Hewitt and Del Potro examples of how ATP-style takeback and pat the dog not always necessary?

Clay lover

Legend

It's pretty much established that they don't have an ATP-style flip to get the racquet into firing position and instead just let it drop into place after the takeback.

What's more though, is the fact that there doesn't even seem to be a pat-the-dog before the forward swing! Their racquet angle doesn't really change from the moment it points towards the back fence to when it makes contact with the ball. So, although they have loopy takebacks, the forward component of their swing is extremely simple. Is this evidence that this simple style works on the ATP?

Of course this swing has shaped them into having a certain type of forehand--despite their differences in playstyle they both have a flat, precise forehand, but at least they are good weapons on the ATP!
 
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BevelDevil

Hall of Fame
Any other players (male or female) use a non-ATP (but also non-WTA) swing? Preferably with a SW grip.
I'm coming back to tennis after 5+ years off and I want a simpler stroke. I was looking at old Steffi Graf footage the other day and I thought that was insightful.
 

Clay lover

Legend
I'm just kinda bored of the "to get to the next level you must have some sort of next-level technique" narrative when actually even some pros (and very successful ones) keep it very simple beyond the backswing.

The backswing is just a matter of habit and can be dialled in through repetition, but the moving parts the ATP FH involves isn't really for everyone.
 

Clay lover

Legend
Any other players (male or female) use a non-ATP (but also non-WTA) swing? Preferably with a SW grip.
I'm coming back to tennis after 5+ years off and I want a simpler stroke. I was looking at old Steffi Graf footage the other day and I thought that was insightful.
James Blake? His swing is really as simple as it gets.
 
The answer is at 6.0 plus an atp take back probably has some advantages (only like 3 or 4 in the top 100 dont use it) but until 5.0 or so other things are much more important. That doesn't mean an atp take back can't work at 4.0 but don't expect that going from wta to atp will take a 4.0 to a 4.5. It is probably more like a tiny single digit percent advantage that only comes into play if you play at the top100 atp level and even there are exceptions, chardy had one of the best forehand with an early layback in his prime.

But if you like It go for an atp take back, just know it is probably more like getting a 4.5 to a 4.6 than making a big difference. Losing 15 pounds, improving your footwork or working on an earlier preparation will probably give you a bigger improvement and if you want to work on swings the forward swing phase is likely the bigger problem than take back or follow through.
 

acintya

Legend

It's pretty much established that they don't have an ATP-style flip to get the racquet into firing position and instead just let it drop into place after the takeback.

What's more though, is the fact that there doesn't even seem to be a pat-the-dog before the forward swing! Their racquet angle doesn't really change from the moment it points towards the back fence to when it makes contact with the ball. So, although they have loopy takebacks, the forward component of their swing is extremely simple. Is this evidence that this simple style works on the ATP?

Of course this swing has shaped them into having a certain type of forehand--despite their differences in playstyle they both have a flat, precise forehand, but at least they are good weapons on the ATP!

lately i have been experimenting with such NON-PAT forehand and i can only advise all recreative players to try it. it is much less power consumpting,but this is not because you dont pat the dog, but because you have more room for error, the stroke is simple and therefore basically you have a lot more time to prepare for the forehand and hit it clean.
and lets not start to talk about catching those wide angle balls to your forehand..it is a lot simpler to just drag the racquet back and hit it...
those few milliseconds you gain by forfeiting the pat the dog style later on become very helpful.
I even started to play two forehands with this potros forehands and because delpos fh doesnt need so much time to set up I am doing much better as i would apply the pat dog forehand which i can hit perfectly but like is said...
the "non-atp" fh is more consistent than the fed fh. just look at Halep.

 
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