Greatest of the three great classics

Greatest?

  • Total voters
    50
Lew II

Lew II

G.O.A.T.
2017 AO final, 2018 WI semifinal and 2019 WI final were the greatest matches in history IMO.

Big3 battling toe to toe for the records. Just look at the number of Slam titles of the contestants in the moment of the match: 17-14, 17-12, 20-15. o_O

Which of these three matches was the greatest? To me they're equally the greatest.



 
Yoneyama

Yoneyama

Hall of Fame
AO17 for me. I don't often see a tennis match as a 'drama' but the way that Federer and Nadal made their ways to the final, then the quality match itself was absolutely unbelievable. The fact that both of those players had depressing 2016 seasons made it even more epic when they met in the final of the first grand slam.

Bonus points because the other big threats at the time (Djokovic and Murray) were dethroned in shock upsets by Istomin (revenge for him) and Zverev (amazing S&V masterclass). Then you had Federer and Nadal both have epic SF showdowns with Wawrinka and Dimitrov to top it off.
 
junior74

junior74

Talk Tennis Guru
The three greatest matches in tennis history
starring:

- The Declined Amigos -

Presented to you by LewII

One is a SF, which somewhat disqualifies it, despite being a great match.

Wimbledon 2019 was very dramatic, but not great if level has anything to do with greatness.

There have been a handfull of great matches before 2017, too :)
 
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DSH

DSH

Talk Tennis Guru
The only "negative", we could say, of Nadal against Djokovic in Wimbledon was that they played in the semifinals.
For the rest, it is clearly the best of the 3 matches cited by a clear margin.
:cool:
 
MichaelNadal

MichaelNadal

Bionic Poster
rdlol.gif
 
ForumMember

ForumMember

Hall of Fame
very very difficult to split them..

Of course quality wise it has to be W 18. If it was a final it was clear winner. But unfortunately it wasn't. AO 2017 hugely significant as it brought Federer back in winning of GS titles and without that he would have been surpassed by Djokovic and Nadal. Similarly W 19 is significant if Federer had won that he would have killed any chance Djokovic had of surpassing him.
 
AnOctorokForDinner

AnOctorokForDinner

G.O.A.T.
Phoenix1983 said:
How is it that you are wrong about virtually everything?

I can assure you that the 2019 W final was more dramatic, and of a similar quality.
Click to expand...

Lawl, the 2018 semi was obviously better and whoever fails to discern that doesn't understand tennis and not worth listening to, so be a good guy for once and stop pestering me with unwanted opinions.
 
DSH

DSH

Talk Tennis Guru
ReeceSachs said:
Didn’t say horrible.
Click to expand...

No, I mean he played a little above the average of his level and still won a match against the greatest legend in the history of Wimbledon.
Hence, my surprise.
 
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Lew II

Lew II

G.O.A.T.
junior74 said:
The three greatest matches in tennis history
starring:

- The Declined Amigos -

Presented to you by LewII

One is a SF, which somewhat disqualifies it, despite being a great match.

Wimbledon 2019 was very dramatic, but not great if level has anything to do with greatness.

There have been a handfull of great matches before 2017, too :)
Click to expand...
The declined amigos that won all last 12 slams.
 
junior74

junior74

Talk Tennis Guru
Lew II said:
The declined amigos that won all last 12 slams.
Click to expand...

Yes, tennis is in terrible shape.

I suggested that there were some great matches before 2017.

Borg - McEnroe W1980
Federer - Nadal W 2008, 2007
Nadal - Djokovic AO2012, RG2013
Federer - Roddick W2009
Sampras - Agassi US 2001
Safin - Federer AO2005
Djokovic - Wawrinka AO13
Djokovic - Del potro W2013

just to mention a few
 
C

ChrisRF

Legend
AnOctorokForDinner said:
Lawl, the 2018 semi was obviously better and whoever fails to discern that doesn't understand tennis and not worth listening to, so be a good guy for once and stop pestering me with unwanted opinions.
Click to expand...
That is way too harsh for such a close question. Such a phrase would be legitimate if someone wants to deny that one of the Big 3 is great at all or similar nonsense, but not here.

Just look at the 5th set of this year’s final, it was as dramatic as it gets. At first Djokovic leads with a break, then Federer comes back and breaks again. Then of course Djokovic saves the 40-15 situation. But after that Federer is very close to another break, and finally Djokovic saves everything and takes the first decisive TB in Grand Slam final history.

Of course 2018 had close situations in the 5th set as well, but "only" with many wasted break points, not the complete rollercoaster as in 2019.

To the pure quality of the tennis I must say I cannot decide. I watched both matches two times (live and then again a few months later; I even made highlights of them). Djokovic/Nadal surely have the more grueling rallyes, but that isn’t automatically more quality. Also the conditions were far from perfect for Nadal. He just doesn’t lke to play indoors.

But then, to everyone his/her opinion.
 
ibbi

ibbi

G.O.A.T.
The 2018 match is apparently handicapped because it was only a semifinal? It's on a whole other level to these other two, certainly this years Wimbledon final which was defined by as much/more bad play as good. The 17 Aussie final goes to a whole other level in the fifth, but I don't think it was as high as the 2018 match overall.
 
junior74

junior74

Talk Tennis Guru
ibbi said:
The 2018 match is apparently handicapped because it was only a semifinal? It's on a whole other level to these other two, certainly this years Wimbledon final which was defined by as much/more bad play as good. The 17 Aussie final goes to a whole other level in the fifth, but I don't think it was as high as the 2018 match overall.
Click to expand...

Agree completely with these comparisons.
But are these three matches the three best matches in the history of the game?
 
AnOctorokForDinner

AnOctorokForDinner

G.O.A.T.
ChrisRF said:
That is way too harsh for such a close question. Such a phrase would be legitimate if someone wants to deny that one of the Big 3 is great at all or similar nonsense, but not here.

Just look at the 5th set of this year’s final, it was as dramatic as it gets. At first Djokovic leads with a break, then Federer comes back and breaks again. Then of course Djokovic saves the 40-15 situation. But after that Federer is very close to another break, and finally Djokovic saves everything and takes the first decisive TB in Grand Slam final history.

Of course 2018 had close situations in the 5th set as well, but "only" with many wasted break points, not the complete rollercoaster as in 2019.

To the pure quality of the tennis I must say I cannot decide. I watched both matches two times (live and then again a few months later; I even made highlights of them). Djokovic/Nadal surely have the more grueling rallyes, but that isn’t automatically more quality. Also the conditions were far from perfect for Nadal. He just doesn’t lke to play indoors.

But then, to everyone his/her opinion.
Click to expand...

You have a lot of weird out-of-the-blue opinions for someone who earnestly watches tennis a lot, I don't understand the ways your analytical faculties work differently.

The 2019 final had pockets of drama, especially in the fifth set, but the second and fourth set were mostly dull and much of the first and third sets was like a procession. The first set and most of the third set of the 2018 semi was a procession but the rest was electric throughout, Nadal saving a ton of BPs while Djokovic edged out the grand tiebreak and the fifth was very tight until the end (final two games easy but so was the final tiebreak in 2019). The fifth set alone does not the match make.

Quality-wise it's a no-brainer altogether, I don't see anything better in 2019 except for Federer's serving. Better return, better strokes, better movement all in 2018. Dunno on net play, neither match was heavy on impressive net points.
 
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DSH

DSH

Talk Tennis Guru
AnOctorokForDinner said:
You have a lot of weird out-of-the-blue opinions for someone who earnestly watches tennis a lot, I don't understand the ways your analytical faculties work differently.

The 2019 final had pockets of drama, especially in the fifth set, but the second and fourth set were mostly dull and much of the first and third sets was like a procession. The first set and most of the third set of the 2018 semi was a procession but the rest was electric throughout, Nadal saving a ton of BPs while Djokovic edged out the grand tiebreak and the fifth was very tight until the end (final two games easy but so was the final tiebreak in 2019). The fifth set alone does not the match make.

Quality-wise it's a no-brainer altogether, I don't see anything better in 2019 except for Federer's serving. Better return, better strokes, better movement all in 2018. Dunno on net play, neither match was heavy on impressive net points.
Click to expand...


You just have to compare the two finals to 5 sets in Wimbledon (2014 and 2019) between these two players and recognize that the drama of the latter replaces the higher quality of the first, although that one also had many exciting moments too, only that the most recent always gets the highest recognition.
Forgetting, forgetting!
 
C

ChrisRF

Legend
AnOctorokForDinner said:
You have a lot of weird out-of-the-blue opinions for someone who earnestly watches tennis a lot, I don't understand the ways your analytical faculties work differently.

The 2019 final had pockets of drama, especially in the fifth set, but the second and fourth set were mostly dull and much of the first and third sets was like a procession. The first set and most of the third set of the 2018 semi was a procession but the rest was electric throughout, Nadal saving a ton of BPs while Djokovic edged out the grand tiebreak and the fifth was very tight until the end (final two games easy but so was the final tiebreak in 2019). The fifth set alone does not the match make.

Quality-wise it's a no-brainer altogether, I don't see anything better in 2019 except for Federer's serving. Better return, better strokes, better movement all in 2018. Dunno on net play, neither match was heavy on impressive net points.
Click to expand...
The second set of 2019 was garbage, I agree. But there were some situations where at least Federer was brilliant. And of course the 3rd set TB of 2018 was much better than all the TBs of 2019. But even though the 5th set doesn’t make a full match, it was so great that it is the decisive factor for me to make this 2019 match more dramatic altogether.

Also that it was a final matters here, and that is was the only decisive TB in a Slam final ever, no matter that this TB itself wasn’t great. However, one could argue that 2018 was de facto the final as well, similar to RG 2013.

And last but not least, 2019 of course didn’t have the winner I wanted while in 2018 I was rather neutral. But I try to not letting me being influenced by such subjective preferences when I judge such things.

One last point: I’m not someone who talks about phrases like “real grass” or demands a certain playing style for grass, but clearly Nadal was struggling with his game there (especially because it was indoors) and mainly came that close because of his immense fighting spirit.
 
ForumMember

ForumMember

Hall of Fame
tonylg said:
I'm not sure any of them rate in the top 10 as greatest in history. Perhaps AO17, perhaps.
Click to expand...
Yeah.. I think last great match was played in 90s when ppl used to S&V.. after that they slowed down the surface and it's all been drab since then.
 
Phoenix1983

Phoenix1983

G.O.A.T.
AnOctorokForDinner said:
Lawl, the 2018 semi was obviously better and whoever fails to discern that doesn't understand tennis and not worth listening to, so be a good guy for once and stop pestering me with unwanted opinions.
Click to expand...

It's a democracy mate, just because you believe ridiculous things like "Gonzales was a tier above Sampras" doesn't mean the rest of us have to let it slide.

I can assure you that I understand tennis very well, probably better than you in fact - and my opinions/comments have equal validity to yours, despite your somewhat arrogant/elitist attitude.
 
Lew II

Lew II

G.O.A.T.
Combined Slam totals of the two contestants

WI 2019 Federer-Nadal semifinal --> 38
RG 2019 Nadal-Federer semifinal --> 37
WI 2019 final --> 35
AO 2017 final --> 31
AO 2019 final --> 30
WI 2018 Djokovic-Nadal semifinal --> 29

We may never experience so much greatness embodied by two players on a court for the rest of our lives.
 
T

thrust

Legend
ChrisRF said:
The second set of 2019 was garbage, I agree. But there were some situations where at least Federer was brilliant. And of course the 3rd set TB of 2018 was much better than all the TBs of 2019. But even though the 5th set doesn’t make a full match, it was so great that it is the decisive factor for me to make this 2019 match more dramatic altogether.

Also that it was a final matters here, and that is was the only decisive TB in a Slam final ever, no matter that this TB itself wasn’t great. However, one could argue that 2018 was de facto the final as well, similar to RG 2013.

And last but not least, 2019 of course didn’t have the winner I wanted while in 2018 I was rather neutral. But I try to not letting me being influenced by such subjective preferences when I judge such things.

One last point: I’m not someone who talks about phrases like “real grass” or demands a certain playing style for grass, but clearly Nadal was struggling with his game there (especially because it was indoors) and mainly came that close because of his immense fighting spirit.
Click to expand...
I always liked Nadal but I could never understand the excuse, by his most ardent fans, why indoor tennis is so difficult for him. IF he were a rookie that could make sense, but as great as he has been for so many years, that makes no sense to me.
 
chjtennis

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
My top 3 Grand Slam matches amongst Big 3 grand are 2008 Wim Nadal v Federer, 2012 AO Djokovic v Nadal, and 2017 AO Federer v Nadal(in no particular order). The following matches are all great as well.

2009 AO: Nadal v Federer
2010 & 2011 USO: Djokovic v Federer
2013 FO: Nadal v Djokovic
2014 Wim: Djokovic v Federer
2018 Wim: Djokovic v Nadal
2019 Wim: Djokovic v Federer
 
junior74

junior74

Talk Tennis Guru
Lew II said:
Combined Slam totals of the two contestants

WI 2019 Federer-Nadal semifinal --> 38
RG 2019 Nadal-Federer semifinal --> 37
WI 2019 final --> 35
AO 2017 final --> 31
AO 2019 final --> 30
WI 2018 Djokovic-Nadal semifinal --> 29

We may never experience so much greatness embodied by two players on a court for the rest of our lives.
Click to expand...

By this logic, the next Stones album will be the greatest ever! Can't wait.
keith-richards-rolling-stones.jpg
 
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