Fixed clamps or flying clamps on a MS200TT

[couch]

I think I'm going to get a laserfibre MS200TT and can't decide on saving a few dollars and getting the flying clamps initially and then upgrading to the fixed clamps later. Are there any users of this machine using the flying clamps? Are they good clamps or should I wait, save some more money, and get the fixed clamps? I think Tim has said if you upgrade it's basically the difference in price between the two types of clamps so you're really not out any extra money, unlike the Gamma machines (which I have considered). It costs you an additional $150 or so to upgrade to fixed clamps later on the Gamma machines.

Or does anyone have the ECO with the flying and/or fixed clamps? Can the ECO be upgraded to a MS200TT? It appears, on the website, that it can not. It appears that you can not upgrade the ECO to the sensory tension jaw. Oh yeah, anybody using the sensory tension jaw? What do you think about it? Is it worth the money down the road. It looks like that saves you a couple of steps on each string so I guess it depends on how many racquets you are stringing.

Any help would be appreciated.

 

[SunDog]

As far as I know, the ms200tt only comes with fixed clamps - you have your choice of single action or double action - but you get fixed clamps. i believe you are confusing this machine with the ECO - which i understand comes with flying or fixed clamp options - and is also upgradeable to the same operational capability of the MS200TT.

I have had a 200TT for going on 4 years now - and i think the sensory jaw is a great feature that makes the stringing process more enjoyable. I had the luxury of not being worried about the additional cost for the higher grade machine - but keep this in mind: from what I have seen, a MS200TT with either SA or DA clamps holds its value very well. I know of one fellow who bought his machine for around $700 and sold it for $630 a couple of years later. I do not know how well an ECO with flying clamps would compare on the resale front.

 

[jorge306]

couch,
I'm on the waiting and waiting and waiting list for the 'new' upgradeable ECO, with fixed clamps.
According to Tim at LF, the new ECO's are upgradeable to a TT, much like a Dell pc. So if you get an eco with flying clamps to begin with you will now be able to upgrade the turntable for fixed clamps, and also the housing for the string tensioning to convert the eco into a TT down the line if desired. I believe the ECO and TT use the same sensory jaw, the only difference being the housing unit that keeps the bar in the '2pm' position instead of having to raise it each time as with the ECO. I certainly hope that's how I understood it. If anyone knows differently, please post and inform.
This is a good site for an ECO review. I keep it as reference.

http://www.keohi.com/tennis/laserfibre/index.htm

Instead of holding out for the fixed clamps, I decided to hold out for the housing that converts the ECO to a TT with the string tensioning housing. With the fixed clamps you already have the turntable for the fixed clamps and I have read of some drawback using flying clamps.
Hope I'm understanding Tim correctly and hope this helps you.

 

[jorge306]

I think SunDog is right about the TT either being single action or double on the clamps now that I think about it.
However does anyone know if the string tensioning system is different on the ECO and TT other than the housing?

 

[fantom]

Here's a quote from Tim when I asked him about the difference b/w the TT and ECO's tensioning unit,

"You're absolutely right. The new ECO's for 05 use the same frame, same everything as the TT.. except for the Sensory Tension Jaw and the single T-bar throat hold down as opposed to the 2 separate throat hold downs on the TT.

Okay.. I'll give this a try in an email.. but it may not be as complete or as understandable as if you would like to call. Here goes:

The TT model has an automatic locking and releasing system for the tensioning lever to make a stringer's life a little easier. It means that in a normal resting position, the lever stays in a very convenient 2 o'clock position. The TT will only attempt to pull tension when it feels or "senses" the string is in the tension jaws. Only when you slide the string into the jaws will the tensioning system automatically unlock and the lever will begin pulling tension. Of course the lever can stop in any position, let's say 4 o'clock. You'll clamp off the string and raise the lever to release the tension. As you bring the lever up toward the 2 o'clock position, the jaw begins to open automatically, it releases the string. Once the jaws no longer feel the string, the lever will automatically lock again in the upright 2 o'clock position.

So in short, the pulling sequence on the TT is 2 o'clock to say 4 o'clock (or any position). Clamp off. Back to 2 o'clock and you're done. It is very fast and very simple.

The ECO, does not have the auto lock/release so it's lever rests in a down position at 5:30. To pull, you'll first raise the lever to 2 o'clock, the jaws will open automatically. You slide the string into the jaws and let the lever pull tension for you. Let's say again the lever stops at 4 o'clock, you're spot on. You'll clamp off, raise the lever. The jaws will automatically release the string up at the 2 o'clock position and then you'll lower the lever back to 5:30 which is its resting position.

So in short, its pulling sequence is 5:30 to 2:00. 2:00 to say 4:00. Clamp off. 4.00 to 2:00. Then 2:00 back to 5:30. It sound like a lot, but it it's not that different than the TT. The good news is that the Sensory Tension Jaw system can be added to the ECO at any time in the future and the ECO will become the TT."

 

[jorge306]

Fantom
Good assesment.
That's what I thought Tim said. That by just adding the Sensory Tension Jaw System you can convert the ECO into a TT.
Am curious, what if somebody got an ECO with flying clamps then puts the sensory tension system.
Will you then have a TT with flying clamps since the 's t system' is what really differentiates the eco from the tt, other than the turntable and fixed clamps?

 

[fantom]

The racquet mount is different b/w the ECO and TT on the throat of the racquet. That's the other difference, I believe.

 

[Longshot]

Tim (great guy, btw) sent me the following info last week on the MS200TT Standard & Premium machines and the ECO.

The MS200TT Models:

1) Standard with flying clamps, 4-point mounting and our EXCLUSIVE One Pull / Any Angle, Smart Weight tensioning system. 100% upgradeable to a Premium version.

2) Standard with 360-degree double action clamps, 4-point mounting and our EXCLUSIVE One Pull / Any Angle Smart Weight tensioning system. 100% upgradeable to a Premium version.

3) Premium with the 360-degree double action clamps, 5-point mounting system, Automatic Sensory Tension Jaw system and our EXCLUSIVE One Pull / Any Angle Smart Weight tensioning system

4) Premium with the single action, 360-degree swivel clamps, 5-point mounting system, Automatic Sensory Tension Jaw system and our EXCLUSIVE One Pull / Any Angle Smart Weight tensioning system



The MS200ECO Current Model:

With flying clamps. Non-upgradeable turntable. Limited availability

It appears the ECO cannot be upgraded but the MS200TT "Standard" model can. Hope this is helpful.

Personally, choices are great but selecting a stringing machine is turning out to be as tedious as picking a new racquet (only without a demo program).

 

[SunDog]

I learn something new every day.

 

[fantom]

Looks like they are now grouping the new 2005 ECO with the TT.

Here's what he sent me a while back to explain the differences:
"The MS200TT (desktop model) http://www.laserfibre.com/MS200_TT.html
$*** (after $80 LaserFibre Bonus Rebate Credit*) with the double action, 360-degree swivel clamps.
$*** (after $100 LaserFibre Bonus Rebate Credit*) with the single action, 360-degree swivel clamps.

NEW FOR 2005: MS200 ECO Component System:

The MS200 ECO is going to change a little for 2005. It is not just a face lift. It is a revolutionary new way of looking at how you buy a stringing machine. For 2005, the ECO and TT models will be able to share all the exact same components. This means you have the option to get an ECO that is 100% upgradeable all the way up to the TT model. In other words, a stringer can start out with an ECO with flying clamps and over time add features like the Sensory Tension Jaw system, fixed clamping systems until it actually becomes a TT model. A stringer could purchase the standard ECO set-ups listed below OR they could conceivably custom build their own stringing machine on the initial purchase by selecting features from both the TT and ECO that meet their stringing and budget needs. No other machine or brand of stringing machines in the world allows you so much flexibility and versatility.

The MS200ECO model http://www.laserfibre.com/MS200_ECO.html
$*** with flying clamps. Non-upgradeable turntable
$*** (after $30 Bonus Rebate Credit*) with flying clamps. 100% upgradeable
$*** (after $50 Bonus Rebate Credit*) with the 360-degree double action clamps. 100% upgradeable.
"

 

[Gaines Hillix]

I think it would be worth the extra investment to go with the ECO with fixed clamps. Fixed clamps are much better and easier to use than flying clamps to begin with, in my experience and with the additional upgrade path you have to the TT you're not locked in.

 

[couch]

Thanks a lot for the replies guys. I have received the same info. as Longshot and that is why I was wondering if the ECO could be upgraded to the TT. If it can, I may just opt for the ECO with the fixed clamps initially and upgrade to the TT with the sensory jaw later. I have e-mailed Tim the same question about upgrading the ECO to the TT. Once I find out from him I will let you guys know. But it does appear from the info. I have gotten that the ECO has a non-upgradeable turntable so I was assuming it was not upgradeable to the TT. Hopefully I will find out for sure from Tim soon.

Thanks again for the replies.

 

[jorge306]

I'm getting confused here.
I believe I'm on the waiting list for the 'new' ECO with fixed clamps, been waiting for quite some time.
Now, as I understand it, from Tim, this ECO with fixed clamps will essentially lack only the two mounting system and the sensory tension jaw 'housing' or system, since the eco and tt both grab the string in the same manner.
Am I wrong on this?

 

[couch]

jorge306, can you e-mail me how much you are buying the eco with fixed clamps for? I was wondering what that option would cost. I am debating on getting the TT but not sure if I'll go that route if I can get the eco with fixed clamps and eventually upgrade it to a TT.

k.mcadams@insightbb.com

Thanks.