Has novak underperformed at the AO?

This sounds strange as he probably is the AO goat but does anyone feel he maybe could have had a Nadal at paris like series in Australia were he wins like 8 times in a row?

Until 2010 or so it was tough but I feel since 2011 the field was quite open for him as he was clearly the best hc player since 2011.

He still was fantastic there but I feel he could have done even better and win 6 in a row or so starting with 2011.
 

The Blond Blur

Hall of Fame
First off, he is the undisputed GOAT of the AO. Second, no he did not underperform there. He's a beast down under, but RAFA in Paris is in a class of his own. There's a reason former and current players say the biggest challenge in tennis is beating him on Chatrier. Now that being said, Joker is the heavy favorite for this years' title, and he deserves to be. I think he can win 2 more titles and finish with 9 total.
 
First off, he is the undisputed GOAT of the AO. Second, no he did not underperform there. He's a beast down under, but RAFA in Paris is in a class of his own. There's a reason former and current players say the biggest challenge in tennis is beating him on Chatrier. Now that being said, Joker is the heavy favorite for this years' title, and he deserves to be. I think he can win 2 more titles and finish with 9 total.
Undisputed TIGER, but yes, he is at AO, but just like Fed could have done better at WC, Djoker could have at AO too.
 
Fed has grossly underperformed at Wimbledon, as well as Basel (FIVE lost finals).
I agree fed could have won more but quite a few of his losses came in his mid to late 30s so that excuses him somewhat. At least Roger won 5 wimby's in a row (could have been 7 if not for the close 08 loss) while novak won "only" 3 AO in a row. He still won a lot there but more in an on off fashion than in a big block like rafa and fed.
 

ChrisRF

Hall of Fame
I don’t see any underperforming here. You said yourself that before 2011 he wasn’t in a position to dominate and I agree with that.

Then we only have the following 3 losses after that:

2014 Wawrinka
2017 Istomin
2018 Chung

The Wawrinka loss was logical as he played 5 sets with him in Australia 3 years in a row. No surprise that Wawrinka wins at least 1 of those matches.

The Istomin incident was the typical early loss that happens once in a decade (it happened more often to past champions, but the Big 3 created new standards here). I remember it was hotter than usual that day and Djokovic sometimes has problems with that.

The Chung loss was due to injury which also isn’t surprising to happen at least once in a decade.
 

oldmanfan

Hall of Fame
Djokr should've lost 1 finals to MuryGOAT (dodgy half-dead state threw MuryGOAT off while he was leading) and could've lost another finals to MuryGOAT before that, had he not choked. How about the 2013 match against Stanimal that Djokr barely scraped by as the arguably 2nd best player in that match?

And you think Djokr under performed at the AO? If anything, he slightly over-performed bc of the 7 he won, he could've lost 1-3 of those with losses against Stan/MuryGOAT.
 

DSH

Legend
Djokr should've lost 1 finals to MuryGOAT (dodgy half-dead state threw MuryGOAT off while he was leading) and could've lost another finals to MuryGOAT before that, had he not choked. How about the 2013 match against Stanimal that Djokr barely scraped by as the arguably 2nd best player in that match?

And you think Djokr under performed at the AO? If anything, he slightly over-performed bc of the 7 he won, he could've lost 1-3 of those with losses against Stan/MuryGOAT.
Do not forget him playing "possum" against Murray in 2015!
:rolleyes:
 

oldmanfan

Hall of Fame
Do not forget him playing "possum" against Murray in 2015!
:rolleyes:
That's the AO finals I was referring to as the one Djokr 'should've' lost to MuryGOAT. There was another AO finals before that when MuryGOAT could've won too.
 
Unlike Clay which has the least competitive field on tour,it's extremely tough to dominate on Hardcourts which has the strongest field on tour
I agree that clay and grass are probably easier to dominate but after 2010 hardcourt probably wasn't that good either with an aging fed, often injured Nadal (who has been owned by Novak anyway since 2011) and not much else.
 

Born_to_slice

Hall of Fame
How could Novak have performed better at RG when every FO he's contested (except two) have Nadal in the draw? Obviously both Federer and Djokovic would have won 4-5 FO's each had it not been for Rafa. It's not "underperforming" to lose consistently to the King of clay on Chatrier.
Novak is super close with Nadal on clay since he started to turn that rivalry around. I don't know exactly but someone said they are 7-8 on clay in last something years. He certainly under-performed 2013/14 against Nadal in RG, though he was sick and vomiting in one of those matches. He also under-performed 2011 against Federer, 2016 against Wawrinka and f'd up straight set win against Murray in SF, last year against Thiem. And let's not pretend that Federer and Wawrinka are on same level in RG with Djokovic.
 

Centrius

Semi-Pro
How could Novak have performed better at RG when every FO he's contested (except two) have Nadal in the draw? Obviously both Federer and Djokovic would have won 4-5 FO's each had it not been for Rafa. It's not "underperforming" to lose consistently to the King of clay on Chatrier.
Yes it is.I mean 12 vs 1, Nadal is not twelve times better at the FO than Djokovic or Federer for that matter.
 

rUDin 21

Rookie
Djokr should've lost 1 finals to MuryGOAT (dodgy half-dead state threw MuryGOAT off while he was leading) and could've lost another finals to MuryGOAT before that, had he not choked. How about the 2013 match against Stanimal that Djokr barely scraped by as the arguably 2nd best player in that match?

And you think Djokr under performed at the AO? If anything, he slightly over-performed bc of the 7 he won, he could've lost 1-3 of those with losses against Stan/MuryGOAT.
By that logic Fed should've lost 2007,2009 and 2012 Wimbledon finals bc Roddick and MurrayGOAT "choked" those matches and Rafa was "injured"in the fifth set.
 
Sorry for the late reply my Canadian companion, but which events do you think Fedavic underperformed at their best slem?
Well Fed just last year (more of a one match underperforming), and Rafa has lost twice on clay. But maybe not so much underperformed as much as should have won more or could have.
 

ollinger

G.O.A.T.
Worst thread of the decade thus far. The guy has seven titles at a slam event and somebody wants to know why he hasn't done better.
 

The Blond Blur

Hall of Fame
Well Fed just last year (more of a one match underperforming), and Rafa has lost twice on clay. But maybe not so much underperformed as much as should have won more or could have.
As painful as this past Wimby final was, I think that was more about Joker being very mediocre for whatever reason. Now that I think about it though, I do think that Ol' Rog underperformed at the 2010 and especially 2011 editions. As far as Joker goes though, I don't think there was a year where we can say he would have/should have won. And as crazy as it sounds, I do think that RAFA has underperformed at RG :oops: 09 was a missed opportunity, I still think the Soderling match is the biggest upset in tennis history.
 
As painful as this past Wimby final was, I think that was more about Joker being very mediocre for whatever reason. Now that I think about it though, I do think that Ol' Rog underperformed at the 2010 and especially 2011 editions. As far as Joker goes though, I don't think there was a year where we can say he would have/should have won. And as crazy as it sounds, I do think that RAFA has underperformed at RG :oops: 09 was a missed opportunity, I still think the Soderling match is the biggest upset in tennis history.
Yeah, more missed opportunities then underperforming.
 

ForehandRF

Hall of Fame
Novak is super close with Nadal on clay since he started to turn that rivalry around. I don't know exactly but someone said they are 7-8 on clay in last something years. He certainly under-performed 2013/14 against Nadal in RG, though he was sick and vomiting in one of those matches. He also under-performed 2011 against Federer, 2016 against Wawrinka and f'd up straight set win against Murray in SF, last year against Thiem. And let's not pretend that Federer and Wawrinka are on same level in RG with Djokovic.
Federer is not on the same level in RG with Djokovic ? Fed stopped Djokovic's amazing winning streak right at the French, in 2011.
 

oldmanfan

Hall of Fame
By that logic Fed should've lost 2007,2009 and 2012 Wimbledon finals bc Roddick and MurrayGOAT "choked" those matches and Rafa was "injured"in the fifth set.
I agree that Roddick should've won WB09 bc he was the slightly better player overall (but then Fedr should've won WB19 so it cancels out, and 'could've' won WB14 bc he had BPs at 4-3* in the 5th that if converted, it would have him serving for the match).

WB07, IF it was an injury, that's life. It wasn't a choke. Being fit to compete is part of sports. So Fedr lucked out there IF Nadl was leading and indeed injured.

WB12, MuryGOAT was 1-0 set up, but he needed to win 2 more sets. He wasn't even 2-1 sets up, let alone 2-0 sets up, so how was that a match he should've won?
 

Born_to_slice

Hall of Fame
Federer is not on the same level in RG with Djokovic ? Fed stopped Djokovic's amazing winning streak right at the French, in 2011.
Come on. Federer stopped Novak 2011 but got smoked next year in straights. Not to mention that Novak straight set victory over Nadal in RG, record in clay masters and other super-close encounters.
 

oldmanfan

Hall of Fame
Come on. Federer stopped Novak 2011 but got smoked next year in straights. Not to mention that Novak straight set victory over Nadal in RG, record in clay masters and other super-close encounters.
That's a bit circumstantial. By then, Fedr was almost 32 in 2012 RG. Djokr is 1yr younger than Nadl, and he had all the chances in the world to dethrone him pre-2011, while Fedr was the one to make 4 RG finals previously. Nadl was still good on clay post 2010, but his peak clay year was 2008, and by 2012 he was already on the decline, and that's when Djokr started to beat him consistently. Maybe post 2011 Djokr would still do well against 2005-2010 Nadl, but we'll never know.
 

Fabresque

Professional
He underperformed at the USO, probably shot above his weight at Wimbledon with those 5 titles. Had it not been for Nadal he’d dominate RG or atleast win 3-4 there.
 

dr325i

Legend
Once Nadal (and maybe NOVAK) pass his slam count, Federer has definitely underperformed with draws he’s been getting (see the 2020 AO draw, lol)
 

rUDin 21

Rookie
I agree that Roddick should've won WB09 bc he was the slightly better player overall (but then Fedr should've won WB19 so it cancels out, and 'could've' won WB14 bc he had BPs at 4-3* in the 5th that if converted, it would have him serving for the match).

WB07, IF it was an injury, that's life. It wasn't a choke. Being fit to compete is part of sports. So Fedr lucked out there IF Nadl was leading and indeed injured.

WB12, MuryGOAT was 1-0 set up, but he needed to win 2 more sets. He wasn't even 2-1 sets up, let alone 2-0 sets up, so how was that a match he should've won?
Bolded part is true,about W 12 MurrayGOAT was 1-0 set up,Fed fought to even the match and when he did it,they closed the roof.Murray was unlucky, 3rd and 4th sets relatively easy for Fed,like last year against Rafa.
 

oldmanfan

Hall of Fame
Bolded part is true,about W 12 MurrayGOAT was 1-0 set up,Fed fought to even the match and when he did it,they closed the roof.Murray was unlucky, 3rd and 4th sets relatively easy for Fed,like last year against Rafa.
I'll agree that up to 1-1 sets at WB12, it was an even match. But many speculated that the roof changed everything, but they forgot that momentum was already shifting to Fedr by then (he won the previous set). Also, MuryGOAT ain't no scrub on indoors (his history says so with his many Shanghai and other titles, also see: post USO16, where he went undefeated for the rest of the year). At best, I think the roof gave Fedr a slight advantage, but again, momentum was already well on Fedr's side. Do note, up to that point, set 1 was the only set MuryGOAT has ever won against Fedr at a slam.
 

Djokovic2011

Bionic Poster
That's a bit circumstantial. By then, Fedr was almost 32 in 2012 RG. Djokr is 1yr younger than Nadl, and he had all the chances in the world to dethrone him pre-2011, while Fedr was the one to make 4 RG finals previously. Nadl was still good on clay post 2010, but his peak clay year was 2008, and by 2012 he was already on the decline, and that's when Djokr started to beat him consistently. Maybe post 2011 Djokr would still do well against 2005-2010 Nadl, but we'll never know.
2012 was one of Nadal's most impressive clay court seasons, not only in terms of results but also level of play. It's ludicrous to suggest he was on the decline at that point.
 

rUDin 21

Rookie
I'll agree that up to 1-1 sets at WB12, it was an even match. But many speculated that the roof changed everything, but they forgot that momentum was already shifting to Fedr by then (he won the previous set). Also, MuryGOAT ain't no scrub on indoors (his history says so with his many Shanghai and other titles, also see: post USO16, where he went undefeated for the rest of the year). At best, I think the roof gave Fedr a slight advantage, but again, momentum was already well on Fedr's side. Do note, up to that point, set 1 was the only set MuryGOAT has ever won against Fedr at a slam.
So how's that different from AO 13 final? Murray winning first set getting close to 2-0 Djokovic equalling after tough TB,and than two similar sets like W 12.Novak did the same thing to Andy as Roger.He was just more clutch.
 

ForehandRF

Hall of Fame
Come on. Federer stopped Novak 2011 but got smoked next year in straights. Not to mention that Novak straight set victory over Nadal in RG, record in clay masters and other super-close encounters.
2012 was simply another match and Novak took his revenge, but both player's level was unimpressive compared to 2011 anyway.2014 Nadal was good but beatable, yet Djokovic failed, just like Federer failed in 2011 against another version of beatable Nadal.There is nothing to clearly indicate that Djokovic is in another league at the French compared to Federer.Let's put masters aside, it's about RG not who is the most successful/greater court player overall.
 
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