Federer's second serve

limmt

Rookie
Have you noticed a huge improvement in Roger's second serve since IW?

In IW, and so far in Miami, he's winning like 75% of points on his second serve, even against Rafa or Stan, which was not the case in the AO.

I think he's using a lot more the kickserve, which has an impressive effectiveness here with the slow HC, with high boucing.
 

limmt

Rookie
Yep, without back issues, it's a formidable weapon on clay. I had the impression he wanted to practice this second kickserve and volley to try an efficient way to shorten points on the dirt.

But I can't remember a period ever when Federer used to win more than 70% on his second serve constantly, even in his peak.

He always was somewhere between 50 and 60%
 

Steve0904

Talk Tennis Guru
I'm sure you can find some matches from Federer's prime where he was around 70% on 2nd serve points won. These are only single match examples so there's almost nothing to take from them. He won't do it consistently. 2 matches is not a pattern. As far as I can tell, Federer's 2nd serve points won % hovered between 56 and 59 percent in his prime (it hit a high at 60% in 2012 and a low of 55% in 2013), and this year it is right around that mark so far, but if he plays a few events on clay I suspect it'll go down.

I also wouldn't read too much into it if Federer keeps it up. He plays and wins so many matches in a year to the point where you won't see the difference in a couple pct points, and if his second serve was terrible he wouldn't be competitive right now.
 

noobforehand20

Professional
im sure the new raquet allows him to get more spin, therefore his yop spin and kick serves have to improve, i dont know if its the air and quick conditions at IW but it seemed those serves were reaching higher height
 

SinjinCooper

Hall of Fame
Kick serves don't have the same wow factor for pro returners that they do for you rec types. The higher the kick, the slower the serve is going, all else being equal. Bigger-leaping kicks make a great changeup, but if you go to that well very often, you're begging to have it crammed down your throat. In general, you want pace and depth before gimmickry when you're facing high-level returners.
 

MasturB

Legend
Kick serves don't have the same wow factor for pro returners that they do for you rec types. The higher the kick, the slower the serve is going, all else being equal. Bigger-leaping kicks make a great changeup, but if you go to that well very often, you're begging to have it crammed down your throat. In general, you want pace and depth before gimmickry when you're facing high-level returners.

Uh... Federer's kickers have been very effective against guys that return deep. We saw Lord Fedr use it very effectively against Rafa and Wawa to where they were standing almost by the stands. Even the angle Fed gets when he hits it short in the box, the high bounce forces the opponent wide and back. On the ad side it's very effective.
 

watungga

Professional
Uh... Federer's kickers have been very effective against guys that return deep. We saw Lord Fedr use it very effectively against Rafa and Wawa to where they were standing almost by the stands. Even the angle Fed gets when he hits it short in the box, the high bounce forces the opponent wide and back. On the ad side it's very effective.

On what MasturB said, it still holds true at any ATP tournaments. I would agree on your point only if we apply it on WTA or club levels.
 

coupergear

Professional
Agree. Nadal seemed to be struggling getting much pop on Rogers second, and the kicker seemed to be jumping bigger than usual.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
 

Tennisanity

Legend
Yes I definitely noticed this. I was thinking this is even bigger than his BH changes. Time and time again Nadal had so much difficultly handling the 2nd serve at IW.
 

racquetreligion

Hall of Fame
the BH steps in earlier and now the second gets more pronounced dwell time
with either a slight toss change 5-10cm further back along with magic string combo
other players are itching to copy? the guy is ahead of the pack in so many ways
even at retirement age its crazy. The seniors tour age has to be moved up to 45!
 

NGM

Hall of Fame
Federer's first serve is a bit worse than last year. Do you know why? That's because he focuses too much on strokes and not train enough his first serve or he's just overconfident that he doesn't feel pressure enough to put his first serve in?

I'm worried that his lacking of first serve can bite him back at important moments.
 

Luckydog

Professional
His 2nd serve is always excellent. The only problem is his 1st serve shining too much so that many people ignore how good his 2nd serveat is .
 
Top