How many clay court specialists....??

MeatTornado

Legend
He'll always be a clay court specialist. He just works on a different scale than most.

A typical clay court specialist won't literally lose 1st round at every hard or grass tourny. But they also won't win the French Open either. Nadal's results are as proportional as any other clay court specialist.
 

Knightrider

Hall of Fame
He'll always be a clay court specialist. He just works on a different scale than most.

A typical clay court specialist won't literally lose 1st round at every hard or grass tourny. But they also won't win the French Open either. Nadal's results are as proportional as any other clay court specialist.
You mean King of Clay and Prince of all other surfraces?
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
He'll always be a clay court specialist. He just works on a different scale than most.

A typical clay court specialist won't literally lose 1st round at every hard or grass tourny. But they also won't win the French Open either. Nadal's results are as proportional as any other clay court specialist.
disagree. a specialist means thats the only thing he excels at. he is clay court cheat code and all court specialist.....
 

Pantera

Banned
He'll always be a clay court specialist. He just works on a different scale than most.

A typical clay court specialist won't literally lose 1st round at every hard or grass tourny. But they also won't win the French Open either. Nadal's results are as proportional as any other clay court specialist.
On that logic Federer merely an indoor specialist
 

Pantera

Banned
it's trash. a round robin even that is best of 3. lmao.

only reason he has 0 is he doesn't care that much and it's always been on indoor hard. rotate surfaces and venues and he would win....
Rafa has withdrawn half the time and will again this year if he wins USO. Its a meaningless event...u can lose yet win lol.
 

tonylg

Semi-Pro
You have to be a clay court specialist to win any slam these days.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
 

Sport

Legend
This should not be a discussion.

With this message I hope to end the discussion and please both Nadal fans and Federer fans.

Nadal is BOTH a clay court specialist (in the sense that clay is by far his most succesful surface) and an all-around player (in the sense that he has been succesful on all surfaces).

To deny that Nadal is a clay specialist is crazy. He has won 12 RG compared with "only" 2 WB titles or 4 US Open titles.

But it is equally crazy to deny that Nadal is an all-around player, as he has won 4 US Open titles (if Medvedev doesn't stop him). His 4th USO title will put him as the 4th player with most US Open titles of the Open Era, only behind Sampras, Federer and Connors. Nadal is the best US Open player of the 2010s decade with 4 titles (unless Medvedev stops him). Not to mention that Nadal has won at least 2 Slams on each surface (hard, grass and clay).

In sum, Nadal is both a clay court specialist and an all-around player.
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
dimtrov has won WTF and never won a slam or made a slam final. Zverev won it in 2018 and never made it to a slam semi. Davydenko won it and never won a slam.

tell me if any of those guys have an olympic gold medal in their trophy case....


tell me fed would have retired before the final of a slam like he did the final of WTF against djoker......


slams>olympic gold>Masters 1000s, WTF.
 

Pantera

Banned
This should not be a discussion.

With this message I hope to please both Nadal fans and Federer fans.

Nadal is BOTH a clay court specialist (in the sense that clay is by far his most succesful surface) and an all-around player (in the sense that he has been succesful on all surfaces).

To deny that Nadal is a clay specialist is crazy. He has won 12 RG compared with "only" 2 WB titles or 4 US Open titles.

But it is equally crazy to deny that Nadam is an all-around player, as he has won 4 US Open titles (if Medvedev doesn't stop him). His 4th USO title will put him as the 4th player with most US Open titles of the Open Era, only behind Sampras, Federer and Connors. Nadal is the best US Open player of the 2010s decade with 4 titles (unless Medvedev stops him). Not to mention that Nadal has won at least 2 Slams on each surface (hard, grass and clay).o he would

In sin, Nadal is both a clay court specialist and an all-around player.
Djokovic is a hard court specialist but clearly an all round great. Just like Nadal as u say
 

Pantera

Banned
dimtrov has won WTF and never won a slam or made a slam final. Zverev won it in 2018 and never made it to a slam semi. Davydenko won it and never won a slam.

tell me if any of those guys have an olympic gold medal in their trophy case....


tell me fed would have retired before the final of a slam like he did the final of WTF against djoker......


slams>olympic gold>Masters 1000s, WTF.
Every player says Masters 1000 bigger that WTF...reason all say is that u have to win every match and so many players are present. The round robin format is exhibition stuff
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
This should not be a discussion.

With this message I hope to end the discussion and please both Nadal fans and Federer fans.

Nadal is BOTH a clay court specialist (in the sense that clay is by far his most succesful surface) and an all-around player (in the sense that he has been succesful on all surfaces).

To deny that Nadal is a clay specialist is crazy. He has won 12 RG compared with "only" 2 WB titles or 4 US Open titles.

But it is equally crazy to deny that Nadam is an all-around player, as he has won 4 US Open titles (if Medvedev doesn't stop him). His 4th USO title will put him as the 4th player with most US Open titles of the Open Era, only behind Sampras, Federer and Connors. Nadal is the best US Open player of the 2010s decade with 4 titles (unless Medvedev stops him). Not to mention that Nadal has won at least 2 Slams on each surface (hard, grass and clay).

In sum, Nadal is both a clay court specialist and an all-around player.
like i said he is great on all surfaces. he is cheat code on clay.
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
Every player says Masters 1000 bigger that WTF...reason all say is that u have to win every match and so many players are present. The round robin format is exhibition stuff
the fact zverev and dimitrov have both won wtf tells you all you need to know about it compared to slams or olympic gold.
 

Sport

Legend
RG titles: 12
SW titles: 2
USO titles: 3
AO titles: 1
WTF titles: 0
4 USO titles on Sunday, which would make him the fourth player with more USO titles in the history of the Open Era, only behind Sampras, Federer and Connors. Nadal is also the best US Open player of the 2010s decade with 4 titles.

ATP finals are played on indoor hard courts. Indoor is a condition, not a surface. You can also play indoor clay or indoor grass.
 

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
end of year exhibition.

notice he didn't put olympics which is much more prestigious than the WTF. once every four years and way more players than WTF.

rafa has olympic singles gold on HARD court. fed and djoker do not.
Touched a sore spot did I? I just posted legitimate facts of what Nadal has won. I didn't include a lot of things, just yearly events.

It's so cute though how you guys get so defensive about Nadal not having won a WTF! Adorable.
 

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
4 USO titles on Sunday, which would make him the fourth player with more USO titles in the history of the Open Era, only behind Sampras, Federer and Connors. Nadal is also the best US Open player of the 2010s decade with 4 titles.

ATP finals are played on indoor hard courts. Indoor is a condition, not a surface. You can also play indoor clay or indoor grass.
Ok? I 'literally' just posted some stats of what Nadal has won.
 

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
Oh the corporate exhibition event...i never bother watching it.
end of year exhibition.

notice he didn't put olympics which is much more prestigious than the WTF. once every four years and way more players than WTF.

rafa has olympic singles gold on HARD court. fed and djoker do not.
The WTF is an exhibition event? I must have missed the memo? I thought they counted towards tour wins, counts for H2H and is a major tournament that players love to win? Didn't realize it was like the Hopman Cup or Boodles tournament!

Silly me. :rolleyes:
 

Sport

Legend
IMO category of tennis tournaments:

Grand Slams: tier A
ATP finals/Olympics: tier B
Masters 1000: tier C
ATP 500: tier D
ATP 250: tier E
 

oldmanfan

Hall of Fame
When clay-court specialist dubbed 'King of Clay' meets non-clay courts that are slowed closer to clay :unsure:.... :whistle:
 

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
Yeah, it makes no sense to just call a tournament an exho just because your player hasn't won it. The same goes for Fed fans about the Olympics.
I'm a Fed fan and the Olympics are definitely not an exho. Djokovic's tears in his loss to DelPo at Rio showed that. Monica Puig winning gold showed how big it is. Winning Olympic Gold is harder and more prestigious than the WTF which is true but having not won an Olympic Gold isn't as bad as not having won the WTF since that's held yearly while the Olympics are very 4 years.
 
Yeah the "king of clay" thing is absurd no matter what happens now, based on pure consistency as well as his slams off clay. If he wins on Sunday he'd have as many slams off clay as Mcenroe
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
When clay-court specialist dubbed 'King of Clay' meets non-clay courts that are slowed closer to clay :unsure:.... :whistle:
i got some bad news for you. berretini wouldn't make the semis of anything resembling clay. nor would anderson who was in the finals of wimby last year. anderson, howerver did make the finals of USO and Wimbledon.....
 

Third Serve

Hall of Fame
Thats the point...only 8 players play and u can lose yet still win. Its that part that ruins it.
Yeah, but you're also discounting the tournaments in which the player won it without losing any matches... which Fed did five times, Djokovic three times, and Nadal still zero.

And what does that say about Nadal since he's never won it? Surely an exho would be easy enough for him?
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
Thats the point...only 8 players play and u can lose yet still win. Its that part that ruins it.
Yes you can lose multiple matches and still win the "tournament". Thats not any kind of real tournament that allows 8 people only in and you can lose matches and still win...
 

Third Serve

Hall of Fame
I'm a Fed fan and the Olympics are definitely not an exho. Djokovic's tears in his loss to DelPo at Rio showed that. Monica Puig winning gold showed how big it is. Winning Olympic Gold is harder and more prestigious than the WTF which is true but having not won an Olympic Gold isn't as bad as not having won the WTF since that's held yearly while the Olympics are very 4 years.
I mean, I wasn't talking about all Fed fans, but I have seen a few who place Olympics below Masters 1000 level.
 

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
I mean, I wasn't talking about all Fed fans, but I have seen a few who place Olympics below Masters 1000 level.
That's crazy talk definitely. You go down in history as an Olympic gold medalist. Nobody outside of tennis gives a crap if you won the Paris Masters once
 

Pantera

Banned
I mean, I wasn't talking about all Fed fans, but I have seen a few who place Olympics below Masters 1000 level.
Not the players...certainly not this generation. Its a massive deal now. Didnt used to be in 90s but now it is. And there is a downside as more important olympics get then more likely Majors end up best of 3 sets as well
 

DSH

Hall of Fame
WTF is a hole in his career, indeed.
Is not a exhibition, like some dorks believe it.
But, I repeat, is not as big as the Grand Slam tournaments are.
And never will be, as much ignorant people want to believe.
:D
 
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Rafa24

Hall of Fame
That's crazy talk definitely. You go down in history as an Olympic gold medalist. Nobody outside of tennis gives a crap if you won the Paris Masters once
even delpo said his olympic bronze meant more to him than his USO slam. tsitsipas said he'd rather win olympic gold than a slam. Djoker cried after losing his chance for a medal.....
 

Pantera

Banned
even delpo said his olympic bronze meant more to him than his USO slam. tsitsipas said he'd rather win olympic gold than a slam. Djoker cried after losing his chance for a medal.....
If i were a player id want Olympic Gold for sure...and Djokovic has said its his priority now.
 
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