Flat first serve. Having trouble getting the toss out in front.

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by Raul_SJ, May 16, 2018.

  1. Raul_SJ

    Raul_SJ Hall of Fame

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    Flat first serve. Trying to get the toss to land about 2 feet in front of the baseline. I notice my best flat serves are hit when the ball lands in that spot.

    Observations:

    Tossing arm about perpendicular to the net at point of toss release:
    Toss lands in the target zone but I don't get the shoulder coil away from the net -- I find the shoulder essential for power. Drops from 85mph to <75mph without shoulder coil.

    Tossing arm about parallel to the baseline net at point of toss release:
    I get the shoulder coil away from the net but toss lands short -- around the baseline.

    Also tried variations in between parallel/perpendicular tossing arm. And also the "J" toss with
    ~ parallel tossing arm. But not really getting consistent results yet.
     
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  2. Rattler

    Rattler Professional

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    Mmm because I was having the same issue...really mine was my first serve while still full of pop, was kicking up because my toss drifted too closs to 12:30 and it needs to be at 2/2:30 for a nice flat one.

    My tossing arm is not parallel to the net though, it’s more angled.

    BTW 1st serve flat one is working great...took about a week of practicing it to build the automaticity.
     
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  3. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Start your prep position with toss arm more counterclockwise.
    I'm old, so like my flat serve toss to land maybe 12-18" inside the court.
     
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  4. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Hit lots of flat serves.
     
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  5. heninfan99

    heninfan99 G.O.A.T.

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    Toss out in front & release the ball at your chin level this will most definitely get it out in front.

    Something like this


    The J toss is too tricky for most though can work more easlily with a low toss, Vic Braden style.

     
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  6. nytennisaddict

    nytennisaddict Legend

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    maybe toss higher to give yourself time to load/coil.. or speed up your load/coil prep
     
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  7. nytennisaddict

    nytennisaddict Legend

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    side note... when dealing with tweaking anything: toss, load/coil, etc...
    i find one always affects the other... even if slightly.
    so, to me, it's impossible to make 1 tweak, and "keep everything else the same".
    eg. if i coil my shoulders more, i might need to toss higher... or speed up the coil prep
    eg. if i tweak my toss (toss in front v jtoss), how i coil/load might change
    eg. engaging my hips more (eg. bow and arrow) affects both the toss and shoulder coil, as well as the the feel of the contact as it relates to my body
    any time i find myself load/coiling more, the contact seems "farther away" making the toss that much more critical

    what i find works for me, is a "toss, then load" type timing.... really focus on getting an accurate toss (no easy for me), and the laod/coil beneath... when everything is in sync, it feels like magic... it's a big/heavy serve (for me), that feels effortless.
    but what usually happens (in a match)... my toss is slightly off, i chase, then adjust my swing to compensate for a bad toss... then put a myriad of bandaids on the swing, rather than fixing the toss.
    then i go back to practice courts, and hit like 20 serves in a row (because i just hit 50 serves before that to get in sync)... but obvioulsy i can't do that in a match.... if only i got fbi on every point :p
     
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  8. Raul_SJ

    Raul_SJ Hall of Fame

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    With toss landing targets, I am pretty accurate landing-wise (left/right ) with a toss that drops ~8 inch from the peak before contact. Back/front still somewhat a problem

    Once in a while I hit a great serve, including load/coil, and proper landing in front, when I accidentally toss low (even around 2 inches). Think I must be speeding up load/coil. It feels good. And then I am tempted to pursue the low 4- 8 inch but am told that it takes more skill to execute a low toss consistently (eg Dolgapolov, Ivanesivic ).

    The general advice I am given is: 12 inches absolute minimum. 18 inches like Federer and 24 inches like Sampras is also great I'm told.

    For some reason, in terms of landing accuracy, I find 18 inch landing accuracy is much more inconsistent than 12, and 24 is much more inconsistent than 18. Although I hit great serves with all three if I get the toss right.

    So it's a matter of which one to practice. I am leaning towards getting it with 12 first and then maybe gradually increasing higher later.

    Does it feel like the coiling away is coming mostly after release? Or mostly before release? Both methods are acceptable...
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2018
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