest
I understand your point, but you are coming off of a very hard loss, so there is going to be IMO a little bit more of a negative feel. I personally don't see it that way, and I am very much and have been a straight shooter on these boards. I said Djokovic was winning here from the start, the same with the way I said Federer was winning in 17, and all the other slam wins. The day I know Federer is done, I will openly say it, but that day is not today. I am certain he will get a slam before he retires, and that is truly my heart felt opinion on it.
Lleytonstation
Talk Tennis Guru
FBPD (Fed Bi-Polar Disorder). I know I joke about it, but we saw the micro (breaks then gets broken) and the macro (losing this one but winning AO17).
However, after today's emotional turmoil of a match, I reflected for a bit. FBPD is the reason I love Fed. Who else can get us so emotionally attached that we have the highest of highs and lowest of lows? I know it's silly as its a man we have never met and it is just a game, but he is capable of bringing such emotion to us.
The loss today will forever hurt me more than any other sporting event ever, but Fed has to live with this on his sleeve forever, we don't. I can't imagine how he is dealing with this, then again he is good at putting things into perspective.
Yes, winning is great, but it is just a perk of being a Fed fan. The ride and journey is what makes me so passionate and emotional about Fed. Today was the roughest ride we have ever been on, but that is also why moments like AO17, WC17, and WC09 were so special.
For the great moments to be as great as they are, you need these scars.
The scar we all got today will only make future moments even greater. If there end up being no more great moments (there will be), this still bonds us with Fed more emotionally than before.
Fed proved he is human today, and I never became a fan of Fed because he wins... I became a fan because he is Federer.
However, after today's emotional turmoil of a match, I reflected for a bit. FBPD is the reason I love Fed. Who else can get us so emotionally attached that we have the highest of highs and lowest of lows? I know it's silly as its a man we have never met and it is just a game, but he is capable of bringing such emotion to us.
The loss today will forever hurt me more than any other sporting event ever, but Fed has to live with this on his sleeve forever, we don't. I can't imagine how he is dealing with this, then again he is good at putting things into perspective.
Yes, winning is great, but it is just a perk of being a Fed fan. The ride and journey is what makes me so passionate and emotional about Fed. Today was the roughest ride we have ever been on, but that is also why moments like AO17, WC17, and WC09 were so special.
For the great moments to be as great as they are, you need these scars.
The scar we all got today will only make future moments even greater. If there end up being no more great moments (there will be), this still bonds us with Fed more emotionally than before.
Fed proved he is human today, and I never became a fan of Fed because he wins... I became a fan because he is Federer.
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
Win or loss , these are experiences in life that we will remember , cherish and look back
We will not think too much about the wins he had against Cilic at Wimb or for that matter Cilic at AO, but this and the other losses are as much remembered as his wins
If at the end of the day, Nadal and Djoker go ahead in slam count so be it .
MeatTornado
Talk Tennis Guru
I couldn't believe I was rooting for the near-38 year old and didn't want the tiebreak to come. I would've been much more comfortable with them keeping on.
FederErizeD
Hall of Fame
It hurts so much ..
D
Deleted member 743561
Guest
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smoledman
G.O.A.T.
Anyone else worried that Roger picked up an injury during the clay? I remember back in Miami he was firing on all cylinders and in the grass season, the forehand lacked sting. I wonder if the hand injury is back. I'm actually more worried about that than anything I saw with the backhand today. I noticed a lot of pushy forehands and not many fearhands.
ghostofMecir
Hall of Fame
One of the interesting dynamics was Federer deciding which BH to go to (slice or topspin) because both were working well. I thought he might be best served if just continuing with the topspin all the way throughout, but the slice was yielding many PLUS situations and working Djoko’s body having to dig for so many.
As it is, he literally did everything well enough to win other than win that last point. He played well enough to win in straight sets, ran Djokovic around from the baseline more than he did in 2014 or 2015. Djokovic had zero break point opportunities until 5-2 in the fourth. That’s absolutely crazy.
This...this would’ve been the GOAT sealer because even if someone overtook him in slams or weeks at #1, you’d have a 37-38 year old winning back to back matches agaisnt the #1 and #2 players playing high quality tennis. Someone else could nominally become “GOAT” at that point, but in reality, how could anyone top this. It was literally right there.
Also, I’ve never seen Djokovic so subdued right after match point in a slam win. He knew he’d pulled another Houdini act.
As it is, he literally did everything well enough to win other than win that last point. He played well enough to win in straight sets, ran Djokovic around from the baseline more than he did in 2014 or 2015. Djokovic had zero break point opportunities until 5-2 in the fourth. That’s absolutely crazy.
This...this would’ve been the GOAT sealer because even if someone overtook him in slams or weeks at #1, you’d have a 37-38 year old winning back to back matches agaisnt the #1 and #2 players playing high quality tennis. Someone else could nominally become “GOAT” at that point, but in reality, how could anyone top this. It was literally right there.
Also, I’ve never seen Djokovic so subdued right after match point in a slam win. He knew he’d pulled another Houdini act.
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ghostofMecir
Hall of Fame
It was weird because the momentum had oddly enough swung his way:
—Early 5th set, Djokovic clearly amps up and doesstsrtd going for more on his FH, Fed’s energy flags. Djoko clearly better until 4-2 in the fifth.
—Fed makes his stand, returns well, hits the BH well and breaks, then starts a,long up the serve. Fed clearly better from 2-4 down to 8-7 up, 40-15, +10 or more in points won in that stretch
—Djoko breaks, then gets out to 40-0 on his serve game at 8-8. Thought it was done then like 2011 USO, but Fed wins a few points on return and then serves really, really well until the TB. At 11-11, he had a relatively “easy” pass with the FH on break point, doesn’t hit it well, and Djokovic hits an ugly volley that lands in, wins the point, Fed looks at his box.
—Another strong serve hold to go to the TB. I thought he had the momentum here and liked his chances had they kept playing, but also like his chances in the TB. The best TB player ever losing three straight TBs...a very small chance that happens
—Lastly, the total points were Federer 218 to 203 for a Djokovic. TB points were 21 points to 11 in favor of Djokovic. Points outside TBs: 207 Federer, 182 Djokovic.
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D
Deleted member 743561
Guest
Can someone here steer me to their favorite source for match stats?
I rarely use that Tennis Abstract site, but I'm guessing I could dig it up there?
For some reason I can never find the basic match numbers in tennis like I can for other sports such as basketball...
I had predicted 22 aces as my tiebreaker in the Racquet Bracket (assuming I wasn't blown out of contention after 1R ), and was curious to see how close I got.
EDIT: @ghostofMecir hooked it up. Thanks again, bud.
I rarely use that Tennis Abstract site, but I'm guessing I could dig it up there?
For some reason I can never find the basic match numbers in tennis like I can for other sports such as basketball...
I had predicted 22 aces as my tiebreaker in the Racquet Bracket (assuming I wasn't blown out of contention after 1R
), and was curious to see how close I got.EDIT: @ghostofMecir hooked it up. Thanks again, bud.
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Poisoned Slice
Bionic Poster
I hear ya. Heart sank a bit when he couldn't convert the chances at 40-15. A little surprised he even made it to tie-break after that. On Top Spin I'd get broken the next service game and lose the match. Sounded like Boris was on team Federer for this one, but he was just impressed like the rest. Playing very well today. Awk well.
D
Deleted member 743561
Guest
You know how putting all your eggs in one basket is foolhardy?
That's another thing that really stinks about this one.
We have so few options remaining for players to really, truly get behind.
Don't get me wrong; I like a number of players on the Tour. And I've beaten the drum big time for Zverev, in particular, as an example. Was fairly pumped for something big there.
But they all went in the toilet! And they're not clutch! They just don't work hard enough or something.
All of the supreme athletes went to other sports.
Blows.
That's another thing that really stinks about this one.
We have so few options remaining for players to really, truly get behind.
Don't get me wrong; I like a number of players on the Tour. And I've beaten the drum big time for Zverev, in particular, as an example. Was fairly pumped for something big there.
But they all went in the toilet! And they're not clutch! They just don't work hard enough or something.
All of the supreme athletes went to other sports.
Blows.
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