Forehand swingpath mechanics

[1HBHNation]

My forehand is actually the worst of my strokes. I do this weird hitch at the takeback where my wrist actually goes floppy and the racket face points to the left side fence (I'm a righty). Anyone with tips on how to fix this? Should I firm up my wrist on takeback? I know the racket face should point more down to the ground.

https://imgur.com/a/TiOW16l

 

[Roads_to_tennis]

Maybe you are using wrong grip size... Same was the case with me when I started playing tennis. I used my friends racquets but they were way bigger in grip size.. don't firm your wrist... That's the worst fix I believe. And avoid holding pan grip if you are in habit of doing that and try to do wrist pronation

 

[Mortsnets]

Do you keep your left hand on the throat during the unit turn?

 

[1HBHNation]

Do you keep your left hand on the throat during the unit turn?

Thanks guys. To answer. I don't use the wrong grip size. I use 4 and 3/8. I can fit my index finger in between the grip. It feels comfortable.

Is the wrist pronation after on the swing through?

And for the other guy. I keep my left hand on the throat. My unit turn is fine imo. I will try to upload image stills when I can to demonstrate the full motion.

 

[1HBHNation]

https://imgur.com/a/TiOW16l

Here it is. The part I'm talking about is slowmo image 3. I enlarged to highlight this odd wrist flop which causes my racket to point left and to the side

 

[eah123]

Show video.

 

[Roads_to_tennis]

Try going down a grip size.. but I know this is something that might not work. You can link a yt video, it will be more clear. I believe that you don't have proper racquet head drop technique... That's what it looks like in images

 

[1HBHNation]

Try going down a grip size.. but I know this is something that might not work. You can link a yt video, it will be more clear. I believe that you don't have proper racquet head drop technique... That's what it looks like in images

Yes i think something goes wrong in the racket head drop. My wrist flexes and does this weird seesaw motion instead of a smooth circular loop.
Am I suppose to do ulnar deviation at the wrist during the dropback? But then I read your not suppose to "force" the wrist lag too. Im so baffled by what my hand or wrist is suppose to do on the forehand. Any help would be appreciated‍.

Here's the video:

 

[theSHAMOO]

I'm not a coach but I just wanna say thats one of the weirest things I've seen on the forehand. Everyones forehand is unique in that they may load with the racquet face to their forehand side fence, court, back fence. I have never seen the wrist turn the hitting face of the racquet towards the backhand side fence. That is truly a unique curse.

 

[PJ78]

It a bit tough to see on the video and the stills so I apologize if I got it wrong … but when u take the racket back it really looks like you are doing it in something like a continental grip up until the racket drop … hence on that still picture #3 your hand is top of the racket … then you flip your wrist and also the racket head over after the drop when going into the forward motion and you end up hitting with a westernish grip at contact. I think that is the issue … try taking the racket back and dropping in the western grip position that u end up hitting the ball with then u won’t flip it later (it’s already flipped) ..

Hope I described it well enough

 

[Mortsnets]

Check out Novak above. Slow it down even more and pause to compare to your swing at various stages. At end of backswing racquet face is down not facing side fence.

 

[Dragy]

Hey @1HBHNation

Your racquet being open towards the left fence is actually a "too closed" issue

Don't focus on stringbed - to my eye, it comes from your arm and elbow, wrist position is consequence:

You start pulling without rotating your elbow down first (which biomechanically is external shoulder rotation). You try to get into buttcap forward while still "elbowing the enemy" - while you actually are supposed to transition into buttcap forward via rotating your arm.
WTA-style players do it at the end of takeback
ATP-style players do it during the arm drop

But you need it anyway to enter the "slot" smoothly and consistently

A drill to find it is:
- in mini-tehhis or feeds, where you are expected to hit gently
- minimize your unit turn, keep chest almost fully open in prep
- do max WTA style arm takeback loop
- drop arm to the ball with buttcap foward and hit the ball by light torso uncoil (remember you had minimal coil) and full smooth follow-through

As you get comfortable with this stage - dropping buttcap forward before pulling - add full "Pat the dog" prep, but from that - transition into elbow-down you practiced previously, then allow major pull to happen. Also go slow-fast, it helps, don't accelerate from full-back pose instantly.

Report please how it goes!

 

[johnmccabe]

Yes i think something goes wrong in the racket head drop. My wrist flexes and does this weird seesaw motion instead of a smooth circular loop.
Am I suppose to do ulnar deviation at the wrist during the dropback? But then I read your not suppose to "force" the wrist lag too. Im so baffled by what my hand or wrist is suppose to do on the forehand. Any help would be appreciated‍.

Here's the video:

you do the exact same thing when you are feeding a ball. you are used to hitting topspin. my guess is you are trying to get racquet head below the ball, but not doing it in a correct way. it looks like you are trying to use wrist action to press down the racquet head while the handle remains high. If you have other videos showing topspin shots with contact point between waist and shoulder height, or some flat forehand, it would be interesting to see whether you do the same wrist thing.

 

[Chas Tennis]

Compare your forhands videos, one above the other, frame-by-frame, in this post. Single frame on Youtube by using the period & comma keys. Always select the video by using the alt + left mouse click, otherwise the video starts playing. Stop on impacts and move back and forth comparing the most similar racket positions. You can go full screen and come back down and the video stays on the same frame. For best accuracy, use very similar camera angles. List all differences. You can find other videos and make these these yourself.

Players have either a straight arm forehand or a bent elbow forehand. Straight arm is Federer and Nadal. Bent elbow is Djokovic. Look at these two options and decide which you are interested in.

Here's some differences to start -

At impact 0.02, ??_your racket tilts down more than D's and the face looks open vs closed. All pros drive with racket face closed at impact. I just viewed this again and the racket looks more vertical. The ball hit high and that rotated the face to open. The behind view is worse for how closed the racket face is, video from the side to see how closed the racket face is at impact.

0:02 ATP pros often use the off arm for added momentum, they speed if up just before the forward swing and pull it into the body with timing to add to uppermost body turn. Sometime they do it and sometimes not so much. Your off arm seems to turn with the uppermost body and that would slow down the uppermost body rather than speed it up.

0:02 Compare D's uppermost body turn by looking at the line between his 2 shoulders vs yours. This is a very important source of racket head speed, his separation of the line between his two shoulders vs the line between his two hips. This involves trunk twisting that may be risky for many player here. Djokovic is very flexible so tone down your trunk twisting relative to his full range of motion.

0:02 Compare trunk tilt, knee bends overall body orientations vs time.

Compare footwork. D picks his footwork because his feet, legs, pelvis togther aim the angular range of motion for his trunk twist motion. I don't know the variety in foot work in use, but just try to find shots where the pro player is not pressured and wants to hit a better forehand, in other words, to use their best technique. Same for your forehands.

If you are hitting better or worse during that video or have variety you should find those forehands and compare them on the above points. A lot of your feeds are not good, don't use them to study your forehand technique.

I've posted on separation, the off arm on the forehand and other forehand observations.

 

[coolvinny]

I think your grip is much too extreme, for one thing. You are also not hitting with enough space between arm and body, but that is also in part caused by the extreme grip. I also used to have a too-extreme grip which I had to work like crazy to change.

 

[coolvinny]

It a bit tough to see on the video and the stills so I apologize if I got it wrong … but when u take the racket back it really looks like you are doing it in something like a continental grip up until the racket drop … hence on that still picture #3 your hand is top of the racket … then you flip your wrist and also the racket head over after the drop when going into the forward motion and you end up hitting with a westernish grip at contact. I think that is the issue … try taking the racket back and dropping in the western grip position that u end up hitting the ball with then u won’t flip it later (it’s already flipped) ..

Hope I described it well enough

At first I though you were saying it’s continental, but yeah I agree it’s western. However that’s the problem here IMO, and this is coming from someone (me) who used to hit western. OP should start the painful process of moving to a milder grip now. I would suggest a full change to a strong eastern which will be more difficult but less likely to result in slipping back to the comfort zone.

 

[PJ78]

Good thread! Lots of helpful comments... I want to revise my suggestions after reading the other comments and also actually practicing some swings with your grip to understand the mechanics a bit better. Two thoughts:

1) Now I realize you have a very extreme grip and that 'hitch' you describe is likely related to having to flip the racket around from when you lower it to when you start your forward swing. This is because when you lower the racket its done in a manner that the hitting face is pointed in the opposite direction. If you lowering it in less of an extreme position (i.e. try to keep the hand placement so the racket face you will eventually contact the ball with is facing the ground) this will result in less of a hitch. Its essentially what Dragy and other are saying and the pics of pros show ... the hand/wrist position at the end of bringing the racket down is such that the racket is pointed downwards.

2) Like others have also said, you may benefit from considering hitting with a less extreme grip. It's quite difficult to hit with that grip and generate pace, or will take a lot of practice to master. A SW grip may provide some more balance in terms of generating pace and topspin. But that is personal choice of course...

Hope it is helpful advice!

 

[1HBHNation]

Wow thank you guys for all the comments. Yes I do agree with a lot of the observations. I so think part of the problem is an extreme grip. I might need to go eastern. And yes thank you also for the suggestions. I'm gonna watch some videos and shadowswing and maybe post an updated video with new form.

 

[Chas Tennis]

Wow thank you guys for all the comments. Yes I do agree with a lot of the observations. I so think part of the problem is an extreme grip. I might need to go eastern. And yes thank you also for the suggestions. I'm gonna watch some videos and shadowswing and maybe post an updated video with new form.

The grip varies with straight arm or bent elbow. Straight elbow is more Federer Eastern Forehand Grip. I don't know Nadal's grip. Djokovic's is Semi Western I believe. Get some close-up videos and pictures of the forehands of these players and see if you can compare grips.

I thought I saw some straight arm plus bent elbow together. ? Carefully compare, observing straight arm & bent elbow pro forehands, and figure which you are or want to be, then use the player with the same arm angle and grip for comparisons. Do this first. I only looked at one forehand and maybe that was not typical for you. I looked over some others but many were bad feeds. You need a steady feed ball, with good height.

Google: forehand grip close-up pictures
Google: tennis forehand pictures

If you looked over your videos beforehand and gave the impact times of forehands that represent your technique, it would work better. You might give a hand sign to the video after you hit a good forehand - thumbs up.

Show your grip close up to the camera.

 

[Dragy]

Wow thank you guys for all the comments. Yes I do agree with a lot of the observations. I so think part of the problem is an extreme grip. I might need to go eastern. And yes thank you also for the suggestions. I'm gonna watch some videos and shadowswing and maybe post an updated video with new form.

Your grip looks nice, it’s SW, very good and versatile

 

[coolvinny]

There’s a lot of variation possible with SW grips. I just think OP’s is too extreme. Most the hand is under the handle.

 

[golden chicken]

There's a lot of comments, but I'm not sure they're all seeing or addressing your rather extreme ulnar deviation of your wrist at the bottom of your takeback/beginning of your forward swing.

A slightly less extreme example of a pro with a similar high elbow, racket facing the left fence thing is Paire, but he doesn't quite do the ulnar deviation the OP does.

I don't have much of a suggestion how to address the issue, perhaps take forehands with your back to the fence so if your racket drifts back too far, it hits the fence.

 

[johnmccabe]

There's a lot of comments, but I'm not sure they're all seeing or addressing your rather extreme ulnar deviation of your wrist at the bottom of your takeback/beginning of your forward swing.

A slightly less extreme example of a pro with a similar high elbow, racket facing the left fence thing is Paire, but he doesn't quite do the ulnar deviation the OP does.

I don't have much of a suggestion how to address the issue, perhaps take forehands with your back to the fence so if your racket drifts back too far, it hits the fence.

It may worth a try for the OP to start his forward swing a little sooner and shorten his racquet drop. I think it'll make a noteable difference.

 

[Pumpkin]

It doesn't matter. It is just a stylistic thing. It won't affect the mechanics of the shot.