How do you feel about the new fee in Post season Playoff?

[Johnph]

I just received an email from the Norcal League official about 40 and over Adult teams in 2014 and it mentioned that teams in District or Sectional championship have to pay to play. I was going to renew my membership to play more League matches but feel that the USTA is starting to milk our money. How do you guys feels about this? So if you go to Sectional, you have to pay $300?

Post Season Fees – While player registration fees will not be increasing, beginning in 2014, teams which qualify and wish to participate in the District and Sectional Championship events will be required to pay a championship team fee for that event weekend. For 2014, the fee will be $150 per team.

 

[damazing]

I think there were already fees for this in my section. For some reason I think that the local district would pick up the fee but I'm not sure if that is the case.

 

[schmke]

I believe in the PNW we've had a fee for even local playoffs, but certainly for Sectionals.

 

[ronray43]

Interesting . . . for Intermountain CO, Districts have always been free; same at Intermountain Sectionals . . . so far, we haven't heard this will be changed for 2014 . . . "USTA, It's About the Money!"

 

[mikeler]

Our 40 and over team had to pay an extra fee at Sectionals. USTA Florida covered our fees for Nationals.

 

[JLyon]

Last check Texas just padi for local league and then $0 for District and Sectionals.
Southern: $$$$ Local, District, and Sectionals == $15 a match or so, pathetic and greedy for sure.

 

[danspobox]

Say No To Usta Post-season Fees

Norcal USTA league captains were informed yesterday, that a $150 Fee will now be required in order to participate in post-season championship events such as Districts and Sectionals starting with the 2014 40+ Leagues. I used to see Districts as a reward to a successful local league play that most certainly involved sacrifices and time on the practice courts, so you may say when I went to districts as a player or captain I felt I earned it, I am turned off by this new proposed change, how do you feel about it?

 

[kylebarendrick]

Maybe this will help discourage the sandbaggers

 

[jussumman]

Maybe this will help discourage the sandbaggers

Sandbagging is players who enter lower rated leagues than their actual rating so they can destroy or win more matches and feel happier about themselves?

What do you call it when someone who is lower rated enters higher rated leagues?

 

[dode]

From my experience, those are per team, not per person. Seriously we are talking about $10 to $20 per person.

John

 

[anubis]

And it assumes you make it to championships. I've been playing for two years and have been on a total of 7 teams. Only one of them made it to Districts.

I have friends who play in a different county, where there's 10 men's teams in each NTRP level. The chances of going to championships is pretty slim.

 

[hammer]

From my experience, those are per team, not per person. Seriously we are talking about $10 to $20 per person.

John

Yeah, it's per team. But many of these post-season tournaments are out of town for me, so I normally stay there for the entire weekend. So I'm already paying a few hundred dollars for the hotel. And then I'm eating out as well, so that's another couple hundred. I've spent around $400-500 per weekend to play in districts and sectionals, so paying a fee on top of all that is something I do not welcome.

And as a captain, now I have the added task of collecting the added fees from my players. And how am I going to split it? Should I split it among the entire roster? Do I just have the people who play it pay? How about if I have a couple of guys who only played one match that weekend? Do I have them pay less?

 

[gameboy]

Nothing, since it won't affect me.... Sad panda is sad.

 

[schmke]

Yeah, it's per team. But many of these post-season tournaments are out of town for me, so I normally stay there for the entire weekend. So I'm already paying a few hundred dollars for the hotel. And then I'm eating out as well, so that's another couple hundred. I've spent around $400-500 per weekend to play in districts and sectionals, so paying a fee on top of all that is something I do not welcome.

And as a captain, now I have the added task of collecting the added fees from my players. And how am I going to split it? Should I split it among the entire roster? Do I just have the people who play it pay? How about if I have a couple of guys who only played one match that weekend? Do I have them pay less?

I don't see how this is really different from simply traveling to Districts. Like you say, to travel there is the travel, hotel, meals that each player is responsible for regardless of if or how many matches they play. The guys that play every match aren't chipping in to pay some of these costs for the guy that only plays one match are they?

Any situation where there are costs to attend, unless you say up front that everyone will get equal playing time, there will be some inequality. This makes it important to determine and communicate up front the goals for the team and what each player should expect for playing time. They can then decide if they want to incur the costs to make the trip. This team fee can simply be one of the costs and you split it amongst all those that attend and are available to play.

An alternative is to have each player pay their respective portion of the fee based on how many matches they played and do this after the event. This way, if a player travels but doesn't play, he at least doesn't get the double whammy of travel costs plus a portion of the team fee.

 

[NLBwell]

Yeah, it's per team. But many of these post-season tournaments are out of town for me, so I normally stay there for the entire weekend. So I'm already paying a few hundred dollars for the hotel. And then I'm eating out as well, so that's another couple hundred. I've spent around $400-500 per weekend to play in districts and sectionals, so paying a fee on top of all that is something I do not welcome.

And as a captain, now I have the added task of collecting the added fees from my players. And how am I going to split it? Should I split it among the entire roster? Do I just have the people who play it pay? How about if I have a couple of guys who only played one match that weekend? Do I have them pay less?

I'm agreeing with this post. It's not so much about an extra $15 for a player, but the hassle and time it imposes for the measly amount of money the USTA will receive. Also, playing well and winning and advancing in the playoffs should be rewarded, not punished.
The USTA could probably make just as much money charging one penny more for everyone who signs up.

 

[danspobox]

you would think doubling the number of leagues this year would have been more than enough for USTA, at the end it is all about more profits it seems.
Basically now districts is like the grand prix tourneys, you pay to play and sometimes you even win it all without playing at all.
how rewarding will that be? and I wonder how many teams will go for it

 

[stever]

The 40+ mixed national fee in Maui is $400. My local USTA office in Phoenix paid $250 of it which was nice.

 

[max8176]

I feel that this is a bit discriminatory. So rich private club teams will have no problem of attending while public park teams have to scramble for addition funding to play at Districts and Sectionals? I thought USTA's goal is for all American whether they are rich or poor to be able to participate in tennis.

 

[Orange]

Interesting . . . for Intermountain CO, Districts have always been free; same at Intermountain Sectionals . . . so far, we haven't heard this will be changed for 2014 . . . "USTA, It's About the Money!"

From an economics standpoint, there is no such thing as a free lunch. A player in your district who advances to Districts might have no additional out-of-pocket costs, but somebody is paying the costs of holding Districts. I expect that other fees, perhaps paid by all participants, are covering the costs.

Each player going to State has to pay a fee when we signed up for the State tournament. I think it was $20 or $25. It was less than the cost of a non-league tournament, and we had more guaranteed games, so I felt it was well worth the cost.

 

[catfish]

There are costs associated with running the tournament. The tournament has to cover the cost of courts, balls, officials, staff, etc. The USTA has operating expenses, just like any other organization.

 

[Say Chi Sin Lo]

Ok... so USTA is trying to charge us more money (almost to the point of penalization for succeeding).

Are they doing more for us?

 

[schmke]

Ok... so USTA is trying to charge us more money (almost to the point of penalization for succeeding).

Are they doing more for us?

As someone else posted, post-season play does cost the USTA money to put the event on. There are courts that have to be paid for (playoffs typically aren't at public courts now are they?), various other logistics of putting an event on, and while many USTA folks may volunteer, not everyone is and I don't think you'd suggest everyone just show up to organize and run your playoffs on a weekend for free.

So there is a cost, and why shouldn't the people who are actually playing and using the courts and benefiting from all the efforts chip in to pay for what they are getting? You aren't suggesting that they increase everyone's league fees a little just so the players that are actually playing get to do so for free are you?

 

[Orange]

As someone else posted, post-season play does cost the USTA money to put the event on. There are courts that have to be paid for (playoffs typically aren't at public courts now are they?), various other logistics of putting an event on, and while many USTA folks may volunteer, not everyone is and I don't think you'd suggest everyone just show up to organize and run your playoffs on a weekend for free.

So there is a cost, and why shouldn't the people who are actually playing and using the courts and benefiting from all the efforts chip in to pay for what they are getting? You aren't suggesting that they increase everyone's league fees a little just so the players that are actually playing get to do so for free are you?

In my location, State matches held at a combination of public and private courts. This year I had one match at a college, two at high school courts, and one at a private club. I don't know what the costs are for each of these, but I know that there is a charge for tournaments held at public parks.

 

[catfish]

As someone else posted, post-season play does cost the USTA money to put the event on. There are courts that have to be paid for (playoffs typically aren't at public courts now are they?), various other logistics of putting an event on, and while many USTA folks may volunteer, not everyone is and I don't think you'd suggest everyone just show up to organize and run your playoffs on a weekend for free.

So there is a cost, and why shouldn't the people who are actually playing and using the courts and benefiting from all the efforts chip in to pay for what they are getting? You aren't suggesting that they increase everyone's league fees a little just so the players that are actually playing get to do so for free are you?

You can try to talk reason with people, but it doesn't work. For some reason there is a huge contingent of USTA league players who think everything is supposed to be free. The USTA is a magical land where the staff & coordinators work for free, clubs and parks don't charge for courts, officials work all weekend for free, the hotels don't charge the staff and officials for their rooms, the tournament desk, tents, chairs, food and laptops didn't cost anything......... You get the idea. People look at the surface, don't know details, but feel free to make judgements.

 

[SunshineJS]

You can try to talk reason with people, but it doesn't work. For some reason there is a huge contingent of USTA league players who think everything is supposed to be free. The USTA is a magical land where the staff & coordinators work for free, clubs and parks don't charge for courts, officials work all weekend for free, the hotels don't charge the staff and officials for their rooms, the tournament desk, tents, chairs, food and laptops didn't cost anything......... You get the idea. People look at the surface, don't know details, but feel free to make judgements.

Great to see some people actually have a clue of cost and can look at the bigger picture!

Here's a glimpse of only one location for a very small district playoff event:
One site using 12 courts over three days, for a total of 17.5 hours...
Club charges $5/hr per court
12 x 5 x 17.5 = $1,050
*if inclement weather arises and the tourney needs to move indoors these court costs easily triple

Mind you that this again is only one site. None of our playoffs in our districts use only one site so multiply that out by many more (up to 10-12 sites for the larger leagues)
Add in the cost of officials (hourly charge + mileage +
food expense)
tournament desk staff (same as above)
balls (~$50 per case, easily go through 5 cases per site per playoff)
insurance
awards
etc.
etc.

Then step outside the league tennis bubble and think how the league fees also support all of the grant money to build or resurface courts for parks & rec and schools, for scholarships given to underprivileged children, and much more.

It's funny when a player asks "what crappy award are we getting this year?" and then the same person complains about a $1 increase in a league fee.

Sorry for the short rant... off my soapbox now

 

[catfish]

Great to see some people actually have a clue of cost and can look at the bigger picture!

Here's a glimpse of only one location for a very small district playoff event:
One site using 12 courts over three days, for a total of 17.5 hours...
Club charges $5/hr per court
12 x 5 x 17.5 = $1,050
*if inclement weather arises and the tourney needs to move indoors these court costs easily triple

Mind you that this again is only one site. None of our playoffs in our districts use only one site so multiply that out by many more (up to 10-12 sites for the larger leagues)
Add in the cost of officials (hourly charge + mileage +
food expense)
tournament desk staff (same as above)
balls (~$50 per case, easily go through 5 cases per site per playoff)
insurance
awards
etc.
etc.

Then step outside the league tennis bubble and think how the league fees also support all of the grant money to build or resurface courts for parks & rec and schools, for scholarships given to underprivileged children, and much more.

It's funny when a player asks "what crappy award are we getting this year?" and then the same person complains about a $1 increase in a league fee.

Sorry for the short rant... off my soapbox now

Like you, I also get very tired of the complaining about league costs. Do these complainers not understand that there are operating expenses involved in running leagues and tournaments?

I could go on a rant here, but I won’t. The complainers don’t want to listen to reason. It’s a lot more fun to talk about how expensive leagues are without really putting thought into what costs could be involved.

Probably there are a lot of league players out there that don’t care too much about costs anyway. They don’t speak up though because it wouldn’t be any fun to have a conversation like this: “Boy, our league fees are reasonable. They’ve only increased $3 or $4 in the last 10 years while everything else has gone way up.”