Greatest three-set match on clay

[NatF]

I remember watching that match live. It was an unexpected loss, because Nadal of course was in the final the year before, and was coming into the 2006 version having beaten Federer in Dubai and making the semis of IW. Moya just knew what he needed to do.

Probably an early showcase of why Moya made a good coach.

 

[NatF]

But then @vive le beau jeu ! wouldn't have got to see one of his favorite matches ever in the final Chennai Final of 2008 with Yonzhny.

Is it better for the Nadal to lose a match earlier or to have a more embarassing beatdown?

 

[Hitman]

I will die on the hill that this is why Fed has the GOAT fh, the go to strategy to beat him would never be hit to his fh - even if he had a rally shot in his backhand that was as stable as Nadal's. But I digress.

Unless you are Del Potro and Federer wants to play chicken with your forehand.

But your overall point is actually why I also say Federer has the GOAT forehand.

 

[Hitman]

Probably an early showcase of why Moya made a good coach.

Well, Moya knew all the weaknesses.

Did you ever watch the tie break tournament that took place in Mallorca in 2004, where it was 8 players in it, and in the final Moya beat Nadal?

The tactic was seen there a bit, after the win, Moya interviewed Nadal and asked why he felt he lost and Nadal said that felt rushed on his forehand.

 

[Hitman]

Is it better for the Nadal to lose a match earlier or to have a more embarassing beatdown?

It depends on when the denadalisation is most effective. Vive would always say it should be first round though...

 

[Martin J]

Well, Moya knew all the weaknesses.

Did you ever watch the tie break tournament that took place in Mallorca in 2004, where it was 8 players in it, and in the final Moya beat Nadal?

The tactic was seen there a bit, after the win, Moya interviewed Nadal and asked why he felt he lost and Nadal said that felt rushed on his forehand.

I wasn't aware of that tournament, are there any videos? Sounds interesting that Moya figured out and started to exploit his FH as early as in 2004.

 

[Hitman]

I wasn't aware of that tournament, are there any videos? Sounds interesting that Moya figured out and started to exploit his FH as early as in 2004.

I saw it back when it happened. I've tried to find it on YouTube but haven't come across it. I'm sure someone must know where we can find a video.

It was basically a tie break only tournament.

 

[NatF]

Well, Moya knew all the weaknesses.

Did you ever watch the tie break tournament that took place in Mallorca in 2004, where it was 8 players in it, and in the final Moya beat Nadal?

The tactic was seen there a bit, after the win, Moya interviewed Nadal and asked why he felt he lost and Nadal said that felt rushed on his forehand.

Nope never saw it or heard of it. Tennis has been experimenting with different exo formats for a while then. Remember who else was in it?

 

[Hitman]

Nope never saw it or heard of it. Tennis has been experimenting with different exo formats for a while then. Remember who else was in it?

It was a one day event. Costa was in it. I don't remember the others. But I do remember it was Moya and Nadal in the final. If I can find it somewhere I will make a thread on it.

 

[dking68]

2021 Nadal d. Tsitsipas in Barcelona Final was heavily underrated. Nadal saved match points and turned it around to win

 

[Third Serve]

But there is. The stats actually confirm that 2021>2022.

Not a big fan of this logic though because a Nadal fan could just say 2021 wouldn’t have been possible if Ned hadn’t dropped off a ton from 2020.

 

[vive le beau jeu !]

But then @vive le beau jeu ! wouldn't have got to see one of his favorite matches ever in the final Chennai Final of 2008 with Yonzhny.

#Slay

 

[Biotic]

Not a big fan of this logic though because a Nadal fan could just say 2021 wouldn’t have been possible if Ned hadn’t dropped off a ton from 2020.

He really didn't drop off a ton IMO. He was more than fine in Rome and the early rounds of RG. Had that match been played on another day, or a couple of hours earlier in the afternoon, Nadal could've won. Not like he didn't have 5-0 in the 1st set. It was like a deja vu up to that point.

Big difference here is that Djoko clawed his way back late in the 1st, compared to 2020 where he lost too many close games (that went to deuce at least). And even so Nadal was cooked in the 3rd set, but it was too late for Djoko to capitalize on it.

 

[StrongRule]

He really didn't drop off a ton IMO. He was more than fine in Rome and the early rounds of RG. Had that match been played on another day, or a couple of hours earlier in the afternoon, Nadal could've won. Not like he didn't have 5-0 in the 1st set. It was like a deja vu up to that point.

Big difference here is that Djoko clawed his way back late in the 1st, compared to 2020 where he lost too many close games (that went to deuce at least). And even so Nadal was cooked in the 3rd set, but it was too late for Djoko to capitalize on it.

In other words, if RG still existed. Unfortunately, it was replaced by the Djokovic Open.

 

[Biotic]

In other words, if RG still existed. Unfortunately, it was replaced by the Djokovic Open.

It was high time for hyena's den renovation.

 

[Daniel Andrade]

2009 Madrid semifinal, Nadal d. Federer 3-6, 7-6(5), 7-6(9)

Isn't it Nadal d Djokovic?

 

[Daniel Andrade]

Madrid 2009 is a match I like less and less the more I watch it tbh

why

 

[Third Serve]

why

Dramatic match but the quality of the tennis was lower than their norm except for the tiebreakers. Too many balls landing just past the service line. Weirdly I felt Nadal didn’t move all that well either.

 

[Connor35]

Iga-Aryna, Madrid 2024

75 46 76

Aryna in an interview called it the best match she's ever played ... and she didnt even win.

 

[StrongRule]

Dramatic match but the quality of the tennis was lower than their norm except for the tiebreakers. Too many balls landing just past the service line. Weirdly I felt Nadal didn’t move all that well either.

On the other hand, it was a very rare example of Nadal being the mentally stronger player in a match against Djokovic.

 

[Third Serve]

On the other hand, it was a very rare example of Nadal being the mentally stronger player in a match against Djokovic.

You do Nadal a disservice with that statement. He’s had plenty of matches where he was more clutch than Djokovic.

 

[Mustard]

Never seen that match, interesting to know! No one really talks about Moya but he had one of the best forehands of all time, was a bit of a boogeyman for Hewitt in 2002 because the way he used that forehand was a bit Federer 0.5.

I saw the Nadal vs. Moya match from 2006 Rome again a while back. Nadal won 6-1, 2-6, 6-2.

 

[Mustard]

I thought that prime Nadal couldn't lose a match to an almost 30 year old veteran.

It shocked people at the time, how Nadal won the first set 6-2, and then lost the next two sets 1-6, 1-6.

 

[Mustard]

On the other hand, it was a very rare example of Nadal being the mentally stronger player in a match against Djokovic.

LOL. What? An example. The 2013 US Open final. It was 1 set all, 4-4 in the third set and Nadal serving at 0-40. Nadal got out of that to hold serve, broke Djokovic to win the third set 6-4, and then Nadal won the fourth set 6-1. Djokovic double faulted at championship point down against Nadal twice in French Open finals, i.e. 2012 and 2014. In 2008, Nadal's number 2 ranking was on the line against Djokovic in Hamburg, and Nadal won 7-5, 2-6, 6-2. In 2009, Djokovic pushed like heck to beat Nadal on clay, in Monte Carlo, Rome and Madrid, and failed to get it done. The 2013 French semi is another.

 

[Martin J]

It shocked people at the time, how Nadal won the first set 6-2, and then lost the next two sets 1-6, 1-6.

I know, it was more of a joke inspired by the recent "Nadal vs Alcaraz" threads, where some posters stated how Alcaraz loses to old veterans and it could never happen to Nadal.
Anyway, Moya deserves credits for the tactics he employed against Rafa, I'm sure that he encouraged some coaches/players to use the same approach.

 

[Martin J]

LOL. What? An example. The 2013 US Open final. It was 1 set all, 4-4 in the third set and Nadal serving at 0-40. Nadal got out of that to hold serve, broke Djokovic to win the third set 6-4, and then Nadal won the fourth set 6-1. Djokovic double faulted at championship point down against Nadal twice in French Open finals, i.e. 2012 and 2014. In 2008, Nadal's number 2 ranking was on the line against Djokovic in Hamburg, and Nadal won 7-5, 2-6, 6-2. In 2009, Djokovic pushed like heck to beat Nadal on clay, in Monte Carlo, Rome and Madrid, and failed to get it done. The 2013 French semi is another.

The Queen's 2008 as well, I always though that Djokovic was the better player with more chances to win that match, but Nadal played crucial points better. Similar to their 2016 Rome encounter, Nadal was the one closer to winning both sets (and the match), but Djokovic was just stronger in clutch moments.

 

[Mustard]

The Queen's 2008 as well, I always though that Djokovic was the better player with more chances to win that match, but Nadal played crucial points better. Similar to their 2016 Rome encounter, Nadal was the one closer to winning both sets (and the match), but Djokovic was just stronger in clutch moments.

Nadal won the clutch moments in the 2008 Queen's Club final. There was only a few points in it.

 

[Mustard]

I know, it was more of a joke inspired by the recent "Nadal vs Alcaraz" threads, where some posters stated how Alcaraz loses to old veterans and it could never happen to Nadal.
Anyway, Moya deserves credits for the tactics he employed against Rafa, I'm sure that he encouraged some coaches/players to use the same approach.

Their 2007 French Open quarter final was a real beatdown, though

 

[Martin J]

Their 2007 French Open quarter final was a real beatdown, though

And Moya was in good form actually, had a nice run at Hamburg (beating Djokovic and pushing Fed at the age of almost 31).
His tactics worked well on HC, but to a lesser extent on clay. It's a surface that gives Nadal all the time he needs, so it's much tougher to execute it on dirt.

 

[NatF]

And Moya was in good form actually, had a nice run at Hamburg (beating Djokovic and pushing Fed at the age of almost 31).
His tactics worked well on HC, but to a lesser extent on clay. It's a surface that gives Nadal all the time he needs, so it's much tougher to execute it on dirt.

Hewitt GOAT for employing the tactics on clay.

 

[Martin J]

Hewitt GOAT for employing the tactics on clay.

Hamburg plays like a slow HC though But since Hewitt is still being underrated/mocked by some around here, we should praise him regardless.

 

[NatF]

Hamburg plays like a slow HC though But since Hewitt is still being underrated/mocked by some around here, we should praise him regardless.

Sssshhhh

 

[StrongRule]

LOL. What? An example. The 2013 US Open final. It was 1 set all, 4-4 in the third set and Nadal serving at 0-40. Nadal got out of that to hold serve, broke Djokovic to win the third set 6-4, and then Nadal won the fourth set 6-1. Djokovic double faulted at championship point down against Nadal twice in French Open finals, i.e. 2012 and 2014. In 2008, Nadal's number 2 ranking was on the line against Djokovic in Hamburg, and Nadal won 7-5, 2-6, 6-2. In 2009, Djokovic pushed like heck to beat Nadal on clay, in Monte Carlo, Rome and Madrid, and failed to get it done. The 2013 French semi is another.

You do Nadal a disservice with that statement. He’s had plenty of matches where he was more clutch than Djokovic.

I said a rare example, not the only example. There were way too much cases of Nadal struggling mentally in their matches, even in some matches that he ended up winning.

You cannot be serious if you think Nadal was mentally the stronger player in any of RG 2012-2014, especially 2013. In 2012 he went from getting broken once during the first 6 matches (and also getting broken once in each of MC and Rome against Djokovic that year) to getting broken 7 times in the final, including 4 times in a row. He was nervous as hell in that one, but him being the much more in-form player still made up for it.

Nadal being so mentally unclutch in RG 2013 is the reason why this match is even remembered. Up a break in the second set, up a break twice in the fourth, and yet he found a way to lose both. It should never have been that close.