Help Me Understand Mini-Tennis (warm up)

EggSalad

Hall of Fame
So, it’s customary to warm up with both players at the service line playing mini tennis. My pro/coach says I should hit top spin but what I’ve always hit are slice. I hit slice because any slow ball in a match in that area will be sliced. It feels unnatural to hit top spin warm ups from that location.

So why top spin?
 
Hitting topspin in mini-tennis requires an early preparation. If you wait until the ball bounces to initiate your prep, slice might be your only option -- esp if the ball is deep in the service box.

Try standing, at least, a couple of feet behind the service line. Make up your mind quickly (Fh or BH?) and start your unit turn / racquet prep as the ball is crossing the net. Compact takeback & racquet drop after the unit turn -- not a full-blown takeback. Swing low to high with a full follow-thru. Not a truncated follow-thru like many players execute (who don't know any better).

EARLY prep. Hope that helps.
 
Hitting topspin in mini-tennis requires an early preparation. If you wait until the ball bounces to initiate your prep, slice might be your only option -- esp if the ball is deep in the service box.

Try standing, at least, a couple of feet behind the service line. Make up your mind quickly (Fh or BH?) and start your unit turn / racquet prep as the ball is crossing the net. Compact takeback & racquet drop after the unit turn -- not a full-blown takeback. Swing low to high with a full follow-thru. Not a truncated follow-thru like many players execute (who don't know any better).

EARLY prep. Hope that helps.
it also helps me calibrate my contact point. if I can’t control my mini tennis shots high and soft with topspin I need to prep and contact earlier.
 
Hitting topspin in mini-tennis requires an early preparation. If you wait until the ball bounces to initiate your prep, slice might be your only option -- esp if the ball is deep in the service box.

Try standing, at least, a couple of feet behind the service line. Make up your mind quickly (Fh or BH?) and start your unit turn / racquet prep as the ball is crossing the net. Compact takeback & racquet drop after the unit turn -- not a full-blown takeback. Swing low to high with a full follow-thru. Not a truncated follow-thru like many players execute (who don't know any better).

EARLY prep. Hope that helps.
Early prep makes sense. Thank you.
 
I stand inside the box and hit only topspin in mini-tennis 90% of the time with a few volleys and slices only if the opponent hits it too deep. I tend to do mini-tennis more before practice and singles matches rather than doubles. The idea is to get my feet moving actively, get used to prepping early and making early contact along with practicing the low-high swing path needed to generate topspin. Hitting topspin and keeping the ball inside the service box is a quick way to groove a controlled swing. During mini-tennis, I focus on having good technique and after that, I think of only the target and type of shot even during the baseline warmup.
 
Last edited:
Early prep makes sense. Thank you.
I have hit with a coupla guys who always target my feet with deep flat, skidding shots regardless of where I stand— on the service line (SL), just inside the SL or a meter behind the SL.

Mini-tennis should be a cooperative warmup (as other types are warmups are supposed to be). But these guys just don’t get it — it’s like their trying to win the warmup. I usually get very little out of this kind of exchange. After a coupla minutes, I just move up into the box and volley most of their shots back.
 
So, it’s customary to warm up with both players at the service line playing mini tennis. My pro/coach says I should hit top spin but what I’ve always hit are slice. I hit slice because any slow ball in a match in that area will be sliced. It feels unnatural to hit top spin warm ups from that location.

So why top spin?

I stand about 1 feet beyond the service line and hit forehands that bounce inside the box. It feels very natural. Very easy.
I think the idea is to then move back to the baseline. It is a warm-up.
 
I do a bit of everything personally. I usually start with just simple volley type shots. Most guys I do mini tennis or warm up with also like driven volley work so we transition into that a bit. Then start doing topspin to help loosen my wrist and arm. Then transition deeper and deeper back to the baseline.
 
I dont think you really need early preparation (but great if you do) for mini tennis because the balls are generally slow. So you can always make the contact in time if you are standing behind the service line. Also note you are not doing full swing, so early preparation is something you could do, but playing mini tennis does not force it. However I do think mini tennis helps in getting a good feel of the ball which is useful in hitting/finishing short balls at angle. Mini tennis is also helpful to start practicing your foot work/coil at a slower pace.

I generally saw it as a warmup exercise + get the feel of the ball based on ball/weather conditions etc + to calibrate your swing/body etc
 
I have hit with a coupla guys who always target my feet with deep flat, skidding shots regardless of where I stand— on the service line (SL), just inside the SL or a meter behind the SL.

Mini-tennis should be a cooperative warmup (as other types are warmups are supposed to be). But these guys just don’t get it — it’s like their trying to win the warmup. I usually get very little out of this kind of exchange. After a coupla minutes, I just move up into the box and volley most of their shots back.
i used to get annoyed by these guys (only-slice-deep-in-mini), but realized they just don't know how to hit topspin mini (usually prep sucks, and they can't relax enough to let the racquet do the work (eg. let it lag) - so they just bunt it back,... and then they think mini is stupid)...
nowadays i take two approaches:
* if already warmed (eg. did jump ropes, wrist movements, etc...), i take the opp to see if i can hit swinging volleys, or half volley gs... usually shank it, but whatever, they have to go fetch
* if not warmed up - i immediately move back (or just go back because they are annoyed they have to fetch, and they move back too), and moonball (high & heavy) back everything with the goal of getting feel, and trying not to miss a single shot

i've been hitting with some ex-atp guys in their 60's, and for whatever reason, they are not a fan of mini (maybe mini wasn't popular back in the day? or maybe because their strokes are not "modern" - eg flattish, not brushy, not much wrist lag in the swing)... so we just move back... and often only use 1 ball for like 5m straight
 
i used to get annoyed by these guys (only-slice-deep-in-mini), but realized they just don't know how to hit topspin mini (usually prep sucks, and they can't relax enough to let the racquet do the work (eg. let it lag) - so they just bunt it back,... and then they think mini is stupid)...
nowadays i take two approaches:
* if already warmed (eg. did jump ropes, wrist movements, etc...), i take the opp to see if i can hit swinging volleys, or half volley gs... usually shank it, but whatever, they have to go fetch
* if not warmed up - i immediately move back (or just go back because they are annoyed they have to fetch, and they move back too), and moonball (high & heavy) back everything with the goal of getting feel, and trying not to miss a single shot

i've been hitting with some ex-atp guys in their 60's, and for whatever reason, they are not a fan of mini (maybe mini wasn't popular back in the day? or maybe because their strokes are not "modern" - eg flattish, not brushy, not much wrist lag in the swing)... so we just move back... and often only use 1 ball for like 5m straight
From what I recall, I started seeing mini-tennis in the late 90s. Don’t know who popularized it.
 
Actually i know not many pros and good players, that are not warming up with mini tennis.
It is just a perfect warm up, where you play all your regular shots in a smaller field and slower.

I agree that it is annoying when your opponent doesnt have the skills to warm up with you for a few minutes.
 
So, it’s customary to warm up with both players at the service line playing mini tennis. My pro/coach says I should hit top spin but what I’ve always hit are slice. I hit slice because any slow ball in a match in that area will be sliced. It feels unnatural to hit top spin warm ups from that location.

So why top spin?
It's all about feel... it's not necessarily for warm up. It always helps me a lot to get my feel for contact and brushing the ball. Sure you can slice, but you should also be hitting topspin... especially if that is a majority of the type of shot you hit. If I start on the baseline with full shots it takes me longer to get in the groove and I'm not always quite as good with my feel, especially if my opponent just jumps right in with big hitting from the get go.
 
I hit slice because any slow ball in a match in that area will be sliced.
Why wouldn‘t you put away slow balls in mid-court and shorter with a topspin drive? Your coach should work with you on that before he improves your mini-tennis as the problem might be your inability to generate your own pace and also to have enough topspin to not make errors when you have a shorter court in front of you.
 
Why wouldn‘t you put away slow balls in mid-court and shorter with a topspin drive? Your coach should work with you on that before he improves your mini-tennis as the problem might be your inability to generate your own pace and also to have enough topspin to not make errors when you have a shorter court in front of you.
I do that. I just meant kind of dink/dunk type of stuff that I slice.

I guess mini tennis warm up wasn’t really a thing when I was a junior many moons ago, so I just haven’t understood why I should hit soft top spin.

But this thread has been helpful and many will be pleased to learn that I know hit both top spin and slice in mini tennis. Internet for the win.
 
I do that. I just meant kind of dink/dunk type of stuff that I slice.

I guess mini tennis warm up wasn’t really a thing when I was a junior many moons ago, so I just haven’t understood why I should hit soft top spin.

But this thread has been helpful and many will be pleased to learn that I know hit both top spin and slice in mini tennis. Internet for the win.
I agree with you that it can be very unnatural to trade "strokes" with both players standing on their service lines.

I coach high school teams - girls in the fall, boys in the spring - and I try to coax the troops toward primarily using mini-ball for switching on their footwork, not their strokes. Even with the ball bouncing well up inside the service box, I encourage them to focus on using their feet to direct the ball back across the net. The idea there is that they need that footwork happening everywhere on the court, even back at the baseline. It needs to be a constant.

I've seen some players/teams effectively use a 3/4 court warmup for strokes where both players are standing in the middle of back box between the service line and the baseline. This seems to work for warming up strokes because players need to exaggerate both their preparation (including their footwork) and also their low-to-high brushing of the ball with very little pace. But trying to do that sort of exchange with both players up at the service line usually promotes overactive arms and dead legs. A warmup that promotes arming the ball is not a good warmup.

That 3/4 court warmup also seems to work when the participants have a rather solid skill set. Some of my varsity kids can do those slower strokes in a short court, but most of the JV kids aren't ready to brush the ball like that yet. The 3/4 court warmup also looks like it's more effective when the two players are hitting cross court to each other and not straight ahead. Something to try...
 
From what I recall, I started seeing mini-tennis in the late 90s. Don’t know who popularized it.
The powers that be at Pickleball HQ sent missionaries out to public courts and turned them on to mini tennis. It was step one to getting tennis players to stand around and just swing their arm. We are currently at the full-takeover stage to where are courts are being stolen away from us.
 
Early prep makes sense. Thank you.
Biggest misconception - early prep. It’s not really early prep, but rather compact strokes…the notion that the faster the ball, the less time you have to prep, therefore you should be able to make contact doing less pre work.

Of which someone already brought up…short court is about controlling your contact point. If you don’t/can’t find your contact point in short court, how do you expect to find it in full court? Contact point shouldn’t alter all that much if you have time. In turn, you gain time by a) moving faster, and/or b) compact strokes.
 
Why wouldn‘t you put away slow balls in mid-court and shorter with a topspin drive? Your coach should work with you on that before he improves your mini-tennis as the problem might be your inability to generate your own pace and also to have enough topspin to not make errors when you have a shorter court in front of you.
guessing it's a function of how quickly one recognizes and gets up to a short ball...
for me, if it's knee height or lower, i'm slicing deep and approaching
if it's waist height (or ideally above the net height), i'm ripping a topspin drive
so if someone is regularly slow to recognize/move to a short ball, i can see their default being a slice...
 
It's a method for advanced players, and players who would like to become advanced, of coordinating their feet and hands to receive, then send, an incoming ball to a small location repeatedly and cooperatively with their opponent/playing partner. It's another important component of the full warm up, because even if you've warmed up your body, you still need to move effectively to start the kinetic chain involved in receiving and sending the ball. Starting from the baseline is less effective for this purpose unless both players can consistently hit an evenly paced ball to the middle third of the backcourt.

Also, it's a good way to chat a bit at close range with your friend before you begin your practice. I never understand why players try to carry on a conversation from baseline to baseline, 80 ft away from each other.

In a match setting, I always ask the opponent if he'd prefer to start with mini tennis or from the baseline and then do whatever he chooses.
 
It's a method for advanced players, and players who would like to become advanced, of coordinating their feet and hands to receive, then send, an incoming ball to a small location repeatedly and cooperatively with their opponent/playing partner. It's another important component of the full warm up, because even if you've warmed up your body, you still need to move effectively to start the kinetic chain involved in receiving and sending the ball. Starting from the baseline is less effective for this purpose unless both players can consistently hit an evenly paced ball to the middle third of the backcourt.

Also, it's a good way to chat a bit at close range with your friend before you begin your practice. I never understand why players try to carry on a conversation from baseline to baseline, 80 ft away from each other.

In a match setting, I always ask the opponent if he'd prefer to start with mini tennis or from the baseline and then do whatever he chooses.
Not really an advanced player drill; we do this at the clinic to with all the kids I teach - short court chips and top spin. It is something they must master as a curriculum into the intermediate and advanced level. The idea of control within short court is a precursor to how well they can control their rallies in full court.
 
Not really an advanced player drill; we do this at the clinic to with all the kids I teach - short court chips and top spin. It is something they must master as a curriculum into the intermediate and advanced level. The idea of control within short court is a precursor to how well they can control their rallies in full court.
I think what sovertennis meant is that it is something used by people who are more thoughtful/serious in their approach to the game like footwork drills etc. Not that you only do it if you are an advanced player, but something you do if you are seeking to become an advanced player and may still use after getting there.
 
If you don’t have time to time the prep, how can you be early?
You do have 95% of the time, unless you fail to recover, split step, get to good position. If you try to compensate for that with abbreviated poorly prepared stroke - well, can work to a degree.

Pros are great at still managing to do good prep despite very fast game. Strokes on the other hand in modern game are faster and shorter, taking less time yet producing a lot of juice.

Just look how loaded, turned, racquet arm taken back are best players on each and every shot, by the time ball bounces. Every freaking time.
 
i used to get annoyed by these guys (only-slice-deep-in-mini), but realized they just don't know how to hit topspin mini (usually prep sucks, and they can't relax enough to let the racquet do the work (eg. let it lag) - so they just bunt it back,... and then they think mini is stupid)...
nowadays i take two approaches:
* if already warmed (eg. did jump ropes, wrist movements, etc...), i take the opp to see if i can hit swinging volleys, or half volley gs... usually shank it, but whatever, they have to go fetch
* if not warmed up - i immediately move back (or just go back because they are annoyed they have to fetch, and they move back too), and moonball (high & heavy) back everything with the goal of getting feel, and trying not to miss a single shot

i've been hitting with some ex-atp guys in their 60's, and for whatever reason, they are not a fan of mini (maybe mini wasn't popular back in the day? or maybe because their strokes are not "modern" - eg flattish, not brushy, not much wrist lag in the swing)... so we just move back... and often only use 1 ball for like 5m straight
@SystemicAnomaly
I don't do that, but stay on the SL or a bit behind it and still try to return everything with TS, or at worse blocking it. Sometimes demi-volleying it, aka taking it on the rise.

It works even against faster balls (be they sliced), if you prep in time, like @Dragy says.
 
Last edited:
Biggest misconception - early prep. It’s not really early prep, but rather compact strokes…the notion that the faster the ball, the less time you have to prep, therefore you should be able to make contact doing less pre work.

Of which someone already brought up…short court is about controlling your contact point. If you don’t/can’t find your contact point in short court, how do you expect to find it in full court? Contact point shouldn’t alter all that much if you have time. In turn, you gain time by a) moving faster, and/or b) compact strokes.
@EggSalad

By "early prep", it's primarily about avoiding a late racquet prep. Too many players wait for the ball to bounce before they initiate their unit turn/racquet prep. If they do the same in mini-tennis, they tend to be very rushed and end up bunting the ball, slicing the ball or hitting the ball too fast and way past the service line (especially if they try to impart topspin). This is becuz the ball is often bouncing 3 meters in front of them or closer in short court tennis.

Sure the takeback will normally be more compact but most decent players will incorporate, at least, a moderate loop to facilitate topspin. Only on balls that bounce close to their feet will they abandon the loop swing.

On a full court rally, the round trip for the ball is typically 1.5 to 2 seconds. For a short court rally, it's not much more than this. Nominally, 2 seconds? Even tho players are hitting the ball slower (but with decent spin) for mini tennis, the ball is traveling only about half the distance. Air drag has less effect on the initial ball speed cuz the ball is traveling only half the distance or less. Player will have less ball travel to read ball trajectory & depth. So they need to stay relaxed but be diligent about turning & prepping.

Players need to prepare fairly early in order to hit the ball slower / shorter. For a given incoming ball speed, a player’s forward swing would need to start a bit sooner for a slower swing.

With an early prep, players have more options. They can swing slow, medium or fast. They can hit the ball with topspin, underspin or fairly flat. They can hit the ball straight or hit it x-court. With a late prep, players are often rushed and find that their options are much more limited.
 
Last edited:
@EggSalad

By "early prep", it's primarily about avoiding a late racquet prep. Too many players wait for the ball to bounce before they initiate their unit turn/racquet prep. If they do the same in mini-tennis, they tend to be very rushed and end up bunting the ball, slicing the ball or hitting the ball too fast and way past the service line (especially if they try to impart topspin). This is becuz the ball is often bouncing 3 meters in front of them or closer in short court tennis.

Sure the takeback will normally be more compact but most decent players will incorporate, at least, a moderate loop to facilitate topspin. Only on balls that bounce close to their feet will they abandon the loop swing.

On a full court rally, the round trip for the ball is typically 1.5 to 2 seconds. For a short court rally, it's not much more than this. Nominally, 2 seconds? Even tho players are hitting the ball slower (but with decent spin) for mini tennis, the ball is traveling only about half the distance. Air drag has less effect on the initial ball speed cuz the ball is traveling only half the distance or less. Player will have less ball travel to read ball trajectory & depth. So they need to stay relaxed but be diligent about turning & prepping.

Players need to prepare fairly early in order to hit the ball slower / shorter. For a given incoming ball speed, a player’s forward swing would need to start a bit sooner for a slower swing.

With an early prep, players have more options. They can swing slow, medium or fast. They can hit the ball with topspin, underspin or fairly flat. They can hit the ball straight or hit it x-court. With a late prep, players are often rushed and find that their options are much more limited.
This is correct. I just dont buy the idea that racket + load prep should be time according to the speed of the ball. One should be annticipate ahead of the balls arrival. Even so if you can’t work for timing and early prep in short court, how does one think they can do it better in full court?

Therefore the objective of the short court is ingrain the idea of anticipation and prepping early, reading the depth of the ball location ahead of the bounce, and moving such that you’re finding your contact point at an ideal spot. More people should do short court not for the act of hitting short court, but rather practice and promote the habits you should be doing.
 
So, it’s customary to warm up with both players at the service line playing mini tennis. My pro/coach says I should hit top spin but what I’ve always hit are slice. I hit slice because any slow ball in a match in that area will be sliced. It feels unnatural to hit top spin warm ups from that location.

So why top spin?
i hate mini tennis warmups. not sure why exactly...just feels like an artificial exercise, totally get what it's supposed to help with but i'm all about heading straight to the baseline and getting into it.

as a touch drill, though, with a continental grip...i can get behind that.
 
i hate mini tennis warmups. not sure why exactly...just feels like an artificial exercise, totally get what it's supposed to help with but i'm all about heading straight to the baseline and getting into it.

as a touch drill, though, with a continental grip...i can get behind that.
I agree. In mini-tennis where the balls are so slow and short, I am easily able to generate topspin. Then when move back and the balls come at you quicker with higher bounce it's hard to recreate what I did during mini-tennis. So I prefer not to do mini-tennis unless my partner wants to do it, then I participate begrudgingly.
 
I agree. In mini-tennis where the balls are so slow and short, I am easily able to generate topspin. Then when move back and the balls come at you quicker with higher bounce it's hard to recreate what I did during mini-tennis. So I prefer not to do mini-tennis unless my partner wants to do it, then I participate begrudgingly.
i'm the opposite...with an eastern forehand, there's a little more windup to hit with a lot of topspin, whereas if you're sw/w, it's much easier to sort of roll over the balls in mini tennis imo. no problem generating topspin with a full stroke from the baseline, just prefer to have some room to do it.
 
So, it’s customary to warm up with both players at the service line playing mini tennis. My pro/coach says I should hit top spin but what I’ve always hit are slice. I hit slice because any slow ball in a match in that area will be sliced. It feels unnatural to hit top spin warm ups from that location.

So why top spin?
It's because you do not know how to hit heavy topspin
Mini-tennis is for advanced strokes only
 
From what I recall, I started seeing mini-tennis in the late 90s. Don’t know who popularized it.

Mini tennis has been around for ages..... Well before the 90s.... They were doing it in the 70s when I was a kid and I am sure that wasn't when it started.

As a kid I didn't get it as I just wanted to head to the baseline and bash balls. As an adult I appreciate it as it helps me feel the ball in the strings and I think I play better when we move back after. Perhaps it is because I am not playing several times a day like I did as a kid.
 
To hit with a full stroke and keep the ball in the service-box at a pace that an opponent can cope with requires early prep and good footwork, but most importantly the ability to do the brushing-upwards stroke in a controlled and precise manner. See from 2.40 with Karue and Osaka. This is a very useful skill to get into a rhythm and ensure you watch the ball to make good contact. My ideal session is mini, then 3/4 court like this before going to the baseline, but it does require finding an opponent who thinks the same.

Practicing With Naomi Osaka - How Do Tennis Players ...


YouTube · My Tennis HQ
147K+ views · 3 years ago
 
Wrong.
I hit very flat from the baseline. Still working on my topspin.
But I can hit exactly like Brady is doing here in mini-tennis. Does anyone consider this topspin???
:unsure:

You can swing relatively fast and thin in mini-tennis, and I would say it might not transition well into baseline hitting. But it trains your feel and timing and being familiar with arcing the ball without opening the stringbed.

You can also hit more through with topspin, but with 50% intensity, and relatively low (not 4-5 ft over the net. This type of shot will be easily same from the baseline, by just ramping up coil-uncoil intensity and racquet head speed.
 
You can swing relatively fast and thin in mini-tennis, and I would say it might not transition well into baseline hitting. But it trains your feel and timing and being familiar with arcing the ball without opening the stringbed.

You can also hit more through with topspin, but with 50% intensity, and relatively low (not 4-5 ft over the net. This type of shot will be easily same from the baseline, by just ramping up coil-uncoil intensity and racquet head speed.

I can hit just like Brady is doing in mini tennis, standing outside the service line. 4 feet over the net. But when I get to the baseline, my shots skim the net.
Unless I am missing something, Brady is hitting more thru the ball. Not particularly hitting thin, correct?
Not putting that much topspin on it. 4 feet clearance. I can do that in mini tennis. No problem.
 
I can hit just like Brady is doing, 4 feet over the net. But when I get to the baseline, my shots skim the net.
Unless I am missing something, Brady is hitting thru the ball. Not putting that much topspin on it. 4 feet clearance. I can do that in mini tennis.
What if, hitting from the baseline, you come more from under the ball? Imagine you hit a lob over a 5 yo kid :-D

Do your net skimmers have a lot of topspin or no topspin?

Brady is hitting with topspin, but very soft, stopping forward momentum and pulling racquet up. To my eye.
 
What if, hitting from the baseline, you come more from under the ball? Imagine you hit a lob over a 5 yo kid :-D

Do your net skimmers have a lot of topspin or no topspin?

Brady is hitting with topspin, but very soft, stopping forward momentum and pulling racquet up. To my eye.

Often times my net skimmers will severely dip down at net-rusher's feet, so I guess I am getting some topspin.
Need to work on getting that deep heavy topspin that troubles opponents at their baseline. Will try to work on going more under the ball.
 

I would like to do these mini tennis drills to improve soft hands
Just nobady wants to do it outside of me...
Everybody wants to hit big shots
 
One of my son's coaches starts practice with the bounce the ball on your side first short court drill. I am not sure it does much for hitting but does get your feet moving.
 
Often times my net skimmers will severely dip down at net-rusher's feet, so I guess I am getting some topspin.
Need to work on getting that deep heavy topspin that troubles opponents at their baseline. Will try to work on going more under the ball.
Good, if they are solid dippers, you can try to not just aim higher over the net generally, but get a feel like you are doing all the same but with really open stringbed. More slappy contact, but same swing shape. It’s possible that you start sailing them long with no spin, but also quite possible to get higher deeper drives with solid spin.

Clean contact with middle of stringbed is also important here, so that your strings grab and launch the ball properly. Common error is hitting too close to the tip.
 
Back
Top