For me, Fed has surpassed Jordan, Brady and Gretzky

Le Master

Professional
Bolt ?? He runs in a straight line with the aid of performance enhancing drugs. Somehow I think tennis is somewhat harder than that. He is just a larger than life character which makes him popular, big deal.
Please. Except for maybe darts (and I even wouldn't put my money on that), you should assume all professional athletes use PEDs. It's naive to not. But I agree tennis players have far more factors contributing to their overall athleticism than sprinters do.
 

Gut Check

Semi-Pro
Please. Except for maybe darts (and I even wouldn't put my money on that), you should assume all professional athletes use PEDs. It's naive to not.
Beta blockers are the PED of choice for pursuits like darts that require steadiness and calm for maximum focus and concentration. Similar activities like target shooting and archery that fall under WADA's rules (since they are in the Olympics) have had participants test positive, and given suspensions. BTW, if anyone points out that since archery and target shooting are in the Olympics and therefore must be classified as "athletics", then darts should receive similar consideration, I group them all together. Call them "sports" if it really makes you happy, but none of them employ a broad enough cross-section of athletic abilities and qualities to be truly considered as "athletics" IMHO.
 

Mustard

Talk Tennis Guru
Darts isn't an athletic undertaking. Much skill required, and participants of that calibre have my respect, but it's not athletics and therefore doesn't qualify for this comparative conversation. Sorry.
It's easy to play darts, but extremely hard to master. To stay on top in such a cut-throat environment where so many people play, is extremely tough. Sports that rely much more heavily on athleticism are cut off for a lot of people who might be out of shape. Darts isn't cut off for such people, but being in shape certainly helps when you are playing long matches or have long days.
 

Mustard

Talk Tennis Guru
Beta blockers are the PED of choice for pursuits like darts that require steadiness and calm for maximum focus and concentration. Similar activities like target shooting and archery that fall under WADA's rules (since they are in the Olympics) have had participants test positive, and given suspensions. BTW, if anyone points out that since archery and target shooting are in the Olympics and therefore must be classified as "athletics", then darts should receive similar consideration, I group them all together. Call them "sports" if it really makes you happy, but none of them employ a broad enough cross-section of athletic abilities and qualities to be truly considered as "athletics" IMHO.
Darts is a professional sport worth millions. Taylor's dominance is a large part of it becoming so lucrative, as he's set such a high standard for others to try to follow. A lot of the stuff with the Olympics is corrupt beyond belief. Darts doesn't need it, and I hope it's never in the Olympics.
 

Gut Check

Semi-Pro
It's easy to play darts, but extremely hard to master. To stay on top in such a cut-throat environment where so many people play, is extremely tough.
Clearly, I acknowledged this in my post.

Darts is a professional sport worth millions. Taylor's dominance is a large part of it becoming so lucrative, as he's set such a high standard for others to try to follow. A lot of the stuff with the Olympics is corrupt beyond belief. Darts doesn't need it, and I hope it's never in the Olympics.
The potential for lucrative financial rewards in of itself doesn't assign athletic value to it.

I never said darts should be in the Olympics. I provided factual information about the use of PEDs in activities that require certain characteristics for high performance.
 

SinjinCooper

Hall of Fame
Can’t get behind Usain, he just runs, where’s the thought in that?
If "thought" is one of your defining criteria, you can go ahead and sweep every pro athlete I've ever seen into the **** heap.

These guys aren't paid for their intellects, and even the most natively intelligent among them scuttle their brains for their glory, because they've got to sacrifice education for physical and athletic development at an early age if they want to compete on the world stage.

The world's brightest word class athletes are complete morons at anything but their own sport.
 

smoledman

G.O.A.T.
If "thought" is one of your defining criteria, you can go ahead and sweep every pro athlete I've ever seen into the **** heap.

These guys aren't paid for their intellects, and even the most natively intelligent among them scuttle their brains for their glory, because they've got to sacrifice education for physical and athletic development at an early age if they want to compete on the world stage.

The world's brightest word class athletes are complete morons at anything but their own sport.
There is definitely an intricate thought process behind the way Federer constructs his matches that is well above how his peers play. Nobody is saying he's a math genius, but the mental stamina to play 200+ points at a high level in a 5-set match is amazing.
 

smoledman

G.O.A.T.
Yeah show me a tennis player in the top 100 that has any bodyfat on them. Fedr is just about the only one not sporting 6-pack abs.
 

Purplemonster

Hall of Fame
Please. Except for maybe darts (and I even wouldn't put my money on that), you should assume all professional athletes use PEDs. It's naive to not. But I agree tennis players have far more factors contributing to their overall athleticism than sprinters do.
I agree, they probably all do except for Federer.
 

Mustard

Talk Tennis Guru
Yeah show me a tennis player in the top 100 that has any bodyfat on them. Fedr is just about the only one not sporting 6-pack abs.
What this means is that there are barriers to people entering these sports which require high levels of athleticism, therefore the competition ain't going to be as deep.
 

MugOpponent

Hall of Fame
I'm still blown away that Tom Brady can be considered in such company. The man has had more good fortune with external factors he had nothing to do with in the history of sports. Take away Belichick and he's basically Matt Ryan. He's had more flukey bounces and undeserved breaks than any player in history. Tuck rule, Seattle not running with Lynch, Atlanta continuing to pass the ball. If the NFL allowed defenses to play and hit like in the 80's or 90's, he is on a hoverround in South Dakota seeing Mt. Rushmore. He's a cheater as well.
 
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Deleted member 756486

Guest
I'm still blown away that Tom Brady can be considered in such company. The man has had more good fortune with external factors he had nothing to do with in the history of sports. Take away Belichick and he's basically Matt Ryan. He's had more flukey bounces and undeserved breaks than any player in history. Tuck rule, Seattle not running with Lynch, Atlanta continuing to pass the ball. If the NFL allowed defenses to play and hit like in the 80's or 90's, he is on a hoverround in South Dakota seeing Mt. Rushmore. He's a cheater as well.
Aaron Rodgers>>>>>>Tom Brady
 

Bluefan75

Professional
I'm still blown away that Tom Brady can be considered in such company. The man has had more good fortune with external factors he had nothing to do with in the history of sports. Take away Belichick and he's basically Matt Ryan. He's had more flukey bounces and undeserved breaks than any player in history. Tuck rule, Seattle not running with Lynch, Atlanta continuing to pass the ball. If the NFL allowed defenses to play and hit like in the 80's or 90's, he is on a hoverround in South Dakota seeing Mt. Rushmore. He's a cheater as well.
And the first three super bowls were won by a field goal at the whistle against teams they taped practicing.
 

Bobby Jr

G.O.A.T.
Nice to see this thread is becoming a pool filled with Tom Brady haters LMAO
He is overrated af by global sports legends ratings. He's just benefited so much from the insane hype machine of US-dominated sports media, his race, his background, the fact he was surrounded by such a great team - probably moreso than any such lauded athlete ever.
 
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Deleted member 756486

Guest
1. Muhammad Ali
2. Lionel Messi
3. Michael Jordan
4. Roger Federer
5. Floyd Mayweather
 
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TMF

Talk Tennis Guru
Perhaps, but Roger Federer will never surpass Phil Taylor for dominance of his sport. Taylor doesn't have a losing record against anybody he has played against at least twice. He has 16 World Championships (first won in 1990, last won in 2013) and 16 World Matchplays (first won in 1995, last won in 2017), the biggest titles of loads and loads he's won. Taylor retired after the 2018 World Championship, where he lost the final (his 21st World Championship final). Taylor was out in Melbourne watching the Australian Open this year, out there playing darts exhibitions. It wouldn't surprise me if Federer has heard of him, at least.
Sorry but the game of dart doesn't qualify for this discussion. Only sports that demand athleticism or having physical qualities - mobility/flexibility, speed, strength, agility, endurance.

Dart belongs in the same category as billiard, or archery, the games that doesn't put any physical toll on the body like tennis.
 
The GOAT athlete is obviously Bradman. He was nearly twice as good as the 2nd best. It was like a man playing against children the difference in skill level.

Funny how yanks think cricket doesnt matter then proceed to talk about baseball. Baseball is only popular (and fading) in one country, maybe 2 if you include Japan. Cricket is extremely popular in quite a few more countries and is the most popular sport by far in India. Go tell an indian that cricket doesn't matter lol. Also requires more athleticism than baseball. Now grid iron that is only popular in one country so I don't even care to rate the athletes out of that. The more global a sport the higher the potential skill level of the best players.
 

Federev

Hall of Fame
20 major titles. 30 major final appearances. 6 year end championships, 10 year end finals appearances.

In his last FIFTY SIX major appearances, he's been to at least the QF's or better FIFTY times...FIFTY.
In his last fifty six major appearances, he's been to the Semi-finals or better FOURTY-FOUR TIMES!!!
He has a 90% winning percentage in slams since mid-2003.

He's been in 145 professional tournament finals, winning 96. His major wins are now 14 1/2 years apart.
He's won doubles Gold. He's led Switzerland to the Davis Cup title. He's led his team to 2 Hopman Cup wins.
He's missed TWO slam events in over 16 years.

We all know about his ranking longevity at Number 1 or 2 or 3.

He is the greatest in his sport, without question. He's been far more consistent than Serena ever was...there's no comparison there (and he has 24 more titles than her).

For longevity and consistent excellence, he's the greatest of the last 100 years. Who is better? And, he'd have 5 or more French Opens if he didn't have to go against the greatest clay court player ever...BY FAR.

And even when Novak was dominating in stretches, Fed always found ways to beat him in Masters events. Fed was right there with him, as he's always been with Rafa...whom he's now beaten FOUR times in a row. If anyone can't give him his props or is still unwilling to call him the greatest without question, you seriously have an unhealthy need to rebel for the sake of rebelling...it points to your own stubborness, arrogance and pride.
He's beaten Rafa 5 times in a row. Basel 2015.
 

Apun94

Hall of Fame
Lol at the simpletons in this topic who can't figure out how to draw parallels between an athlete in a team sports and an athlete in an individual sport. Double LOL at 3rd worlders trying to discredit Brady and America sports. You really have no idea how stupid you sound.
Well we all know how great Trump America is.
Lol, hit a nerve there?
 

Firstservingman

Talk Tennis Guru
I love the mans game. Horrible off court personality cannot wait till this all comes out after the fact. For anyone discerning, his behavior on court was worse than Connoers and Mcenroe at their worst. Cursing umpires blubbering after winning and snuffing out anything for Marin. I mean Mcenroe and connors probably want to make a deal with the devil just to have one shot to beat this idiot. Worst nerd of all time, best game. God, what did we do to deserve such a goof?
what
 
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Deleted member 756486

Guest
Anyway, Fed is definitely above the "American" sport GOATs as they are only played seriously in one or two countries. Tennis is played seriously in most countries.
I would agree with you if a man called Michael Jordan didn’t exist.
 
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Deleted member 756486

Guest
It still doesnt change the fact that MJ played only against other countrymen. Hardly international competition
Jordan has won two gold medals both against international competition (obviously)

Try again.
 
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Deleted member 756486

Guest
It still doesnt change the fact that MJ played only against other countrymen. Hardly international competition
Also the only country that even comes close to America in basketball is Spain and they are way behind us.
 

WhiskeyEE

Legend
The GOAT athlete is obviously Bradman. He was nearly twice as good as the 2nd best. It was like a man playing against children the difference in skill level.

Funny how yanks think cricket doesnt matter then proceed to talk about baseball. Baseball is only popular (and fading) in one country, maybe 2 if you include Japan. Cricket is extremely popular in quite a few more countries and is the most popular sport by far in India. Go tell an indian that cricket doesn't matter lol. Also requires more athleticism than baseball. Now grid iron that is only popular in one country so I don't even care to rate the athletes out of that. The more global a sport the higher the potential skill level of the best players.
Cricket doesn't matter and I'm no yank.
 

Karma Tennis

Hall of Fame
Outside of America you’ve got countries in Europe, Asia, Africa and Australia.
Ummm, Europe, Asia, and Africa are CONTINENTS. Each of these Continents contains several countries.

Australia is a country. (By some definitions Australia is also a Continent)

It is funny to read all the North American Centric views here. Sorry, but sports like American Football, Ice Hockey and Baseball don't really count in this discussion. Otherwise, you must also include Cricket in which case you must include Sir Donald Bradman. Sir Donald Bradman was the Babe Ruth of Cricket. Cricket is played in a lot more countries in the world than sports like American Football and Ice Hockey. His record on the International Stage is akin to Gretzky's in North America.

This discussion should really be focused on truly International Sports .... Football (Soccer!), Tennis, Basketball, Boxing, Golf, Swimming and Track Athletics. All of these sports have a significant presence all over the world.

So on that basis Federer and Jordan certainly up there. Much of the world wouldn't even know who Brady and Gretzky are. The first time I ever heard of Wayne Gretzky was when he hosted the final instalment of The Tennis Channel's "100 Greatest of All Time". I then googled Gretzky. What he achieved in his sport is breath-taking but he is not a universal name in a universal sport the way Federer, Jordan, Ali and Nicklaus are.

Cricket doesn't matter and I'm no yank.
Cricket matters in this discussion because it is played in a lot more countries than sports like American Football and Ice Hockey are. Cricket is the most popular sport in India. There's almost 1.4 Billion people in India.A lot more people in the world know of Don Bradman's feats of more than 70 years ago than have ever even heard of guys like Brady or Gretzky.
 
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Deleted member 756486

Guest
Ummm, Europe, Asia, and Africa are CONTINENTS. Each of these Continents contains several countries.

Australia is a country. (By some definitions Australia is also a Continent)

It is funny to read all the North American Centric views here. Sorry, but sports like American Football, Ice Hockey and Baseball don't really count in this discussion. Otherwise, you must also include Cricket in which case you must include Sir Donald Bradman. Sir Donald Bradman was the Babe Ruth of Cricket. Cricket is played in a lot more countries in the world than sports like American Football and Ice Hockey. His record on the International Stage is akin to Gretzky's in North America.

This discussion should really be focused on truly International Sports .... Football (Soccer!), Tennis, Basketball, Boxing, Golf, Swimming and Track Athletics. All of these sports have a significant presence all over the world.

So on that basis Federer and Jordan certainly up there. Much of the world wouldn't even know who Brady and Gretzky are. The first time I ever heard of Wayne Gretzky was when he hosted the final instalment of The Tennis Channel's "100 Greatest of All Time". I then googled Gretzky. What he achieved in his sport is breath-taking but he is not a universal name in a universal sport the way Federer, Jordan, Ali and Nicklaus are.
Wait there’s countries outside of America? Where are they? And when did they get there?
 
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Deleted member 756486

Guest
Errr. Is that the same Messi that missed the Penalty Shot in the Copa America Final in 2016?

For sure nobody is perfect, but the #1 does not miss in those situations.
He carried that Argentina team to the final if Higuain wasn’t such a choker in important moments he would be a World Cup and Copa America winner already.
 
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