Flatter Hitting (Video)

mmeyer1

Rookie
Attached is my 1st video I have taken of myself in almost a year. The main thing I was trying to do was to flatten out my shots a little bit more, mainly my forehand, while still keeping a good amount of spin to clear the net. I noticed in my old video (also attached) that my FH takeback was quite loopy and led to me hitting late quite often. Any feedback on how to further improve my strokes and make them more offensive would be greatly appreciated!

Old (July 09)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx7NdXKIJSA&feature=related
New (June 10)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBfhV8xq_KE
 

RoddickAce

Hall of Fame
Just a question, are you able to move your opponents around using angles and wrongfooting them, but can't really easily end points with a big flat shot...because if so...I seem to have the same problem.
 

mmeyer1

Rookie
Hey RoddickAce, that pretty much sums up my game... I can usualy maneuver them around with my backhand or forehand cc, but cant seem to pound out a winner unless i get a short ball. Its frustrating not being able to crank up my strokes that extra notch like some people I have played.
 

pyrokid

Hall of Fame
Hey RoddickAce, that pretty much sums up my game... I can usualy maneuver them around with my backhand or forehand cc, but cant seem to pound out a winner unless i get a short ball. Its frustrating not being able to crank up my strokes that extra notch like some people I have played.

Just take a longer stroke.
Meaning more shoulder rotation, longer loop, and more leg drive.
And try to hit smoother, don't try to suddenly speed up the racquet really fast.
 

RoddickAce

Hall of Fame
Hey RoddickAce, that pretty much sums up my game... I can usualy maneuver them around with my backhand or forehand cc, but cant seem to pound out a winner unless i get a short ball. Its frustrating not being able to crank up my strokes that extra notch like some people I have played.

It certainly is very frustrating, in a way, I think Roddick has the same problem too (relative to his peers of course).
 

myalterego

Rookie
mmeyer1, quick question:

I noticed in your video's description you were hitting at the courts of the University of Miami. Are you a current student there?
 

mmeyer1

Rookie
hey alterego, I am actually not a student there, I am a graduate of UCLA and I was in Miami doing research on the invasive anole species, and the UM courts were the nearest free courts to the house I was subletting
 

NotAtTheNet

Semi-Pro
mmeyer, I'm finishing up my grad school at UM right now. Lemme know if you ever want to hit. tvothang[at]gmail.com
 
S

saigonbond

Guest
Howdy,
I'll point out 2 things that I work on with my teams and students. Maybe it will help you: Footwork and Mechanics.
FOOTWORK:
Begin with better footwork and balance. This is the base of everything on a tennis court.
You have a tendency to hit off your back foot, often leaning back on one leg. This is the curse of the "modern" open stance forehand many pros hit with. Unfortunately, many of us try to emulate them with shabby results.
2 footwork methods to hit a harder, flatter, heavier ball:
Method#1:
With an open stance forehand, you must "load up" on your right leg. As you swing, transfer the "load" to your left leg with a small hop.
Method#2:
Step in with your left leg and hit a closed stance forehand. You will automatically transfer "the load" this way. You should already know how to do this because your 1 handed backhand is closed.
MECHANICS:
Take a longer swing path from backswing to follow through. Your current backswing is abbreviated and starts near your right ear (ie. Roddick) and finishes around your left hip. Your swingpath is almost an like an upsidedown U.
Tip#1:
Forget the "winshield wiper" forehand. This is overstated and badly taught.
Tip#2:
Try the Reverse Power "C" forehand.
From the ready position, take a swingpath in the shape of a reverse letter C. Your follow through should finish by your left ear (often caught by your left hand). This will elongate your swing and still create enough topspin for control. You already have very good racquet head speed, so this should be fun and fairly easy for you!
Tip#3:
Try pointing at the ball with your left hand or index finger. This helps you focus on hitting the ball out in front.
Tip#4:
Work on depth not power. The power comes with a deep penetrating ball.
Tip#5:
Get on a ball machine or get a better hitting partner (no offense).
Practice, practice, practice and GOOD LUCK :)
 

xFullCourtTenniSx

Hall of Fame
Just a question, are you able to move your opponents around using angles and wrongfooting them, but can't really easily end points with a big flat shot...because if so...I seem to have the same problem.

Okay... If you can use angles and wrong-foot your opponent with angles and STILL can't get a winner, there's a severe problem with your game or your concept of angles and wrong-footing.

Just keep doing it until they make an error or get a short ball. Once you get the short ball, hit deep to the open court and finish at the net. Simple as that.

Hey RoddickAce, that pretty much sums up my game... I can usualy maneuver them around with my backhand or forehand cc, but cant seem to pound out a winner unless i get a short ball. Its frustrating not being able to crank up my strokes that extra notch like some people I have played.

Okay... First off, focus on getting those short balls. Winners from the baseline (or worse, from BEHIND the baseline) are very low percentage shots. Work the point until you get an error or a short ball, then approach deep and finish at the net.

Tennis isn't about hitting winners, it's about getting one more ball into the court than your opponent can.

As for those people that can hit harder on demand, that comes from accelerating the racket through the ball.

Now to analyze your stroke...

First thing I notice is that you either send the ball uncontrollably high or short with no pace. The reason for this is your poor footwork. You can never set yourself properly to allow yourself to fully utilize your whole body into the stroke. Look at your feet when you hit a shot. I frequently see your feet coming off the floor when you hit a stroke. Also, you end up with your weight on your back foot most of the time. Your opponent isn't hitting any forcing shots, so you should be able to keep both your feet on the ground and get your weight moving on to your front foot. When you hit a shot, you want to be balanced and have both of your feet on the ground and rotate your hips through the shot. The quicker you rotate your hips, the more pop you can get without losing control since your base remains stable. It becomes far easier to hit cleanly through the ball. Of course, sometimes you can't keep both your feet on the floor (when you're backing up really quickly or deal with an incredibly high ball you didn't have enough time to properly set up for), but you should make an effort to keep your feet on the floor and move your weight forward.

Next, if you want a bigger shot, take a bigger swing and swing faster. Also, rotating your hips through the shot helps a lot and helps you move your weight forward.

Finally, hit straight through the ball if you want to hit flatter (making sure that you still have control over your racket face).

As for tactics, you should really focus on keeping the ball deeper. First off stop trying to blast the ball, and try to maintain your balance and hit through the ball, aiming for good depth and placement. After a few minutes, slowly speed up your swing speed and add spin. If you can keep your opponent behind the baseline, they can't really do anything to hurt you. If they do, then their shot was too good. If they do it throughout the day, then they're too good for that day. If they do it every time they play you, then they're too good for you and you need to keep practicing before you get to their level.

And although I said going for winners from the baseline was a big no-no, I guess I'll let you in on how to hit them. There are many ways to do it. The obvious down the line, the crosscourt bomb, the crosscourt angle, and the dip drive.

For the down the line shot, you simply hit through the ball and sort of place it down the line and deep. Swing as fast as you can where you can still control the shot. You want to use this when you pulled your opponent wide or have them off balance. If you hit it well and they are on the full run, you can charge the net behind this shot. If not, expect a short ball. Also, if you can, hit this shot on the rise and when YOU are on balance. Same goes for that short ball. Try to catch it early, but on balance.

For the crosscourt shot, either they gave you a down the line shot and you had the opportunity to hit a running forehand deep into the corner, or you're trying to pull this off in a crosscourt exchange. If the former situation, it's like hitting it down the line. Focus on depth and placement and make sure you get it in because you're on the run. Don't try to pull a Sampras. You'll either go back into a neutral rally, get a short ball, force an error, or get the winner so chill; things are in your favor.

If in a crosscourt exchange, you want to back your opponent up or put them off balance. To do this, you have two options. A deep shot that pushes your opponent back (a hard, deep crosscourt shot near the corner or a heavy topspin semi-lob into the same location) or a solid topspin angle that pulls them off the court. They will want to run back to the center of the court to cover the rest of the court. So with their response (likely either lacking in pace or depth), you quickly move up and take the ball on the rise and deep into the corner with a flat shot. You're still playing the percentages (though you take some risk by playing a flat shot), so you should make this shot most of the time. Keep in mind that since you're hitting the ball on the rise, you don't need to hit the ball as hard, just make clean contact and hit through the ball. Chances are they won't be able to recover to the corner in time, or you took it so early that you hit behind them. Even if they do get it back, you can easily repeat it constantly until you draw an error, short ball, or a winner. Obviously, you don't want to force yourself if they hit a good shot back.

The crosscourt angle winner is pretty self explanatory. Heavy spin towards the sideline.

For the dip drive, the concept is simple, but requires practice. What you require is a high ball that lacks pace. You can hit this shot from ANYWHERE on the court. Though you want to hit it from as close to the net as possible. If you're like 5 feet behind the baseline, unless you have a laser for a forehand and machine-like precision, I suggest lobbing it back or hitting a topspin drive. Anyways, your contact point is between shoulder height to the top of your head (you can also consistently hit it from chest height if you're inside the baseline). When you recognize where the ball will bounce, you need to measure out how far away you need to be so that it will bounce into your strike zone. For the setup, you need to start the racket above your contact point (usually above your shoulder). From there, you hit straight through the ball towards your intended target point with a slightly closed racket face. If cleanly hit and well placed, you can hit this at 70% and still draw a short ball without any problem. The reason you start with the racket above the ball is because you want to hit the shot with as little spin as possible. Starting below the ball will naturally force you to hit up, and you will either slow the shot down with heavy spin, send it long, or send it into the net to try and compensate. I prefer to hit this shot crosscourt, since it's the percentage shot and I can still get a winner just by placing it well and how hard I hit it. But the down the line will always be open, so that's cool too, just avoid going down the line from behind the baseline. From what I've seen, Nadal is one of the few players that doesn't use this shot too frequently. He always starts from under the ball and uses heavy spin. Agassi and Federer frequently use this shot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_oenWftWCc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqSp_U1Un2U (last forehand)

As you can see, you just need to put it off to the side. You don't need to tag lines or hit corners. Give yourself a big area to hit to and just pick a side. The pace will draw an error anyways.

Overall though, you should just look to work the point and get the short ball and work from there. Draw errors, don't go for winners unless it's an easy put-away.
 

Davis937

Professional
Howdy,
I'll point out 2 things that I work on with my teams and students. Maybe it will help you: Footwork and Mechanics.
FOOTWORK:
Begin with better footwork and balance. This is the base of everything on a tennis court.
You have a tendency to hit off your back foot, often leaning back on one leg. This is the curse of the "modern" open stance forehand many pros hit with. Unfortunately, many of us try to emulate them with shabby results.
2 footwork methods to hit a harder, flatter, heavier ball:
Method#1:
With an open stance forehand, you must "load up" on your right leg. As you swing, transfer the "load" to your left leg with a small hop.
Method#2:
Step in with your left leg and hit a closed stance forehand. You will automatically transfer "the load" this way. You should already know how to do this because your 1 handed backhand is closed.
MECHANICS:
Take a longer swing path from backswing to follow through. Your current backswing is abbreviated and starts near your right ear (ie. Roddick) and finishes around your left hip. Your swingpath is almost an like an upsidedown U.
Tip#1:
Forget the "winshield wiper" forehand. This is overstated and badly taught.
Tip#2:
Try the Reverse Power "C" forehand.
From the ready position, take a swingpath in the shape of a reverse letter C. Your follow through should finish by your left ear (often caught by your left hand). This will elongate your swing and still create enough topspin for control. You already have very good racquet head speed, so this should be fun and fairly easy for you!
Tip#3:
Try pointing at the ball with your left hand or index finger. This helps you focus on hitting the ball out in front.
Tip#4:
Work on depth not power. The power comes with a deep penetrating ball.
Tip#5:
Get on a ball machine or get a better hitting partner (no offense).
Practice, practice, practice and GOOD LUCK :)

Hey Saigon ... yeah, nice post ... yeah, the OP definitely needs a decent hitting partner ... the bas- - - - was not allowing you to hit with any rhythym ... and ... he was unable to give OP any decent feeder balls!
 

Davis937

Professional
Hey FullCourt ...

... that was just an OUTSTANDING post ... you devoted a lot of time and thought to it ... obviously ... some really excellent tactical suggestions, also ... remind me never to play singles with you ... well, you already know you would eat me up with your kicker **smile** ... I know you're going to play tomorrow (Saturday) ... so, good hitting to you!
 

Bacterio

Rookie
I really feel like the best way to improve your strokes would be to clean up your footwork a little. A lot of your shots are off balance and that's probably why you feel like you're not getting the pace you see others get.

It seems like on quite a few shots you're putting yourself in a good position so that the ball is off to your side and you don't handcuff yourself but the problem is that you never change your momentum after you get into position.

For example, the ball is coming to your right, so you move over a few steps and instead of stopping, loading up your legs and getting your momentum going forward, your momentum keeps on moving right and you end up hitting a loopy slow forehand and you fall to the right after the shot. It's really evident on the shots where you left leg comes off the ground. If anything after loading up on a shot your right leg should come off the ground a little as you unload into the shot with your momentum moving you forward into the court, not sideways.

On shots that were right in your strike zone and you didn't have to move it seemed like things went alright as far as your take back and swing, but any time you had to move you'd run into problems.
 

mmeyer1

Rookie
Hey thanks everyone for all the informative and thoughtful posts! Your suggestions have definitely opened my eyes to my mechanical and footwork issues. I noticed that I hit most of my forehands with an open stance and generate an overly spinny ball with little pace, yet when i hit with a closed stance, I can flatten the ball out more easily. Is this because it is more natural to have my weight moving forward in this stance? If so, how does one get their momentum forward in an open stance? My momentum always goes side to side in my open stance FH...
 

ProgressoR

Hall of Fame
hey alterego, I am actually not a student there, I am a graduate of UCLA and I was in Miami doing research on the invasive anole species, and the UM courts were the nearest free courts to the house I was subletting

man that sounds bad, i would suggest sitting on soft cushions or maybe a big doughnut. But dont eat it afterwards.
 

10nistennis

Rookie
Hey thanks everyone for all the informative and thoughtful posts! Your suggestions have definitely opened my eyes to my mechanical and footwork issues. I noticed that I hit most of my forehands with an open stance and generate an overly spinny ball with little pace, yet when i hit with a closed stance, I can flatten the ball out more easily. Is this because it is more natural to have my weight moving forward in this stance? If so, how does one get their momentum forward in an open stance? My momentum always goes side to side in my open stance FH...


You get the forward momentum by pushing off the back foot. You might be transferring your weight from your back foot to your front foot, which would be a problem since it would cause your weight to go side to side since you're in an open stance.


To explain further, when you are in a closed stance, transferring your weight from your back foot to your front foot is no problem since it will cause you to have the correct weight transfer. However, when transferring like that in an open stance, your weight is pulled to the side, not out in front.


So for open stance, push off the back foot, which may cause you to jump a bit in the air, which is fine.
 
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xFullCourtTenniSx

Hall of Fame
... that was just an OUTSTANDING post ... you devoted a lot of time and thought to it ... obviously ... some really excellent tactical suggestions, also ... remind me never to play singles with you ... well, you already know you would eat me up with your kicker **smile** ... I know you're going to play tomorrow (Saturday) ... so, good hitting to you!

Unfortunately, I can't play today. No time. Gotta go to a BBQ and meet a military buddy that got his leave request for the weekend approved.

Playing singles with me isn't so bad. Just avoid hitting short and avoid the forehand. Forehand to forehand crosscourt is essentially the most dangerous "neutral" rally to get into with me.

But people tell me I make them run a lot... So maybe easier said than done...

Hey thanks everyone for all the informative and thoughtful posts! Your suggestions have definitely opened my eyes to my mechanical and footwork issues. I noticed that I hit most of my forehands with an open stance and generate an overly spinny ball with little pace, yet when i hit with a closed stance, I can flatten the ball out more easily. Is this because it is more natural to have my weight moving forward in this stance? If so, how does one get their momentum forward in an open stance? My momentum always goes side to side in my open stance FH...

It is MUCH easier to get your weight into the shot with a neutral stance. It's why Federer hits so many of his big transition forehands with this stance.

With an open stance, it's the least ideal to use when hitting an offensive shot. It was created for a defensive shot. The idea is that you don't have time to get your weight into the shot, so you lob it up. To get your weight into an open stance shot, you have to really lean into the shot, keep both your feet on the floor, and rotate your hips into the shot. Although, if possible you want to use at least a semi-open stance. I never hit with an open stance anymore unless I'm completely on the defensive. I try to hit everything with a neutral stance, but I can't so I hit a good amount with a semi-open stance.
 

mmeyer1

Rookie
Ahh I see now... I guess I am just so lazy with my feet that I tend to just hit the majority of my FHs with an open stance. I will try to be quicker with my feet, so I can use a more neutral stance. Thanks for all the advice guys!
 

xFullCourtTenniSx

Hall of Fame
Ahh I see now... I guess I am just so lazy with my feet that I tend to just hit the majority of my FHs with an open stance. I will try to be quicker with my feet, so I can use a more neutral stance. Thanks for all the advice guys!

Yeah. I improved my speed and ability to take small, accurate steps, but this really helped me elevate my footwork to another level by giving me a real goal to go for and allowed me to make better use of small steps and really attack the ball with my footwork.
 

atac

Rookie
Just try to more of the back of the ball. Perhaps try following through over your shoulder instead of at your hip so you get more of a horizontal swing. Just tinker with that. Good luck.
 

ProgressoR

Hall of Fame
i now use open stance FH and it is a better stroke for me than when i used close stance, previously i wasnt able to effectively use my core fully, with open stance that has made it easier. In time i might go back to neutral stance as my stock FH stance as my body adapts to using the core more. But for some people, like me, open FH is better for me right now, i wouldnt say you just need to use it when you dont have time to set up properly in the neutral stance.

This is my experience.
 
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