Feedback on serve and volley

[tonylg]

It’s basically split stepping while running and without stopping, that eventually takes different forms from stutter step to a hop and land on both feet and others in between. Can I practice this while jogging in the park, just split stepping every 3 seconds for example?

Yes, do it just as someone approaches from the other direction.

 

[Morch Us]

And then they error on net or miss long/wide every time on practice, but during match it hits the line every single time.

I tell my hitting partners to "tee off" and go for it.

 

[BounceHitBounceHit]

You disagree that the full stop split step exists or that it's not optimal? It does exist but perhaps it's not optimal.

Look at my split:

That's pretty much a full stop: very little forward momentum. Could I have been more aggressive? Certainly.

@fuzz nation @Curious: if you single frame through this video ["." is forward; ";" is backward], you'll see that I actually did a cross-behind step, if ever so slight, on my follow-through]. And notice the return jammed me a bit so I had to move out of the way to volley.



Then maybe it's just a matter of semantics: for me, the split step is to prepare myself to move dynamically and to start from a balanced posture. Initiation of the movement towards the ball comes after I land.



I do too. Always be ready because it's eventually going to come to me.

[/QUOTE]

Yes. One should split on EVERY shot. It’s the key to court coverage. Further, Movement = Spacing=Stoke production [emoji2]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Cashman]

I put my s&v points together from the weekend match. I’m very keen to improve on this. What errors, flaws do you guys see? Especially @S&V-not_dead_yet of course.

Nice footage. You've received a lot of good tips so I won't rehash them.

On the whole split-step thing - I wouldn't get too caught up on the terminology or slow-mo of pros or whatever. Just focus on what it is supposed to achieve. That is - letting you wipe off a bit of momentum and move with balance and purpose into a solid first volley.

Watch through your video again and pause every time you hit a volley. Are you in balance and over the top of the ball, or are you rushing through the court and/or stabbing at it? If it's the latter, it's probably because you need to give yourself a little more of a pause to prepare at the moment your opponent hits the ball. How you do that (splitting, stuttering, whatever) doesn't really matter, as long as it gets the job done and feels natural.

 

[Curious]

Nice footage. You've received a lot of good tips so I won't rehash them.

On the whole split-step thing - I wouldn't get too caught up on the terminology or slow-mo of pros or whatever. Just focus on what it is supposed to achieve. That is - letting you wipe off a bit of momentum and move with balance and purpose into a solid first volley.

Watch through your video again and pause every time you hit a volley. Are you in balance and over the top of the ball, or are you rushing through the court and/or stabbing at it? If it's the former, it's probably because you need to give yourself a little more of a pause to prepare at the moment your opponent hits the ball. How you do that (splitting, stuttering, whatever) doesn't really matter, as long as it gets the job done and feels natural.

Great, except for ‘former’ instead of ‘latter’.

 

[Curious]

How you do that (splitting, stuttering, whatever) doesn't really matter, as long as it gets the job done and feels natural.

That was my gut feeling but was a bit hesitant to express it scared of being told off harshly by @tonylg that I should do it ‘properly’.

 

[Curious]

Speaking of S&V

 

[Curious]

@ByeByePoly @S&V-not_dead_yet
Back to S&V. Started practicing again.
What's good what's bad here?

 

[golden chicken]

@ByeByePoly @S&V-not_dead_yet
Back to S&V. Started practicing again.
What's good what's bad here?

Why aren't you playing out the point?

 

[Curious]

Why aren't you playing out the point?

I was just practicing the serve and first volley, specifically the split step rhythm and timing.

 

[ByeByePoly]

@ByeByePoly @S&V-not_dead_yet
Back to S&V. Started practicing again.
What's good what's bad here?

This looks like improvement… not rushed, more balanced, natural movement. I think what was catching my eye in earlier video was exaggerated long early strides.

I didn’t go back and review this thread … but I couldn’t say it better than @Cashman on the split step thing.

“Just focus on what it is supposed to achieve. That is - letting you wipe off a bit of momentum and move with balance and purpose into a solid first volley.”

I would have said the same thing … but not nearly as well. Keep in mind the objective… hitting a quality 1st volley, in balance and under control, as close to net as the ros allows. You shouldn’t give up forward coverage with a typical baseline split step. The way I thought about it is I’m running in with a required change of direction to intercept the ros. I don’t stop, and then run again. I also don’t try and keep initial full run in at moment of direction change. I wiped off some momentum.

Just go watch match video Edberg vs Becker at Wimbledon. Just watch server’s feet following in their serve. Not as cookie cutter as you might guess … and if you want to call any of that pause a split step, it’s often with the feet very close to each other.

Good work … even trying s&v at 50+ says a lot about your work you have put into conditioning.

 

[Curious]

letting you wipe off a bit of momentum and move with balance and purpose into a solid first volley.”

Yeah being ready to move in any direction, which requires a moment of slow down when the opponent hits the return.

 

[Curious]

Maybe I should focus on that momentary slowing down instead of trying to do a proper split step.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

Maybe I should focus on that momentary slowing down instead of trying to do a proper split step.

It's situational: if you watch the greats [Sampras, Edberg, McEnroe, etc], you'll notice that their first split after the return is more like a stutter step, which is optimized for forward and lateral movement. They don't do a full split because that's less efficient in getting them closer to the net and guards against the lob, which is unlikely on the return.

 

[ByeByePoly]

Maybe I should focus on that momentary slowing down instead of trying to do a proper split step.

I think it will take care of itself with reps. Sprint through it and you will get burned on those that require a big lateral move. Stop completely … and you will not close as good as you needed to (having to hit constant 1st volley at service line or deeper will be all the reminder you need. ).

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

@ByeByePoly @S&V-not_dead_yet
Back to S&V. Started practicing again.
What's good what's bad here?

What a volley at 0:27!

I assume you're splitting based on the time of opponent contact, not distance from the net.

One comment on lateral positioning: the further out wide you serve, the more line you have to cover. I noticed that you tend to follow the same angle regardless of where you served. Your partner did not test you with any hard line returns.

I like your footwork. You could work more on taking that last step rather than leaning at the waist [a big problem of mine].

On the low ones, you're not bending your knees much and instead relying on adjusting your racquet face angle, with mixed results. Of course, you have to balance that against how much your quads and knees can take.

I think you've got a solid base. As you get more match experience, your technique will naturally refine itself. And you will receive a certain # of opponent UEs simply because they know you're coming to the net.

 

[ByeByePoly]

What a volley at 0:27!

I assume you're splitting based on the time of opponent contact, not distance from the net.

One comment on lateral positioning: the further out wide you serve, the more line you have to cover. I noticed that you tend to follow the same angle regardless of where you served. Your partner did not test you with any hard line returns.

I like your footwork. You could work more on taking that last step rather than leaning at the waist [a big problem of mine].

On the low ones, you're not bending your knees much and instead relying on adjusting your racquet face angle, with mixed results. Of course, you have to balance that against how much your quads and knees can take.

I think you've got a solid base. As you get more match experience, your technique will naturally refine itself. And you will receive a certain # of opponent UEs simply because they know you're coming to the net.

Did you hear those Curious bones creaking @0:27?

“And you will receive a certain # of opponent UEs simply because they know you're coming to the net.”

50% didn’t hit it in … 40% hit Curious a sitter… 10% good shots with illusions there were more where that came from.

You know … I sold the service line volley to s&v grasshopper Curious as something to avoid, but there were many times I much preferred a bh volley at service line after serving wide deuce than low ros tighter to net. It gave enough distance to drive low over net and hit deep to corner without hitting up.

 

[J011yroger]

50% didn’t hit it in … 40% hit Curious a sitter… 10% good shots with illusions there were more where that came from.

Shots fired!

J

 

[ByeByePoly]

Shots fired!

J

What? Just heartfelt advice to my brother @Curious … love my brother Curious.

Besides … if that was “shots fired” … it was fired from a gun with a silencer.

Let’s take the silencer off :

Approaching the net in 4.5 singles is often a good bet. Approaching the net against Curious’s opponents is playing with house $, shooting fish in a barrel, buying Amazon and Apple after a trip to the future, …

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

What? Just heartfelt advice to my brother @Curious … love my brother Curious.

Besides … if that was “shots fired” … it was fired from a gun with a silencer.

Let’s take the silencer off :

Approaching the net in 4.5 singles is often a good bet. Approaching the net against Curious’s opponents is playing with house $, shooting fish in a barrel, buying Amazon and Apple after a trip to the future, …

Playing Devil's Advocate, it didn't look like the partner was trying that hard to hit difficult-to-volley returns.

 

[ByeByePoly]

Playing Devil's Advocate, it didn't look like the partner was trying that hard to hit difficult-to-volley returns.

Didn’t look at other dude in this video … there has been match video. I could be wrong … hitting to bh and running to net might not work in Australia.

 

[Curious]

Playing Devil's Advocate, it didn't look like the partner was trying that hard to hit difficult-to-volley returns.

We were practicing serves and I suddenly decided to add the volley without telling him. So yes he kept returning nice and easy.

 

[Curious]

You could work more on taking that last step rather than leaning at the waist

On the low ones, you're not bending your knees much and instead relying on adjusting your racquet face angle, with mixed results.

I’m glad I asked you. Very good points I’ll work on.

 

[ByeByePoly]

That should have been stated generically… approaching net good bet at 4.5 … even better bet at lower levels.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

That should have been stated generically… approaching net good bet at 4.5 … even better bet at lower levels.

Either my opponent's returns are getting better or my serves and reflexes are getting worse...it must be the former.

 

[ByeByePoly]

Either my opponent's returns are getting better or my serves and reflexes are getting worse...it must be the former.

Two things:

1) you have been fighting off father time like Rocky Balboa … bunch of older ttw ex-s&v players really really appreciate it
2) you ain’t playing 3.5

And yes … of course … no atrophy on your part, absolutely amazing how all of your opponents improved … even more amazing all at same time.

 

[Morch Us]

Pretty sure this was not real points play, which makes your first volleys look better than they actually were. Generally you will have better success rate to send first volleys, especially the low ones and not from a side of the court, deep back (since less angles to work with, and a sitter in the middle of the court is pretty much lost point). Of course if you are able to get the first volley above net neight, you are welcome to finish them to one side using the angles. In the video what I see is that you are hitting too many middle of the court short sitter first volleys.

@ByeByePoly @S&V-not_dead_yet
Back to S&V. Started practicing again.
What's good what's bad here?

 

[AlexSV]

Seemed like you tried to hit near every volley to the open court? If you can't make the space (or don't have the time) to get in position for a good forehand volley to the ad side, nothing wrong with a forehand volley back behind the server to the deuce side. Might prevent some of those volleys that were up the middle or sitting up for the opponent.

 

[Curious]

Seemed like you tried to hit near every volley to the open court? If you can't make the space (or don't have the time) to get in position for a good forehand volley to the ad side, nothing wrong with a forehand volley back behind the server to the deuce side. Might prevent some of those volleys that were up the middle or sitting up for the opponent.

Returner

 

[zill]

@Curious your racquet face is very open in the drop. Given up on closing it? eg dropping on edge. You were really obsessed with it a couple of years ago.

 

[Curious]

@Curious your racquet face is very open in the drop. Given up on closing it? eg dropping on edge. You were really obsessed with it a couple of years ago.

To be honest I still think about it despite the great examples that it’s not a problem: Sampras, Federer, Shapovalov

 

[Curious]

My current models are Ivanisevic and Kyrgios.

 

[zill]

My current models are Ivanisevic and Kyrgios.

why pin point? At one stage you were a big advocate of the platform stance as it's more stable?

 

[Curious]

why pin point? At one stage you were a big advocate of the platform stance as it's more stable?

Personal choice. I feel better rhythm and momentum with pin point.