High performance training

[Pusher]

Hey guys,

My son is 17 and will play D-1 tennis next fall. He spends about 10-12 hours on court per week mostly in very intense practice sessions. He will take maybe one day off per week, sometimes two depending on the weather. Obviously with all that on court time he is pretty fit at about 6'0 180lbs-and he is apparently in the middle of a growth spurt.

But all of his training comes with side effects. He is almost constantly tired and really has little time or energy for any off-court work. He says he wakes up every morning wondering what will be hurting that day. He has suffered stress fractures in his spine and his strength is so one sided that he has had one leg about 1.25 inches longer than the other. He is addressing that issue with trainers and docs, etc and surprisingly that problem has been mostly corrected.

I try to load him up on carbs and I make sure he eats three decent meals per day. He has increased the intensity and duration of his workouts because he knows he has to get better before he gets to college. His college coach says he also has to make a 5:30 mile run time or he won't make the travel squad. I don't know what his mile time may be right now but if he has to train to run a 5:30 or better then that may cause even more problems.

I suspect that he will have to face the fact that he will continue to feel drained until he stops growing and gets to a certain physical maturity level-he is a late bloomer. But I don't know that for a fact and it may be that he needs to make changes in his training. I really don't want to pay for a physical trainer- his current training costs are already significant.

Any help or advice is appreciated.

Thanks

 

[WBF]

To be honest... If he is a solid player, he may gain more through concentrating on fitness training, with a few light hits every week to keep up his timing.

*edit*: Expanding on this: Most serious teams will have major fitness plans for their members. Even at a so-so D3 college, my body (mostly legs) was consistently sore when we were engaging in fitness regularly. I would imagine a D1 team would have even more focus on fitness, as it is an incredibly integral part of the high level game of tennis.

 

[Pusher]

To be honest... If he is a solid player, he may gain more through concentrating on fitness training, with a few light hits every week to keep up his timing.

*edit*: Expanding on this: Most serious teams will have major fitness plans for their members. Even at a so-so D3 college, my body (mostly legs) was consistently sore when we were engaging in fitness regularly. I would imagine a D1 team would have even more focus on fitness, as it is an incredibly integral part of the high level game of tennis.

That would certainly be a luxury but he's not solid enough to not worry about improving. Most of the guys on that team are 21 years old and up with much more experience. His entire game has to get better and he knows it.

 

[WBF]

You have a tough situation. I think you should consult a doctor given past physical issues and potential injuries. I might not have been a D1 level player back before college, but I trained a good 1.5-2 hours a day with a 5.5 level player, and would often go for a run afterwards... yet I never had any injuries and felt no stress on my body... If your son is having trouble with just tennis, I would be very hesitant to recommend adding fitness training *in addition* to tennis... Being talented means nothing when you are injured!

Besides, if he works on his game so much, and doesn't have time for fitness, there is a good possibility that the lack of fitness training will result in poor performance once he is forced to undergo the fitness entailed in a D1 program... If he gets fit now, while working on tennis perhaps not as intensely as before, he could gain a slight advantage over others vying for spots.

 

[tbini87]

You have a tough situation. I think you should consult a doctor given past physical issues and potential injuries. I might not have been a D1 level player back before college, but I trained a good 1.5-2 hours a day with a 5.5 level player, and would often go for a run afterwards... yet I never had any injuries and felt no stress on my body... If your son is having trouble with just tennis, I would be very hesitant to recommend adding fitness training *in addition* to tennis... Being talented means nothing when you are injured!

Besides, if he works on his game so much, and doesn't have time for fitness, there is a good possibility that the lack of fitness training will result in poor performance once he is forced to undergo the fitness entailed in a D1 program... If he gets fit now, while working on tennis perhaps not as intensely as before, he could gain a slight advantage over others vying for spots.

liked the post. definitely sounds like a tough situation. first major point is that his ability does not matter if he is injured. so his health needs to come before anything else. secondly, he is still young, and will have at least 3 more years of playing and hopefully being on the travel squad. is he on any type of scholarship? is red shirted or medical out of the question?

it sounds like your son is doing all he can to be the best player he can be at the moment. sounds like his work on the court is very intense, so i am guessing he is in good physical shape even if not dedicating tons of time to simply working out. maybe he could cut out a few hours a week for working out, or at least training for the 5:30 mile.

as wbf said, once he is at college they will have him busting his butt on the court and in the weight room. he will probably have a strength and conditioning coach who will have your son in great condition. your son will also have well trained trainers around to help with any physical problems he will be having. i am guessing he will be in good hands! for now just keep him safe, well fed, and motivated!

 

[chess9]

180 lbs sounds a bit heavy at 6'0", unless he is very muscular.

Also, muscular imbalances are a serious problem for tennis players. Regular fitness training in the gym would be my prescription. If this is the offseason for him, I'd get into the gym for the next few months, three days per week, and have some moderate hitting two or three days per week.

The muscle imbalances will affect his running and his play ultimately, IMHO.

If he's tired and sore every day he may have other health issues, but overtraining sounds like a possibility. Most people don't appreciate how intense the training can be and kids can be very bad about resting and eating properly. He also may have a lousy diet, inasmuch as he sounds slightly heavy. A lousy diet will make you tired and will slow recovery.

-Robert

 

[WBF]

Whoa whoa whoa. 180 lbs for 6'0" sounds heavy? It's not

 

[Spatula]

Funny how no one here has questioned his nutritional regiment and rest/recovery (ie. sleep per night). These two factors are huge in training either for tennis or in the gym.

 

[lilminihorse]

Funny how no one here has questioned his nutritional regiment and rest/recovery (ie. sleep per night). These two factors are huge in training either for tennis or in the gym.

I was gonna say the same thing.. definitely make sure he's taking a good multi vitamin. and eat a lot of food.... if he's feeling drained he's either not getting enough calories or not getting appropriate nutrients

 

[Thrice]

If you can afford it find a good high performance athletic center(e.g. http://www.hammerbodies.com/gamespeed.htm - sorry I only know St. Louis). It sounds like the cost laid out now will be worth it. Your son needs someone who is qualified to set up a program for nutrition, training/recovery cycle, and balancing sport specific training with fitness training. By training only on tennis six days a week his body does not have recovery time. If he is run down at that age something needs to change, especially given the injuries that have previously occurred.

As others have pointed out, you can't play if your injured. Also, you can be better technically than the other player, but if they are faster and have more stamina you may lose anyway. Good luck.

ps a pertinent article in the local paper http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/li...C429A9FC78941779862573C6006C57AF?OpenDocument

 

[CAM178]

Forgive me, as I have skimmed over the posts. What I did note are but a few things:

1. Your son, based on his training and size, should not be having the physical ailments that he is having. He's only 17? He should not be feeling like an old man when he wakes up ('What's going to hurt today?'), and he damn sure should not have had a stress fracture of the spine. That is really, really serious stuff. I would almost want to hazard a guess that he is doing something else that is causing this type of damage. I'm 36, and I train about as much as your son does, with little to no effect on my body. But I take off when I need to. I love the game too much to burn myself out again. That happened when I was a junior, and as an adult, and I don't want that to happen again.

2. He needs to get someone to set up a proper training plan for him. No offense meant to you, but the one he is on is obviously not working. You are an amateur doing this, and he needs a professional. Put it this way: would you want someone doing your job who was not as experienced as you are? Please don't take that the wrong way. I guess I am trying to emphasize the point, as your son is in a pretty bad way right now.

3. 6'0" and 180 pounds is the perfect size. He does not need to be any smaller. My guess is that he is naturally skinny, and he is probably almost all muscle. His specs are almost identical to mine. I am 6'2" and 180, and I should be a bit bigger muscle-wise.

4. It almost sounds like your son might need a bit of a break. I understand the pressures of college tennis, but he is dangerously close to burnout. As a high level player, I would hate to see the old college burnout situation happen to your son: ask all former college tennis players who quit why they quit, and you'll get the same answer: 'I hated it, man. I just got sick of it.' So many players who were sick ballers and could still be great players threw their racquets into a closet after their last college match and never picked up a racquet again because they got so burned out on it. Your son obviously loves the game, so help him figure out what will get him back to loving the game. Right now it sounds like he really needs to take it easier, as this is physically hurting him. That will soon lead to a mental unhinging, as he will start to hate seeing that little yellow ball.

 

[chess9]

Whoa whoa whoa. 180 lbs for 6'0" sounds heavy? It's not

I was about 180 in college, but I had a very muscular upper body. I still have very skinny legs and a couple of muscles above the waist, but I'm now 166.

Anyway, for Division 1 tennis you'd better not be carrying any fat, and if you are, you'd better have loads of talent to compensate for it.

Maybe we should ask what his bodyfat percentage is?

Just my opinion.

-Robert

 

[chess9]

Funny how no one here has questioned his nutritional regiment and rest/recovery (ie. sleep per night). These two factors are huge in training either for tennis or in the gym.

That's exactly my point! Look above your post.

-Robert

 

[NoBadMojo]

sounds like the kid could be pushing/being pushed too hard. unless all this brings him joy, i would suggest changing things around or you may have an 18 year old burnout. also, as others have noted, nutrition, hydration, and rest hasnt been discussed, and is very impt
6' and 180 certainly doesnt have to be too heavy. we're not talking distance running here. People who have large quads and stuff can weigh much more than they look...people shouldnt judge other people just on height and weight.
hitting the gym is vastly overrated here for tennis by some especially if involving weights. plyometrics is good for tennis and if the guy likes other sports, i highly encourage cross training and that keeps things fresh and fun.
If interested, I am friends with a current ATP/WTA tour trainer. He trained Ginepri back when he made his big run, and several others. he does web based/email/phone training which is tennis specific. This is a reasonable way to take advantage of a tour trainer for not a lot of money. Once he customizes a program for someone, up to them to keep it going. let me know if interested, and i'll hook you up

 

[maverick66]

sounds like he needs to remember that your body needs rest. even elite athletes take time off. its good to push yourself but not to the point where it hurts and you feel drained. if you can get him in with a trainer that has some experiance training athletes. ask for college degrees from the trainer as there are alot out there who have a piece of crap certificate. also does he have a tennis coach? if so he should relize that your son is hurting himself and work with him to get over injuries.
and 180 lbs is not heavy for 6'0" i was 190 at 6'1" and was not carrying much body fat around. the guy isnt a cyclist or a marathon runner he needs the size to last.

 

[WBF]

I was about 180 in college, but I had a very muscular upper body. I still have very skinny legs and a couple of muscles above the waist, but I'm now 166.

Anyway, for Division 1 tennis you'd better not be carrying any fat, and if you are, you'd better have loads of talent to compensate for it.

Maybe we should ask what his bodyfat percentage is?

Just my opinion.

-Robert

I'm guessing this is due to individual differences. I'm pretty healthy at 188 right now (I'm 6' as well), I could probably lose 2-3 lbs for a more optimal weight. When I have been down to 180, I was very, very skinny looking (bony, emaciated, etc). Considering that I haven't lifted in over 4 years, I would imagine I could gain some muscle, lose some fat, and be very, very fit at my current weight, give or take a pound or two.

NBM's idea sounds like it could be quite helpful for your son.

 

[Spatula]

That's exactly my point! Look above your post.

-Robert

I read your post, and I wasn't refering to body weight. I didn't address it because it's a mute point. 6' 180 is fine for a 17 y/o. I was roughly the same weight if not lighter at his age. I'm 6' myself and currently 200lbs w/8% bodyfat. My training style/needs are differnt though.

My point is simply that nothing has been noted abuot his nutritional intake. Fatigue and recovery are direcdt impact of poor nutrition. Suggest his parent look into that aspect of it.

 

[Japanese Maple]

Pusher, if your son is truly Division I college material I am surprised that he is all tennis , all the time with no strength training and speed/plyometrics mixed in on a weekly basis for balance and improved on-court performance. Tennis at that level takes a tremendous amount of speed,agility,quickness,strength, and flexibility if if he truly wants to improve as a player. Its not all about hitting the ball, but improving as an athlete at a high level. Adding variety to his weekly rountine will not only improve his athletic/tennis performance but will also prevent burnout and mental fatigue, and make his actual tennis hits more productive. Pay attention to 1) well balanced nutritional meal plan, 2) proper hydration-at least a gallon of water per day along with a sport drink like gatorade while playing tennis, 3) speed/plyometric workouts-really missing the boat by not doing this!,4) strength training-full body with emphasis on legs, shoulders, rotator cuff, and core 5) HIIT-life cycle is best. 6) flexibility-does he stretch before and after tennis?, 7) rest/recovery days-resting is just as important as working out. Overall, he needs more variety and balance in his weekly schedule along with proper diet and hydration. Find a good trainer who works with tennis players to set up a program for you with the above in mind. Good luck.

 

[CAM178]

nothing has been noted abuot his nutritional intake. Fatigue and recovery are direcdt impact of poor nutrition. Suggest his parent look into that aspect of it.

I mentioned it (#2). I told him that he needs a professional to be doing this. I did not directly mention nutrition, as it was implied with 'training'.

 

[chess9]

I read your post, and I wasn't refering to body weight. I didn't address it because it's a mute point. 6' 180 is fine for a 17 y/o. I was roughly the same weight if not lighter at his age. I'm 6' myself and currently 200lbs w/8% bodyfat. My training style/needs are differnt though.

My point is simply that nothing has been noted abuot his nutritional intake. Fatigue and recovery are direcdt impact of poor nutrition. Suggest his parent look into that aspect of it.

You missed this from my post above!!!

"Most people don't appreciate how intense the training can be and kids can be very bad about resting and eating properly. He also may have a lousy diet, inasmuch as he sounds slightly heavy. A lousy diet will make you tired and will slow recovery."

LOL!

-Robert

 

[BeHappy]

email me at my TW email: buttertastesreallynice@yahoo.com, don't worry, I'm not going to spam you or anything like that, if you're worried you can set up another email address for yourself in less than two minutes on yahoo, it's just that I have the solution to your problem but can't give it to you over the forum.

 

[Pusher]

Thanks guys, I appreciate all the responses.

A few things:

At 6'0 180 he is not overweight he's just pretty much all muscle and bone. He's not ripped by any means but he is solid.

I've probably made things sound worse than they are and of course he's getting the proper medical attention and diet.

For those of you that have been around serious junior players you probably know that being tired is partly a result of being a teeneager. The growth demands plus training regimen requires a minimum 10 hours sleep every night and he gets that most of the time. But here lately he does seem more lethargic than usual.

The spine issue is fairly common with tennis players and is particuarly common among football players, especially interiior linemen. Its mostly a result of putting enormous pressure on the core muscles and if they aren't strong enough you get a pressure fracture. It sounds worse than it is.

I think backing off the training regimen a little makes sense. I do set his schedule but I listen to him closely when he says he needs a break or something hurts. Actually he can tolerate intensity levels I thought may be a bit too much but thats the way he likes it.

I just wish i could make things a little easier for him but he likes training hard and burnout is not likely-he loves tennis too much.

BTW, I've considered trying creatine and decided to leave it alone but I do give him Advil before he practices. That seems to help with soreness and recovery. I may be searching for answers that are just not there-if one works hard enough problems will occur I suppose.

 

[BeHappy]

post a reply to this thread once you've sent the email

 

[Pusher]

Forgive me, as I have skimmed over the posts. What I did note are but a few things:

He needs to get someone to set up a proper training plan for him. No offense meant to you, but the one he is on is obviously not working. You are an amateur doing this, and he needs a professional. Put it this way: would you want someone doing your job who was not as experienced as you are? Please don't take that the wrong way. I guess I am trying to emphasize the point, as your son is in a pretty bad way right now.

Most parents of junior players struggle with determining proper training plans. And you're right, I am not a professional. Its just such a juggling act: school responsibilites,the weather, the availability of hitting partners and his coach's schedule-all combine to result in training that is often erratic and illogical.

The only juniors I know that can count on a training regimen every day, every week, are the guys at the academies. Deep pockets certainly count in tennis.

 

[nickb]

Does he do baskets?...I do baskets every day if I can. You could feed for him...they are very important for grooving strokes and fitness. Players seem to laugh at me on court every day hitting the same shots over and over...but its a very fast way to improve and is often overlooked.

Gym work is also very important and needs to be done to up your game to that next level and prevent injury.

Nick

 

[onehandbh]

How explosive is his speed? 50meter, 100 meter times?
Incorporating some sprint work could help him reach a 5:30 mile.

10-12 hrs a week doesn't sound like an excessive amount of tennis
pay week. I think I played about double that in high school, but everyone
has a different capacity for exercise.

The fact that he's tired all the time and has small fractures is a little
concerning... I think cutting down the number of days of training or
at least changing it up might help. If he plays 2 hrs per day 5 days
a week, he might consider changing it up to something like:

Mon: 3 hrs tennis
Tues: 30 minutes of maybe just volleying which should be easier on
his body. followed by some sort of stretching, yoga, or gym work.
Wed: 2 hrs tennis
Thurs: 30 minutes of tennis of something specific like just serving
followed by gym, fitness training.
Fri: 2 hrs tennis
Sat: 3 hrs tennis
Sun: rest.

I also took a 45 minute nap every day during school. I'd just
prop up a book and go to sleep behind it.

 

[maverick66]

BTW, I've considered trying creatine and decided to leave it alone but I do give him Advil before he practices. That seems to help with soreness and recovery. I may be searching for answers that are just not there-if one works hard enough problems will occur I suppose.

wouldnt worry so much with creatine but would definetly look into a good multi-vitamin and some kind of protein shake. they will help him recover lost nutrients from pushing hard. i used to have to take alot of pills and shakes when i was training all out for futures and they helped alot and i could feel when i didnt use them. creatine didnt do much for me. ive heard people have good results with it but for me it wasnt helping enough to continue to buy it.

 

[CAM178]

Most parents of junior players struggle with determining proper training plans. And you're right, I am not a professional. Its just such a juggling act: school responsibilites,the weather, the availability of hitting partners and his coach's schedule-all combine to result in training that is often erratic and illogical.
The only juniors I know that can count on a training regimen every day, every week, are the guys at the academies. Deep pockets certainly count in tennis.

Do you have access to good hitting partners for him in the area? See if you can find 10-20 good hitting partners. . . guys who played high-level college, guys who are current pros (not teaching!), or guys who used to be on tour. They're always around. When they can, get them to hit with your son. With that many (10-20), you should be able to rotate enough through them so that he has regular hitting partners. And have them play matches against him. If he gets tooled by them that's only going to help him that much more for when he gets to college. And drills will help, too. As a higher-level guy, I would absolutely help an aspiring college player. But you won't know without asking these guys.

Most importantly: tell your son to slow down when he feels like it. Right now he's on the brink of burn-out, both physically and mentally (just based on what you've told us), so he needs to take it easy. But get him to get in at least 60 min a day. That is very mild. A few years back (at age 33), I was playing up to 4 hrs daily, and I felt no pain. Everyone is different, but he shouldn't be hurting like he is.

Why is he so tired and hurting so much? Have you had tests run? If not, you might want to jump on that, and contact some docs. It might be something far more serious than tennis burnout. I'm not trying to scare you. As someone who can still play 3-4 hrs at a time at my age, it is concerning that someone less than half my age is having such physical issues.

 

[tbini87]

wow, lot of good help in there! i am actually getting ready for my upcoming season at a jc in so cal, and this info is really helpful.

 

[tbini87]

Do you have access to good hitting partners for him in the area? See if you can find 10-20 good hitting partners. . . guys who played high-level college, guys who are current pros (not teaching!), or guys who used to be on tour. They're always around. When they can, get them to hit with your son. With that many (10-20), you should be able to rotate enough through them so that he has regular hitting partners. And have them play matches against him. If he gets tooled by them that's only going to help him that much more for when he gets to college. And drills will help, too. As a higher-level guy, I would absolutely help an aspiring college player. But you won't know without asking these guys.

Most importantly: tell your son to slow down when he feels like it. Right now he's on the brink of burn-out, both physically and mentally (just based on what you've told us), so he needs to take it easy. But get him to get in at least 60 min a day. That is very mild. A few years back (at age 33), I was playing up to 4 hrs daily, and I felt no pain. Everyone is different, but he shouldn't be hurting like he is.

Why is he so tired and hurting so much? Have you had tests run? If not, you might want to jump on that, and contact some docs. It might be something far more serious than tennis burnout. I'm not trying to scare you. As someone who can still play 3-4 hrs at a time at my age, it is concerning that someone less than half my age is having such physical issues.

where do you live cam? i could use your help haha!

but honestly, you are super lucky to be able to play so hard and not have much pain. i haven't been so lucky. after breaking (and compound dislocating) 3 fingers on my dominant hand i now have arthritis in some fingers and don't have great strength or gripping ability on my playing hand. i also have a bulging disk in my back which i kind of just block out now. i guess i just have an easier time knowing the physical pain some people have to go through, and how lucky others are to be able to wake up everyday feeling great!

 

[Pusher]

Do you have access to good hitting partners for him in the area? See if you can find 10-20 good hitting partners. . . guys who played high-level college, guys who are current pros (not teaching!), or guys who used to be on tour. They're always around. When they can, get them to hit with your son. With that many (10-20), you should be able to rotate enough through them so that he has regular hitting partners. And have them play matches against him. If he gets tooled by them that's only going to help him that much more for when he gets to college. And drills will help, too. As a higher-level guy, I would absolutely help an aspiring college player. But you won't know without asking these guys.

Most importantly: tell your son to slow down when he feels like it. Right now he's on the brink of burn-out, both physically and mentally (just based on what you've told us), so he needs to take it easy. But get him to get in at least 60 min a day. That is very mild. A few years back (at age 33), I was playing up to 4 hrs daily, and I felt no pain. Everyone is different, but he shouldn't be hurting like he is.

Why is he so tired and hurting so much? Have you had tests run? If not, you might want to jump on that, and contact some docs. It might be something far more serious than tennis burnout. I'm not trying to scare you. As someone who can still play 3-4 hrs at a time at my age, it is concerning that someone less than half my age is having such physical issues.

Hitting partners are limited-we live in a small town. Believe me, I hustle getting his training schedule together to make surre he gets enough court time.

From reading some of the posts it appears that some feel 10-12 hours a week is not that much. Remember that 10-12 hours of training is a whole different world than 10-12 hours of playing matches or hitting around. Matches are easy and I've never seen him get tired in a match. Practices usually go 90 minutes at full speed at 100% effort and hitting at 100%. They usually involve a teaching pro along with a current D-1 player or a pro circuit player. They are brutal and no matter how good a shape you are in it is a killer. On Monday he hit with a southeast region top 10 at Boys 16 and they went at it hard for 2 hours. Not playing points but crushing cross court forehands and then back hands and overheads. Walking off the court they both looked semi-conscious.

And then tonight he played a match with a 4.5 adult and I have never seen him so listless even though he won at 2 and 2. It lasted 2 hours even though the score might indicate otherwise. We just got back and he is in bed at 9:30.

But that is what it takes to play at a high level. The pain, the sacrifice of any sort of social life, the pressure packed tournaments, its all a part of the game. But he wouldn't give it up for anything, its like he's on some sort of quest.

I just want to insure he is healthy with no long term impacts from this training regimen.

 

[Pusher]

wouldnt worry so much with creatine but would definetly look into a good multi-vitamin and some kind of protein shake. they will help him recover lost nutrients from pushing hard. i used to have to take alot of pills and shakes when i was training all out for futures and they helped alot and i could feel when i didnt use them. creatine didnt do much for me. ive heard people have good results with it but for me it wasnt helping enough to continue to buy it.

That sounds like good advice. He does take vitamins but not any extra nutrients like protein shakes, etc. I tried creatine myself just to see what impact it would have on me as I play maybe 3-4 times a week. After doing the front end loading I really didn't see any impact.

 

[Pusher]

Does he do baskets?...I do baskets every day if I can. You could feed for him...they are very important for grooving strokes and fitness. Players seem to laugh at me on court every day hitting the same shots over and over...but its a very fast way to improve and is often overlooked.

Gym work is also very important and needs to be done to up your game to that next level and prevent injury.

Nick

Hey Nick.

Luckily, one of the local teaching pros coached Baghdatis when he was a junior and also coached several WTA players. He works primarily with juniors 12-16 and he does baskets almost exclusively. Thats a great way to grove your stroke and build that muscle memory and it has a fitness component. I see somebody hitting baskets and I figure thats a serious player that wants to play at a high level-no laughing from me..

 

[Pusher]

How explosive is his speed? 50meter, 100 meter times?
Incorporating some sprint work could help him reach a 5:30 mile.

10-12 hrs a week doesn't sound like an excessive amount of tennis
pay week. I think I played about double that in high school, but everyone
has a different capacity for exercise.

The fact that he's tired all the time and has small fractures is a little
concerning... I think cutting down the number of days of training or
at least changing it up might help. If he plays 2 hrs per day 5 days
a week, he might consider changing it up to something like:

Mon: 3 hrs tennis
Tues: 30 minutes of maybe just volleying which should be easier on
his body. followed by some sort of stretching, yoga, or gym work.
Wed: 2 hrs tennis
Thurs: 30 minutes of tennis of something specific like just serving
followed by gym, fitness training.
Fri: 2 hrs tennis
Sat: 3 hrs tennis
Sun: rest.

I also took a 45 minute nap every day during school. I'd just
prop up a book and go to sleep behind it.

Hey onehandbh.

Nobody trains 20-24 hours a week-at least no tennis player I know. Many play tennis that long but training and playing-those are two very different things.

I agree that sprints are great exercise for tennis players. My son used to do them and then he gave me a little reminder that he could do sprints or he could go work on his serve but he couldn't do both. Sprints drained his legs and trying to hit serves with weak legs is most difficult. Unless you're a pro with lots of training time available a junior has to choose to either work on court or off the court but doing both with any frequency and consistency is virtually impossibe.

Concerning your schedule-3 hours on any one day is pretty much counterproductive unless you have a lot of down time in that 3 hours. Do 3 hours on Monday and you better plan on taking the next 2 daysoff.

 

[CAM178]

Practices usually go 90 minutes at full speed at 100% effort and hitting at 100%. . . . But that is what it takes to play at a high level. The pain, the sacrifice of any sort of social life, the pressure packed tournaments, its all a part of the game. But he wouldn't give it up for anything, its like he's on some sort of quest.
I just want to insure he is healthy with no long term impacts from this training regimen.

Practices, in my opinion, should not be quite that hard. It's no wonder he is burned out physically. I would definitely scale it back. You should ask some of his peers how they are training. But before I stick my foot in my mouth, how did the former/current satellite pros train when they were his age? Did they train this hard, or have you not asked them?

I guess it comes down to personal taste. Some guys like to train really hard, some don't.

I disagree as to the 'that's what it takes' approach. If this is what your kid wants to do, then that's his choice. But it sure doesn't sound healthy. And I disagree as to cutting out a social life. That is exactly why I quit tennis when I was younger: girls. But if these are his choices, then he is going to have to live by the sword. He's in a for an awakening when he goes to college to play tennis, as there will definitely be a social aspect to it. Probably much more so than he is prepared for. He will get plenty of tennis, but there is a lot of down time and social stuff.

I hope that your son stays healthy, enjoys all of the great tennis, and has a blast at college. He will love it, as most everyone does.

 

[CAM178]

Pusher, are you at all close to Charleston? I just now noticed that you are from SC.

 

[Ace]

Listless and in bed at 9:30?
Maybe he's just depressed about something that has nothing to do with tennis.

 

[Pusher]

Listless and in bed at 9:30?
Maybe he's just depressed about something that has nothing to do with tennis.

You're reaching my friend.

No depression.

 

[Pusher]

Pusher, are you at all close to Charleston? I just now noticed that you are from SC.

Hey Cam,

No, not close to Charleston although I grew up there. I'm in the upstate.

 

[CAM178]

Listless and in bed at 9:30?
Maybe he's just depressed about something that has nothing to do with tennis.

I wasn't going to say it, but I'm concerned that it's either that (depression), or he has a medical condition. I remember at 17 that you couldn't keep me still. I never went to bed before 12 when I was in HS.

No offense is meant, pusher. It just concerns me that someone so young and healthy is always tired and sleeping so much. I understand the body needs rest, but even when I have played 6 hours in a day (tournament, 4 matches), I don't crash that early.

 

[Pusher]

I wasn't going to say it, but I'm concerned that it's either that (depression), or he has a medical condition. I remember at 17 that you couldn't keep me still. I never went to bed before 12 when I was in HS.

No offense is meant, pusher. It just concerns me that someone so young and healthy is always tired and sleeping so much. I understand the body needs rest, but even when I have played 6 hours in a day (tournament, 4 matches), I don't crash that early.

No, it really is overtraining.

He is a very happy kid with a D-1 scholarship (partial) in his pocket and his school of choice. If you knew him you would know that depression is the last thing to worry about. After tennis his second occupational choice is stand-up comedian.

If he takes more than 2 days off from training he says his energy level goes sky high-feels great. We do that before tournaments.

BTW, 4 tournamnet matches in one day is tough. But think about doing that about 3 times a week, every week, and then you may understand the training regimen most all ranked juniors endure.

 

[WBF]

I agree with CAM. When I was first introduced to high intensity training, I might have been sore as hell, and had trouble using things like stairs, but... It shouldn't make you sleepy. That is a bit odd. Then again, I never went to bed particularly late during highschool.

 

[Pusher]

I agree with CAM. When I was first introduced to high intensity training, I might have been sore as hell, and had trouble using things like stairs, but... It shouldn't make you sleepy. That is a bit odd. Then again, I never went to bed particularly late during highschool.

To bed at 9:30 and up at 7:00 is about right if you are an athlete. I don't see that as odd.

 

[Sleepstream]

Pusher,

You're having trouble finding a good hitting partner for him around the uni? I'm surprised and not at the same time.

I know there are some players around here who are/were 5.0-5.5 players. I would recommend going around the uni courts if you have the time. I'm not at the courts too often these days, but I have seen some higher level players when I have been there.

 

[JohnP]

I bought a book recently called "Core Performance" by Mark Verstegen. I liked the book alot, and ended up checking out his website, www.coreperformance.com. They have an online component of their workout program. It costs a bit but they have a three week trial.

I started the training program just recently and so far I love it to death. I chose the "Tennis off-season" program and it has a huge variety of options as far as days per week, you can change the intensity level alot to suit your situation. It might be worth your time to check it out, he might get alot of benefit going through their off-season tennis workout program at some point between now and then. They also have a lower intensity "in season" program. Good luck...

John

 

[NoBadMojo]

I agree with CAM. When I was first introduced to high intensity training, I might have been sore as hell, and had trouble using things like stairs, but... It shouldn't make you sleepy. That is a bit odd. Then again, I never went to bed particularly late during highschool.

it can make some people very sleepy and cause them to require more sleep than others...sleep is the way the body regenerates and recovers. everyones' system functions differently. one particular individuals experience does not mean the next ones will be the same..or that it should be the same. the key is to know your body

 

[CAM178]

As to knowing about a top-level junior's training requirements, yes, I am aware. But also know that different strokes for different folks applies. Some guys need very little training, some need quite a bit. When I am training a lot (as I will be in Feb for Nat'ls), I will train b/tw 2-4 hrs per day. So yeah, I know what it takes. It's the difference between breezing through early rounds, or having to shake the rust off. I'd rather breeze through.

Pusher, it sounds like you've got everything under control. And if your boy is a stand-up comedian, then he's obviously got a sense of humor. Congrats to him on getting the scholarship, and I wish him the best at college.

 

[superman1]

More sleep (good sleep, not disrupted sleep on a crappy mattress) + more attention to recovery.

Most pro players will do a cool down after a match. They might go on the bike for a little bit, then stretch, then have a shower or a steam bath, and then get a massage, listen to some music. Most people ignore all of this because it's just a total hassle after you've beaten yourself up and just want to go to sleep, but it makes a huge difference.

 

[Japanese Maple]

More sleep (good sleep, not disrupted sleep on a crappy mattress) + more attention to recovery.

Most pro players will do a cool down after a match. They might go on the bike for a little bit, then stretch, then have a shower or a steam bath, and then get a massage, listen to some music. Most people ignore all of this because it's just a total hassle after you've beaten yourself up and just want to go to sleep, but it makes a huge difference.

Excellent points Superman, it sounds like a nutrition/hydration issue and inadequate warm-up and cool down, without post match feeding within 30 minutes to replenish his glycogen stores adequately. I wonder if he is drinking enough water-at least a gallon per day along with a sport drink like gatorade while practicing. Using a foam roller would help with his soreness, along with whirlpools and massages if the budget allows, but at least use a whirlpool.

 

[Pusher]

Pusher,

You're having trouble finding a good hitting partner for him around the uni? I'm surprised and not at the same time.

I know there are some players around here who are/were 5.0-5.5 players. I would recommend going around the uni courts if you have the time. I'm not at the courts too often these days, but I have seen some higher level players when I have been there.

The problem is getting people to commit to play on a regular basis. But there are some good players around.