Gut vs. Poly: Ball Pocketing?

ashridge

Semi-Pro
I've been on a long experimenting road trying to find a string/racquet combo that provides easy spin, good control, good durability, and good comfort for my sensitive elbow. This has proven to be harder than I imagined. I currently am playing with a Prince 03 Speedport Black racquet because I tried one a friend had with Prince Tour XP string in it and the combo had good control, spin and comfort, though being a poly, probably not as much durability as I'd like. Still, 3 out of 4 ain't bad. His racquet was strung in the high 40's but he hits flat and doesn't break strings and the strings had been in there for a while, so for all I know the tension may have been down in the 30's. One thing I noted in particular was the amount of ball pocketing that set-up had, which felt great. It was like a catapult for the ball, but with good spin and control. And despite his stringbed being full poly, my arm didn't hurt after playing with it several times.

So after I acquired my racquet, I started experimenting with mulitiple hybrids and other softer strings than poly, just assuming that it was probably the racquet that provided that great pocketing feel and comfort, not the string set-up, and I figured it would be better for my arm by default to use a softer string set-up than full poly. Well, I was wrong. I have now strung and tried a whole procession of set-ups: Gut/Poly, Gut/ZX Pro, Poly/SynGut, Multi/Poly, Gut/Multi, ZX Pro/Poly, ZX Pro/SynGut, ZX Pro/Multi, and full Multi. Most strung in the 50's because this racquet is fairly powerful. My elbow didn't feel totally comfortable afterwards with any of these set-ups, though some were more comfy than others. Also, none of these tests provided the combo of spin, control, comfort and pocketing that that old full bed of Tour XP poly did in my friend's racquet.

So this week I finally got around to trying to copy what he had in his racquet. A full bed of Prince Tour XP 16, and I strung it up at 37 x 33. And BOOM, all the things I had liked about that string in his racquet, I was now feeling in my racquet (same as his) with the same string. Low powered string that allowed me to really swing out, yet somehow felt "lively" on impact, extremely noticeable ball pocketing, above average spin, excellent control, and the confidence to go for some shots I've been hesitant to with some of those other tests because they were too powerful and I had a lot of balls sail long. Today when I played my match, there were several times I hit a deep, arching groundstroke that looked for all the world to both me and my opponent like it was going to sail long and then at the last minute it dove down and landed inside the baseline. My opponent was flummoxed and it really put a smile on my face. And the best thing is that my elbow didn't hurt during the match and so far hasn't hurt after. My arm was a little *tired* after the match, but I think it's maybe because the set-up was lower powered and I was swinging out a little harder both to get more power and because the set-up had more control and allowed me to go for some shots. I think I could actually probably lower the tension a few lbs. more for slightly more power and still have good control.

Durability is the question. I don't have experience with this particular poly and how long it plays until going "dead". I know that Gut mains will last and play well longer in a Gut/poly hybrid than just straight poly. I tried a Gut/Poly hybrid with Tonic 15L Longevity and Tour XP 16 in this racquet at 58 x 43, and it had good spin, but control was only "fair", and it definitely didn't have as good of ball pocketing or comfort as full Tour XP at 37 x 33. I strung the Tour XP so low at 43 in the hybrid set-up because I just wasn't sure if my arm could take more than that. As it turned out, though, the full poly set-up at 37x33 was more comfy on my elbow than the Gut/Poly at 58x43.

I have plans to try a full bed of Tonic Ball Feel Gut in this racquet (with string savers to increase durability), but I am skeptical that I am going to be happy with the spin production in that set-up, and I hit a good amount of topspin in my game. I'd like to try a Gut/poly hybrid again with Tonic and Tour XP, but at a tension that is more likely to give me good pocketing and yet still good control. Is that even possible? If Tonic/Tour XP at 58x43 only gave me "fair" control, won't my power be even greater and control even less if I drop the tension of the Tonic mains quite a bit to be closer to the Tour XP crosses at 43?
 
This is one of my observations: ppl think gut/poly has this inherent feel, comfort advantage but then raise the tension a lot for control and I think that essentially elimates the supposed pluses.

There are ATP players doing full poly at 13, so I would continue to explore the P at low tensions.

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This is one of my observations: ppl think gut/poly has this inherent feel, comfort advantage but then raise the tension a lot for control and I think that essentially elimates the supposed pluses.

There are ATP players doing full poly at 13, so I would continue to explore the P at low tensions.

Sent from my SM-T560NU using Tapatalk

Yep, I definitely get what you are saying, and I'm in that camp. Stringing the gut high to get control eliminates some of the comfort advantage, or at least in a Gut/poly hybrid. The question is if you string the Gut lower to retain that comfort, can you control the ball or will it just shoot all over the place? I've always read that Gut is comfortable even when strung high, but maybe that is only in a full bed?
 
Yep, I definitely get what you are saying, and I'm in that camp. Stringing the gut high to get control eliminates some of the comfort advantage, or at least in a Gut/poly hybrid. The question is if you string the Gut lower to retain that comfort, can you control the ball or will it just shoot all over the place? I've always read that Gut is comfortable even when strung high, but maybe that is only in a full bed?
I've done VS and tourna silver at 58/54 on an 18/20 and thought it was a rocket launcher. No arm issues, but just blocking serve returns back seem to float long many times.

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I've done VS and tourna silver at 58/54 on an 18/20 and thought it was a rocket launcher. No arm issues, but just blocking serve returns back seem to float long many times.

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Serve returns were one thing about this Tour XP set-up at 37x33 that were really eye-opening for me. My forehand serve return is one of my weapons, but my 1-handed backhand return usually ends up being a slice on a 1st serve, which sometimes is ok, but often falls shorter into the court than I'd like. With this low-tension poly set-up, I found I could take a full swing with my 1-hander and hit a topspin ball and get it back into the court most of the time instead of sailing it long.
 
I've been on a long experimenting road trying to find a string/racquet combo that provides easy spin, good control, good durability, and good comfort for my sensitive elbow. This has proven to be harder than I imagined. I currently am playing with a Prince 03 Speedport Black racquet because I tried one a friend had with Prince Tour XP string in it and the combo had good control, spin and comfort, though being a poly, probably not as much durability as I'd like. Still, 3 out of 4 ain't bad. His racquet was strung in the high 40's but he hits flat and doesn't break strings and the strings had been in there for a while, so for all I know the tension may have been down in the 30's. One thing I noted in particular was the amount of ball pocketing that set-up had, which felt great. It was like a catapult for the ball, but with good spin and control. And despite his stringbed being full poly, my arm didn't hurt after playing with it several times.

So after I acquired my racquet, I started experimenting with mulitiple hybrids and other softer strings than poly, just assuming that it was probably the racquet that provided that great pocketing feel and comfort, not the string set-up, and I figured it would be better for my arm by default to use a softer string set-up than full poly. Well, I was wrong. I have now strung and tried a whole procession of set-ups: Gut/Poly, Gut/ZX Pro, Poly/SynGut, Multi/Poly, Gut/Multi, ZX Pro/Poly, ZX Pro/SynGut, ZX Pro/Multi, and full Multi. Most strung in the 50's because this racquet is fairly powerful. My elbow didn't feel totally comfortable afterwards with any of these set-ups, though some were more comfy than others. Also, none of these tests provided the combo of spin, control, comfort and pocketing that that old full bed of Tour XP poly did in my friend's racquet.

So this week I finally got around to trying to copy what he had in his racquet. A full bed of Prince Tour XP 16, and I strung it up at 37 x 33. And BOOM, all the things I had liked about that string in his racquet, I was now feeling in my racquet (same as his) with the same string. Low powered string that allowed me to really swing out, yet somehow felt "lively" on impact, extremely noticeable ball pocketing, above average spin, excellent control, and the confidence to go for some shots I've been hesitant to with some of those other tests because they were too powerful and I had a lot of balls sail long. Today when I played my match, there were several times I hit a deep, arching groundstroke that looked for all the world to both me and my opponent like it was going to sail long and then at the last minute it dove down and landed inside the baseline. My opponent was flummoxed and it really put a smile on my face. And the best thing is that my elbow didn't hurt during the match and so far hasn't hurt after. My arm was a little *tired* after the match, but I think it's maybe because the set-up was lower powered and I was swinging out a little harder both to get more power and because the set-up had more control and allowed me to go for some shots. I think I could actually probably lower the tension a few lbs. more for slightly more power and still have good control.

Durability is the question. I don't have experience with this particular poly and how long it plays until going "dead". I know that Gut mains will last and play well longer in a Gut/poly hybrid than just straight poly. I tried a Gut/Poly hybrid with Tonic 15L Longevity and Tour XP 16 in this racquet at 58 x 43, and it had good spin, but control was only "fair", and it definitely didn't have as good of ball pocketing or comfort as full Tour XP at 37 x 33. I strung the Tour XP so low at 43 in the hybrid set-up because I just wasn't sure if my arm could take more than that. As it turned out, though, the full poly set-up at 37x33 was more comfy on my elbow than the Gut/Poly at 58x43.

I have plans to try a full bed of Tonic Ball Feel Gut in this racquet (with string savers to increase durability), but I am skeptical that I am going to be happy with the spin production in that set-up, and I hit a good amount of topspin in my game. I'd like to try a Gut/poly hybrid again with Tonic and Tour XP, but at a tension that is more likely to give me good pocketing and yet still good control. Is that even possible? If Tonic/Tour XP at 58x43 only gave me "fair" control, won't my power be even greater and control even less if I drop the tension of the Tonic mains quite a bit to be closer to the Tour XP crosses at 43?

I have a similar setup in my Youtek Prestige Pro. Tonic 16 and Tour XP 17 at 53 and 49 lbs respectively. Gut mains/poly cross. I do not get enough control with one even though ball pocketing is very good. My ground strokes have to be a controlled swing in order to land inside the court. In order to achieve enough control, I have ordered some VS Gut and Prince Tour XC in both 15L gauge. I'm planning to install them at the same tension(53/49) to see if that helps. The combination also should last me a very long time. I can report back after hitting a couple of sessions with that setup which could be in 2 weeks.
 
I have a similar setup in my Youtek Prestige Pro. Tonic 16 and Tour XP 17 at 53 and 49 lbs respectively. Gut mains/poly cross. I do not get enough control with one even though ball pocketing is very good. My ground strokes have to be a controlled swing in order to land inside the court. In order to achieve enough control, I have ordered some VS Gut and Prince Tour XC in both 15L gauge. I'm planning to install them at the same tension(53/49) to see if that helps. The combination also should last me a very long time. I can report back after hitting a couple of sessions with that setup which could be in 2 weeks.

Yes, I'd be very interested to hear your report on the new set-up.

How long do your Gut mains last before breaking with the Tonic 16/Tour XP 17 set-up?
 
I have seen that a lot. Folks want a softer string bed due to arm issues and go with a hybrid and then complain that they need more control.

I currently know one player that wanted a full bed of softer Poly so I restrung his racquet with Volkl Cyclone tour. He loved it (granted for the 10 or so hours he got out of it) but wanted more control so now he is stringing it up at 64lbs on an 18x20 racquet. I told him all you are doing is turning the softish (for a poly) string into a stiff string and removing what you liked about it. We will see how long it is before he complains that his shoulder is bothering him again. I think it goes to show that these two characteristics oppose each other.
 
Yes, I'd be very interested to hear your report on the new set-up.

How long do your Gut mains last before breaking with the Tonic 16/Tour XP 17 set-up?
I have had about 10 hours on it and there is only slight fraying on the gut mains. I think it will last me a long time.

I have seen that a lot. Folks want a softer string bed due to arm issues and go with a hybrid and then complain that they need more control.

I currently know one player that wanted a full bed of softer Poly so I restrung his racquet with Volkl Cyclone tour. He loved it (granted for the 10 or so hours he got out of it) but wanted more control so now he is stringing it up at 64lbs on an 18x20 racquet. I told him all you are doing is turning the softish (for a poly) string into a stiff string and removing what you liked about it. We will see how long it is before he complains that his shoulder is bothering him again. I think it goes to show that these two characteristics oppose each other.

I think it's about finding the right tension for me at least. I'm totally sold on gut poly setup. I have never had elbow issues thankfully and love the way this setup plays consistently throughout.
 
I have had about 10 hours on it and there is only slight fraying on the gut mains. I think it will last me a long time.



I think it's about finding the right tension for me at least. I'm totally sold on gut poly setup. I have never had elbow issues thankfully and love the way this setup plays consistently throughout.

Yes, I agree gut/poly is nice and finding the tension that one likes is key. In fact it is really the key for whatever setup a player likes.

Personally, I am really liking a full bed of soft poly at really low tension. It doesn't last that long but I simply restring it myself when it gets unwieldy.
 
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