how do I get the toss into the field with the toss parallel to the baseline?

[dominikk1985]

I saw a video which suggested that the pro players toss with the arm going up parallel to the baseline. I always had the racket arm going forward pointing to the net. I was not really able to hit a good flat serve or kicker but I hit a nasty slice/kicker (80% slice and maybe 20% topspin) which was hard and had a lot of action.

Now that I tried the toss arm going up parallel to the baseline it worked very well for a pure kick serve and also my flat serve was booming. the arm to the side fence closes the shoulders more than the toss arm to the net which I believe adds more power. also the ball will be directly over the head.

however when the arm is be moved up exactly in line with the baseline the ball also will be over the baseline because the arm goes vertical over the BL.

how do I have that arm to the side toss and still get the toss a couple inches into the field? I would like to get my hard slider back.

 

[mbm0912]

I like this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzR_NaTvPo4

 

[5263]

I like this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzR_NaTvPo4

he says some funny things, but gets to it at 4:20 or so and at 6:00 you can see the best angle of a good example with Tommy Haas. It shows how far the ball comes back on the rock back, then comes out from there towards the court. I teach to place it just behind the knee on the inner thigh right before starting the wt shift forward for the toss.

Not sure why he keeps harping on parallel to the BL ? Later in the vid he comments and proves what I'm saying here, on how the arm does not go up and down parallel tot he BL. Yes they are close but no cigar imo. I think a better ref is that front foot angle or alignment. The arm comes to a position that pretty closely mirrors where that front foot is pointed in most cases.

 

[LeeD]

J toss.
Starts with arm parallel to baseline, ends with arm pointing at service line/sideline intersect.

 

[5263]

Seems he misses how the arm runs out of steam as it moves forward to near the BL ref and also slightly beyond the release, but starts to arc back a bit after the release as the server starts his archers bow....moving hips forward of hands and feet like a bow that is loaded by a draw.

Go to this vid-- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXkAK_iFBuQand you can see how the toss starts behind the knee, then rises on a diagonal to a peak well into the court.

 

[psv255]

Charliefedererer had a great Sampras graphic from above, I think it's this one:

What gets the toss out into the court is the initial ball position. If you start the ball farther back (around center of body, behind left leg for righty, right leg for lefty) and try to throw parallel to baseline, the arm will move forward by itself, and the ball will get a good forward component.

 

[5263]

What gets the toss out into the court is the initial ball position. If you start the ball farther back (around center of body, behind left leg for righty,

yes, as you can see his arm starts 15-20 degrees from parallel .. behind the BL and moves forward to 15 or so in front of the BL.

 

[sureshs]

Here is a guy with the traditional out-in-front toss - nothing "J'" about him:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCcAB16tStA

 

[5263]

Here is a guy with the traditional out-in-front toss - nothing "J'" about him:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCcAB16tStA

I think he does it all extremely out front but still has a small back to forward move.

 

[Fintft]

yes, as you can see his arm starts 15-20 degrees from parallel .. behind the BL and moves forward to 15 or so in front of the BL.

Yes and there have been some videos posted recently on the subject.

 

[dominikk1985]

so it is only roughly parallel and still a little bit of forward movement involved?

seems like they go a little more back than parallel so that they can have some forward move of the arm without opening the front shoulder so much.

 

[winstonlim8]

I think Almagro doesn't have a J toss or a parallel to the baseline toss and it doesn't seem to have hurt his serve any.

After years of suffering with an inconsistent toss, I decided to emulate Almagro and just think of "putting" the ball straight up at 12 o'clock or 12.30 for my topspin, flat and slice serves while concentrating on whether to hit the ball at 7 o'clock, dead centre or 3 o'clock.

 

[5263]

so it is only roughly parallel and still a little bit of forward movement involved?

seems like they go a little more back than parallel so that they can have some forward move of the arm without opening the front shoulder so much.

yes to the first comment and imo, they turn the shoulders away from the court slightly during the toss.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

The tossing arm can start nearly parallel or absolutely parallel to the baseline, if desired. However, the movement upward is not vertical. The tossing arm moves upward and forward somewhat to get the toss to move into the court. No great mystery here.

I think Almagro doesn't have a J toss or a parallel to the baseline toss and it doesn't seem to have hurt his serve any...

Not very many of the other current pros employ a J toss either. Andy Murray is one of the few. Many in these forums are confused about what a J toss really is. Here is a good example of it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CkRHH2TRVAU&t=54s

 

[Raul_SJ]

The tossing arm can start nearly parallel or absolutely parallel to the baseline, if desired.

Is this also an acceptable way to toss? Do any pros use this method?

http://tennis.about.com/od/serve/a/tacklingtoss.htm

The solution is to use a tossing motion that may seem somewhat awkward at first, where you start the ball just in front of the leading edge of your right leg (for a right-hander). Instead of swinging the ball out, then up, in a circular path, slant the ball upward and forward on a straight line toward your intended point of contact for the serve. It sometimes helps to imagine that you're guiding the ball up through a pipe that goes to your point of contact. Your arm will look and feel mostly straight during your toss, but you'll naturally bend your elbow slightly in the early part of the tossing motion in order to move the ball in a straight line.

With this straight-line tossing motion, you can release the ball with your tossing arm extended as far upward as you wish, and the ball will not drift behind you. You don't have to worry about exact timing, because with the ball moving on a straight line, it will always be moving in the same direction no matter when you release it.
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[fuzz nation]

I avoid the idea of the tossing arm being roughly parallel with the baseline because my body alignment with my target changes significantly from one side to the other. This change in orientation is even more magnified when playing doubles where I stand out near the singles sideline to serve. My set position relative to the baseline probably rotates at least 30 or 40 degrees in a doubles setting.

This thought may rob you of an alignment aid, but it may also let you toss with a little less restriction if you're not trying to conform to the baseline while doing it. Just be careful not to ignore the baseline so much that you start chronically foot-faulting.:shock:

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

^ (@fuzz nation) While I can serve with the tossing arm (nearly) parallel to the baseline, I normally lift the tossing arm at some intermediate angle to the baseline -- somewhere between 30 degrees to 45 degrees forward of the baseline direction. The angle will be dictated, in part, by my position along the baseline (and which court I am serving to).

^^ (@Raul_SJ) While I would agree with much of Jeff Cooper's other tennis articles, I am not really following this one. I do not buy the premise that we want a toss that is straight up. The ball toss should have some measure of of arc (parabolic curve). This can readily be seen with the high toss of Pete Sampras. The lower toss of RF seems to an even wider arc that the Sampras toss.

 

[LeeD]

Start of toss with body well sideways, almost back to target.
When ball is up, you can rotate a little towards more facing forwards, to hit the ball.