Get ready for another Fortress to fall: Djokovic wants to play longer than Fed

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
So we all know one of the top reasons Fed is considered GOAT by his fans, and why they excuse every loss over the past 10+years is because he's "old" and been staying competitive at this "old" age. Well, looks like the apparent unique nature of this achievement is under assault, as Djokovic, himself one of the most durable players in history, has his eye on extending his longevity even past Fed's...so my question is: Do you think he can do it and if so how will his results compare to Fed's?

 

James P

Hall of Fame
Pretty much the same way it is with Federer, I feel like if you can maintain the high level at an old age, why not. I mean, I'm ready for fresh blood, but I can't blame them for hanging on if they continue to dominate. The question is, how long will he play when he gets knocked out of the top 5 or 10 permanently? Does he hang around or hang it up, not wanting to be a second tier talent anymore? Moot point until it happens, of course.
 

ghostofMecir

Hall of Fame
So we all know one of the top reasons Fed is considered GOAT by his fans, and why they excuse every loss over the past 10+years is because he's "old" and been staying competitive at this "old" age. Well, looks like the apparent unique nature of this achievement is under assault, as Djokovic, himself one of the most durable players in history, has his eye on extending his longevity even past Fed's...so my question is: Do you think he can do it and if so how will his results compare to Fed's?

Was Pete “old” when Federer beat him at Wimbledon as a teenager?
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Pretty much the same way it is with Federer, I feel like if you can maintain the high level at an old age, why not. I mean, I'm ready for fresh blood, but I can't blame them for hanging on if they continue to dominate. The question is, how long will he play when he gets knocked out of the top 5 or 10 permanently? Does he hang around or hang it up, not wanting to be a second tier talent anymore? Moot point until it happens, of course.
Depends. If it's due to injury/poor form then he'll prolly give it a year to see if he can get back on the train. Course none of it matters if he thinks he can win slams.
 

Sport

Legend
Was Pete “old” when Federer beat him at Wimbledon as a teenager?
Peter Sampras and his fans are true gentlemen. They never put excuses for the losses.

Sampras lost against a well-playing Roger. Nothing else. Federer was better that day. No single Sampras fan has ever called Sampras old for that match (he was 29 in the Wimbledon 2001 match, so it would be ridiculous to excuse the loss with age).

28 years young Federer lost to Berdych at Wimbledon 2010. Obviously, age cannot be a factor in that loss. Does it mean Berdych is better than Federer on grass just for one match?

And a Federer aged 29 lost to Tsonga at Wimbledon 2011. Does it mean Tsonga is better than Federer just for one match?
 
So we all know one of the top reasons Fed is considered GOAT by his fans, and why they excuse every loss over the past 10+years is because he's "old" and been staying competitive at this "old" age. Well, looks like the apparent unique nature of this achievement is under assault, as Djokovic, himself one of the most durable players in history, has his eye on extending his longevity even past Fed's...so my question is: Do you think he can do it and if so how will his results compare to Fed's?

It is not so much his age at 38 as he still can bring his almost peak game. Just less often as he ages (makes it harder to win slams). It is the fact that the two guys chasing him are also ATG's who are 5 and 6 years younger.

Of course Djoker can hang around till 38 as there will be no ATG's to deal with. Will Djoker have to deal with a 6 years younger ATG at WC at 38? Will he have to deal with the best clay court player of all time at RG who is 5 years younger?

Yes, age is an issue (not THE reason or an excuse) but Fed would have won a slam and maybe two this year if it was not for TWO younger ATG's...
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Peter Sampras and his fans are true gentlemen. They never put excuses for the losses.

Sampras lost against a well-playing Roger. Nothing else. Federer was better that day. No single Sampras fan has ever called Sampras old for that match (he was 29 in the Wimbledon 2001 match, so it would be ridiculous to excuse the loss with age).

28 years young Federer lost to Berdych at Wimbledon 2010. Obviously, age cannot be a factor in that loss. Does it mean Berdych is better than Federer on grass just for one match?

And a Federer aged 29 lost to Tsonga at Wimbledon 2011. Does it mean Tsonga is better than Federer just for one match?
Fed won fair and square as he was zoned to the max and PETE was not at his best, but not an excuse, just a fact. Having said that, PETE retired the next year and didn't have the benefit of the juices that the pros have nowadays, so 29 then was much older than 29 now
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Nah, he was injured when he lost to Federer
he injured his youth
No injury, but not playing well and Fed zoned out to the point of entering an altered state of consciousness. Not an excuse just a fact.
Also, Pete lost to a future slam champ/tier 1/2 GOAT, Fed lost to two zoned out bozos
 

Sport

Legend
Fed won fair and square as he was zoned to the max and PETE was not at his best, but not an excuse, just a fact. Having said that, PETE retired the next year and didn't have the benefit of the juices that the pros have nowadays, so 29 then was much older than 29 now
Do you think Sampras' demolition of Agassi in the Wimbledon 1999 final was his last performance at his best? That match was impressive from Pete. Agassi was the RG champion and came to the final full of confidence. Yet, a 27 years old Sampras executed a masterpiece, what an exhibition of serve and volley. Poor Agassi had no chance.
 
Do you think Sampras' demolition of Agassi in the Wimbledon 1999 final was his last performance at his best? That match was impressive from Pete. Agassi was the RG champion and came to the final full of confidence. Yet, a 27 years old Sampras executed a masterpiece, what an exhibition of serve and volley. Poor Agassi had no chance.
Even though I did not like Agassi as I was a massive Sampras fan, I always felt bad for Agassi out there. Even a return genius like Agassi had no chance at times.
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Do you think Sampras' demolition of Agassi in the Wimbledon 1999 final was his last performance at his best? That match was impressive from Pete. Agassi was the RG champion and came to the final full of confidence. Yet, a 27 years old Sampras executed a masterpiece, what an exhibition of serve and volley. Poor Agassi had no chance.
Def at Wimbledon. As someone who loved both Andre and PETE I have to admit I felt bad for 'Dre in that match. Started off relatively competitive, then Pete broke him and just entered zen mode. I think 'Dre may have even been traumatized.

Also not by ANY means a PEAK performance from PETE but his 2002 Open match v Rusedski was a classic BECAUSE he was playing so bad that Rusedski actually stood a chance, which made Pete's win and final FH winner & victory roar that much more satisfying
 
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SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
It is not so much his age at 38 as he still can bring his almost peak game. Just less often as he ages (makes it harder to win slams). It is the fact that the two guys chasing him are also ATG's who are 5 and 6 years younger.

Of course Djoker can hang around till 38 as there will be no ATG's to deal with. Will Djoker have to deal with a 6 years younger ATG at WC at 38? Will he have to deal with the best clay court player of all time at RG who is 5 years younger?

Yes, age is an issue (not THE reason or an excuse) but Fed would have won a slam and maybe two this year if it was not for TWO younger ATG's...
Doesn't feel like Novak needs to really "peak" per se since his gamestyle is so focused on percentage tennis. Long as he stays healthy physically and mentally I think he'll bring it at the slams and stay high in the rankings
Nole loves a challenge, and I almost worry that with Fedal gone/retired he'll lose motivation since he doesn't get a boost from beating mugs
 
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Doesn't feel like Novak needs to really "peak" per se since his gamestyle is so focused on percentage tennis. Long as he stays healthy physically and mentally I think he'll bring it at the slams and stay high in the rankings
Nole loves a challenge, and I almost worry that with Fedal gone/retired he'll lose motivation
Very true. I dont see him having a sharp decline or his shots going awry all of the sudden. Only issue would be if he loses his defense abilities. However, he is in great shape so I could see it being possible where his level does not fluctuate much over the next 5 years.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Doesn't feel like Novak needs to really "peak" per se since his gamestyle is so focused on percentage tennis. Long as he stays healthy physically and mentally I think he'll bring it at the slams and stay high in the rankings
Nole loves a challenge, and I almost worry that with Fedal gone/retired he'll lose motivation
Novak wants the slam record, think that is enough motivation for him. With or without Fedal.
It’s a big chance Novak will end up with the most weeks and the slam record too.
He might even get same amount of Wimbledon’s as Federer the way things look now. No great grass players (as usual in newer times) and Novak game now better faster surfaces than USO for example.
 

NoleFam

G.O.A.T.
Doesn't feel like Novak needs to really "peak" per se since his gamestyle is so focused on percentage tennis. Long as he stays healthy physically and mentally I think he'll bring it at the slams and stay high in the rankings
Nole loves a challenge, and I almost worry that with Fedal gone/retired he'll lose motivation
Trying to reach Fedal is what is pushing him and making more records. It's the chase that keeps his hunger alive. If Fedal leave, I also have the feeling that desire and motivation will wane.
 
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NoleFam

G.O.A.T.
Do you think Sampras' demolition of Agassi in the Wimbledon 1999 final was his last performance at his best? That match was impressive from Pete. Agassi was the RG champion and came to the final full of confidence. Yet, a 27 years old Sampras executed a masterpiece, what an exhibition of serve and volley. Poor Agassi had no chance.
It was one of the greatest performances I have ever witnessed on a tennis court in my lifetime.
 

Third Serve

Hall of Fame
Got an opinion on the topic?
Impossible to know. I think the stuff that Federer is doing at 38 is pretty impressive and I don't think it can be easily replicated. Djokovic is the only active player who I feel could accomplish this, but it's a stretch. Obviously, Novak's own achievements at 31-32 are special on their own but it takes a great deal of talent, adaptability, conditioning, and most importantly motivation to make it up to 38 and still be in the mix for the biggest trophies. Given his mental lapses from time to time (2016-2018), I find the latter of these four requirements to be his most difficult to maintain. Also, we have to consider that Federer and Nadal will likely both retire before him. Where will his motivation be then?

But this is what I think could happen. As I've said, it's truly impossible to know since many were saying the same things about Nadal retiring before age 30 some years ago.
 
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Fabresque

Professional
The reason Fed’s lasted so long is the lack of competition. The next-gen when he was aging consisted of Raonic, Dimitrov, and Nishikori. When all 3 bombed and became the lost gen, Fed still continued strong with Djokovic and Nadal.

This most likely won’t be the case for Djoker. Tsitsipas and Zverev have beaten him a good few times. And Medvedev showed Big 3 level dominance during the summer hardcourt swing, beating Novak en route to his first Masters 1000 title.

Age may very well be a number, but it’s only down for Novak from here on, and we finally have someone (Medvedev) showing he can dethrone the big 3.
 

OhYes

Legend
So we all know one of the top reasons Fed is considered GOAT by his fans, and why they excuse every loss over the past 10+years is because he's "old" and been staying competitive at this "old" age. Well, looks like the apparent unique nature of this achievement is under assault, as Djokovic, himself one of the most durable players in history, has his eye on extending his longevity even past Fed's...so my question is: Do you think he can do it and if so how will his results compare to Fed's?

If he does that I will hate him.
 

Mike Sams

Legend
Djokovic's style isn't conducive for playing into his late 30s to 40s. He's heavily defensive, runs almost every ball down, and relies a lot on his flexibility and speed. His mind will continue to be that of a player wanting to give every effort to get the ball back but his body will break before then. Even losing a fraction of his speed and reflexes will make the difference between winning and losing. He plays a young man's style. Unless he changes up his game and becomes an attacker, he's not going to be grinding it out with the young guys when he's in his late 30s.
 

beard

Professional
No, Novak will play just to take all Fed's important records, and retire like a real man... 3 years at most... But, If it take 10 years of play to break records 10 it is...
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Djokovic's style isn't conducive for playing into his late 30s to 40s. He's heavily defensive, runs almost every ball down, and relies a lot on his flexibility and speed. His mind will continue to be that of a player wanting to give every effort to get the ball back but his body will break before then. Even losing a fraction of his speed and reflexes will make the difference between winning and losing. He plays a young man's style. Unless he changes up his game and becomes an attacker, he's not going to be grinding it out with the young guys when he's in his late 30s.
Will EGG-technology improve in the early 20s and revitalize him in between matches and provide perpetual youth???
 

beard

Professional
Djokovic's style isn't conducive for playing into his late 30s to 40s. He's heavily defensive, runs almost every ball down, and relies a lot on his flexibility and speed. His mind will continue to be that of a player wanting to give every effort to get the ball back but his body will break before then. Even losing a fraction of his speed and reflexes will make the difference between winning and losing. He plays a young man's style. Unless he changes up his game and becomes an attacker, he's not going to be grinding it out with the young guys when he's in his late 30s.
Yes, same as we heard here that Nadal will play from wheelchair by 27 yo... Fed fans will never learn.... just won't :rolleyes:
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Fedr has a severe nut allergy from what I can tell, because according to Wilander the Nadal has the biggest balls on the ATP.
The allergy seems to have diminished since 2014, no? It is The Nadal that breaks down when eating Lindt chocolate.
 

OhYes

Legend
Djokovic's style isn't conducive for playing into his late 30s to 40s. He's heavily defensive, runs almost every ball down, and relies a lot on his flexibility and speed. His mind will continue to be that of a player wanting to give every effort to get the ball back but his body will break before then. Even losing a fraction of his speed and reflexes will make the difference between winning and losing. He plays a young man's style. Unless he changes up his game and becomes an attacker, he's not going to be grinding it out with the young guys when he's in his late 30s.
Although I wouldn't like it to happen, listening to such expertise while we heard similar story about Nadal millions of times, makes me chuckle.
 

OhYes

Legend
Ok let me put this into perspective - if Novak still plays while Federer (and maybe Nadal) is/are not playing anymore, will he like his new role when crowd show respect and appreciate they can still watch one of big 3 play tennis ? I think he would like that new change of events, and probably stay few more years to feel the vibes.
 

Lew II

Hall of Fame
It is not so much his age at 38 as he still can bring his almost peak game. Just less often as he ages (makes it harder to win slams). It is the fact that the two guys chasing him are also ATG's who are 5 and 6 years younger.

Of course Djoker can hang around till 38 as there will be no ATG's to deal with. Will Djoker have to deal with a 6 years younger ATG at WC at 38? Will he have to deal with the best clay court player of all time at RG who is 5 years younger?

Yes, age is an issue (not THE reason or an excuse) but Fed would have won a slam and maybe two this year if it was not for TWO younger ATG's...
Can you tell me what ATGs from 9 years older to 4 years younger (born in 1972-85) did Federer have to face in his career, if ATGs are so important?

Fed fans always tell me that ATGs are players like others, and Baghdatis/Gonzalez can play just as good as them.
 

terribleIVAN

Hall of Fame
The delusions of grandeur with Djokodal are never far from the surface. Neither of those guys are the ball strikers or athletes that Fed is.
I'll certainly give you the ball strike part.

But a better athlete ?

You out of your mind ?
 

Mike Sams

Legend
Although I wouldn't like it to happen, listening to such expertise while we heard similar story about Nadal millions of times, makes me chuckle.
Nadal's story is different. Youth wasn't the issue with him. It was his body giving him a lot of trouble and he was forced to take extensive breaks. A change of coach and change in tactics (more attacking/less back of court defense) helped a lot.
The topic of Djokovic and Nadal playing up to age 40 is a very different subject altogether. Even Federer can barely keep up with the tour these days. He's been taken out of 2 Slams this year by much younger guys (Tsits and Dimi). He got overpowered by the much younger Thiem in IW. And Federer doesn't play a style similar to Nadal and Djokovic. He doesn't go run balls down or get into endless long rallies. It's going to be interesting to see how long Nadal and Djokovic stay on the tour and keep their level of play up against a growing field of younger players who are making inroads.
 

OhYes

Legend
Nadal's story is different. Youth wasn't the issue with him. It was his body giving him a lot of trouble and he was forced to take extensive breaks. A change of coach and change in tactics (more attacking/less back of court defense) helped a lot.
The topic of Djokovic and Nadal playing up to age 40 is a very different subject altogether. Even Federer can barely keep up with the tour these days. He's been taken out of 2 Slams this year by much younger guys (Tsits and Dimi). He got overpowered by the much younger Thiem in IW. And Federer doesn't play a style similar to Nadal and Djokovic. He doesn't go run balls down or get into endless long rallies. It's going to be interesting to see how long Nadal and Djokovic stay on the tour and keep their level of play up against a growing field of younger players who are making inroads.
Nadal was in much worse shape than Djokovic concerning longevity, anyone can tell you that. No matter which attribute you put into comparison, Novak should have longer career than him (in theory).
 

TearTheRoofOff

Hall of Fame
Although I wouldn't like it to happen, listening to such expertise while we heard similar story about Nadal millions of times, makes me chuckle.
Well I suppose the Duracell Bunny is the exception. Most thought he'd have run out of 'AA batteries' a long time ago, but, alas. They really do last for ages. Where's Kodak when you need them?
 
Peter Sampras and his fans are true gentlemen. They never put excuses for the losses.

Sampras lost against a well-playing Roger. Nothing else. Federer was better that day. No single Sampras fan has ever called Sampras old for that match (he was 29 in the Wimbledon 2001 match, so it would be ridiculous to excuse the loss with age).

28 years young Federer lost to Berdych at Wimbledon 2010. Obviously, age cannot be a factor in that loss. Does it mean Berdych is better than Federer on grass just for one match?

And a Federer aged 29 lost to Tsonga at Wimbledon 2011. Does it mean Tsonga is better than Federer just for one match?
Usually we call it a zoning player.
Neither pete nor fed were in good form at 2001 & 2010 wimby respectively..
2011 is a weird thing
 

Red Rick

Talk Tennis Guru
Not quite sure what Djokovic is gonna do when he's outgrinded. I don't think he really has teh forehand to force issues much, though his serve has been amazing this year.
 
So we all know one of the top reasons Fed is considered GOAT by his fans, and why they excuse every loss over the past 10+years is because he's "old" and been staying competitive at this "old" age. Well, looks like the apparent unique nature of this achievement is under assault, as Djokovic, himself one of the most durable players in history, has his eye on extending his longevity even past Fed's...so my question is: Do you think he can do it and if so how will his results compare to Fed's?

well with all his injuries i don't think he'll beat fed
 
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