Hitting Through Forehand Video

tlm

G.O.A.T.
Here is a clip of some rally practice and I am trying to hit through my forehand more, plus get more depth and lower trajectory.

 

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
The gauntlet has been thrown! Shroud, it's your move.
Yeah, there is no gauntlet. But if I could make any move I wanted, I would have some freak transporter accident that would mix tlm's FH with mine. It would be the perfect fh IMHO.
 

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
Here is a clip of some rally practice and I am trying to hit through my forehand more, plus get more depth and lower trajectory.

Some good consistent hitting and you seem to be getting more depth than your partner most of the time.

What happens if you hit more of a SW grip?
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
Some good consistent hitting and you seem to be getting more depth than your partner most of the time.

What happens if you hit more of a SW grip?
Good question and I do get more depth using SW grip. But I am not as consistent with it so I use full w most of the time.
 

Windsor

Rookie
To hit through the ball , you would need to transfer the weight of your body forward at contact point. To do that, your left leg should work as a pivot while your right leg advance as a result of the weight transfer. In your case, left leg isnt't pivoting and right leg is not advancing causing you to produce less penetrating shots.
 

watungga

Professional
There are lots of Kerber slow motion in the tube. That's the ultimate hit through I've seen ever.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
To hit through the ball , you would need to transfer the weight of your body forward at contact point. To do that, your left leg should work as a pivot while your right leg advance as a result of the weight transfer. In your case, left leg isnt't pivoting and right leg is not advancing causing you to produce less penetrating shots.
I went back and watched for weight going forward and it looked like I only had that happen on a couple of my forehands.
 

Disgruntled Worker

Professional
Timing is off. Building solid ground-strokes starts at the net. It starts with mini-tennis and developing proper muscle memory. I can tell you guys just start blasting forehands from the baseline with no prep.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
Timing is off. Building solid ground-strokes starts at the net. It starts with mini-tennis and developing proper muscle memory. I can tell you guys just start blasting forehands from the baseline with no prep.
Well your right we don't start at the net and we do not practice any mini tennis. We start from the baseline but we don't blast right away we hit easy rally shots until warmed up and then start hitting away.
 

Lance L

Semi-Pro
From what I can see you are hitting almost completely with your arm. Imagine you have a large can of coffee on a long table and you want to shove it to the other end. You don't use just your arm, you are pushing off with your right leg, and turning your shoulders into it. You push through that can off coffee. You need to hit through the ball with your entire body. You can do this and still get plenty of topspin.

Next time have this mental picture: You are using your hand and pushing through the ball. Not hitting through, pushing through. Pushing through with your legs, shoulders, then arm.

Another point: I think you are hurting yourself by moving back so much. So many times your overall effect is moving back when you hit instead of forward. Personally I try to never move back once they hit the ball. That might be a bit exaggerated, but I think moving back is for recovery and moving in is for once they have hit the ball. So often you end up way behind the baseline, in a match I would be short ball/lobbing you all time, and that is an exhausting way to play.
 

dimkin

Hall of Fame
@tlm you really gotta turn more and give more space for the racquet path . . .


the raq has to make some loop around your trunk before making contact.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
@tlm you really gotta turn more and give more space for the racquet path . . .


the raq has to make some loop around your trunk before making contact.
There are times I have made sure to get farther away from the ball sideways and I noticed that I hit the ball better. I have a tendency to get to close to the ball.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
Isn't tough to hit through the ball with such an extreme grip.
In the past I used SW grip but have went to full western now. I hit to many shots long with SW grip. I have found that if I catch it right I can hit better shot with the extreme grip, also seems like I can flatten my shots out better with western grip.
 

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
In the past I used SW grip but have went to full western now. I hit to many shots long with SW grip. I have found that if I catch it right I can hit better shot with the extreme grip, also seems like I can flatten my shots out better with western grip.
That has been my experience and for years I could never hit the sw. W was just safer and worked, and SW was always a cluster. But something happened recently where now I use SW 80-90% of the time. It had to do with focusing on the take back and doing a good unit turn and keeping the left hand pointed to the right longer, and I had a coach who wanted me to hit flat. That cleaned up some of my bad habits.

Can you get a ball machine and try hitting flat with a SW?
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
That has been my experience and for years I could never hit the sw. W was just safer and worked, and SW was always a cluster. But something happened recently where now I use SW 80-90% of the time. It had to do with focusing on the take back and doing a good unit turn and keeping the left hand pointed to the right longer, and I had a coach who wanted me to hit flat. That cleaned up some of my bad habits.

Can you get a ball machine and try hitting flat with a SW?
Ya I own a ball machine and once it warms up I will be out hitting with it.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
There are times I have made sure to get farther away from the ball sideways and I noticed that I hit the ball better. I have a tendency to get to close to the ball.
For some reason, getting closer to the ball (sideways) gets you as well hitting the ball more in front of you (earlier contact), which is great for both control and power (and taking away a bit more time from your opponent too). Also I experience more comfort when I hit this way.

Only I don't understand W grip in this respect, I do it also with SW grip and all I can say is that it works.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
For some reason, getting closer to the ball (sideways) gets you as well hitting the ball more in front of you (earlier contact), which is great for both control and power (and taking away a bit more time from your opponent too). Also I experience more comfort when I hit this way.

Only I don't understand W grip in this respect, I do it also with SW grip and all I can say is that it works.
Western grip helps keep the racket closed some even with a steep upward swing.
 

Fxanimator1

Hall of Fame
Western grip helps keep the racket closed some even with a steep upward swing.
It would be an interesting experiment though with a ball machine...to just turn your grip one bevel and hit the ball exactly like you normally do. and see where that puts the ball's flight path.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
Western grip helps keep the racket closed some even with a steep upward swing.
I see.
I though where is W grip in respect of hitting the ball more in front of you (which requires positioning with trajectory of ball closer to your body). Does it make some problems in this respect?
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
It would be an interesting experiment though with a ball machine...to just turn your grip one bevel and hit the ball exactly like you normally do. and see where that puts the ball's flight path.

I see your point and I have tried exactly what you are suggesting. I will try it again next time out with ball machine.

The problem I had was if I was off a little my shots would go long to easily. If I was right on with the timing the shots were good and more penetrating. So being I go more for consistency I use the W grip.

So I think because of my inconsistent timing and exaggerated upper cut swing the W grip helps.
 

Fxanimator1

Hall of Fame
I see your point and I have tried exactly what you are suggesting. I will try it again next time out with ball machine.

The problem I had was if I was off a little my shots would go long to easily. If I was right on with the timing the shots were good and more penetrating. So being I go more for consistency I use the W grip.

So I think because of my inconsistent timing and exaggerated upper cut swing the W grip helps.
I think you've really reached a realization and a crossroad, so to speak in your technique, and that is, it's holding you back, provided that you want to move forward technique-wise. You just wrote it in your own words that I've high-lighted above.
 
Last edited:

tlm

G.O.A.T.
A lot of mishits in this one - why? Very late preparation in most of your shots
Really I didn't think I had many mishits in the video, other than the backhand one. But I do see the late prep on a lot of shots.
 

jga111

Hall of Fame
Really I didn't think I had many mishits in the video, other than the backhand one. But I do see the late prep on a lot of shots.
2.23, 2.31 + others, generally late contact. Overall nice controlled hitting, better than most of the users here I'm sure. Prep earlier and you will find more time. Generally aim to be in your load position before the ball has gone over the net..this will help
 

RetroSpin

Hall of Fame
tlm, I would ignore most of these suggestions. You are well aware that your technique has flaws, but I don't see them hurting your shot too much. I thought you were hitting those FHs pretty cleanly. Of course, your partner is feeding you medium speed balls that are landing at the service line, so you're not really getting pushed. Still, you're hitting a consistent solid ball. You have a serviceable 4.0/4.5 FH, and it will take a major reworking of it to get much better. I'm not sure that would be the best use of your time.

I did notice that you stand way far back. I don't think you can get away with that on a hard court. Your partner hit several angled shots by you. If you were just behind the baseline, you would have a much better shot at getting them.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
2.23, 2.31 + others, generally late contact. Overall nice controlled hitting, better than most of the users here I'm sure. Prep earlier and you will find more time. Generally aim to be in your load position before the ball has gone over the net..this will help
Yes I still need to work on earlier prep. I don't know why it is so hard for me to get that ingrained.
 

Bluefan75

Professional
2.23, 2.31 + others, generally late contact. Overall nice controlled hitting, better than most of the users here I'm sure. Prep earlier and you will find more time. Generally aim to be in your load position before the ball has gone over the net..this will help
Dumb question here, but load position...is that what I was shown once as (I'm a righty) left hand pointing at the ball and the racquet back already? (more or less...)
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
tlm, I would ignore most of these suggestions. You are well aware that your technique has flaws, but I don't see them hurting your shot too much. I thought you were hitting those FHs pretty cleanly. Of course, your partner is feeding you medium speed balls that are landing at the service line, so you're not really getting pushed. Still, you're hitting a consistent solid ball. You have a serviceable 4.0/4.5 FH, and it will take a major reworking of it to get much better. I'm not sure that would be the best use of your time.

I did notice that you stand way far back. I don't think you can get away with that on a hard court. Your partner hit several angled shots by you. If you were just behind the baseline, you would have a much better shot at getting them.
Like in this video I am working on trying to hit through the ball more and get more depth. So not major change.
I do play pretty deep court positioning. That is something I could work on.
 

jga111

Hall of Fame
Yes I still need to work on earlier prep. I don't know why it is so hard for me to get that ingrained.
Is your friend a good volleyer? Get him to play you from the net. Usual controlled hitting - this will help massively because you will have less time. Do this for 30 mins or so then both play from the baseline, you will be amazed how much more time you have
 

jga111

Hall of Fame
Dumb question here, but load position...is that what I was shown once as (I'm a righty) left hand pointing at the ball and the racquet back already? (more or less...)
Load Position isn't a reflection of where your hands are etc, but signifies the start of your forward motion when your 'energy' for striking is loaded
 

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
tlm, I would ignore most of these suggestions. You are well aware that your technique has flaws, but I don't see them hurting your shot too much. I thought you were hitting those FHs pretty cleanly. Of course, your partner is feeding you medium speed balls that are landing at the service line, so you're not really getting pushed. Still, you're hitting a consistent solid ball. You have a serviceable 4.0/4.5 FH, and it will take a major reworking of it to get much better. I'm not sure that would be the best use of your time.

I did notice that you stand way far back. I don't think you can get away with that on a hard court. Your partner hit several angled shots by you. If you were just behind the baseline, you would have a much better shot at getting them.
I think this is good advice. Tlm has a great FH and it will be hard to improve on it without a bunch of work, but with the type of shot he is getting from all the "bad" technique I think he has the skill to make changes. Its whether he wants to or sees the need to go through the pain.

His FH is pretty complicated IMHO in that there are factors that align to make it work. IMHO the grip, hitting off the back foot and the left arm drooping are all related and I don't know what is causing what (though I think the back foot is the main issue). Changing one of them will mess everything else up and he already has a good thing and is winning matches.

A good question is if he is loosing to better players, does that bother him, and if so, WHY is he loosing? If its the FH then a change is in order but if its something else well thats the area to focus on IMHO.
 

Power Player

Talk Tennis Guru
The gauntlet has been thrown! Shroud, it's your move.
I think it's actually your move. You have made a lot of comments here on a lot of people. Let's see what you got. If you don't want to be on film, why not reach out to a local TT member and play?
 

dimkin

Hall of Fame
I think this is good advice. Tlm has a great FH and it will be hard to improve on it without a bunch of work, but with the type of shot he is getting from all the "bad" technique I think he has the skill to make changes. Its whether he wants to or sees the need to go through the pain.

His FH is pretty complicated IMHO in that there are factors that align to make it work. IMHO the grip, hitting off the back foot and the left arm drooping are all related and I don't know what is causing what (though I think the back foot is the main issue). Changing one of them will mess everything else up and he already has a good thing and is winning matches.

A good question is if he is loosing to better players, does that bother him, and if so, WHY is he loosing? If its the FH then a change is in order but if its something else well thats the area to focus on IMHO.
I think tlm is doing well trying to improve his stroke.
His fh is solid, and a isn't easy to attack, BUT

(b) because it's so arm-based if one day tlm doesn't warm up properly could cause injury
(c) it's difficult stay in neutral fh cc-cc rallies, as the natural direction is dl and dm, that exposes
him negatively to geometry of most points against good opponents
(d) low balls ... and approach shots
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
I think this is good advice. Tlm has a great FH and it will be hard to improve on it without a bunch of work, but with the type of shot he is getting from all the "bad" technique I think he has the skill to make changes. Its whether he wants to or sees the need to go through the pain.

His FH is pretty complicated IMHO in that there are factors that align to make it work. IMHO the grip, hitting off the back foot and the left arm drooping are all related and I don't know what is causing what (though I think the back foot is the main issue). Changing one of them will mess everything else up and he already has a good thing and is winning matches.

A good question is if he is loosing to better players, does that bother him, and if so, WHY is he loosing? If its the FH then a change is in order but if its something else well thats the area to focus on IMHO.
Well Shroud I know that you mentioned before that if I could combine some of your forehand with my forehand I would really have something then which I think your right about that. But really I think by prepping earlier and trying to get the weight going forward more often and also get the left arm more involved would be a big improvement.

So maybe I can try to add one of those suggestions at a time and see what happens. On my video there are a couple I noticed were I actually got my weight into the shot and one of them by partner fouled his shot off so it shows there was more juice on that shot than most.

Unlike you my backhand is a lot bigger weakness than my forehand, I noticed your backhand is a good shot. So for right now I will get better improvement by developing the backhand more.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
Is your friend a good volleyer? Get him to play you from the net. Usual controlled hitting - this will help massively because you will have less time. Do this for 30 mins or so then both play from the baseline, you will be amazed how much more time you have
Actually I have a couple of guys that I hit with that like to hit volleys so I could try that in practice.
 

dimkin

Hall of Fame
tlm - on a tangential: check out this guy's forehand:


his turns and loads a lot better, but his arm motion is similar to yours.
EXCEPT - look how loose he is, and how much WHIP he gets.
I think if you relaxed you could have a similar stroke
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
tlm - on a tangential: check out this guy's forehand:


his turns and loads a lot better, but his arm motion is similar to yours.
EXCEPT - look how loose he is, and how much WHIP he gets.
I think if you relaxed you could have a similar stroke
I do like his nice and relaxed swing, I see what you are referring to.
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
There are times I have made sure to get farther away from the ball sideways and I noticed that I hit the ball better. I have a tendency to get to close to the ball.
This was the comment I was going to make as its something I'm working on right now. More spacing between the ball and my body so it forces arm extension through the ball and gives way more pace.

I also note a very high launch angle on your shots which is robbing some pace as well. Could it be racket and string setup? I notice i get much better launch when i pair NG with a stiff poly like 4G inthe crosses.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
This was the comment I was going to make as its something I'm working on right now. More spacing between the ball and my body so it forces arm extension through the ball and gives way more pace.

I also note a very high launch angle on your shots which is robbing some pace as well. Could it be racket and string setup? I notice i get much better launch when i pair NG with a stiff poly like 4G inthe crosses.
Your right more spacing lets you hit with more arm extension which gives more pace. When just hitting around like in this video I can take the same swing on 2 different shots but if one has more spacing the shot is always better. Now I just have to work on getting that right set up spot ingrained.

As far as string set up goes that is not the problem I use very stiff and dead set ups to help lower trajectory. I am using head gravity which is a full poly set up at 70 lbs.
 

dimkin

Hall of Fame
Your right more spacing lets you hit with more arm extension which gives more pace. When just hitting around like in this video I can take the same swing on 2 different shots but if one has more spacing the shot is always better. Now I just have to work on getting that right set up spot ingrained.

As far as string set up goes that is not the problem I use very stiff and dead set ups to help lower trajectory. I am using head gravity which is a full poly set up at 70 lbs.
geezus ... and no arm pain? how long have you been using that setup?
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
geezus ... and no arm pain? how long have you been using that setup?
For a few months now, I was using Kevlar mains at 60 lbs. with poly x's at 65 lbs. So I am used to stiff string set ups, I change my strings often though. I do not like playing with old poly, it feels and plays like crap to me. Even though I Know the new string set up is tighter it still seems better feeling than after hitting it steady for a week or so.
 
Top