How good will Alcaraz be on grass compared to Nadal/Federer?

[McGradey]

I will hold my judgment on Carlos until after this Wimbledon. I’m still not convinced he’s a grass player, but I like to give him the benefit of the doubt.

It’s difficult to fathom how a player wins back to back grass tournaments incl Wimbledon, and yet they are still not a grass player, how do you figure that? Is it because he hits with a lot of topspin and is good on clay also? Who are the grass players now if not Carlos?

 

[Arak]

It’s difficult to fathom how a player wins back to back grass tournaments incl Wimbledon, and yet they are still not a grass player, how do you figure that? Is it because he hits with a lot of topspin and is good on clay also? Who are the grass players now if not Carlos?

He doesn’t have to win Wimbledon to convince me. I just want to see him play again. As for who the other grass players are, I would have said Djokovic if he wasn’t recovering. Rune moves well too. I don’t think there are true grass specialists at the moment.

 

[Arak]

Convinced about Sinner?

Sinner isn’t a typical grass players but he is a contender for sure. If you ask me, neither has a typical grass game, but no one in the top 10 has it. I wouldn’t be surprised if someone like T Paul or Mannarino make a deep run.

 

[McGradey]

He doesn’t have to win Wimbledon to convince me. I just want to see him play again. As for who the other grass players are, I would have said Djokovic if he wasn’t recovering. Rune moves well too. I don’t think there are true grass specialists at the moment.

Two guys who lost to Carlos at Wimbledon. You’re right there aren’t any grass specialists these days though, maybe Berrettini, another Alcaraz 23 victim, might be one of the closer ones.

 

[Arak]

Two guys who lost to Carlos at Wimbledon. You’re right there aren’t any grass specialists these days though, maybe Berrettini, another Alcaraz 23 victim, might be one of the closer ones.

Berrettini is also coming back from injury, but certainly if healthy he would be a candidate. Unfortunately, the lack of a true grass specialist means that the usual favourites on other surfaces will be in the final, Carlos and Sinner.

 

[Deleted member 810491]

He doesn’t have to win Wimbledon to convince me. I just want to see him play again. As for who the other grass players are, I would have said Djokovic if he wasn’t recovering. Rune moves well too. I don’t think there are true grass specialists at the moment.

Alcaraz has the best volleys of anyone in the Top 10, and volleying is a specialty of grass tennis.
He's a more natural volleyer than Djokovic, that's for certain.
Plus the fact that Alcaraz is an aggressive baseliner, so he's suited to grass more than he is clay, and he was WAY WAY better at 2023 Wimbledon than at 2024 RG.

Sinner will always get no credit here, unfortunately, even after beating Djokovic at the AO. It’s always going to be “the other player was bad” and lucky Sinner and his chicken legs, blah blah blah…

That's just me talking, but overall this forum has hyped Sinner A LOT more than Alcaraz this year, and in the last months of last year too.
I've been hyping Alcaraz constantly since October 2023, while the rest of the forum abandoned him and hyped Sinner.
Djokovic took a lot away from Sinner's AO, when he said “I was, in a way, shocked with my level, you know, in a bad way. There was not much I was doing right in the first two sets. I guess this is one of the worst Grand Slam matches I've ever played. At least that I remember" and I've spoken about Medvedev playing 6 more hours than Sinner before the AO Final.
Overall though, Sinner's AO has been received huge praise on this forum, and many said he'd win Roland Garros.

Was making a point that it's equally ridiculous to group Rafa with Fed at Wimbledon, yes Rafa got him once but the h2h is 3-1 there and Fed has literally 4x the titles. One epic match can't change that

Nadal-Federer 2007 and 2008 Wimbledon Finals = the highest level of grass tennis ever seen in the 21st Century.
Remember, we're talking about LEVEL, not number of titles.
Nadal created a higher degree of difficulty than any other player Federer faced, so together they represent the highest level.

 

[NeutralFan]

Sinner isn’t a typical grass players but he is a contender for sure. If you ask me, neither has a typical grass game, but no one in the top 10 has it. I wouldn’t be surprised if someone like T Paul or Mannarino make a deep run.

Djokovic didn't have a typical grass game and he won 7 slams there

 

[Humble Crumble]

Djokovic didn't have a typical grass game and he won 7 slams there

Sinner will always get no credit here, unfortunately, even after beating Djokovic at the AO. It’s always going to be “the other player was bad” and lucky Sinner and his chicken legs, blah blah blah…

 

[Arak]

Djokovic didn't have a typical grass game and he won 7 slams there

Djokovic has developed his game in the last 10 years.

 

[NeutralFan]

Djokovic has developed his game in the last 10 years.

Yes but not typical grass game. He played defensive lock down + his usual baseline game ( alongside his usual return + serve ) Djokovic became heavyweight everywhere not on just grass in last 10 years.

 

[Soul_Evisceration]

Nadal is not "high distinction" on grass, let alone off clay.

Alcaraz isn't winning another Wimbledon title. Djokovic, Sinner and future next gen will prevent him from doing that. He might even go the Nadal route of losing in the early rounds to players ranked outside the top 100.

Djokovic is done winning Majors at this point and Sinner has yet proven to win anything on Grass.

Alcaraz is not going to be a Federer on Grass but it would really surprise me that he would have a Nadal drought and lose to many players on Grass.

 

[Arak]

Yes but not typical grass game. He played defensive lock down + his usual baseline game ( alongside his usual return + serve ) Djokovic became heavyweight everywhere not on just grass in last 10 years.

No body has a typical grass game, since Federer. Maybe Dimitrov but he’s not good enough. Djokovic, Sinner and Alcaraz are still the most likely to reach a final, but of course Djokovic is injured so he’s out.

 

[NeutralFan]

No body has a typical grass game, since Federer. Maybe Dimitrov but he’s not good enough. Djokovic, Sinner and Alcaraz are still the most likely to reach a final, but of course Djokovic is injured so he’s out.

Look Djokovic is beneficiary of Modern grass court ( or change ) so is Fed in his initial years. As far as your claim that Djokovic improved in last 10 years, well it wasn't just his grass court sucess that came up in his last 10 years but grass court sucess came alongside his sucess everywhere. It's not as if he was dominating everywhere except grass before 2011 and all of a sudden found grass game.

 

[Arak]

Look Djokovic is beneficiary of Modern grass court ( or change ) so is Fed in his initial years. As far as your claim that Djokovic improved in last 10 years, well it wasn't just his grass court sucess that came up in his last 10 years but grass court sucess came alongside his sucess everywhere. It's not as if he was dominating everywhere except grass before 2011 and all of a sudden found grass game.

I don’t know what you’re arguing honestly. I never claimed Djokovic improved his game on grass, I said he improved his game, period. It helped him on all surfaces.

 

[ND-13]

Nadal is not "high distinction" on grass, let alone off clay.

Alcaraz isn't winning another Wimbledon title. Djokovic, Sinner and future next gen will prevent him from doing that. He might even go the Nadal route of losing in the early rounds to players ranked outside the top 100.

Cope

 

[ND-13]

I see anywhere from 7-10 Wimbledon

 

[RS]

But then Nadal-Murray H2H on grass can come into play as well. Nadal only lost 1 set combined in 3 meetings with Murray at Wimbledon

Peak Murray vs Peak Hewitt 10 matches at Wimbeldon?

 

[zagor]

Peak Murray vs Peak Hewitt 10 matches at Wimbeldon?

Slight edge to Hewitt, 6-4. Murray has bigger weapons/game but that 2nd serve is there to be attacked and I feel peak Hewitt had more dog in him.

 

[zagor]

I will hold my judgment on Carlos until after this Wimbledon. I’m still not convinced he’s a grass player, but I like to give him the benefit of the doubt.

He's a great shotmaker and a great athlete, won Queens and Wimbledon. I'd say he has proven himself to be a modern era grasscourt player.
The era of surface specialists is pretty much gone, true top guys are gonna be top contenders in every slam basically.
I'd say he has a couple of Wimbledon titles in him, we'll see. Of course maybe Novak will recover or Sinner prove himself to be better on grass going forward.

 

[RS]

Hewitt FTW

 

[Razer]

Alcaraz could cross Nadal's resume on Grass but he cannot touch Federer.

 

[zagor]

Hewitt FTW

@NatF likes this

 

[NatF]

@NatF likes this

In 2012 Murray lost the majority of the baseline points to Federer, in 2004 Hewitt won the majority of the baseline points.

What it tells us.

 

[zagor]

In 2012 Murray lost the majority of the baseline points to Federer, in 2004 Hewitt won the majority of the baseline points.

What it tells us.

 

[zagor]

In 2012 Murray lost the majority of the baseline points to Federer, in 2004 Hewitt won the majority of the baseline points.

What it tells us.

2012 Fed >>> 2004 Fed
Experience >>>> legs

Evolution of the game baby

 

[RS]

2012 Fed >>> 2004 Fed
Experience >>>> legs

Evolution of the game baby

 

[RS]

In 2012 Murray lost the majority of the baseline points to Federer, in 2004 Hewitt won the majority of the baseline points.

What it tells us.

That Hewitt is much better off the ground and would beat 2012 Federer.

 

[RS]

Slight edge to Hewitt, 6-4. Murray has bigger weapons/game but that 2nd serve is there to be attacked and I feel peak Hewitt had more dog in him.

I would assume you give Hewitt USO 6-4 maybe 7-3?

 

[TheGoldenEra1990’s]

I don’t know. he hasn’t shown anywhere close to a level of as those two yet on grass . Do you have any idea what 06-07 Nadal would do to 2023 grandpa Nole at Wimbledon? Well it wouldn’t go 5 sets let’s just say that.


Fed is a no brainer. Carlos isn’t even on his planet and never will be on grass IMO

This year Carlos will have to literally blitz through Wimbledon without dropping a set and drop a ton of bagels to make me think otherwise. Cause Nadal was taking close to peak Fed 5 sets in 07. Carlos wouldn’t win a set against that Fed. Hell he would be lucky just to win games LOL

 

[Rosstour]

Grouping Murray with Sampras at the USO

Was making a point that it's equally ridiculous to group Rafa with Fed at Wimbledon, yes Rafa got him once but the h2h is 3-1 there and Fed has literally 4x the titles. One epic match can't change that

 

[Nappa]

Djokovics volley skill is on par with Nadal and Alcaraz

Heck no

 

[NatF]

That Hewitt is much better off the ground and would beat 2012 Federer.

2012 Fed >>> 2004 Fed
Experience >>>> legs

Evolution of the game baby

One of these much is closer to the truth than the other

 

[RS]

One of these much is closer to the truth than the other

 

[RS]

You should thank me for that question NatF

 

[NatF]

You should thank me for that question NatF

I'm very grateful.

 

[zagor]

I would assume you give Hewitt USO 6-4 maybe 7-3?

6-4 probably. I'd give the edge to Murray at AO and FO.
I know it's a controversial take on TTW but I do think their peak levels are similar.

 

[zagor]

One of these much is closer to the truth than the other

 

[RS]

6-4 probably. I'd give the edge to Murray at AO and FO.
I know it's a controversial take on TTW but I do think their peak levels are similar.

Nadal RG 05 vs Djokovic RG 11 10 match series?

 

[a10best]

Alcaraz has the best volleys of anyone in the Top 10, and volleying is a specialty of grass tennis. YES the way tennis should be played
He's a more natural volleyer than Djokovic, that's for certain.
Plus the fact that Alcaraz is an aggressive baseliner, so he's suited to grass more than he is clay, and he was WAY WAY better at 2023 Wimbledon than at 2024 RG. -


That's just me talking, but overall this forum has hyped Sinner A LOT more than Alcaraz this year, and in the last months of last year too.
I've been hyping Alcaraz constantly since October 2023, while the rest of the forum abandoned him and hyped Sinner.
Djokovic took a lot away from Sinner's AO, when he said “I was, in a way, shocked with my level, you know, in a bad way. There was not much I was doing right in the first two sets. I guess this is one of the worst Grand Slam matches I've ever played. At least that I remember" and I've spoken about Medvedev playing 6 more hours than Sinner before the AO Final.
Overall though, Sinner's AO has been received huge praise on this forum, and many said he'd win Roland Garros.


Nadal-Federer 2007 and 2008 Wimbledon Finals = the highest level of grass tennis ever seen in the 21st Century. SPOT ON and fans agree the best rivalry
Remember, we're talking about LEVEL, not number of titles.
Nadal created a higher degree of difficulty than any other player Federer faced, so together they represent the highest level.

Djokovic has adjusted his grass game since 2014 and just wins when he shouldn't or by the slightest margin. Last year he lost when he shouldn't have.
Being objective, is Djokovic going to hit 2 routine consecutive bh's into the net in a tiebreak again?

I'm still on team Sinner but may take a transfer to Alcaraz's if his body can hold up. Wimbledon, Olympics & then hard courts season in the U.S. heat. Yikes. This man will need a break.

 

[RS]

6-4 probably. I'd give the edge to Murray at AO and FO.
I know it's a controversial take on TTW but I do think their peak levels are similar.

I would agree the gap isn't as big as advertised. Because Murray is a better player I would just go with him most the time though.

 

[zagor]

Nadal RG 05 vs Djokovic RG 11 10 match series?

That's a good one actually. The same way I think say peak Fed wouldn't allow Murray/Stan to win slams on his watch, peak Novak might have done better against raw Nadal of 2005/2006 simply because of his GOAT 2HBH.
I think Novak might sneak out a win or two, so 9-1 or 8-2 to Nadal.

I would agree the gap isn't as big as advertised. Because Murray is a better player I would just go with him most the time though.

Sure, that's fine. I think Murray's consistency was certainly great but I've found the level of play he brought in big matches to be often lacking.

 

[Incognito]

I will hold my judgment on Carlos until after this Wimbledon. I’m still not convinced he’s a grass player, but I like to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Where you convinced djoko was a grass player when you saw him first time.

Alcaraz like Murray or Fed or even Nadal move on grass like classic grasscourters.

Try sliding on grass with old FILA shoes from the late 70s lol.

 

[ChaelAZ]

Would LOVE to see him take Wimby this year. Alcz game transfers so well to all surfaces, he will always be a contender.

 

[BeatlesFan]

Why is the OP lumping together Fed and Nadal when Roger won 8 Wimbledon trophies and Nadal two? Carlos has a reasonably good chance of matching Rafa's # of Wimbledon titles in three weeks. He's never catching Roger's numbers. At least couple Fed with Pete or Djokovic.