Federer v Djokovic Shanghai 2014 or Federer v Nadal Shanghai 2017 - What was the better Fed performance?

[Hitman]

I was recently watching some highlights to get ready for this year's Shanghai and went back and watched these two as part of that, along with a few runs from Murray, Davydenko and Djokovic.

Federer in imperious form in both, and it wasn't like Djokovic or Nadal were playing badly, but Federer wasn't losing on those days.

Looking back, which do you feel was the better performance?

 

[BeatlesFan]

I think 2017 Shanghai is less impressive. Fed had overcome his mental demons against Rafa and had beaten him 3 times in 2017. Such was not the case for 2014 Fed against Novak.

 

[nolefam_2024]

God mode fed. He showed on fast courts no one comes close to him. Including the GOAT.

 

[TheNachoMan]

I forgot the 2017 Shanghai match even happened. Fed really owned Nadal in 2017. lol

 

[Third Serve]

The 2014 match was one of the best I’ve ever seen from a 30+ year old. Outclassed his opponent in just about every department except for the return.

The 2017 match was nice and Fed did play better in the overall tournament (remember he almost lost to Mayer in 2014, and he needed two tiebreaks to beat Simon), but Nadal didn’t pose as much of a challenge. Djokovic on the other hand played a good match (very good, even) and still got outplayed.

 

[Krish872007]

2014. Played just about the perfect match against a pretty good, in-form version of Novak
Came out of nowhere considering the rest of his tournament was super-patchy; could / should have lost to Mayer in R1, came out flat against Simon in the final. Matches against RBA and Benneteau were decent but nothing close to the level in the semis

He needed to redline a bit more in the Slams and stay rock solid mentally, wasn't quite able to do that consistently in that 2014-2016 or 2018-19 period. 2017-early 2018 was great of course

 

[TheFifthSet]

2014 was a shotmaking clinic, 2017 a serving clinic.

 

[Krish0608]

2014 because that was blitzkrieg. One Fed’s best late career performances on a fast harcourt.

 

[Towny]

Definietely the 2014 match, which was one of Federer's best latter career performances. Djokovic wasn't as unstoppable in 2014 compared to 2015 but he was in very good form after the US Open. He obliterated everyone in Beijing and would go on to completely dominate Paris and the WTF. He played well in this match too, but Federer was able to execute his strategy perfectly and Djokovic didn't have the answer.

Consider also Djokovic won Shanghai in the preceding two years and the following year too. Nadal on the other hand has never won it. The Nadal match was great stuff too, especially on serve, but Federer's performance against Djokovic was something else

 

[Djokovic_is_the_best#1]

Federer on fast courts at his best was the greatest ever. When he has at his god mode best he could blow anyone off court including djokodal.

Both were impressive but I’d say 2014 against Djokovic was the best and a masterclass.

 

[nolefam_2024]

Let's get this straight. Nole played the best he could. He was in form, bagelling players left and right. He had just thrashed Berdych for his life. Djokovic was getting into the god mode after USOpen 2014. For this 1 match, Roger literally demolished him.

 

[Aestheticsaboveallelse]

I was recently watching some highlights to get ready for this year's Shanghai and went back and watched these two as part of that, along with a few runs from Murray, Davydenko and Djokovic.

Federer in imperious form in both, and it wasn't like Djokovic or Nadal were playing badly, but Federer wasn't losing on those days.

Looking back, which do you feel was the better performance?

Lmfao 18-0 in favor of 2014

 

[Aestheticsaboveallelse]

Let's get this straight. Nole played the best he could. He was in form, bagelling players left and right. He had just thrashed Berdych for his life. Djokovic was getting into the god mode after USOpen 2014. For this 1 match, Roger literally demolished him.

Yea when Federer is all on point he's unbeatable

 

[Third Serve]

No votes for 2017 so far is crazy

 

[Aestheticsaboveallelse]

No votes for 2017 so far is crazy

20-0 to 2014!

 

[Holmes]

Nadal because Fed doesn't have a match-up and age advantage over him.

 

[djokovic the conqueror]

2017. Federer completely owned Nadal and made Nadal look like a mug on hard courts.

 

[Rally]

2014 was a higher level from Roger and against a stronger opponent. Roger still had his legs under him in 2014, and that match was arguably his best match of the year from a total performance standpoint. I don't know if there are any other matches that year where as a whole he was firing better on the forehand, backhand, serve, volley, twitch reflexes, point construction, and execution. That being said, to me it is still a diminished forehand compared to the way he could stroke it with the 90. With the RF97 in that match it felt like he was always thinking one shot ahead every time he hit a forehand. Compare it with most matches where he played Djokovic with his 90, for example 2010 Shanghai. There were so many points where it looked like Roger just said "okay I'm done point constructing and I'm just going to blast the forehand". It felt like he didn't have a shadow of that level of confidence on the forehand wing again until AO17. As a whole 2014 Shanghai was the better Federer, but the best sum of the parts would be 2014 movement, rally balls, and serve, and 2017 reckless abandon and feel on the "tee off on neutral balls" forehand and backhand. Volleys are a wash because Roger's always exceptional at net regardless of year.

 

[Holmes]

Yea when Federer is all on point he's unbeatable

Any ATG all on point is unbeatable.

 

[DSH]

2014 clearly, when he drove Joker crazy with his ultra-offensive serve and volley game.
In 2017 Nadal paid for the physical effort of that season and was injured in the tournament.
It was enough for him to reach the final but Federer was another level of obstacle.

 

[mental midget]

Yea when Federer is all on point he's unbeatable

what novak's done is pretty mind-boggling, but at the end of the day i think supreme offense triumphs over supreme defense. this is what we saw here.

 

[Backspin1183]

2014. In the 2017 final Nadal wasn't moving well.
IW 2017 is the better Federer performance against Nadal.

 

[Aestheticsaboveallelse]

what novak's done is pretty mind-boggling, but at the end of the day i think supreme offense triumphs over supreme defense. this is what we saw here.

But the problem with supreme offense is its much harder to summon very consistently than supreme defense and thats why Djokovic got the consistency of results

 

[Aestheticsaboveallelse]

Any ATG all on point is unbeatable.

Nah just Nadal on clay and Federer hard/grass

 

[darthrafa]

rafa did not play relatively well on fast courts, so 2014's Fed was better

 

[nolefam_2024]

Nah just Nadal on clay and Federer hard/grass

Hey fedal fan stop hating Nole because he beat your childhood icons.

That's how life goes.. MOVE ON.

Don't pollute board

 

[Aestheticsaboveallelse]

Hey fedal fan stop hating Nole because he beat your childhood icons.

That's how life goes.. MOVE ON.

Don't pollute board

I'm not, he wins the consistency battle by a landslide but not the highest level

Federers super high level happens too infrequently but its unstoppable like Nadal on clay

 

[Aestheticsaboveallelse]

Any ATG all on point is unbeatable.

This inherently contradicts itself as there can only be one unbeatable per surface, otherwise they would be beatable

 

[kishnabe]

2014 Shanghai Federer that showed up against Djokovic beats Djokovic in all 3 2014-2015 GS finals. Some BS shotmaking.

 

[nolefam_2024]

I'm not, he wins the consistency battle by a landslide but not the highest level

Federers super high level happens too infrequently but its unstoppable like Nadal on clay

What super highest level. Federer won by 2 breaks in this match. There would be even better Federer matches vs Nole than this one.

Do NOT try to underrate our guy on ttw just because Federer is more popular.

 

[junior74]

Fedberg 14 had moments of brilliance. Shanghai match was super fun to watch.

 

[NatF]

2014, it was almost like watching the "old" Fed with the serve plus one.

 

[MichaelNadal]

2014, it was almost like watching the "old" Fed with the serve plus one.

He was slicing and dicing and it was sexy af

 

[jl809]

2014 is Fed in peak trigger pulling mode, that brand of completely outrageous offence which he nearly pulled off in the USO 15 final but was far less clutch and was on a slower surface. I'm not one of those people who believes peak offence always >> peak defence, but it is very very rewatchable

 

[ChrisRF]

2014 for me as well. Djokovic was just about to start his insane run from Paris 2014 to RG 2016, the most impressive 1.5 year period in tennis history. And it would very likely have started in Shanghai if not for THIS Federer.

 

[platypus50]

2014 due to the fact that Djoker was in pretty good form that tournament.

By 2017, Nadal had lost his insane footspeed and ability to retrieve shots of Federer's that would have been either winners or unreturnables against most other opponents.

Federer was hitting his 1HBH well in all of his matches against Nadal in 2017 so there was only ever going to be one outcome on a fast HC which is a Federer win.

 

[fedfan24]

2014. when federer plays like that on a proper surface, there's only 1 winner

 

[Holmes]

This inherently contradicts itself as there can only be one unbeatable per surface, otherwise they would be beatable

Could just be a never ending match.

 

[Kralingen]

I wonder how much Fed lost due to the slowing of the courts. What if all HC Slams played like Shanghai in the 2010s.

 

[Holmes]

2014, it was almost like watching the "old" Fed with the serve plus one.

But if he'd lost it would be like watching the "old Fed".

 

[Holmes]

I wonder how much Fed lost due to the slowing of the courts. What if all HC Slams played like Shanghai in the 2010s.

Would make for an interesting thread.

 

[FeroBango]

I wonder how much Fed lost due to the slowing of the courts. What if all HC Slams played like Shanghai in the 2010s.

Quite a bit. Fast-courterer is unrivalled.

But .... it's what it is.

 

[Third Serve]

I wonder how much Fed lost due to the slowing of the courts. What if all HC Slams played like Shanghai in the 2010s.

huh I don’t think anyone has ever thought of this before

 

[fedfan24]

I wonder how much Fed lost due to the slowing of the courts. What if all HC Slams played like Shanghai in the 2010s.

curious that he demolishes them most of the time at dubai, cincy, shanghai etc but soon as you get those slow as molasses plexicushion or post 2010 decoturf he can't hit through them

 

[Pheasant]

For Shanghai, it's 2006 > 2014 > 2017. 2014 had peak Federer hitting. But 2006 hit that well, but had better footwork to line up that cannon forehand a bit more often.

 

[mental midget]

But the problem with supreme offense is its much harder to summon very consistently than supreme defense and thats why Djokovic got the consistency of results

pretty much. a point here and there though and fed would be at 22/23 slams...at the end of the day he did ok though. him, pete and maybe laver i think are the triumvirate of GOAT attacking players.

also fwiw for a good long stretch federer was outrageously consistent...that 04-07 stretch, basically single-digit loss years? absurd.

 

[RS]

Did Djokovic put one of best straight set losses in history?

 

[nolefam_2024]

pretty much. a point here and there though and fed would be at 22/23 slams...at the end of the day he did ok though. him, pete and maybe laver i think are the triumvirate of GOAT attacking players.

also fwiw for a good long stretch federer was outrageously consistent...that 04-07 stretch, basically single-digit loss years? absurd.

That won't matter when Nole ends his career. He will create a huge gap.

Without pandemic, he would have already. And 4 is a big gap already. 1/2 slams going either way in the end won't matter but the 40-15 was a huge stain vs Federer's mental toughness. It can happen once but to happen it 3 times is really poor.

 

[BauerAlmeida]

2014 because Djokovic is better than Nadal on the surface and he was younger. These compensate for Nadal being a tougher matchup.

 

[nolefam_2024]

This poll just shows how much respect ttw has for the GOAT. You can mope as much as you want but you still will be happy when fed takes down the GOAT. Especially on hc.