Foreigners in College Tennis

[phinstennis]

jenson is an example

I know it is frustrating for some people to see team filled with internationals Luke Jensen made him self look like a patriot and did nothing. With American girls his best finish in 6 years was quarterfinals of big east tournament He was paid 350k to do nothing. His all American recruiting philosophy was a big joke amongst eastern coaches.
Most college coaches get paid peanuts and the only way to get paid better is to win and many times that does not do it. it is easy to throw stones form a distance.
if you want things to change then the American kids need to beat the foreign kids and show they are worth recruiting and investing scholarship dollars in. As it is ,all the talk is promoting zenophobia and, an us verses them mentality.
Most coaches do not have the job security to to take this stance.
Rumors is that Jensen may have been breaking NCAA rules to attract top American 5 star and blue chippers he needed. Some patriot. Internationals are here to stay and people should just get used to it and accept it. They are a part of the game.

 

[red rook]

Part of the game? They constitute the entirety of the Fsu roster lol! 100% non-American is pretty extreme no matter how you spin it.

Doesnt Fsu stand for Florida STATE university. State. State funded.

I don't know why this gets me so fired up. I'm almost always a calm person. I think it's because a. Our tax dollars (presumably proved in this thread) are funding (directly or indirectly) non-us citizens to play tennis on scholarship. If they're paying to be over here and enrolled I have no problem with it. I think that's the crux.

But I also think it's because I want the state of American tennis to be better. You may tell me having foreign nationals taking all our roster spots is helping us get better. Somehow I don't think that's the case either. I guess the argument there is that an all-American field will water down the worth of the national title, which can't be proved to any degree either.

 

[Kirijax]

If the schools are going to open up their doors to foreign players then it's all fair. The American players are snatched up by the top schools, leaving the lower tier schools to do what they can to be competitive. If that means taking foreign players that are better than the left over Americans, then it is what is. Also, the foreign students add a lot to the school they enroll in, not only in sports but in academics as well. We should welcome them with open arms.

 

[red rook]

Wait wait wait. You can decide how you want to spend your money and I can decide how to spend mine, but these are tax-dollar funded programs. That means money from the community taken from our paychecks without our concession or endorsement and it is my feeling that it should support community folks from the US.

 

[andfor]

Wait wait wait. You can decide how you want to spend your money and I can decide how to spend mine, but these are tax-dollar funded programs. That means money from the community taken from our paychecks without our concession or endorsement and it is my feeling that it should support community folks from the US.

Yours is a simple argument to a complex situation. If you had your way because those are "tax dollar" being spent on internationals for athletic scholarships, how would you then address the private schools doing with their scholarship dollars as they please? Just let them dominate? I posed this questions before and the answer was they didn't care what the private schools did. Obviously rantings of a tennis parent whose kid did not get to go to some big program because they where not of he level needed to play there in the first place.

I like the NJCAA's answer. No more than 15% of any team roster can consist of internationals. The NCAA will not address this anytime soon. The best answer is for American players to get better and play at a school that is a fit for them academically and tennis wise. There are so many schools that need good players but have a hard time filling out the roster. Look around.

 

[phinstennis]

to red rook

Just so you know I get the state school thing. My perspective has nothing to do with state schools. I have coached at the mid level division I, Division III and Division II. All of the schools I was at were private. In order to beat Binghamton and Stoney Brook many years ago. I had to put together a roster of 50% Americans and 50% internationals. One of my foreign guys was actually on a soccer scholarship so he cost me nothing. I had to battle two state schools that fit your criteria. By the way it got me nothing. We won every award possible and I asked for a raise from my 13k part time salary and got an answer of no. I resigned. We played Baylor In the NCAA's and here is a funny one. Ben Becker Played third doubles. He won the NCAA's that year. D III internationals not an issue. D II different story. The teams having the most success in the east at that level are filling their roster with internationals.
Had an experience this fall to be proud of. My two star freshman #1 defeated a rival schools foreign #1. The international had been ranked 12 in England in the 18 and unders. I'm working hard to get American two and three star kids. Heck man, I go after three and four stars guys but even when i give them packages that pay 90% they turn me down for the D I dream. My school is very high level academically so level of education is not the issue. I'm working hard on American guys, but I will get the best students I can get that play the kind of tennis that can win me the conference. By the way my two star guy has 3k in tennis money and 23k in academic. The kid from England at the opposing school on a full tuition tennis scholarship at a private school.(30K) I feel really good about my investment and this American is anchoring my program to hopefully attract more fine young Americans.
A final and proud not. For less than that tuition scholarship I spoke of, i brought in three high level players(2 Americans and one international) that may put me into contention for the conference title. Americans kids can do it. I will continue to prove it. I must confess i do love the international guys just as much as the Americans guys. If the have ever been on my team they are my family.

 

[raging]

One of the arguments against foreign players is that they take the spots of american players.

Obviously the competition for spots is tough but 1 point is that some of these foreign players end up staying & either coaching on college teams, going into coaching or other work in the USA. I think they add to the cultural mix and improve the standard of play, forcing the american players to work harder for their spots/wins and even tennis career.

The Real Question is are the american players tough enough?
Steve Johnson is a good example of somebody who was tough enough to win at college level and also because he just won a challenger.
I am sure there are many others..the best rise to the top or at least try to get there.
Building a safety net won't make them stronger, college tennis being international means it is an even better test of how committed you are.

 

[SECFAN]

Tennis is an international game. Let's face it the best players at the next level are from other countries. I personally like having players from other countries. It's neat getting to know them and the different backgrounds. They add a lot to the university and the community. They are usually outstanding students and many have gone on to work here in the U.S. If Americans want to be part of the team, they need to work harder and earn a spot. I don't think anyone should be given a spot just because they are from a particular country.

 

[sundaypunch]

Wait wait wait. You can decide how you want to spend your money and I can decide how to spend mine, but these are tax-dollar funded programs. That means money from the community taken from our paychecks without our concession or endorsement and it is my feeling that it should support community folks from the US.

The typical state university gets about 20% of their money from the state and 80% from tuition dollars. You should only complain about about your paycheck helping fund one of those scholarship kids, lol.

Also, using your logic, you must have a problem with scholarships given to out-of-state kids?

 

[justinmadison]

The typical state university gets about 20% of their money from the state and 80% from tuition dollars. You should only complain about about your paycheck helping fund one of those scholarship kids, lol.

Also, using your logic, you must have a problem with scholarships given to out-of-state kids?

Quote from the uc budget web site

http://budget.universityofcalifornia.edu/?page_id=5#fundingsources


" In 1990, the state contributed $16,430 per student, or 78 percent of the total cost of education. By 2009-10, that figure had fallen to $7,570 per student, or 48 percent of the total cost. (Figures for both years are inflation adjusted)."


Where did your 20% number come from?

 

[DaveKB]

Quote from the uc budget web site

http://budget.universityofcalifornia.edu/?page_id=5#fundingsources


" In 1990, the state contributed $16,430 per student, or 78 percent of the total cost of education. By 2009-10, that figure had fallen to $7,570 per student, or 48 percent of the total cost. (Figures for both years are inflation adjusted)."


Where did your 20% number come from?

It really depends on the state and its political philosophy towards education and the money that is given to higher education. I do not know state by state %'s, but I expect CA is near the top. In Virginia, UVA now gets under 10% from the state (if you exclude the hospital portion of UVA) , but other state schools get a little more maybe 15%. UVA gets less because the political guys in Richmond looked at how much money is donated by alums and decided UVA needs less from the state. As a result in state tuition plus room and board is now around $25,000 at UVA and out of state is over $50,000.

I live in NC and historically the state has given a lot to higher education, but with recent election results they are cutting state funding to state Universities by quite a bit in order to afford tax cuts on top income earners.

 

[onehandbh]

K-State team is 100% international.

2025-26 Tennis Roster - Kansas State University Athletics

The official 2025-26 Tennis Roster for the Kansas State University Wildcats

www.kstatesports.com

 

[jindra]

K-State team is 100% international.

2025-26 Tennis Roster - Kansas State University Athletics

The official 2025-26 Tennis Roster for the Kansas State University Wildcats

www.kstatesports.com

American kids know better not to go to K-State

 

[PURETENNISsense]

American kids know better not to go to K-State

They should do their research before trying to shoot for a team like that

 

[anirbandutta]

 

[jcgatennismom]

Try to see this as a glass half full. There are plenty of foreign players training in US, playing tourneys that juniors are eligible to play-from prize $, ITA circuit, to Future Qualis. The bright side is that without leaving the US or even their home state, players can find opportunities to play and hit with international juniors or collegians. Also seek out paid hits on UTR. We didn’t live in FL or Cali but foreign teaching pros brought over kids from their home countries in summer and also there would be young pros passing through. My son had a chance to play against players from every continent (besides Antartica) while in HS, most of those opportunities locally. It’s like field of dreams. US tennis has built a great development program via college, and many internationals spend some time in US prior to college. Take advantage of those opportunities. Train with some coaches locally if possible from different countries to learn different styles. Play some on clay. Last thing we need to do is give US kids an inferiority complex so they will be intimidated if they have to play a foreign player. Play some now so when u get to college, u believe u have a chance to win every time u step on court

 

[Sureshot]

Try to see this as a glass half full. There are plenty of foreign players training in US, playing tourneys that juniors are eligible to play-from prize $, ITA circuit, to Future Qualis. The bright side is that without leaving the US or even their home state, players can find opportunities to play and hit with international juniors or collegians. Also seek out paid hits on UTR. We didn’t live in FL or Cali but foreign teaching pros brought over kids from their home countries in summer and also there would be young pros passing through. My son had a chance to play against players from every continent (besides Antartica) while in HS, most of those opportunities locally. It’s like field of dreams. US tennis has built a great development program via college, and many internationals spend some time in US prior to college. Take advantage of those opportunities. Train with some coaches locally if possible from different countries to learn different styles. Play some on clay. Last thing we need to do is give US kids an inferiority complex so they will be intimidated if they have to play a foreign player. Play some now so when u get to college, u believe u have a chance to win every time u step on court

If I recall correctly you live in metro Atlanta which is a tennis hotbed in its own right. So would be much easier to get those hits you mentioned. What about a kid in Kentucky or Wisconsin? They are clearly at a disadvantage. In fact, Reese Brantmeier the standout who’s joining UNC this fall had to venture far and wide from her home in small town Wisconsin to develop to where she is today. There’s a finite ceiling to the approach you propose. Ultimately the player will have to go where the serious training is

 

[LOBALOT]

If I recall correctly you live in metro Atlanta which is a tennis hotbed in its own right. So would be much easier to get those hits you mentioned. What about a kid in Kentucky or Wisconsin? They are clearly at a disadvantage. In fact, Reese Brantmeier the standout who’s joining UNC this fall had to venture far and wide from her home in small town Wisconsin to develop to where she is today. There’s a finite ceiling to the approach you propose. Ultimately the player will have to go where the serious training is

Are you kidding?

Whitewater is not far from Madison and University of Wisconsin and of course Wisconsin-Whitewater is right there. Furthermore, we know many Wisconsin tournament kids who would head to Chi town and hit and those Chicago kids are no joke. Chicago junior tennis is dog-eat-dog and a lot of the Wisconsin kids would head that way. There are plenty of foreign players and coaches in Chicago.

University of Chicago just won the D3 title, Northwestern, has a very strong D1 program, UIC, etc.

I am sure she ventured for national events like most kids but you don't just become a good player in isolation. There has to be very good tennis and instruction around you.

 

[Sureshot]

Are you kidding?

Whitewater is not far from Madison and University of Wisconsin and of course Wisconsin-Whitewater is right there. Furthermore, we know many Wisconsin tournament kids who would head to Chi town and hit and those Chicago kids are no joke. Chicago junior tennis is dog-eat-dog and a lot of the Wisconsin kids would head that way. There are plenty of foreign players and coaches in Chicago.

University of Chicago just won the D3 title, Northwestern, has a very strong D1 program, UIC, etc.

I am sure she ventured for national events like most kids but you don't just become a good player in isolation. There has to be very good tennis and instruction around you.

I hear you. But I read an interview where both Brantmeier and her mom said she had to travel down south for training and tournaments. It just might have been her particular circumstances. Another example is this year’s Wimbledon girls champ Liv Hovde, originally from Minnesota but now lives and trains in TX

 

[jcgatennismom]

If I recall correctly you live in metro Atlanta which is a tennis hotbed in its own right. So would be much easier to get those hits you mentioned. What about a kid in Kentucky or Wisconsin? They are clearly at a disadvantage. In fact, Reese Brantmeier the standout who’s joining UNC this fall had to venture far and wide from her home in small town Wisconsin to develop to where she is today. There’s a finite ceiling to the approach you propose. Ultimately the player will have to go where the serious training is

The win win situation would be for talented kids to have paid hits with college students in fall-extra $ for collegians, high level match play for juniors. Even in the states that are weak for US juniors, there are colleges with 12+ men. My son has a remote job and moved out West to enjoy other outdoor interests but is moving back to ATL because he misses the tennis. He had plenty of opportunities to teach on the side but no one in the summer to hit with to keep up skills. The good kids boarded in Cali or Texas. I really hope in the future between UTR, post grads who move to every state, that players won’t have to move to keep playing. Maybe just board in summer with host families-I think many US families would host a higher level student to attend their local high level academy for a month or more if they contributed for food and gas. I once hosted a player 2 years older than my son for 3 weeks who was in States for jr ITFs-my son learned a lot from that player’s work ethic and maturity. US can’t grow tennis with players from only a handful of states. I thought it was silly so many US juniors would travel to ITF grade 5s in places like Haiti when there were more talented internationals already playing in US.

 

[LOBALOT]

The win win situation would be for talented kids to have paid hits with college students in fall-extra $ for collegians, high level match play for juniors. Even in the states that are weak for US juniors, there are colleges with 12+ men. My son has a remote job and moved out West to enjoy other outdoor interests but is moving back to ATL because he misses the tennis. He had plenty of opportunities to teach on the side but no one in the summer to hit with to keep up skills. The good kids boarded in Cali or Texas. I really hope in the future between UTR, post grads who move to every state, that players won’t have to move to keep playing. Maybe just board in summer with host families-I think many US families would host a higher level student to attend their local high level academy for a month or more if they contributed for food and gas. I once hosted a player 2 years older than my son for 3 weeks who was in States for jr ITFs-my son learned a lot from that player’s work ethic and maturity. US can’t grow tennis with players from only a handful of states. I thought it was silly so many US juniors would travel to ITF grade 5s in places like Haiti when there were more talented internationals already playing in US.

It is funny you talk about foreign players here and hitting with them. On this very board there was someone posting about one of the top juniors from their country and how they traveled to the states for college, had a blog he posted back to his home country about his experiences, etc.

It got me thinking... that sounds a lot like so and so who my son has hit with.... So I reached out to the individual out here on TT. Sure enough it was one and the same player who traveled to the states for college.

 

[andfor]

My son got to hit with many of the international college players while he was a junior player. It was so good for his development. A number of those kids have relocated to the US post-graduation and are great Americans.

There's really no way to stop it, it's been tried and I believe those court cases that have overturned any attempt to limit scholarships regardless of nationality.