Federer not the greatest

nigel said:
McEnroe - more tournament and match wins
Connors - ditto
Lendl - ditto
Sampras - 6 consecutive year end No.1

Plus all of them had much more comptetion during their respective eras

I would rate Federer in the next group, in no particular order
Agassi
Laver
Federer
Edberg
Borg
Becker

Federer has won all his slams in a 6 year period in which he had almost no world class contemporaries. A quick look through his beaten opponents in GS finals attests to this:
Baghdatis
Philippoussis
Soderling
Gonzalez
Roddick
etc

When finally someone came along to challenge him, he has been unable to beat him (Rafa), and also now has a losing record against Murray.

He has just been very fortunate.

A good player, but vastly over-rated
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Epic fail!! And Mcenroe played a joke in Wimbledon final in 1984, Chris Smith. Lendl vs Pernfors in 1987. You can only beat who is in front of you. Philipoussis on grass, prime Roddick/Baggy/Hewitt on HC is a very tough matchup for most players.
 
And then the younger generation came along.. They beat Federer a few times in 2008, but Federer still made for Slam finals. He compiled a great record against Del Potro and Djokovic. Then they all bounce on that record against Murray, a up-and-comer whos 8 years younger..

Its suddenly a much better era than all the time before that. I wonder what will be said if Djokovic and Murray both lose to Federer, and Federer wins a 16th Slam.
 
joeri888 said:
And then the younger generation came along.. They beat Federer a few times in 2008, but Federer still made for Slam finals. He compiled a great record against Del Potro and Djokovic. Then they all bounce on that record against Murray, a up-and-comer whos 8 years younger..

Its suddenly a much better era than all the time before that. I wonder what will be said if Djokovic and Murray both lose to Federer, and Federer wins a 16th Slam.
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They haven't reached their primes yet! :shock::???::D:cry:
 
TheMagicianOfPrecision said:
Epic fail!! And Mcenroe played a joke in Wimbledon final in 1984, Chris Smith. Lendl vs Pernfors in 1987. You can only beat who is in front of you. Philipoussis on grass, prime Roddick/Baggy/Hewitt on HC is a very tough matchup for most players.
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Federer will go down as one of the greats. If not the greatest.
Love him or hate him that cannot be denied.
McEnroe does not have the records but is probably the best player I have ever seen and playing with tiny wooden rackets.
I'm visiting a friend in Malmo Sweden this weekend.
 
Netspirit said:
Davy got bageled by Nadal earlier in Doha but managed to come back strong. He must have been thinking of that match.

I assume that once he's down a break and the second break is looming, he just stops "wasting energy" and tries to focus on coming back in the next set. Which he almost did, by the way, as Fed got lucky twice: Davy's losing streak spanned over the very beginning of the 4th set giving him that early break, and Fed's "5 aces" comeback from 0-40 was pure luck.
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You mean that Sampras was the luckiest player ever ??
 
mandy01 said:
Right.So the match had nothing to do with Roger's significant change of tactics and lesser number of shanks.Whatever.:roll:
Typical of some of the folks here :roll:
Anyway,if Nadal is so mentally tough he should've found a way yesterday.He was playing pretty well.Instead he didnt even complete the match-I'm sorry I'm bringing this up but its exactly what some of the posts here deserve.And Del Po is out already.
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LOL. Federer didn't do jack. Davydenko just kept netting midcourt balls for about an hour and couldn't get a first serve to save his life.
 
Cesc Fabregas said:
LOL. Federer didn't do jack. Davydenko just kept netting midcourt balls for about an hour and couldn't get a first serve to save his life.
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Quote of the day. They should put this next to the list of his achievements. I borrowing this line and crediting you. Thanks!
 
Not sure if you are also taking the ****, but thanks anyway. Don't watch as much female tennis, but off the top of my head:

Graf
Navratilova
Margaret Court
S Williams

Then 2nd group
Chris Evert
M Seles
J Henin
Billie Jean King

Most over-rated
Hingis
 
And I imagine you were high as a kite last nite ridin' the Davy Express. Sorry your train derailed when the Fed Super Chief blasted through.
 
Cesc Fabregas said:
LOL. Federer didn't do jack. Davydenko just kept netting midcourt balls for about an hour and couldn't get a first serve to save his life.
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Of course he 'didnt do jack' :lol:.He just played better.He was spraying balls all over the place in the first set-and that had much to do with Davy winning it so easily.Roger already had 23 unforced errors by the first couple of games of the second set,I think.The moment he tightened screws things looked different.
Anyway Davy still played a good match save the third set.His serve of course sort of let him down in the end.
 
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nigel said:
Not sure if you are also taking the ****, but thanks anyway. Don't watch as much female tennis, but off the top of my head:

Graf
Navratilova
Margaret Court
S Williams

Then 2nd group
Chris Evert
M Seles
J Henin
Billie Jean King

Most over-rated
Hingis
Click to expand...

You overrate both Serena and Henin at this point in time. They play in the weakest era of womens tennis ever and even with that Serena has many less slams than Evert, and Henin many less than King.
 
DNShade said:
Umm....the joke Mac played in the 84 final was a guy named Connors. Chris Smith was 83.
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Chris Lewis was a hell of a player, played a great 5 setter against Kevin Curren 2 days before, at least he walked out there and played...a shocker!
Chris was no joke...show some respect you guys!
 
nigel said:
McEnroe - more tournament and match wins
Connors - ditto
Lendl - ditto
Sampras - 6 consecutive year end No.1

Plus all of them had much more comptetion during their respective eras

I would rate Federer in the next group, in no particular order
Agassi
Laver
Federer
Edberg
Borg
Becker

Federer has won all his slams in a 6 year period in which he had almost no world class contemporaries. A quick look through his beaten opponents in GS finals attests to this:
Baghdatis
Philippoussis
Soderling
Gonzalez
Roddick
etc

When finally someone came along to challenge him, he has been unable to beat him (Rafa), and also now has a losing record against Murray.

He has just been very fortunate.

A good player, but vastly over-rated
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Nigel... Just another Federer Basher! Did you think to look at Sampras opponents in his Slam wins...

Moya, Martin, Chang, Pioline, Courier, Ivanisevic, rafter.... I would say pretty similar to federers lowly opponents. With the exception of Agassi I would say their competition was very similar.

Silly thread, seen a million times just started to cause some chaos and then not a peep out of you!

FAIL
 
Agreed. Federers competition has been far too weak. I would put him just outside the top 10 male tennis players of all time. Federer has racked up all those slams because he keeps playing first time slam finalists and gift givers like Roddick. Everytime he plays quality opponents like Nadal...well we know what happens. I hope Murray doesnt wilt away like US two years ago. If Murray plays with confidence, Federer is toast.
 
Cesc Fabregas said:
LOL. Federer didn't do jack. Davydenko just kept netting midcourt balls for about an hour and couldn't get a first serve to save his life.
Click to expand...


This is a testament of how mentally strong Fed is with THE FORCE!

He just sat there on the sideline and "willed" davy into missing every shot in the match.
 
rommil said:
For Serena at Denny's!!!!!!!!!!
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:lol: that's funny

but this is funnier

cakewalk_draw said:
Agreed. Federers competition has been far too weak. I would put him just outside the top 10 male tennis players of all time. Federer has racked up all those slams because he keeps playing first time slam finalists and gift givers like Roddick. Everytime he plays quality opponents like Nadal...well we know what happens. I hope Murray doesnt wilt away like US two years ago. If Murray plays with confidence, Federer is toast.
Click to expand...
 
cakewalk_draw said:
Agreed. Federers competition has been far too weak. I would put him just outside the top 10 male tennis players of all time. Federer has racked up all those slams because he keeps playing first time slam finalists and gift givers like Roddick. Everytime he plays quality opponents like Nadal...well we know what happens. I hope Murray doesnt wilt away like US two years ago. If Murray plays with confidence, Federer is toast.
Click to expand...

Murray played with confidence at Cincinatti 09 and YEC 09 and WAS toast. If Federer is outside the top ten 10 where is your buddy Nadal?
 
cakewalk_draw said:
Agreed. Federers competition has been far too weak. I would put him just outside the top 10 male tennis players of all time. Federer has racked up all those slams because he keeps playing first time slam finalists and gift givers like Roddick. Everytime he plays quality opponents like Nadal...well we know what happens. I hope Murray doesnt wilt away like US two years ago. If Murray plays with confidence, Federer is toast.
Click to expand...

GrafSelesTroll?
 
I say we stop this subjective debate, and determining once and for all who the greatest of all time is. Lets build a time machine, and get all these guys in their primes, and have them play a tournament (round robin, single elim, double elim), and then we can crown who the greatest is.

*oh wait, we can't do that can we. Guess we can't really determine objectively who the GOAT is*
 
cakewalk_draw said:
Cincy 09!? Murray was suffering from bleeding knuckles. The YEC was just an unfortunate encounter, The wheels really came of Andy :(.
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LMAO SUFFERING OF BLEEDING KNUCKLES??? Have you once in your life played tennis idiot? and Murray is the one who punched his racket. When you are playing you focus on the game and not some scratches or extremely minor injuries that would cause you to lose concentration of the game fool. Federer kicked Murray's tail in both of those encounters and slammed winners down every part of the court. ****.

I am really looking forward to your excuses if there is a Murray Federer final depending on who wins.
 
nigel said:
McEnroe - more tournament and match wins
Connors - ditto
Lendl - ditto
Sampras - 6 consecutive year end No.1

Plus all of them had much more comptetion during their respective eras

I would rate Federer in the next group, in no particular order
Agassi
Laver
Federer
Edberg
Borg
Becker

Federer has won all his slams in a 6 year period in which he had almost no world class contemporaries. A quick look through his beaten opponents in GS finals attests to this:
Baghdatis
Philippoussis
Soderling
Gonzalez
Roddick
etc

When finally someone came along to challenge him, he has been unable to beat him (Rafa), and also now has a losing record against Murray.

He has just been very fortunate.

A good player, but vastly over-rated
Click to expand...

First of all calling those players not world Federer beat is not right. Top get to the top of the world it takes incredible work.

Another mistake you made is that Federer is 29 and Connors retired at 40!! Thats a huge gap and thats why he won more matches than Federer. Also no one really cares about how many matches you win. Its the grandslams that count. Why do you think so many people hate Murray even though he wins so many masters?

Lendl made 10 straight semifinals and Federer just made 23. The competition is still tough and Federer managed to do it. Lendl also accomplished this when competition was about the same level as today.

You could argue that Laver won 2 grand slams but it was during the time when tennis was still growing and competition wasnt that strong.

Sampras has a real good contender against Federer. But at Federer's age Sampras was still a couple of slams away from getting 14.
 
Ok the way you figure it out
Subtract 4 slams cuz of the AO
Career slam doesnt count cuz of Nadal
Subtract 5 due to inferior peers
Multiply all other player's totals by 3.14 because the argument is circular
 
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