Finally Some Justice: Nadal engages in gamesmanship
- Thread starter Chopin
- Start date
Cup8489
G.O.A.T.
I apologize. I was getting heated at other posters, you're not really being unfair.
And I don't consider Federer's bathroom break a harmless joke, but I would see it as less of a problem compared to someone taking one just before their opponent was to serve. That's what my beef is, doing it before a huge game in a match that was barely an hour long at that point. Rafa was doing it obviously to make Federer get tight, and while Federer may or may not have been doing the same against Davydenko, he did say that he did it to allow the shade to cross the court.
Are both examples of gamesmanship? Sure, but I consider Nadal's a larger breach, as in the Federer example Davydenko was up a set, rather than down match points or something. That's why I find Nadal's antics more deplorable, because of the timing.
sportsfan1
Legend
dudeski
Hall of Fame
The fact is that Nadal has a long history of taking MTOs whenever Fed gets on a roll. Therefore anyone can be totally reasonable and assume that this washroom break was a momentum breaking tactic. Fed on the other hand is not known to do such things.
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drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
Yes, and being that Nadal was never potty trained, the whole tennis tour should suffer at him taking them when it is most inconvenient for his opponent.
Atherton2003
Hall of Fame
156 posts on this thread discussing whether Nadal really had to pee.
TheTruth
G.O.A.T.
Thanks, Cup.
Regarding the timing of the break he must have really needed it. I know he wasn't expecting to get back in the match on matchpoint. Fed is notorious for being a great frontrunner and hitting aces on crucial points. There was no way Federer was going to be denied. Enjoy your victory. It was a masterful performance
.
TheTruth
G.O.A.T.
He's done well for someone who hasn't mastered such an elementary bodily function.
Hi drak. Long time. No see.
Atherton2003
Hall of Fame
I'll give Nadal the benefit and say that he really needed to go.....he seems to be having bladder issues lately.
drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
Not too sure about that. Lot of buttpicking going on back there.
Good to see you still posting.
drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
Yup. The moment he stopped serving, and his opponent was serving for the match. It hit him at that exact moment.
DjokovicForTheWin
Banned
You're funny. I love your sense of humour. What a wonderful post. I'm feeling all warm and fuzzy inside.
TheTruth
G.O.A.T.
Ignoring the first part. Good to see you as well.
PCXL-Fan
Hall of Fame
Thetruth is one of the blindest *********s out there. While he's being serious... dont worry most dont take him seriously.
I'm just glad this wasn't happening during a Grandslam.
Clarky21
Banned
In all seriousness there does seem to be an issue. He took 2 bathroom breaks today in his doubles match. Maybe he has the IW plague and cannot help it. I would rather players go to the bathroom when they need to rather than having them p*ss or sh*t their pants on the court. If you gotta go you gotta go,people.
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
cc0509
Talk Tennis Guru
Exactly. *******s constantly bring up this one incident with Federer yet with Nadal he makes a full time career out of MTO's and injury excuses. Gotta love it.
cc0509
Talk Tennis Guru
Please spare us with the melodrama, you were happy for the Federer win but then you go on to crucify and criticize Federer in the Nadal news thread. Hypocrite much?
dudeski
Hall of Fame
Wow, that's weird. He must have something going on
Gonorrhoea is hell of a disease.
Biscuitmcgriddleson
Professional
You mean he had no idea that he needed to release waste 4 minutes before going to the bathroom? You know, when it was his turn to serve
M
monfed
Guest
Federer took a bathroom break AFTER the first set was over(at AO 2010). Nadal does it in the middle of a set especially BEFORE Federer's service game at 5-4 no less. Jesus
Do Nadal fans even realise that Federer is a rhythmatic server compared to Nadal? Delaying Federer on HIS service damages Federer in that it hampers his concentration and takes him temporarily out of the 'moment'. OTOH Nadal can deal with a few extra seconds of delay because his serve isn't built as much on rhythm,on the contrary he prefers a little more b/w each point to recover.
And, the receiver ought to play at the server's pace unless there's a very serious problem faced by the receiver. The difference maybe 5-10 seconds but that is vital, just like how it is when the ball scrapes the line by a mm for a winner/error, it's close yet critical!
On a side note, does etiquette need to be enforced? Chew on that for a bit.
Do Nadal fans even realise that Federer is a rhythmatic server compared to Nadal? Delaying Federer on HIS service damages Federer in that it hampers his concentration and takes him temporarily out of the 'moment'. OTOH Nadal can deal with a few extra seconds of delay because his serve isn't built as much on rhythm,on the contrary he prefers a little more b/w each point to recover.
And, the receiver ought to play at the server's pace unless there's a very serious problem faced by the receiver. The difference maybe 5-10 seconds but that is vital, just like how it is when the ball scrapes the line by a mm for a winner/error, it's close yet critical!
On a side note, does etiquette need to be enforced? Chew on that for a bit.
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Nadal = Gamesmanship?!
What, you're only realizing this now?!?!?!?!
Oh, and did he really have to pee? Amazing how after just a few minutes of play, he had to take a bathroom break. And amazing how players in the past NEVER, and I mean NEVER took bathroom breaks, even in 4+ hour matches. Pathetic that the pro tours allow bathroom breaks at NAY time other than at the end of a set. Naturally, there are the cheaters like Nadal who will push the limits of the rules (time between points and Nadal?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!) since they know they can't win on merit, so they have to resort to gamesmanship.
sbengte
G.O.A.T.
So you think Fed wasn't joking ? Especially when the break was legal, non disruptive between the sets as allowed and he was back on time ?
You can only joke about something that was not meant to be gamesmanship in the first place. Exactly why Nadal doesn't "joke" about his MTOs in post match interviews. Let me know when Nadal makes a joke in his presser saying "He was playing very well, so I took an MTO to throw him off his rhythm".
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sbengte
G.O.A.T.
FWIW , here is the official word from the ATP rulebook :
O. Toilet Break
1) A player may be permitted to leave the court for a toilet break. A player is entitled to one (1) toilet break during a best of three set match and two (2) toilet breaks during a best of five set match. Toilet breaks should be taken on a set break and can be used for no other purpose.
I cannot believe that it is 9 pages on this thread and people are not able to comprehend the difference between a break taken after a set within the permissible time and one taken in between games during a set (before opponent's serve, to boot). Talking about a valid between the sets break in the thread like this defeats the whole purpose of what is being talked about. No one even notices these breaks if they are taken after a set. However if taken between games, that too before an opponents' serve, it is another story altogether.
O. Toilet Break
1) A player may be permitted to leave the court for a toilet break. A player is entitled to one (1) toilet break during a best of three set match and two (2) toilet breaks during a best of five set match. Toilet breaks should be taken on a set break and can be used for no other purpose.
I cannot believe that it is 9 pages on this thread and people are not able to comprehend the difference between a break taken after a set within the permissible time and one taken in between games during a set (before opponent's serve, to boot). Talking about a valid between the sets break in the thread like this defeats the whole purpose of what is being talked about. No one even notices these breaks if they are taken after a set. However if taken between games, that too before an opponents' serve, it is another story altogether.
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So he actually yet again broke the rules, i thought it was just gamesmanship.
yellowoctopus
Professional
Mr. Nadal would probably take the same stance on this and all the rules [that he is breaking] that it is 'is more the [interpretation] of the umpire, that's my [his] way to understand the rule'. In another word, if I (big I, not anyone else) can get away with it, it's acceptable.
Shameful, IMO.
li0scc0
Hall of Fame
I can see the story now....
Nadal finally comes clean on urination issue.
Rafael Nadal, in his press conference with the media, said the issue that has been bothering him of late. "Yes, before Indian Wells I sit in a reclining chair. I rest, no? Rest needed for body, to prepare. And then I turn funny and feel awful need to, what is the word, go pee-pee? And this urge keep happening. I thought of not playing tournament, but could not let fans down. I fear this will happen so often. I want a special brace or wrap, but how you wrap bladder? Impossible, no?"
Hahaha that's just hilarious man!:mrgreen:
SLD76
G.O.A.T.
woodrow1029
Hall of Fame
He did not break the rules. The rule says SHOULD. If it's an emergency, then he can go.
Nobody knows for sure, of course, but one can go by prior history, and Nadal has a very long and pronounced history of injury and bathroom breaks that could be viewed as attempts to disrupt the opponent's momentum. It's the Boy Who Cried Wolf, only in reverse. The fact that he has been fined more than once for illegal coaching and admits in his autobiography that he received same during the 2010 US Open doesn't help matters.
the infamous moon landing is FAKE ! now everyone at my kids school knows about it. 911 is real tho
single_handed_champion
Professional
I thought you are allowed to go to the bathroom if it is done within the changeover. I've seen it happen lots of times before. I think if you come back after the changeover ends, you lose a point, then game etc.
woodrow1029
Hall of Fame
The set break is definitely the preferred time to take a toilet break. If the player can't wait until the set break, it is then preferred to wait until before the player is about to serve (even if that means going before an even game). If it is an emergency, and the player has to go RIGHT THEN, they may be authorized to leave the court to use the bathroom. If they are authorized to leave, a bathroom break is reasonable time, and while they should be as fast as possible, they don't need to be back before the changeover time expires.
If the player has already used their allowed toilet breaks (for men, 1 for a best of 3 set match and 2 for a best of five set match), and he needs to go again, he may be allowed to leave the court, but warned that if he is not back before the end of the changeover/set break, he will be penalized under the Point Penalty System.
Biggest psych artist on the tour: Nadal. Cheap, low class, junior moves, just like his apd orig. frame at 338g. I used to call him: Rat boy. Now I call him: The Butt pick kid.
Fed asked
Never that I recall. Although Fed was criticized by some for taking a break after Davydenko had already taken his on a change over with Davy ahead at, I think it was, the Auzzie.
During the BNP semi, Fed actually asked "Do I have time?" during a rain break, and the chair asked him, "Can you wait?", so he didn't leave.
Never that I recall. Although Fed was criticized by some for taking a break after Davydenko had already taken his on a change over with Davy ahead at, I think it was, the Auzzie.
During the BNP semi, Fed actually asked "Do I have time?" during a rain break, and the chair asked him, "Can you wait?", so he didn't leave.
All-rounder
Legend
10 pages of bickering for a 2 minute bathroom break....
kanamit
Hall of Fame
It's the same arguments from the *******s everytime something like this happens: (a) if an ump doesn't enforce a clear rule, then there must not be a rule and therefore Rafa did not violate a rule. Or (b) everybody violates these rules, so it is unfair to gang up on Rafa when he does it.
It's always some tortured piece of logic constructed solely for the ad hoc purpose of defending Nadal. In order to see this clearly, just ask yourself, if somebody murders a stranger and tosses the stranger's body in the lake, but is never caught, does that mean that the murder was legal? What if the police department knows about it and chooses not to prosecute because the murderer is a powerful pillar of the community? Does it mean that the murder was legal then?
The logic is obviously laughable.
It's always some tortured piece of logic constructed solely for the ad hoc purpose of defending Nadal. In order to see this clearly, just ask yourself, if somebody murders a stranger and tosses the stranger's body in the lake, but is never caught, does that mean that the murder was legal? What if the police department knows about it and chooses not to prosecute because the murderer is a powerful pillar of the community? Does it mean that the murder was legal then?
The logic is obviously laughable.
Crisstti
Legend
Who cares?. Not everyone has to do whatever Fed does.
That's just a lie.
Another pathetic hateful thread.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
Like serving on time?
Let us face it. You and other guys will buy ANY explanation, that will excuse Nadal's behavoiur, no matter what (and do not tell me, that you did not agree with everything Nadal says. It is only in those times, when it is purely theoretical situation, where you MAY express different view than the one Nadal has, if any). So, what is the point of trying to use logic, which is flawed? Keep yourself happy by continuing to agree with Nadal, but do not throw in explanations and then say "Who cares?" If you do not care about logic, why bother arguing at all?
It may come to you as a shock, but, usually, grown men can control themselves for a couple of minutes, if need be. Also, those urges do not come suddenly, unless you have some serious physical issue. I am saying this to show you, that there is logical reasoning behind the point, that Nadal choose that particular moment to go. So, if you are going to argue you'd better bring on something better than "I believe that, that is so". You explain why is Nadal not able to control himself, like most normal people do? In this particular situation, I do not see Nadal's behaviour as correct. He could have chosen any other moment in that set to use a bathroom break. He chooses exactly that moment. You see coincidence. I do not.
Crisstti
Legend
Serving time is not the issue of this thread.
Maybe he had been holding it for a while already?. Amazing the bitterness in this thread even though Fed won.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
Oh, really? :roll:
You mean, like it occured in his service game prior to that?:-? Do you see what you are getting yourself into? You have to look for all sorts of unprobable reasons, to try to explain what happened.
Facepalm at the bitterness comment.
Post of the year so far :lol:
Already tried that argument. It's still the officials' fault apparently.
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