MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
Who would win? Best of 5 match, peak versions of Nadal and Djokovic if it was like the battle of the surfaces in 2007? That was half clay, half grass, and even though it was an exo Rafa and Fed took it pretty seriously.
Half AO court, half Chatrier court….
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MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
I don’t need them to lol, but I do want serious takes
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Please let Djokovic be hypothetically the most dominant player ever on a particular Grand Slam, please.
There's only 1 Slam on clay, while there're 2 Slams on hard. Yet, Nadal has as many Slams on clay as Novak on hard.
Number of titles at pet Slam:
Nadal 14 RG.
Djokovic 10 AO.
Winning percentage at pet Slam:
Nadal 97% at RG.
Novak 92% at the AO.
Number of titles at the rival's pet Slam:
Djokovic 3 RG (2 without facing Rafa, 1 facing injured Rafa).
Nadal 2 (2 without facing Novak).
P.S.: as per the direct H2H between RG and the AO, the sample size is so different that any conclusions are potentially decieving. Novak beat Rafa in his 7th attemt at RG, while Rafa only faced Novak twice at the AO. Would Nadal have beaten Novak twice at the AO had he had 10 attempts like Novak did at RG with Rafa? Rafa leads the H2H over Novak in the other Slam on hard (US Open), even though the court obviously plays different and it's not the best reference.
Nadal is far more dominant at RG than Novak is at the AO (14 - 10= 4 extra titles), but Novak is sligthly more succesful at RG than Nadal at the AO (3 - 2 = 1 extra title).
Nadal is the favorite for this hypothetical, but as a hypothetical it remains untestable, therefore unprovable, therefore irrelevant.
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esvc
Semi-Pro
I thought you never watch Djokovic. Make up your mind lol.Who would win? Best of 5 match, peak versions of Nadal and Djokovic if it was like the battle of the surfaces in 2007? That was half clay, half grass, and even though it was an exo Rafa and Fed took it pretty seriously.
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
You want me to be bored so bad it’s eating you up
Lauren_Girl'
Hall of Fame
Who would win? Best of 5 match, peak versions of Nadal and Djokovic if it was like the battle of the surfaces in 2007? That was half clay, half grass, and even though it was an exo Rafa and Fed took it pretty seriously.
I don't know who would win. We can only speculate based on the factual results...
Djokovic beat Nadal TWICE on the Chatrier. 20% of wins
Nadal never defeated Djokovic on the Rod Laver Arena. 0%
More determining, Djokovic won his last 19 sets against Nadal on HC. Djokovic never stopped winning sets and matches against Nadal on clay.
Mustard
Bionic Poster
2 May 2007 in Majorca, the Battle of Surfaces on a half-clay, half-grass court, Roger Federer vs. Rafael Nadal, Federer is 25 and Nadal is 20, Nadal leads the head-to-head 7-3, Federer with 54 wins in a row on grass, Nadal with 72 wins in a row on clay. At the time, 6 of Federer's last 10 match losses, dating back to the 2005 French Open, had been to Nadal. Of the other 4 losses, 2 were to Canas, 1 to Nalbandian and 1 to Murray.
Nadal won the Battle of Surfaces match 7-5, 4-6, 7-6.
Nadal won the Battle of Surfaces match 7-5, 4-6, 7-6.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Determining of what? Nadal has only lost the last 4 sets he played against Novak at the RLA.
Since you're mentioning other tournaments on hard as evidence of what would happen in the RLA, I'll do the same. More determining: Nadal leads the H2H over Novak at the other Grand Slam on hard. in effect, Nadal leads Novak 2-1 at the US Open.
Also, Novak beat Nadal at RG at his 7th attempt, not his second attempt. Nadal has only faced Novak twice at the RLA. You can't prove or disprove how many victories would Nadal have against Djokovic at the RLA in 10 attempts like Novak had against Rafa at the Philippe Chatrier. The sample size is so different that that 20% vs. 0% is not useful for analysis.
Novak's % win against Rafa in his first two meetings at RG: 0%.
Nadal's % win against Novak in his only two meetings at the AO: 0%.
Same sample size, same percentages.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
The definitive answer to this thread lies in 2012. Both Nadal and Djokovic were at their absolute peak. Nadal forced Novak to 5 sets in the AO final, while Novak could only force Nadal to 4 sets in the RG final, proving Nadal was more dominant on his garden and, conversely, he also made his match closer at Novak's garden than viceversa.
Lauren_Girl'
Hall of Fame
Determining of who's more dominant on his favorite surface. When has Djokovic lost 19 consecutives sets against Nadal on clay? Never.
And why has he only faced Djokovic twice on the RLA? lol. I guess losing to Verdasco, Tsitsipas, Tsonga, Ferrer allowed him to avoid further humiliations in finals against Djokovic.
At the end of the day, his winning rate is still 0% and Djokovic's in RG is still 20%. That's all I need to know.
Mustard
Bionic Poster
Nadal and Federer had to change their shoes at every change of ends.
junior74
Bionic Poster
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
Its the kind of epicness we need today
The Blond Blur
G.O.A.T.
This basically boils down to who’s more dominant on their preferred surface. And the answer is:
CoolCoolCool
Hall of Fame
How many matches would they play?
Djokodalerer31
Hall of Fame
How convenient of you to compare 2012 AO to the same year of RG, instead of comparing it to their RG semis year later, where they actually both played much better and it is a general consensus, that it was their best match ever! And if Djokosmash didn't happen back then...who knows how that match would end up...
esvc
Semi-Pro
Deep inside you love King DjokovicYou want me to be bored so bad it’s eating you up
The Blond Blur
G.O.A.T.
Yeah, no one sane actually thinks RAFA played better at RG in 2013 over 2012.
Djokovic_is_the_best#1
Bionic Poster
2012 AO wasn’t novaks best Australian open form. He was much more dominant in 2011 and probably say he was in better form in 2013 too. I’m only compared these years though not to older Djokovic.
Djokovic was hailed for winning 2 marathon matches against Murray and Nadal but I’d say his tennis level wasn’t as high and he had more unforced errors too.
nolefam_2024
Bionic Poster
Intriguing idea.
I wonder what the outcome will be. Both guys are top two greatest baseliners of all time. There is no Borg or Vilas anyone ever that will come close to Rafole from the baseline.
I think it would be the most fun match we will see.
I wonder what the outcome will be. Both guys are top two greatest baseliners of all time. There is no Borg or Vilas anyone ever that will come close to Rafole from the baseline.
I think it would be the most fun match we will see.
Azure
G.O.A.T.
This gets to me every single time I watch this. He looks so adorable here haha. Almost disbeliefThis basically boils down to who’s more dominant on their preferred surface. And the answer is:
CoolCoolCool
Hall of Fame
Well, it was disbelief. He wasn't celebrating a win, he was shocked because an old hag gave him the finger for no reason lol.This gets to me every single time I watch this. He looks so adorable here haha. Almost disbelief
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
It wasn't dumb at all given the circumstances lol. It was the king of clay vs the king of grass. Nadal had won the last couple FO's and was undefeated on clay for years, and Federer had won the last 4 Wimbledon's it was epic af
check out the point at 3:58
NeutralFan
G.O.A.T.
I love how fanboys fight over the hypotheticals lol .
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
The Sinner
Semi-Pro
Nadal in 5, or 4 tight sets. Rafa hands-down better at RG than Nole at AO, but Nole slightly better AO than Rafa at RG.
That'll be 2008 Nadal vs 2011 Djokovic.
That'll be 2008 Nadal vs 2011 Djokovic.
weakera
Talk Tennis Guru
Djokovic got extraordinarily lucky with the weather anyway. With normal RG conditions he would have taken a straight set beating.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
No, he isn't. Just because he had a few years where his competition were collapsing Murray and Ruud (and nobody else), it doesn't make him better. He never beat a strong in-form player in RG.
nolefam_2024
Bionic Poster
If that's true then we MUST conclude there aren't any strong in form players other than Nadal on clay in last 20 years making this the WEAKEST field in tennis history on clay.
nolefam_2024
Bionic Poster
Strong RULES. Nole rules. After Nadal Nole is the strongest on clay.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Or maybe we have to conclude that when Djokovic was facing strong in-form players, he was losing to them.
nolefam_2024
Bionic Poster
No we can't. Djokovic beat Nadal in RG 21 and Raz in RG 23.Or maybe we have to conclude that when Djokovic was facing strong in-form players, he was losing to them.
It's not up to debate ANYMORE.
Strong RULES.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Right, a player who totally collapses after just 2 sets is surely a strong opponent.
nolefam_2024
Bionic Poster
That's HIS faultRight, a player who totally collapses after just 2 sets is surely a strong opponent.
Nole shouldn't care what happens on the other side of the court. Just like your Rafa didn't care if Zverev leg was broken or missing.
Just celebrate your wins.
That was my first thought in 2007 as well, that it's always an advantage to defend the slower court and attack the faster court. However, on second thought Federer might even rather defend against Nadal's shots on grass, because he doesn't have to deal with the high topspin there (but again on the other hand that means Nadal himself is more difficult to attack).
I think we can get to the conclusion that both players are so great on "their" surface because they prefer both the offensive AND defensive aspects of that surface. Federer prefers to attack AND defend on grass while Nadal prefers to attack AND defend on clay.
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