Grunting with service return

[Cindysphinx]

There's a lady I know. We may partner in the near future. She does something, and I'm not sure how to handle it.

She grunts on her groundstrokes, including service returns. She has told me that in the past, people have mistaken her grunt for an out call and have stopped playing. Because of this, she gives opponents a pre-match warning: "Hey, I just want to tell you that I grunt when I hit service returns. That's not me calling the ball out. If I call a ball out, I will make a very clear out call with a gesture."

To my ears, the grunt sounds like a grunt, not an out call. I once played the grunter in a mixed match, and she gave the speech before the match started. I didn't have any problem discerning that a grunt was a grunt, but apparently others have more trouble.

Despite the speech, opponents will sometimes mistake the grunt for an out call. (Another friend told me this recently happened in a USTA match). The grunter starts to get irritated that her opponents keep making this mistake even after the speech; the opponents are unhappy they are losing points because of their momentary confusion.

Now. If the grunter and I partner in a match, my feeling about it is that if you make unnecessary noise, you do it at your peril. So if our opponents say they mistook a grunt for an out call, I will offer to play a let every single time, no matter how often it happens and regardless of the speech. I would not feel it right to consider the grunt a hindrance resulting in our loss of a point, as it does not happen as the ball is on its way to the opponent.

Is this the proper way to handle it?

Cindy -- who doesn't have this problem because she grunts on volleys, not groundstrokes

 

[jrod]

I think verbalization etiquette went by the wayside a long time ago. Only recently has the WTA felt the need to penalize someone for verbalizing during play (squeals vs. screams vs. some kind of noise that would rival a jet engine on takeoff produced by a portuguese firecracker).

A hefty percentage of the guys I play at the 4.0-4.5 level make noises when striking the ball that I would characterize as mostly grunts. The women I know do tend to be more quiet during the point but after the point is over is another story altogether (and lets not talk about changeovers).

Seriously, I see no issue with a grunt on the serve, return of serve, or any other stroke for that matter. It has become part of the game, for good or bad.

 

[volusiano]

Maybe a way to help is to ask her to also accompany her out calls with a hand or racket gesture. If she's a good sports and knows that her grunt is enough of an issue to warn people off before a match, she should be willing to cooperate with a hand/racket gesture to reinforce her actual "out" calls.

 

[Cindysphinx]

The problem comes in when she does the grunt on an "in" ball and the opponents want to play a let. I think in those cases we should play the let, even if has happened before in the match and even if she gave the speech. Then again, I don't want to get into a fight with her about it.

I will definitely bring a copy of the Code with me to that match, that's for sure.

 

[sureshs]

I heard Jeremy Chardy grunting on all service returns against Murray

 

[wao]

The problem comes in when she does the grunt on an "in" ball and the opponents want to play a let. I think in those cases we should play the let, even if has happened before in the match and even if she gave the speech. Then again, I don't want to get into a fight with her about it.

I will definitely bring a copy of the Code with me to that match, that's for sure.

I would have to agree with jrod on this as a grunt is not a hinderance to play. Many people grunt when they hit a ball ( serving,returning, ground strokes and as you said when you volley). I personally would not play a let on a service return. When I play doubles and I am not returning, I call the service line and they would call the sideline unless it was clearly out then I would make the call. I understand the whole sportmanship (or person ship) but in my opinion that is taking it over the top if I signal the out ball with "out" or in my case I hold up a finger. Just MO.

 

[tailofdog]

Grunt

Well,
I am a grunter and, its natural to me.
I think if you look at the pro game, you will find most men grunt. A lot of women also grunt and it is VERY much a part of the game. I have people who have a problem with it. You notice i did not say i have a problem with their reaction. As long as anything is within the rules its a level playing field.

 

[Topaz]

For most, the grunt is their exhalation. I don't believe exhalation has been 'outlawed' by the USTA yet, and to claim it as a hindrance would be a sorry interpretation of the rules by any of your opponents, especially since your partner lets them know up front that she does it and it is part of her game.

 

[LuckyR]

There's a lady I know. We may partner in the near future. She does something, and I'm not sure how to handle it.

She grunts on her groundstrokes, including service returns. She has told me that in the past, people have mistaken her grunt for an out call and have stopped playing. Because of this, she gives opponents a pre-match warning: "Hey, I just want to tell you that I grunt when I hit service returns. That's not me calling the ball out. If I call a ball out, I will make a very clear out call with a gesture."

To my ears, the grunt sounds like a grunt, not an out call. I once played the grunter in a mixed match, and she gave the speech before the match started. I didn't have any problem discerning that a grunt was a grunt, but apparently others have more trouble.

Despite the speech, opponents will sometimes mistake the grunt for an out call. (Another friend told me this recently happened in a USTA match). The grunter starts to get irritated that her opponents keep making this mistake even after the speech; the opponents are unhappy they are losing points because of their momentary confusion.

Now. If the grunter and I partner in a match, my feeling about it is that if you make unnecessary noise, you do it at your peril. So if our opponents say they mistook a grunt for an out call, I will offer to play a let every single time, no matter how often it happens and regardless of the speech. I would not feel it right to consider the grunt a hindrance resulting in our loss of a point, as it does not happen as the ball is on its way to the opponent.

Is this the proper way to handle it?

Cindy -- who doesn't have this problem because she grunts on volleys, not groundstrokes

My guess is your opponent's ears are every bit as good as yours. I have never heard of a player making the pre-match omments that your potential partner does, so my hat is off to her, she is going above and beyond.

I agree that your opponent's are seeking a cheap "let" and I would not be inclined to give it to them since they were warned. I have personally been asked if I called a serve out when I didn't, I gave them a let since I didn't give a pre-match warning.

 

[NBM]

I think she should just stop grunting.....a 3.5 hitter has bigger fish to fry than feeling the need to grunt on their shots....things like putting a decent repeatable move on the ball.

Federer and others seem to do just fine w.o grunting. There is no reason for 3.5's to grunt...it simply doesnt help them and often causes others to laugh at them and evidently cause confusion and disrupt play. Nothing funnier than a 3.5 outputting a very loud grunt whilst hitting a 12 mph ball.

 

[SuperJimmy]

You should watch practice videos of Andy Murray on his website. In the Miami Block 5, you can see Alex Corretja grunting when he is FEEDING the ball, lol.

I dont think there is anything wrong with grunting (even if the ball is slow). If opponents are seriously complaining about that, then they are not really there to play tennis...and I'd look for other opponents who actually want to hit the ball.

I once played against a player, that whenever hitting his forhand, when his non dominant hand was in front, he would point up with his index finger. Of course, that point up motion is the same one he used to call balls out (without saying anything verbally). Now that was a tough match to handle.

 

[Birke]

I can only ever recall grunting not even a handful of times, on my backhand side and all were winners down the line.

Should I start grunting full-time? lol

 

[burosky]

3.5s are people too! ;-)

Grunting is not an issue for me. I was only bothered by my opponents one time only because it threw me off. He was grunting way after he makes contact with the ball! I wasn't sure if he was deliberately distracting me but since he did it consistently, I gave him the benefit of the doubt. As soon as I cleared that in my mind it didn't bother me anymore. The one I find a little funny is this guy I play with who grunts when hitting lobs and drop shots as well. Funny and weird at the same time.

 

[Topaz]

3.5s are people too! ;-)

Grunting is not an issue for me. I was only bothered by my opponents one time only because it threw me off. He was grunting way after he makes contact with the ball! I wasn't sure if he was deliberately distracting me but since he did it consistently, I gave him the benefit of the doubt. As soon as I cleared that in my mind it didn't bother me anymore. The one I find a little funny is this guy I play with who grunts when hitting lobs and drop shots as well. Funny and weird at the same time.

Yeah we are!

I grunt on occasion...on exhalation. Just happens, it isn't something that I *think* about doing...even though evidently I have bigger fish to fry!

 

[sureshs]

Oh man this is getting exciting. I mentioned Drakulie needs to be informed and he is already here talking about big frames.

THE RECESSION IS OFFICIALLY OVER. OBAMA HAS ANNOUNCED THAT THE FUN CAN BEGIN AGAIN.

 

[drakulie]

^^I agree. People shouldn't grunt, or use small frames. Right??

 

[Xisbum]

Grunting from the other side of the net never bothers me; I just hit everything back until I hear someone on the other side say "wait, your (serve, return, smash, fill-in-the-blank) was out." Then I claim deafness as an excuse until they make their calls clearer and louder. ;-)

Hand or arm movements (non-racquet side) on the other hand can be very confusing. I have on occasion stopped play when I see the opponent's hand go skyward with the index finger extended. But, again, once they explain that it's part of their natural swing, I just hit everything I can and sort it out later.

For the record, I do grunt/exhale/whistle/curse occasionally while serving. Not to be confused with the wail that sometimes follows poorly struck balls.

P.S. Drakulie, I must admit to using an oversized racquet, one of the few concessions I have made to an aging body. Sorry to disappoint you. :-(

 

[jrod]

......P.S. Drakulie, I must admit to using an oversized racquet, one of the few concessions I have made to an aging body. Sorry to disappoint you. :-(

Me too. I recently switched from a 90 sq inch frame to a 93 sq inch one....slippery slope you know. I figure I'll get to 98 sq inches in another 10 years or so and very likely break the 100 sq inch barrier by the time I'm 70.

 

[sureshs]

^^I agree. People shouldn't grunt, or use small frames. Right??

The perverseness of racquet selection rules must apply.

 

[Cindysphinx]

Me too. I recently switched from a 90 sq inch frame to a 93 sq inch one....slippery slope you know. I figure I'll get to 98 sq inches in another 10 years or so and very likely break the 100 sq inch barrier by the time I'm 70.

I have two Wilson T-2s from a few years ago. 120 inches. Since I'm a 3.5, I can't wait to start using them again.

 

[Lakers4Life]

There's a lady I know. We may partner in the near future. She does something, and I'm not sure how to handle it.

She grunts on her groundstrokes, including service returns. She has told me that in the past, people have mistaken her grunt for an out call and have stopped playing. Because of this, she gives opponents a pre-match warning: "Hey, I just want to tell you that I grunt when I hit service returns. That's not me calling the ball out. If I call a ball out, I will make a very clear out call with a gesture."

To my ears, the grunt sounds like a grunt, not an out call. I once played the grunter in a mixed match, and she gave the speech before the match started. I didn't have any problem discerning that a grunt was a grunt, but apparently others have more trouble.

Despite the speech, opponents will sometimes mistake the grunt for an out call. (Another friend told me this recently happened in a USTA match). The grunter starts to get irritated that her opponents keep making this mistake even after the speech; the opponents are unhappy they are losing points because of their momentary confusion.

Now. If the grunter and I partner in a match, my feeling about it is that if you make unnecessary noise, you do it at your peril. So if our opponents say they mistook a grunt for an out call, I will offer to play a let every single time, no matter how often it happens and regardless of the speech. I would not feel it right to consider the grunt a hindrance resulting in our loss of a point, as it does not happen as the ball is on its way to the opponent.

Is this the proper way to handle it?

Cindy -- who doesn't have this problem because she grunts on volleys, not groundstrokes

Who does she think she is? Seles or Safin?

BTW, What exactly does Seles grunt? It sounds to me like "CAFE" (like the McDonalds coffee).

 

[Jack Migger]

I'm an occasional grunter.

Usually its when the balls hit on the opposite side of the court I'm currently on and I have to sprint to get it. It just comes out naturally, like others said, it's like a heavy exhalation in combo with my effort to get the ball back over. Never had any complaints about it so far.