Head 360+ Extreme MP vs. Pure Aero / Extreme Tour / Blade 16x19 v7
- Thread starter Ryebread
- Start date
edelp
Semi-Pro
But you liked the Extreme tour and the Speed MP+ and you like the gravity pro. I have to say, currently, Head has a superb series with the 360+. Ask me one year ago and I was more either Angell/Yonex or Head prostock (old moulds).
MrAvocado232
New User
Do you compare the ezone 100 2017 or the latest version with the extreme?
dgoran
Hall of Fame
I compared (not side by side but maybe few days apart) latest ezone and emp
can i ask if you have compared these to the previous version of the EMP (the yellow and black 360 version)?
from what I have read so far, it seems most people prefer the new 360+ offerings than the previous 360 versions. thanks.
dgoran
Hall of Fame
I agree i still like them and have them. It's hard to decide they are all good like you said. It's not just Head...vcore 98 is outstanding for say aging player looking for wilson six one 95 type of stick replacement. Prince 97p is still the best of the bunch IMHO if you don't want to move to 100sq in. So many choices
i will be off to my final session this arvo before i have to stay off for about 2 weeks.
i bought some TK82S pallets last week, but they are not yet delivered - i was going to change out the TK82 to the TK82S, as i think over the years i am used to the more squared handle shape.... and i think my backhand can be erratic due to the rectangular TK82 shape.. this could well be in my head, but thought i'd change it and see if the TK82 makes difference.
I should receive the TK82S pallets later this week, so i will change it over while i am off and then match the no.2 at the same time.. i think. lol
i bought some TK82S pallets last week, but they are not yet delivered - i was going to change out the TK82 to the TK82S, as i think over the years i am used to the more squared handle shape.... and i think my backhand can be erratic due to the rectangular TK82 shape.. this could well be in my head, but thought i'd change it and see if the TK82 makes difference.
I should receive the TK82S pallets later this week, so i will change it over while i am off and then match the no.2 at the same time.. i think. lol
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
strung the Radical MP at 51/50 today and it's better, after the first hit....
should be great for my second hit with it.
but it's completely different from the extreme line, which feels very plush.
could be the spin grommets create extra pocketing which gives you the feeling of plush?
the radical is more direct, more control
my slice is great with it, can't say that about the extreme.
not as much power as the emp, for sure.
the emp has some competition.
but I'm not sure if the rmp can displace the emp yet.
should be great for my second hit with it.
but it's completely different from the extreme line, which feels very plush.
could be the spin grommets create extra pocketing which gives you the feeling of plush?
the radical is more direct, more control
my slice is great with it, can't say that about the extreme.
not as much power as the emp, for sure.
the emp has some competition.
but I'm not sure if the rmp can displace the emp yet.
We gets do you get 19 g cyclone. I only see 18g on TW
Plebcake
New User
Hey all, currently demo'ing the Extreme Tour and Rad Pro - loving the Extreme Tour, enough to make the switch. Before I do I was wondering if anybody can compare the ETour to the new Vcore 98? I'm coming from a Vcore 97HD, and love Yonex QC, so would be interested in hearing thoughts before I make a purchase.
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
I played extensively with the extreme tour and the new Vcore 98, which I own.
The Vc has, for me:
Far better stability in the hoop, yet is still quite head light.
A lot more put away power. The tour has none of that.
Far better for a two hand backhand.
Better at net.
Greater directional control
both:
Good overall control
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
The other guys
World Class Forehand
Rookie
Do you use Volkl Cyclone or Volkl Cyclone Tour?
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
Cyclone
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
I'm currently mixing in the new Radical MP, still.
Other sticks in my bag:
blade 16x19 v7
extreme mp
vcore 98 (2021)
The Radical is string sensitive IMO
string bed is quite dense in the middle, seriously dense. very much a control frame.
and so, it is good at low tension. I am currently at 51/50 to get a little more pop from it.
I may try 50/49 next actually.
I'm playing with 19 gauge cyclone, which is firm but not terrible on the arm
this makes it more headlight, I haven't made any other mods.
I didn't like it at 52/51
after a few hits at 51/50, I have been gelling with it a bit
the thick width of the beam is different for me. I've never seen one like this before.
it still moves through the air well.
I don't feel any pocketing, like with my extreme mp which has spin grommets
I'm not a slicer, but with this stick, I am now! nice feel and confidence inspiring.
pretty good plow/stability for me, vs. a heavy 4.5 ball.
I'm amazed how it can dig up low balls.
I think the main take aways from the radical mp are
1. control
2. pop when you need it, more than a blade
3. you can hit flat and you can hit spin - so you can really mix it up and play a variety of styles!
4. pretty good stability!
5. comfort seems ok, with it's ra of 65, but it doesn't feel super plush.
I wonder if going with a 2lb differential will improve pocketing and add a more plush feel.
so for eg: instead of 51/50, maybe I'll do 51/49 next.
--
I'm very happy with the Radical MP when I'm playing vs. a proper 4.5 player, who hits with both incredible pace and spin.
I need more control, a stick that is solid for blocking, as well as hitting a nice ball.
the denser string pattern helps here, and slightly less power, yet stable hoop.
I have pretty much zero time, with these players, so the stick needs to be maneuverable... with the balance and weight of the RMP, it fits the bill quite well.
the extreme mp is not as good for blocking,
When I have to generate my own pace, completely,
and/or playing with a 4.0 or even a 4.5 who is only hitting with great pace but not as much spin, I think perhaps the extreme MP is better for me here.
LOTS more power, but when I cover the ball, it's controllable.
hope this makes sense.
I'm over thinking it. but I have a lot of racquets and I'm really trying to figure out what to go with - longterm.
I'm a holic, sure, but I don't want to be - anymore!!!
I think I play the best with the EMP, with my typical hitting partner.
but overally, across the board? I think the RMP may be the best fit, it's a chameleon!!!!
Other sticks in my bag:
blade 16x19 v7
extreme mp
vcore 98 (2021)
The Radical is string sensitive IMO
string bed is quite dense in the middle, seriously dense. very much a control frame.
and so, it is good at low tension. I am currently at 51/50 to get a little more pop from it.
I may try 50/49 next actually.
I'm playing with 19 gauge cyclone, which is firm but not terrible on the arm
this makes it more headlight, I haven't made any other mods.
I didn't like it at 52/51
after a few hits at 51/50, I have been gelling with it a bit
the thick width of the beam is different for me. I've never seen one like this before.
it still moves through the air well.
I don't feel any pocketing, like with my extreme mp which has spin grommets
I'm not a slicer, but with this stick, I am now! nice feel and confidence inspiring.
pretty good plow/stability for me, vs. a heavy 4.5 ball.
I'm amazed how it can dig up low balls.
I think the main take aways from the radical mp are
1. control
2. pop when you need it, more than a blade
3. you can hit flat and you can hit spin - so you can really mix it up and play a variety of styles!
4. pretty good stability!
5. comfort seems ok, with it's ra of 65, but it doesn't feel super plush.
I wonder if going with a 2lb differential will improve pocketing and add a more plush feel.
so for eg: instead of 51/50, maybe I'll do 51/49 next.
--
I'm very happy with the Radical MP when I'm playing vs. a proper 4.5 player, who hits with both incredible pace and spin.
I need more control, a stick that is solid for blocking, as well as hitting a nice ball.
the denser string pattern helps here, and slightly less power, yet stable hoop.
I have pretty much zero time, with these players, so the stick needs to be maneuverable... with the balance and weight of the RMP, it fits the bill quite well.
the extreme mp is not as good for blocking,
When I have to generate my own pace, completely,
and/or playing with a 4.0 or even a 4.5 who is only hitting with great pace but not as much spin, I think perhaps the extreme MP is better for me here.
LOTS more power, but when I cover the ball, it's controllable.
hope this makes sense.
I'm over thinking it. but I have a lot of racquets and I'm really trying to figure out what to go with - longterm.
I'm a holic, sure, but I don't want to be - anymore!!!
I think I play the best with the EMP, with my typical hitting partner.
but overally, across the board? I think the RMP may be the best fit, it's a chameleon!!!!
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6. Slice
7. Maneuverability
Pretty much why I love the Radical Series. My friends normally ban me from slicing against them. Just such a great racquet that allows so many options.
Amazing how far your understanding of racquets has come in a short time. For the lower ranking oppents you need to hit the ball a little sooner is all, with a slightly spin friendly swing. Basically attack the ball as they say. It is another reason I like the radical... often players don't know what to do with solid flat hits. EMP can hit flat but not as well as the Radical series. Emp is nice because it is a spin monster. If someone is hitting heavy spin friendly balls... it knows just what to do. Radical you have to add a little extra. Eventually if you play with the Radical enough you can move it around the sweet spot to act close to a EMP.
Still currently playing with the Gravity Pro which feels like a slightly forgiving Radical while giving up some maneuverability. Speed MP still a worthy backup.
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which racket are you primary playing with extreme , radical or gravity. What tension did you settle on in extreme MP and Gravity pro
Main racquet is the Gravity Pro. Still exploring strings. Normally hybrid head velocity/poly or Triax/poly. Sometimes full multi. Normally midrange so we are talking 55/52...understanding modern stringing options is something I am slowly exploring. I normally have one racquet with one option and one with another.
Speed MP is normally just Triax or Head velocity. I have it at 55 normally depending on weather.
Extreme MP explored a few options, but with most racquets I just use Triax or Head Velocity.
I ordered the 19 g cyclone and 18 g Solinco soft hyper G and 18 g ice code . Not happy with the set up I have now. What tension did you settle for on your extreme MP
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
NICE, I'm curious what you think about this setup.
sticks, strings, tension are soooo subjective!
but start here: 54 lbs in the mains, 53 lbs in the crosses.
heading into warmer months, this is a good place to start.
once you try it out, if you feel it's too much control and not enough pop, you can go down a LB.
but it'll settle in and lose a little tension after an hour.
good luck.
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
That is exactly what always happens with me. So I only keep one of each now.
Speedmp*
Speedpro*
Gravitytour*
Bladev7m16
NadalPA*
ExtremeMP
Vcore98
RadicalMP
Selling four of them, when I have time. maybe five.
What did I learn today?
1. The vcore 98 v6 and the radical MP 360+ are in many ways, the same. They have the same stability and flex and SW. The radical is 318 strung and 33 cm. Vcore 323 and 32.5 cm! They are both control frames that have sneaky power and spin. They both want the same tension and both are 16x19 98” frames. They have the same amount of sweet spot. And they have the same 41 power ranking. The difference for me is that the RMP had a metallic feel to it, like a clash 98. Better feel obviously. But it’s weird. The Vcore feels more muted, but in a decent way (for me). The Vcore is better for my serve. But it has a lower launch angle IMO on strokes. It is better for a 2HBH - may be this handle.
2. The Extreme MP (combo of 19g cyclone and customized with weight in the handle to make it 33CM) can’t leave my bag. I think it’s my favorite 100” power/spin frame of all time. I may use a 98 now, as my primary, but this EMP has staying power.
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Ryebread
Hall of Fame
what wasn’t working well for you?
Well RPM blast never worked for me to stiff and goes dead quickly and RPM power is a bit stiff and must be strung between 44 and 49 unless your Thiem and it doesn’t snap back so good so with excel in the crosses now at 48/47 the strings have to be adjusted a lot. Possibly a full bed of RPM power at 46 might work
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
anyone who likes the Extreme MP with a few grams in the handle to make it headlight, it may be worth checking out the......
yonex vcore 98 v6 (current/2021) model:
strings, no higher than 50 lbs in the mains. for example, try out 50 in the mains, and 49 in the crosses.
if you want power closer to the EMP, go with 48/47 instead.
sweet spot and stability are the same, you won't need any time adjusting - aside from the balance, it's VERY headlight stock (no weight needed in handle).
mine is 323 grams, 32.4 cm balance
^ this is with rubber band dampener, overgrip, and 19g poly
with heavier poly, like 17G, you'll be at 325 grams and around 32.6 or 32.7 balance, still quite HL for sure.
I think it's close to the radical MP, but:
more forgiving feel
better pocketing
no metallic feel
better for serving
better 2hbh
better in the upper section of the hoop
bigger sweet spot, similar to a 100, but this is a 98 (yonex thing)
compared with the extreme MP:
similar pocketing and comfort, this is good!
similar/great spin!
vcore 98 is 305 unstrung.
the EMP is 300. but then you add two overgrips to fix the handle, and 2 grams in the handle, so you're at the same place.
so it's similar weight to the EMP IF you have modified it to be HL. otherwise, it's heavier for sure.
vcore offers more control, but you still want a modern swing similar to the EMP.
it's still powerful! you can launch one accidentally. need to concentrate, just like with the EMP.
little better at the net, smidge better.
may be a bit better on my serve.
slightly better 2hbh
forehands are close!
it's like a "little more dialed in" EMP, for whatever that is worth! lol.
I bought this at launch and recently restrung it for a revisit romp. and I like it now, with the lower tension. I was previously at 54/51.
yonex vcore 98 v6 (current/2021) model:
strings, no higher than 50 lbs in the mains. for example, try out 50 in the mains, and 49 in the crosses.
if you want power closer to the EMP, go with 48/47 instead.
sweet spot and stability are the same, you won't need any time adjusting - aside from the balance, it's VERY headlight stock (no weight needed in handle).
mine is 323 grams, 32.4 cm balance
^ this is with rubber band dampener, overgrip, and 19g poly
with heavier poly, like 17G, you'll be at 325 grams and around 32.6 or 32.7 balance, still quite HL for sure.
I think it's close to the radical MP, but:
more forgiving feel
better pocketing
no metallic feel
better for serving
better 2hbh
better in the upper section of the hoop
bigger sweet spot, similar to a 100, but this is a 98 (yonex thing)
compared with the extreme MP:
similar pocketing and comfort, this is good!
similar/great spin!
vcore 98 is 305 unstrung.
the EMP is 300. but then you add two overgrips to fix the handle, and 2 grams in the handle, so you're at the same place.
so it's similar weight to the EMP IF you have modified it to be HL. otherwise, it's heavier for sure.
vcore offers more control, but you still want a modern swing similar to the EMP.
it's still powerful! you can launch one accidentally. need to concentrate, just like with the EMP.
little better at the net, smidge better.
may be a bit better on my serve.
slightly better 2hbh
forehands are close!
it's like a "little more dialed in" EMP, for whatever that is worth! lol.
I bought this at launch and recently restrung it for a revisit romp. and I like it now, with the lower tension. I was previously at 54/51.
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
Friends, here is where I am.
when I play with my 4.0 friends, I can play with my vcore98, 305 stick.
when I play with a 4.5 and 5.0 friend, I need to go back to a 300 gram stick.
I feel sluggish with the 305.
granted, I have weighted my 300 up, the EMP, but it still feels lighter through the air... for some reason, even though it's a 100.
you know what, I really just rally with the heavier hitters, so I guess I could play with the two different sticks, hardly any adjustment.
rally with the EMP.
play sets with the vcore, which I can serve a lot better with anyhow.
it just seems weird to need to do this.
when I play with my 4.0 friends, I can play with my vcore98, 305 stick.
when I play with a 4.5 and 5.0 friend, I need to go back to a 300 gram stick.
I feel sluggish with the 305.
granted, I have weighted my 300 up, the EMP, but it still feels lighter through the air... for some reason, even though it's a 100.
you know what, I really just rally with the heavier hitters, so I guess I could play with the two different sticks, hardly any adjustment.
rally with the EMP.
play sets with the vcore, which I can serve a lot better with anyhow.
it just seems weird to need to do this.
JOSHL
Hall of Fame
Are you sure this is the radical? Seems like you’re referring to the extreme tour? Radical pro has a 330 SW.
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
Thx. Fixed it. I meant mp radical.
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
easiest to swing 98?
extreme tour for a 305 is very HL
vcore 98 is 305, feels heftier than the tour for some reason.
dgoran
Hall of Fame
Not necessarily swing more usability. Tour has smaller sweetspot than vcore and it's less maneuverable and my vcore is more headlight than e tour
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
yea, good point... the vcore98, would be better across the board for me.
time_fly
Hall of Fame
Surprised with all of this active discussion and demoing of the PA and EMP that everyone is overlooking the Dunlop SX 300. I play tested it, and it’s definitely worth a demo if you are looking into this category of frame. It has good dampening technology and the string setup is unique for a spin racquet — the cross strings are quite dense in the center — which depending on the player you might like more or less than the others. I found the launch angle to be lower and the frame to be a little more effective at blocking and hitting flat than more open pattern spin racquets.
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
just a guess that dunlop, prince, and pk are probably only on the radar of folks in their late 40's and older?
the babolat, wilson, head brands may be more appealing to the younger audience? whether that is based on marketing, paint jobs, pro relationships, etc, I don't know for sure.
I'll check out the XS300
thx for bringing it to my attention
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
they feel the same to me.
after a few days, I feel like the stiffness gets to me a bit.
and I can't go low tension with that frame, b/c that leads to control issues for me, so it's a no-go.
the EMP and Yonex vcore 100 were more forgiving for me and better pocketing anyhow. similar spin/power for sure.
def easy to use, didn't take long for me to fall in love with the playability, especially serving bombs, 2hbh......
-
my issues with playing opponents in different levels, 4.0 vs 4.5 vs 5.0....
I feel that the EMP, customized with 19G poly, and weight in the handle to make the balance 33CM....
this is probably the best for me if I could only have one stick.
the stability is there for blocking and sparring with heavy hitters.
the extra power is there for me, when I need to create my own pace/depth, with the looper 4.0 gang.
and when I cover the ball, I have zero issues with controlling the power this stick offers.
I just had to make some adjustments to my serve. B/C it wasn't the best for me, there. the Vcore98 (I think) is best for my serve for some reason.
It seems that no matter the situation, the frame just knows what to do.
the pocketing feels great.
I always go one LB lower on the crosses.
currently at 54/53. I have played 55/54 as well, which was ok!
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Ryebread
Hall of Fame
just checked it out, sounds just like the pure aero, extreme mp, and vcore100.
def worth a demo for folks who want power/depth/spin - yet low 60 RA strung, which is incredible.
cheers
time_fly
Hall of Fame
TW has the strung RA for both the normal and Tour versions as 65, which is still lower than a lot of the competition. It still feels pretty crisp, but not harsh. The only thing I didn’t like about it is that the head feels more hefty than you would expect from the specs — kind of like the Yonex EZONE 98 Tour. Several reviews noted that the swingweight was higher than spec in their test samples.
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
caesar66
Professional
After a couple of weeks of back and forth between my normal sticks (tfight 315 xtcs) and the EMP, I decided to stick to the 315s. I think I’m just too rooted in heavy, headlight frames, and the mass of the 315s just makes them feel so solid, especially on serves and volleys. I really did enjoy my romp with the EMP, though; it’s still an excellent racquet and has a ton to offer folks used to PD/APD specs who want more feel.
Ryebread
Hall of Fame
hey, haven't heard from you in a while, what's your stick now?
I remember you had a ezone 98, or was it the 98+?
I just got one for a longterm demo.
First day, I love it.
I think it's great for folks who don't want to be tied down to hitting with spin.
The occasional flat hit or two, you'll still have control.
basically, you can play with spin and put shape on the ball
or you can just crush it and hit flat.
good feel
good comfort, at 64 RA, no issues here
good at the net
good balance for me/maneuverability
good strokes
I played a few drill games today and was on point!
will try it in some match play later, and get into serving then,
but so far, I love it.
def will be listing my vcore98 now.
strung her with TB 19g at 52/51
jalapeno74
Rookie
A question for all Extreme MP (360+) users - did you experience a lot of fast string snapping?
I have been testing this frame for two weeks now and really like it (so much fun to play with) but my string setup snaps really fast.
Because of elbow issues I have to use soft mains which results in hybrids with soft co-polys. So far I have tried:
Kirschbaum SynGut 1.25 with Oehms Sonic 1.23 (shaped) - snaps in 60 minutes
Kirschbaum SynGut 1.25 with Oehms Black Pearl 1.18 (round) - snaps in 70 minutes
Wilson Sensation 1.30 with Oehms Black Pearl 1.18 (round) - snaps in 100 minutes
When I use the setups mentioned above in other frames like a Clash 98 or VCore 95 they last at least twice as long.
Anyone experienced something similar?
I have been testing this frame for two weeks now and really like it (so much fun to play with) but my string setup snaps really fast.
Because of elbow issues I have to use soft mains which results in hybrids with soft co-polys. So far I have tried:
Kirschbaum SynGut 1.25 with Oehms Sonic 1.23 (shaped) - snaps in 60 minutes
Kirschbaum SynGut 1.25 with Oehms Black Pearl 1.18 (round) - snaps in 70 minutes
Wilson Sensation 1.30 with Oehms Black Pearl 1.18 (round) - snaps in 100 minutes
When I use the setups mentioned above in other frames like a Clash 98 or VCore 95 they last at least twice as long.
Anyone experienced something similar?
JOSHL
Hall of Fame
Any synthetic main with poly cross will snap quickly In an open pattern frame like the EMP. I would try to reverse the combo if you want longer string life or switch to full soft poly like Yonex Poly tour air or ISO speed cream. Or even a thinner gauge full poly.
smalahove
Hall of Fame
Try a full bed soft poly at 40 lbs or lower, like the MSV Focus_hex +38 or Völkl V-Star. Those strings have stiffness ratings in the multi-range, and are ime, extremely comfortable to play with. But as with any string, higher tensions are more likely to aggravate TE.
DontQuixote
Rookie
Wondering how tour racquet journal is going. Still using the 360+ EMP?
I purchased the EMP after reading your post and demoing
