From multi-poly to gut-poly - tension difference? Help needed.

Winners or Errors

Hall of Fame
OK, I've never played with gut but decided to bite the bullet and experiment.

My current setup is 50# mains and crosses: Multi-Feel 16 mains, Proline X 1.25 crosses.
The gut setup will be Klip Legend 16 mains with the same cross.

How should I set up the tension to keep the power level the same? Thanks in advance for any sage advice. I have the string already.
 
TW Babolat VS Touch Natural Gut String Review scores the string at 100 for power. TW also carries Klip Legend 16 but there is no review of that string and, they do not carry Multi-Feel or Proline so reviews providing power assessment for Klip, Milti-Feel and Proline are not available at TW. However natural gut is still considered the most powerful string available so one may suppose it is not possible to keep the power level the same. You picked an excellent string but you are now comparing apples to oranges rather than apples to apples.
 
If you're trying to keep the power level the same, I'd probably go up 2-3 pounds with the gut, keep the poly the same. But, you have to consider why you're switching away from the TF in the 1st place. Do you want more power? You'll probably get a little higher launch angle with gut too. Are you looking for that? Not discouraging you, as I love natural gut, but what are you looking to gain by the switch?
 

SinneGOAT

Hall of Fame
OK, I've never played with gut but decided to bite the bullet and experiment.

My current setup is 50# mains and crosses: Multi-Feel 16 mains, Proline X 1.25 crosses.
The gut setup will be Klip Legend 16 mains with the same cross.

How should I set up the tension to keep the power level the same? Thanks in advance for any sage advice. I have the string already.
I would go about 55 gut main/50 poly cross. Gut is more powerful than multi, and also much softer. With gut I never worry about comfort, so if you want extra control bring the poly cross to 52, or higher on the main. I do gut/Alu 57/52 and a prestretch on the Alu and I get decent control but still have never had arm pain after 4 weeks.
 

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
TW's review on Multifeel 1.30 rates the power at 84. which is consistent with a lot of multis, ie 80-90 rating. Klip Legend will play like any NG, only firmer than the VS. Klip NG at 55 or 56# would be my recommendation. No pre stretch on the machine. NG does not need it. Proline X's tension can remain at 50 or increased to 52.
 

Winners or Errors

Hall of Fame
TW's review on Multifeel 1.30 rates the power at 84. which is consistent with a lot of multis, ie 80-90 rating. Klip Legend will play like any NG, only firmer than the VS. Klip NG at 55 or 56# would be my recommendation. No pre stretch on the machine. NG does not need it. Proline X's tension can remain at 50 or increased to 52.
Thanks.
 

Winners or Errors

Hall of Fame
If you're trying to keep the power level the same, I'd probably go up 2-3 pounds with the gut, keep the poly the same. But, you have to consider why you're switching away from the TF in the 1st place. Do you want more power? You'll probably get a little higher launch angle with gut too. Are you looking for that? Not discouraging you, as I love natural gut, but what are you looking to gain by the switch?
No idea what I'm hoping to gain. I bought half a set. It's an experiment. Racquet and string tinkerer, just never had the budget for gut... and now I do.
 

Winners or Errors

Hall of Fame
TW Babolat VS Touch Natural Gut String Review scores the string at 100 for power. TW also carries Klip Legend 16 but there is no review of that string and, they do not carry Multi-Feel or Proline so reviews providing power assessment for Klip, Milti-Feel and Proline are not available at TW. However natural gut is still considered the most powerful string available so one may suppose it is not possible to keep the power level the same. You picked an excellent string but you are now comparing apples to oranges rather than apples to apples.
Dude, what are you reading? TW carries Kirschbaum Proline X and Tecnifibre Multi-Feel, and have reviews posted for both. I've been playing those strings for years, though. The Klip gut was a half set I bought on a whim, and I just want to try to make a realistic comparison when I string with it, hence the tension question.
 

LOBALOT

Hall of Fame
TW's review on Multifeel 1.30 rates the power at 84. which is consistent with a lot of multis, ie 80-90 rating. Klip Legend will play like any NG, only firmer than the VS. Klip NG at 55 or 56# would be my recommendation. No pre stretch on the machine. NG does not need it. Proline X's tension can remain at 50 or increased to 52.
Hi @esgee48 I am curious on this related to prestretching on gut. Are you saying because gut holds tension so well it doesn't need a prestretch? I have been struggling a bit with gut and tensions lately so have reverted to prestretch on my machine so I'm curious as to your perspective.

Thanks
 

stapletonj

Hall of Fame
My experience is that if you only go up 2-3 lbs. on tension, you will be disappointed, it will feel too loose and springy and the loss of control will be noticeable.
I went from 56/57 lbs. poly all the way up to 64 lbs. in my yonex vcore 100. (slick yonex poly in the crosses at about 57 lbs.) no arm pain, good power, much better control and feel.
of course, YMMV....
 
Dude, what are you reading? TW carries Kirschbaum Proline X and Tecnifibre Multi-Feel, and have reviews posted for both. I've been playing those strings for years, though. The Klip gut was a half set I bought on a whim, and I just want to try to make a realistic comparison when I string with it, hence the tension question.
sorry - there are about 500 strings out there, didn't know Kirschbaum makes Proline and that Technifibre makes Multi-Feel. - too many to keep up with.
 

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
Hi @esgee48 I am curious on this related to prestretching on gut. Are you saying because gut holds tension so well it doesn't need a prestretch? I have been struggling a bit with gut and tensions lately so have reverted to prestretch on my machine so I'm curious as to your perspective.

Thanks
From my perspective, good premium NG only needs a manual prestretch to remove coil memory. They have so little static tension loss that machine pre stretch is a waste since they almost always go back to their original state. A 10% machine prestretch using ref tension 56# means pull goes to 61.6# for like 3 seconds, then steps back down to 56. You may reduce static tension losses by 1-2#. Most players including me can't perceive that 1-2# difference.

I generally do not favor machine pre stretch at all. I rather hold the pull using only ref tension for 10-15 seconds or whenever the machine stops making adjustments for at least a 5 count. When you do a machine pre stretch, the section of string between the clamp and the gripper is pre stretched again on the next pull. Only on the last pulls does this not happen. Multiple pre stretches with different string lengths may lead to different residuals in the stretched string. I know some people do not use RT. I do for I only use a very small universe of strings. When I switched to this method, my readings showed little or no losses after 12 hours off the stringer. My clients' string jobs show the same behavior, which they are happy about. Prior to that, it was somewhat erratic depending on how fast I clamped. Maybe you can explain what you are looking for. Are you experiencing hot spots on your string bed? Or dead spots?

edit: I do not string for speed. I string for consistency in the final product.
 

Louis33

Rookie
OK, I've never played with gut but decided to bite the bullet and experiment.

My current setup is 50# mains and crosses: Multi-Feel 16 mains, Proline X 1.25 crosses.
The gut setup will be Klip Legend 16 mains with the same cross.

How should I set up the tension to keep the power level the same? Thanks in advance for any sage advice. I have the string already.
You will have three major differences with the gut compared to a multi in the mains. Gut will be more elastic increasing power. Gut will slide better than multi on the poly cross strings giving more spin and increasing durability. Gut will hold tension better than multi allowing it to play more consistently.

I would estimate to start out with a gut reference tension roughly 5 pounds tighter than your current multi so 55 pounds would be a good reference tension to start out with.

Cross tension is a bit trickier. Gut will slide better than your multi on poly crosses increasing spin, but this will also increase trajectory off the string bed giving you the impression of more power so we need to increase your poly cross string tension accordingly in order to increase friction closer to your current setup. I would start out with a reference tension of 53 pounds with your poly crosses to better accomplish this.

Final tension would be 55/53 lbs. If you find trajectory too high then increase cross tension 1-2 lbs. Trajectory too low then lower cross tension 1-2 lbs.
 

LOBALOT

Hall of Fame
From my perspective, good premium NG only needs a manual prestretch to remove coil memory. They have so little static tension loss that machine pre stretch is a waste since they almost always go back to their original state. A 10% machine prestretch using ref tension 56# means pull goes to 61.6# for like 3 seconds, then steps back down to 56. You may reduce static tension losses by 1-2#. Most players including me can't perceive that 1-2# difference.

I generally do not favor machine pre stretch at all. I rather hold the pull using only ref tension for 10-15 seconds or whenever the machine stops making adjustments for at least a 5 count. When you do a machine pre stretch, the section of string between the clamp and the gripper is pre stretched again on the next pull. Only on the last pulls does this not happen. Multiple pre stretches with different string lengths may lead to different residuals in the stretched string. I know some people do not use RT. I do for I only use a very small universe of strings. When I switched to this method, my readings showed little or no losses after 12 hours off the stringer. My clients' string jobs show the same behavior, which they are happy about. Prior to that, it was somewhat erratic depending on how fast I clamped. Maybe you can explain what you are looking for. Are you experiencing hot spots on your string bed? Or dead spots?

edit: I do not string for speed. I string for consistency in the final product.
Thank you. The reason I am asking is I really have been struggling with my gut setup lately and have been going up and up in tension and finally started using the 10% pre-stretch which really hasn't made a difference but thought it might. I am at now at 57/51 with gut / Cream. I tried switching from VS to Wilson which has helped a little.

The whole setup is kind of mushy and locked. Perhaps I it is not the gut but instead I should move on from Cream to something a tad firmer and more slick.
 

2nd Serve Ace

Hall of Fame
Thank you. The reason I am asking is I really have been struggling with my gut setup lately and have been going up and up in tension and finally started using the 10% pre-stretch which really hasn't made a difference but thought it might. I am at now at 57/51 with gut / Cream. I tried switching from VS to Wilson which has helped a little.

The whole setup is kind of mushy and locked. Perhaps I it is not the gut but instead I should move on from Cream to something a tad firmer and more slick.
Cream has a tendency to fray like a multi. Never thought it was that great of a cross string. Have you tried ghostwire?
 

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
Look at the Stiffness #, Tension Loss% and COF for Bab SpiralTek [now aka Bab SG] and 4G Soft. I have been recommending Bab SpiralTek as a nice slippery cross if you want a softer cross.
 
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