Help me understand!

[catfish]

Maybe someone can give me some insight into this. A couple of weeks ago, I played an 8.0 mixed league match with a 3.5 male partner. My 3.5 partner played in high school, didn’t pick up a racquet for several years and now has started playing USTA league tennis as a 3.5. He has really nice groundstrokes and serves, but he is lacking consistency.

We played what I considered a weak to medium level 8.0 team. We won the first 3 games easily. My partner started out playing under control, and he hit nice topspin groundstrokes that the female opponent couldn’t handle. The 4.0 female opponent was older than me, and it quickly became obvious that she had movement issues and she was having troubling handling our pace and my partner’s spin. I hit her some short balls and she couldn’t get to them before the 2nd bounce. The 4.0 male opponent was a pretty solid 4.0. Not overpowering, but he hit a nice ball and volleyed pretty well. However, I felt like this match would be a piece of cake because our male opponent could not really make up for his female partner. So in the 4th game of the first set, my partner apparently decided that he must hit an ace on every serve, and a winner on every shot. He proceeded to double fault his next service game away, and hit every ball that he touched as hard as he can. I mean balls were flying everywhere. It was like another person had stepped onto the court. Every point was over after one shot. Opponents hit to my partner and Bam!, point over. He tried these screaming down the line shots, and they all went into the bottom of the net or straight to the curtain. We lost the first set 6-3.

I was appalled at what I just witnessed. I generally don’t like to tell people how to play tennis, but I couldn’t help myself. I told him that all we had to do to win a point was hit a medium paced cross court ball or short ball to the women and we would win the point. I pointed out that “we” were making things hard on ourselves with unnecessary unforced errors. My partner got back in control somewhat, and we did win the match in a 3rd set TB. But I felt like I was playing against 3 opponents. My partner hit a lot of winners, but he also had TONS of unforced errors. For the life of me, I can’t understand what would make someone play like that. It was so obvious that our opponent was weak. Why try to hit a great shot when a good one will do just fine? What makes players slam balls around wildly and almost lose a match that they could so easily win. Maybe someone has some insight into this strange phenomenon.

 

[jamauss]

Sometimes, for some players, one of the most difficult things to come to terms with is that you aren't capable of playing at a certain level - even though you think you can. Sometimes people like your partner are a bit in denial and refuse to accept (to themselves, mentally) that they aren't that good. Sometimes it takes a while for them to calm down, so to speak, and play within their own abilities. Ego has a lot to do with it. I've played with people like that before and there is little you can do to affect how they play by what you say to them. They'll make a difficult shot 2 out of 10 times and think it means they should go for it all 10 times because they think that eventually that "2 out of 10" will become "8 out of 10" - even though it really won't.

 

[catfish]

Is it possible that a 3.5 male player feels that he must do better than his 4.5 female partner because of ego? Is that a possibility?

 

[jamauss]

Is it possible that a 3.5 male player feels that he must do better than his 4.5 female partner because of ego? Is that a possibility?

Very much a possibility. It takes a mature (and humble) tennis player to realize they should adjust their strategy to what works best, even if that means to put ego aside and let their partner dictate strategy instead of trying to "look good" at all costs. I'm guessing your partner was a young guy?

 

[gregor.b]

Maybe someone can give me some insight into this. A couple of weeks ago, I played an 8.0 mixed league match with a 3.5 male partner. My 3.5 partner played in high school, didn’t pick up a racquet for several years and now has started playing USTA league tennis as a 3.5. He has really nice groundstrokes and serves, but he is lacking consistency.

We played what I considered a weak to medium level 8.0 team. We won the first 3 games easily. My partner started out playing under control, and he hit nice topspin groundstrokes that the female opponent couldn’t handle. The 4.0 female opponent was older than me, and it quickly became obvious that she had movement issues and she was having troubling handling our pace and my partner’s spin. I hit her some short balls and she couldn’t get to them before the 2nd bounce. The 4.0 male opponent was a pretty solid 4.0. Not overpowering, but he hit a nice ball and volleyed pretty well. However, I felt like this match would be a piece of cake because our male opponent could not really make up for his female partner. So in the 4th game of the first set, my partner apparently decided that he must hit an ace on every serve, and a winner on every shot. He proceeded to double fault his next service game away, and hit every ball that he touched as hard as he can. I mean balls were flying everywhere. It was like another person had stepped onto the court. Every point was over after one shot. Opponents hit to my partner and Bam!, point over. He tried these screaming down the line shots, and they all went into the bottom of the net or straight to the curtain. We lost the first set 6-3.

I was appalled at what I just witnessed. I generally don’t like to tell people how to play tennis, but I couldn’t help myself. I told him that all we had to do to win a point was hit a medium paced cross court ball or short ball to the women and we would win the point. I pointed out that “we” were making things hard on ourselves with unnecessary unforced errors. My partner got back in control somewhat, and we did win the match in a 3rd set TB. But I felt like I was playing against 3 opponents. My partner hit a lot of winners, but he also had TONS of unforced errors. For the life of me, I can’t understand what would make someone play like that. It was so obvious that our opponent was weak. Why try to hit a great shot when a good one will do just fine? What makes players slam balls around wildly and almost lose a match that they could so easily win. Maybe someone has some insight into this strange phenomenon.

I recently played a tournament with an ex 18's age champion who didn't play for about 15 years and put on about 50lbs. He thought he was the same player who was smacking winners all those years ago. He wasn't. Seems to me once you have been there your mind stays there but the body doesn't. Don't get me wrong,there were some breath taking winners and unbelievable shot making,but too many errors and we struggled against what I would call 'lesser' opponents..

 

[spot]

I think its a very tough transition for players who have had a big drop in their game from time. They see a ball that would have been a weak ball to them when they were playing every day and they attack it like they would have before. But now they simply aren't at that level and its a crazy idea when patience would have been more important. At a high level of tennis you have to take advantage when your opponent gives you the opportunity where at the 3.5 level you have a ton of chances to pick your spot.

 

[OrangePower]

Maybe someone can give me some insight into this. A couple of weeks ago, I played an 8.0 mixed league match with a 3.5 male partner. My 3.5 partner played in high school, didn’t pick up a racquet for several years and now has started playing USTA league tennis as a 3.5. He has really nice groundstrokes and serves, but he is lacking consistency.

We played what I considered a weak to medium level 8.0 team. We won the first 3 games easily. My partner started out playing under control, and he hit nice topspin groundstrokes that the female opponent couldn’t handle. The 4.0 female opponent was older than me, and it quickly became obvious that she had movement issues and she was having troubling handling our pace and my partner’s spin. I hit her some short balls and she couldn’t get to them before the 2nd bounce. The 4.0 male opponent was a pretty solid 4.0. Not overpowering, but he hit a nice ball and volleyed pretty well. However, I felt like this match would be a piece of cake because our male opponent could not really make up for his female partner. So in the 4th game of the first set, my partner apparently decided that he must hit an ace on every serve, and a winner on every shot. He proceeded to double fault his next service game away, and hit every ball that he touched as hard as he can. I mean balls were flying everywhere. It was like another person had stepped onto the court. Every point was over after one shot. Opponents hit to my partner and Bam!, point over. He tried these screaming down the line shots, and they all went into the bottom of the net or straight to the curtain. We lost the first set 6-3.

I was appalled at what I just witnessed. I generally don’t like to tell people how to play tennis, but I couldn’t help myself. I told him that all we had to do to win a point was hit a medium paced cross court ball or short ball to the women and we would win the point. I pointed out that “we” were making things hard on ourselves with unnecessary unforced errors. My partner got back in control somewhat, and we did win the match in a 3rd set TB. But I felt like I was playing against 3 opponents. My partner hit a lot of winners, but he also had TONS of unforced errors. For the life of me, I can’t understand what would make someone play like that. It was so obvious that our opponent was weak. Why try to hit a great shot when a good one will do just fine? What makes players slam balls around wildly and almost lose a match that they could so easily win. Maybe someone has some insight into this strange phenomenon.

I think you answered your own question. Could be he just needs to get a few matches under his belt - people without recent match experience sometimes gets tense and play irrationally.

 

[catfish]

I think you answered your own question. Could be he just needs to get a few matches under his belt - people without recent match experience sometimes gets tense and play irrationally.

He played mixed this past Fall, and has played in some local Member/Guest tournaments. So I don't think this is the problem.

 

[OrangePower]

He played mixed this past Fall, and has played in some local Member/Guest tournaments. So I don't think this is the problem.

How did he do in his previous mixed season? Would be interesting to know if 'all or nothing' is his regular mode of play, or whether it's something about your specific partnership that led to him playing this way (whether it be ego or whatever).

 

[dcdoorknob]

I would think most 3.5s playing 8.0 would be a bit apprehensive and unsure of themselves to start out with (regardless of gender), as they're playing mostly 4.0s and 4.5s. If he hadn't played at this level much, perhaps he had just pshyhed himself out mentally and thought he needed to rip every ball just to keep up.

If not, and other explanations don't work either, then I guess we're left with the undeniable fallback: people be crazy.

 

[LeeD]

Fun?
What fun is it to win by hitting controlled shots you already know you can make.
Much more fun to smack the ball and push the limits.
Mental discipline is a tough pill to swallow, as the game can be fun, it can be competitive, or it can be lifethreatening ...your losses.
Maybe your 3.5 partner doesn't take tennis as seriously as you do, and would like to have some fun.

 

[Cindysphinx]

Is it possible that a 3.5 male player feels that he must do better than his 4.5 female partner because of ego? Is that a possibility?

What? Are you suggesting there was some Male Ego involved? Hush your mouth!

Actually, I think I know what was happening. Sometimes, you see a weaker player across the net. They should never handle your ball, but they get a few back. This is a High Insult. So you start overhitting to Show Them A Thing Or Two.

Yeah, it's a Guy Thing, mostly.

I was playing 8.0 mixed against teammates recently. I was hitting slice serves because, well, that's what I do. The more slice I put on my serve, the harder my male opponent tried to hit it. His shots were flying all over the bubble. Yet he simply would not dial his return back. I think to do so would have been an admission that my pitiful slice serve was more than he could handle. So he kept blasting away.

 

[OrangePower]

^^^^

Well, if there's a time to practice more aggressive returns against a slice serve, it would be when playing a practice match against teammates, no? So perhaps it makes sense not to dial returns back in this situation.

During a match where your primary goal is to win, that's a different story of course.

 

[tennis tom]

It sounds like he was suffering from an endocrinal phenomenon called Hi-T, or abnormaly high testosterone levels. Would you consider yourself cougar material? Maybe he was trying to impress you with his skills on court and otherwise. You'll won the match, so all's well that ends well. I hope he was suitably rewarded for his heroic efforts. Given a little polishing on his rough edges this could make for a winning team.

 

[LeeD]

I agree with the last 2 posts.
If you're going to win anyways, why not push your own limits and have fun doing it. A boring win is one where nobody takes chances, instead, only doing what they already CAN do. Nobody get's better, it's pure win or lose.
You get better by winning AND pushing your limits, trying stuff that is slightly beyond reach, stuff that a better player would try.

 

[Delano]

It sounds like your partner went for way too much... but there are sometimes reasons why people who are inconsistent might still be better better off going for their shots...

For instance, I've been in a situation where my serve went off the rails, and my partner, getting frustrated with the double faults, started to encourage me to "take something off" the ball. The thing is, if I slow the motion down too much, I won't be able to generate enough racket head speed to hit what is usually my highest percentage serve (a kick). It's frustrating, but slowing it down might just lead to slow motion double faults. Sometimes you just have to work through it during the match. I won't try to hit the crap out of the ball, but there's a limit to how much I can slow it down.

There are also times when my strokes (especially backhand side) go off the rails, and I know that I won't survive a long (or even a short) rally. Every now and then, this just happens - it used to rattle me, now I just see it as one of those mysterious things about tennis. In this case, I usually try to get to the net as quickly as possible, but I might be more aggressive on groundstrokes to keep the points shorter. I've had people ask why I didn't just play out the point, why I was taking such risks to get to the net - the answer is, well, because desperate times call for desperate measures. No point in sitting there waiting for my opponent to get points at will by hitting repeatedly to it.

Anyway, if your partner was absolutely killing the ball and making errors, this probably wasn't the case.

 

[LeeD]

Also, consider....
A weak hitter trying only to be consistent would find a miss long by 6' a horrible shot. Me, long by 6' means I needed to aim 6" lower, that's all. If you can hit hard, your misses will be much bigger than someone who misses while dinking and doinking.
I can miss a first serve by 10', and get the next 3 IN because it's a matter of lowering the target only 4". A weak hitter can't figure that out.

 

[gameboy]

Welcome to 3.5 men's doubles!!!

That pretty much describes half of my team. These guys have beautiful strokes, as good as you will see in 4.0 or even 4.5 level. They just are not very consistent. But still you will see them trying to blast every service returns and hit incredible down the line shots for winners.

Whatyagonnado?

 

[tennis tom]

Whatyagonnado?

Whacktheirpepes.

 

[LeeD]

If they are not consistent when they try to hit hard, how will they learn to hit hard without HITTING HARD and missing?
All part of the learning experience.
You try to win every time you set foot on the court.
But you also try to hit your best ability, stretch your limits, so you CAN progress and hit harder.
What fun is playing safe only to bow to the almighty "win at all cost" idea?

 

[OrangePower]

^^^^

A time and a place for everything...

During practice matches and such, sure.

On the other hand, when you have a partner and a team counting on you, that is not the time to be experimenting.

 

[catfish]

What? Are you suggesting there was some Male Ego involved? Hush your mouth!

Actually, I think I know what was happening. Sometimes, you see a weaker player across the net. They should never handle your ball, but they get a few back. This is a High Insult. So you start overhitting to Show Them A Thing Or Two.

Yeah, it's a Guy Thing, mostly.

I was playing 8.0 mixed against teammates recently. I was hitting slice serves because, well, that's what I do. The more slice I put on my serve, the harder my male opponent tried to hit it. His shots were flying all over the bubble. Yet he simply would not dial his return back. I think to do so would have been an admission that my pitiful slice serve was more than he could handle. So he kept blasting away.

You're probably right. I played a 9.0 match a couple of weeks ago and the 4.5 male opponent was possibly even wilder than my 3.5 partner. The guy hit some nice winners during the first set, but went ballistic when he double faulted & lost his serve to lose the first set. My 4.5 male partner and I won the 2nd set in about 10 minutes. It was over that fast because the 4.5 male opponent tried to hit every ball as hard as he could and hit every ball out. It was bizarre. This was not a matter of strokes being a little off. This was some of the wildest tennis I've ever seen in my life.

The 2 incidents in recent mixed doubles matches prompted me to ask what makes people do this.

 

[catfish]

^^^^

A time and a place for everything...

During practice matches and such, sure.

On the other hand, when you have a partner and a team counting on you, that is not the time to be experimenting.

Agreed!

Also, when I play against people that are obviously overmatched by my partner and I, I feel like we can win very easily by "subtle" play. There's no reason to make them feel even worse by slamming balls around. The woman we played was having trouble with many of our shots. Why try to hit harder........she was probably a little embarassed........that is until my partner started donating games.

 

[catfish]

How did he do in his previous mixed season? Would be interesting to know if 'all or nothing' is his regular mode of play, or whether it's something about your specific partnership that led to him playing this way (whether it be ego or whatever).

Lots of TB's, but I didn't see his matches because if I was there I was playing on another court.

 

[catfish]

It sounds like he was suffering from an endocrinal phenomenon called Hi-T, or abnormaly high testosterone levels. Would you consider yourself cougar material? Maybe he was trying to impress you with his skills on court and otherwise. You'll won the match, so all's well that ends well. I hope he was suitably rewarded for his heroic efforts. Given a little polishing on his rough edges this could make for a winning team.

Ah, that must be it. I'm stunningly beautiful and he was trying to impress me.

Yes, he and a 4.5 woman should make a very good 8.0 team if he can get control of the Hi-T.

 

[chatt_town]

Yep...I've ran into people like this before. I remember playing back some years back on a 7.0 mixed team. The woman I was playing with was so new to tennis that once when a team set up to run australian on her she stopped the server and walked up to me and asked "can they do this". So knowing how weak the woman was that I was playing with, this fool comes out and hits like the first 3 balls at my head for no good reason...I was packed in and prepared to be off the court in about 35 minutes. well after he did this my partner was shaking so bad it wasn't funny and asked if he was going to keep doing it. I said no, he'll stop and told her to just go to the baseline.

To his credit he never hit a ball at her. So as soon as his partner started serving to me on the ad side, I just dropped the ball short in her alley and came to the T and waited for the alley opp....when she gave it to me...I blasted him in the shoulder blade and he gave me all kinds of hell. I think I hit at him the rest of the match and we ended up beating them because he was too stupid to just hit two balls to her on the baseline each point. I do not cover 3/4's of the court. I make the women I play with play. So you run across people like this from time to time. They do not use their heads. I have rarely lost a match because I wasn't thinking. Most people I lose to have to out play me. I'm not going to beat myself and I have every shot. I'll slice all day in a men's 4.0 singles match if I'm winning the points and don't care what it looks like on the sideline.

Maybe someone can give me some insight into this. A couple of weeks ago, I played an 8.0 mixed league match with a 3.5 male partner. My 3.5 partner played in high school, didn’t pick up a racquet for several years and now has started playing USTA league tennis as a 3.5. He has really nice groundstrokes and serves, but he is lacking consistency.

We played what I considered a weak to medium level 8.0 team. We won the first 3 games easily. My partner started out playing under control, and he hit nice topspin groundstrokes that the female opponent couldn’t handle. The 4.0 female opponent was older than me, and it quickly became obvious that she had movement issues and she was having troubling handling our pace and my partner’s spin. I hit her some short balls and she couldn’t get to them before the 2nd bounce. The 4.0 male opponent was a pretty solid 4.0. Not overpowering, but he hit a nice ball and volleyed pretty well. However, I felt like this match would be a piece of cake because our male opponent could not really make up for his female partner. So in the 4th game of the first set, my partner apparently decided that he must hit an ace on every serve, and a winner on every shot. He proceeded to double fault his next service game away, and hit every ball that he touched as hard as he can. I mean balls were flying everywhere. It was like another person had stepped onto the court. Every point was over after one shot. Opponents hit to my partner and Bam!, point over. He tried these screaming down the line shots, and they all went into the bottom of the net or straight to the curtain. We lost the first set 6-3.

I was appalled at what I just witnessed. I generally don’t like to tell people how to play tennis, but I couldn’t help myself. I told him that all we had to do to win a point was hit a medium paced cross court ball or short ball to the women and we would win the point. I pointed out that “we” were making things hard on ourselves with unnecessary unforced errors. My partner got back in control somewhat, and we did win the match in a 3rd set TB. But I felt like I was playing against 3 opponents. My partner hit a lot of winners, but he also had TONS of unforced errors. For the life of me, I can’t understand what would make someone play like that. It was so obvious that our opponent was weak. Why try to hit a great shot when a good one will do just fine? What makes players slam balls around wildly and almost lose a match that they could so easily win. Maybe someone has some insight into this strange phenomenon.

 

[Maui19]

I played doubles with a guy who liked to hit it hard. And much of the time, he would hit it hard and out. We were getting killed, and I had a little huddle with him and said something like "we are killing ourselves with OE. Let's work on keeping it in play and see what happens." He said basically that he likes to hit it hard and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't but that's the way he plays. Well excuse me for taking up space on your court! We went down in flames in an ugly set that was definitely no fun to play. I didn't say two words to him the rest of the night.

Some guys play that way because it's the only way they know or like.

 

[catfish]

I agree with the last 2 posts.
If you're going to win anyways, why not push your own limits and have fun doing it. A boring win is one where nobody takes chances, instead, only doing what they already CAN do. Nobody get's better, it's pure win or lose.
You get better by winning AND pushing your limits, trying stuff that is slightly beyond reach, stuff that a better player would try.

I guess your definition of fun is not the same as mine. There's a big difference between pushing your limits and trying some different shots, and trying incredibly stupid shots and making 100 unforced errors. I completely understand that we all have bad days, but my partner was trying shots that he never had and never will have. It's not fun to play with somebody doing that.

Frankly, I get really tired of people who think being a good tennis player = hitting the ball really hard.

 

[tennis_ocd]

To give him the benefit of doubt, I think in the midst of a match there can be real difficulty in grasping actual stats from perceptions. Reality vs. fantasy.

Not that I'd suggest any rec tennis player has delusions of grandeur, but perhaps one's seeing smoked dtl winners with each forehand; the other the curtain getting hammered each time with oes. This could be easily and constructively addressed with an impartial observer.

 

[Totai]

Maybe he was bored from the lame tennis being played in that match. If I am playing against an old lady that can't run FORWARD to get to a ball before it bounces twice, then I would definitely get bored and start trying out different shots to entertain myself.

 

[Totai]

I guess your definition of fun is not the same as mine. There's a big difference between pushing your limits and trying some different shots, and trying incredibly stupid shots and making 100 unforced errors. I completely understand that we all have bad days, but my partner was trying shots that he never had and never will have. It's not fun to play with somebody doing that.

Frankly, I get really tired of people who think being a good tennis player = hitting the ball really hard.

judging from your attitude, you would make a ****ty partner. Way to motivate your partner!

 

[catfish]

Maybe he was bored from the lame tennis being played in that match. If I am playing against an old lady that can't run FORWARD to get to a ball before it bounces twice, then I would definitely get bored and start trying out different shots to entertain myself.

So your boredom is more important than anything else? USTA League tennis is a team sport. What about your partner and the others on the team? If you get bored with these matches, the best thing to do is win them quickly and get off the court and relieve your boredom elsewhere. Or even better, don't play.

 

[tennis tom]

judging from your attitude, you would make a ****ty partner. Way to motivate your partner!

Now, now, name calling is not necessary. 4.5 ladies are few and far between and deserve more respect than that; besides, she is stunningly beautiful to boot. Lets not drive her off to golf or croquet, she was just trying to instruct the young lad on winning percentage tennis.

 

[Totai]

Now, now, name calling is not necessary. 4.5 ladies are few and far between and deserve more respect than that; besides, she is stunningly beautiful to boot. Lets not drive her off to golf or croquet, she was just trying to instruct the young lad on winning percentage tennis.

Alright, I may have gotten a bit out of hand, but I can relate to her partner. I played from a young age and all through highschool, and then quit for many years before picking up a racket again. I too would be inconsistent with my shots, and tended to over power everything. The last thing I needed would have been a judgemental partner to stand there and tell me I will never be good enough to hit my shots.

Anyway OP, tell your partner to work on his footwork. A lot of my hitting problems stemmed from lazy footwork.

 

[Totai]

So your boredom is more important than anything else? USTA League tennis is a team sport. What about your partner and the others on the team? If you get bored with these matches, the best thing to do is win them quickly and get off the court and relieve your boredom elsewhere. Or even better, don't play.

Bordom isn't more important than everything else, but it is a strong force. If you are bored on court, you will not be fully engaged, and therefore will not play up to your potential. Most human beings who aren't mental giants will also lose focus and try to entertain themselves somehow.

And to your point of this being USTA league, it is just that. It isn't Wimbledon. The guy is paying money to play. It isn't a job, it is entertainment. You should try looking at it the same way.

 

[catfish]

Alright, I may have gotten a bit out of hand, but I can relate to her partner. I played from a young age and all through highschool, and then quit for many years before picking up a racket again. I too would be inconsistent with my shots, and tended to over power everything. The last thing I needed would have been a judgemental partner to stand there and tell me I will never be good enough to hit my shots.

Anyway OP, tell your partner to work on his footwork. A lot of my hitting problems stemmed from lazy footwork.

I never told my partner anything of the sort. If you read the prior posts, all I told him was that hitting cross court shots was winning points, and I also pointed out that cross court is higher percentage than down the line. I also told him that "WE (not he)were hurting ourselves with unforced errors". That's about all I said.

BTW, this guy is young, but not that young. He's at least 30.

 

[LeeD]

Problem here is that you guys were winning easily, and after his bout with sprayballitis, YOU GUYS WON!
You mention his "100" horrible misses. How many winners did he hid along that stretch, and how many intimidating shots?
I would assume you tend to exxagerate a bit. If he can possibly hit "100" losers, you would not have won any match, short of a 10 out of 19 set match.

 

[tennismonkey]

Frankly, I get really tired of people who think being a good tennis player = hitting the ball really hard.

+1. lol

i'd also add people who think being a good tennis player ....

= aiming 1 millimeter above the netcord on all shots.
= serving as hard as possible on all first serves with a first serve percentage of 0%.

 

[catfish]

Problem here is that you guys were winning easily, and after his bout with sprayballitis, YOU GUYS WON!
You mention his "100" horrible misses. How many winners did he hid along that stretch, and how many intimidating shots?
I would assume you tend to exxagerate a bit. If he can possibly hit "100" losers, you would not have won any match, short of a 10 out of 19 set match.

This match could have easily gone either way. We lost the first set, and did win the 2nd set pretty easily. But in a third set TB, anything can happen. So we could have lost just as easily.

Yes, 100 unforced errors could be an exaggeration. But I think it's close. He averaged about 4 per game. There were 9 games in the first set and 8 games in the 2nd set. Many games went deuce many times. So 75 would probably be accurate. Yes, he hit some intimidating shots, but shots stop being intimidating when they all go out.

I am not talking about small misses here. I'm talking about completely wild tennis. Balls flying to the curtain and being slammed into the bottom of the net. I mentioned in another post here that I played a 9.0 match where the 4.5 man playing against me was even wilder than this 3.5 guy. I'm wondering what makes people do this. Why is it fun to hit a tennis ball so hard that it hits the curtain on the fly? My son and his buddies used to do it when they were 10 years old. But why would someone want to do that repeatedly in an adult mixed doubles league match? It takes a lot more skill to play in control and stay mentally focused than it does to slam balls around wildly.

 

[LeeD]

I guess you should watch these guys play a SINGLES match.
When I was learning tennis, I often played as if I had nothing to lose...hitting what seemed like "wildly" and missing by "huge" margins.
But after a couple of years, I lowered my sights, controlled my posture, slowed my movement, and actually had a pretty good A/Open career, considering I started tennis after the age of 24, after 2 major surgery multi pin broke legs and THREE collarbone breaks, I'd consider a low level 5.0 a very good level to reach.
If I'd played more conservatively, hit like the injured old man like I was, I'd win more matches at the C and possibly B levels, but would have gone nowhere in the Opens.
You know we play like we practice. If we're practicing to improve our game in the future, it's hard to back off and modify our games to WIN in the present. Can't have your cake and eat it too, or something like that.

 

[Fuji]

You're problem is you are playing doubles with a guy! :lol: They will always try to be superior on court no matter who they are playing against, from what I've seen. (Heck it's happened to me a few times in my first year or so of doubles, and it wasn't even mixed!)

-Fuji

 

[LeeD]

Yes, and that's why most guys who play tennis seriously for more than 4 years have 120+ serves, 90 mph forehands (on the right occasion), can leap for overheads and smash them away like a first serve, and can cover alley to alley in singles.
Guys are different than girls.
Ever go to a yoga classs? Say 20 total practioners, 15 female, 3 male? Seems all 15 females can do all the poses. 3 males? None can do them correctly. Of the two remaining, YES, they are techniically male, and can do all the poses.............:shock:

 

[user92626]

OP and All,

I would say that good and sensible players are always made to suffer fools. I, too, play with this one guy whose tennis "senses" are stunningly bad but loves to hit the ball hard. He ALWAYS loses no matter what side he's on. He knows he has no control and I have pointed out to him that his main problem was over-hitting. He just ignored and one time said that he loved to play like that!!! Tennis time with him was bad that I almost quit to come out. But I am too addicted to the game so I adjusted and just laughed it off and have a whatever attitude with him. It's working for my sanity.

 

[dizzlmcwizzl]

Saying something is probalbly all you needed to do. Sometimes people (read men) get to doing something without really thinking. With my male friends, I have no problem at all walking up to them ... telling them thier serve return is awful and to take something off it.

However sometimes I think the male-female dynamic keeps us from saying what we need to our partners. Dont be afriad to tell him to dial it back. Apparently it worked this time and you have not written about a bad attitude after you dialed him back. ... If it bothers him he will tell the coach not to partner with you anymore and you have a win anywayz.

Doubles is all about helping you partner to be successfull and communicating is the surest way to make that happen.

 

[Cindysphinx]

I think it is important to remember that someone who is overhitting may not in fact be overhitting.

For me, the worst thing I can do is slow my racket head speed. If I am missing (especially missing long), the cure is to make sure I am not too close to the ball and to make sure I accelerate through the ball.

If my partner tells me to take something off of it, that is *so* not helpful. Partner, trust me that I am trouble-shooting the problem, and if you can give me some space I will get it sorted.

When it is my partner who is wild, I let them be unless they ask me a specific question about how they might do better. My standard response is to focus on footwork.

 

[user92626]

I think it is important to remember that someone who is overhitting may not in fact be overhitting.

For me, the worst thing I can do is slow my racket head speed. If I am missing (especially missing long), the cure is to make sure I am not too close to the ball and to make sure I accelerate through the ball.

If my partner tells me to take something off of it, that is *so* not helpful. Partner, trust me that I am trouble-shooting the problem, and if you can give me some space I will get it sorted.

When it is my partner who is wild, I let them be unless they ask me a specific question about how they might do better. My standard response is to focus on footwork.

Hmmm...Cindy, if you launch the ball that misses the court by 4+ feet or hits the net squarely in the middle or the bottom, or frame it, especially off of shots that you have more than enough time to set up, and you do that 7 out of 10 times, you ARE overhitting. You are doing things that exceed the speed that your senses could control.

The thing about "racket head speed" that you're refering to is likely a different issue. It's usually the issue of tension and fear which causes player to slow down or being rigid with their mechanics. Racket head speed isn't even relevant if you are using the right racket. Meaning, you could slow down noticeably if you use a heavier racket and the end result is just the same.


In fact, anecdotally, one of the things I tried to cure my overhitting friend's problem was suggesting him to use a heavier racket, something that matches his strength and hopefully slow him down a bit. He adamantly refused and continues to use a pair of 10.2 head heavy by several points, 95 sq in rackets.

 

[OrangePower]

Yes, and that's why most guys who play tennis seriously for more than 4 years have 120+ serves

Off-topic, but I LOL'd at this! Lee I think it's time to get a new radar gun because your old one is defective

 

[LeeD]

I wonder if "4' long" is really a bad miss?
That usually means, on a groundstroke, if I'd hit 3" lower, or added a hair more topspin...or any kind of spin, the ball would fall IN. I'm not pushing my forehand groundie to be safe and consistent. Instead, I'm hitting a forcing attempt at my maximum capability, which is around 4.0, NOT the new bumped up 4.0, but the old one where you actually had to hit and understand tennis.
4' out on a first serve is not bad. I'm going for my max speed, maybe 95 for this old fart. 1.5" lower would be IN.
On a volley, it's also not bad. I'm going for forcing volleys, usually within 3' of the baseline. I cannot hit every volley there, some short, some LONG.
That's why I'm 4.0.
Hitting the middle of the net on any balanced stroke IS a bad miss. As is hitting the backboard on a fly, or anything more than 2' wide.

 

[LeeD]

Not really.
Since you also live in NorCal, I would invite you to check out my "75mph" (by some fellow poster's claims) serves.
EVERY court I go to with more than 5 courts, I have the biggest or third biggest serves, and that includes college courts when the varsity singles are not practicing. No, I don't currently claim anything over 95. I'm 62, figure on me losing 30% of my physical skills. Possibly much more, as you know I couldn't run AT all, couldn't jump at all, during my vid.
How fast can YOU serve if you can't run or jump? Think about it.

 

[user92626]

I wonder if "4' long" is really a bad miss?

It IS a really bad miss. You know why? Because due to some sort of probabilty, there are still other misses in between and thus it's too much overall. You need room for other mistakes.

A 6 inch miss or the net tape hit is a really good miss, because next to it is likely a winner. Such misses require very little & easy adjustment.