How many clay court specialists....??

Eren

Professional
Fed is better from age 35-37 than 30-35. no?
Perhaps, not sure. Era was weaker since 17 than from 11-13 tbh.

For the record, I have not looked up since when Federer got the losing record against Djokovic in indoor matches. Perhaps he even already acquired it in 2013.
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
it's trash. a round robin even that is best of 3. lmao.

only reason he has 0 is he doesn't care that much and it's always been on indoor hard. rotate surfaces and venues and he would win....
You Rafa fanatics are a joke. Nadal sucks on indoor and has only managed to win one indoor tournament in what, 17 years on tour now?

WTF is a very important tournament and you burying your head in the sand doesn't change the fact. It's the 5th biggest tournament of the year and any pro would agree. I've seen numerous interviews of the top players and one thing they consistently say is that reaching the Year End Championship is always one of their main goals.
 

DSH

Hall of Fame
You Rafa fanatics are a joke. Nadal sucks on indoor and has only managed to win one indoor tournament in what, 17 years on tour now? WTF is a very important tournament and you burying your head in the sand doesn't change the fact. It's the 5th biggest tournament of the year and any pro would agree. I've seen numerous interviews of the top players and one thing they consistently say is that reaching the Year End Championship is always one of their main goals.

In your opinion, is the WTF more near in prestige to the Grand Slams or to the Masters 1000?
:unsure:
 

marc45

G.O.A.T.
Rafa has withdrawn half the time and will again this year if he wins USO. Its a meaningless event...u can lose yet win lol.
disagree it's meaningless but you can definitely lose and then win it, happened often....you can actually lose twice and win it but don't think that's ever happened
 
You Rafa fanatics are a joke. Nadal sucks on indoor and has only managed to win one indoor tournament in what, 17 years on tour now?

WTF is a very important tournament and you burying your head in the sand doesn't change the fact. It's the 5th biggest tournament of the year and any pro would agree. I've seen numerous interviews of the top players and one thing they consistently say is that reaching the Year End Championship is always one of their main goals.
He's actually won 2 indoor titles: Sao Paulo and Madrid.
 

Flint

Hall of Fame
lmao a WTF is at least on the same level as the Olympics in terms of relevance to a player's legacy. It's exclusive to the top 8 players, for crying out loud.
Ahh the old WTF Vs Olympic gold discussion.

Well not many people know this but as it turns out a player actually needs both of them to be eligible for the GOAT discussion.
 

Third Serve

Hall of Fame
Ahh the old WTF Vs Olympic gold discussion.

Well not many people know this but as it turns out a player actually needs both of them to be eligible for the GOAT discussion.
So Murray is the GOAT, followed closely by Agassi? Muzziah fans rejoice!
 
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ADuck

Hall of Fame
Above Masters, below slams.
Closer to masters than slams. Hence, winning a WTF would only be equivalent of winning 1.5 masters at the most. Slams cannot be compared with any BO3 event, especially one that limits the field to 8 players.
 
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DSH

Hall of Fame
Closer to masters than slams. Hence, winning a WTF would only be equivalent of winning 1.5 masters at the most. Slams cannot be compared with any BO3 event, especially one that limits the field to 8 players.
Masters 1000 = 1000 points.
WTF (invictus) = 2000 points.
Grand Slams = 4000 points.

:cool:8-B
 

ADuck

Hall of Fame
Masters 1000 = 1000 points.
WTF (invictus) = 2000 points.
Grand Slams = 4000 points.

:cool:8-B
Probably even less. WTF arguably has a weaker field than a Masters 1000 due to it only taking the top 8 players of the year. The problem is the top 8 players have earnt points on a variety of different surfaces/conditions so it doesn't guarantee they will be the best 8 players at that event. Think of any masters 1000 recently, how many times are the best 8 players in the event the top 8 players in the world at that given moment? Not many times.
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
Closer to masters than slams. Hence, winning a WTF would only be equivalent of winning 1.5 masters at the most. Slams cannot be compared with any BO3 event, especially one that limits the field to 8 players.
What a big surprise to see a Nadal fan downplaying the WTF :rolleyes::rolleyes:
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
I have facts on my side
Dude you're a massive Rafa fanatic and everything I've ever seen you write is pro Rafa, anti Fed.

He's never gonna win the WTF which is the 5th biggest tournament of the year. Accept that and move along with your life.
 

ADuck

Hall of Fame
Dude you're a massive Rafa fanatic and everything I've ever seen you write is pro Rafa, anti Fed.

He's never gonna win the WTF which is the 5th biggest tournament of the year. Accept that and move along with your life.
And you're a massive Fed fanatic. The same argument applies both ways here, but you're too stupid to realize it. It honestly doesn't matter the manner in which people form their opinions, as long as they are backed by facts and reasoning. Now this argument has devolved into dribble because instead of bringing facts and proper arguments to the table, you've used ad hominem. Have fun living in your little bubble.
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
And you're a massive Fed fanatic. The same argument applies both ways here, but you're too stupid to realize it. It honestly doesn't matter the manner in which people form their opinions, as long as they are backed by facts and reasoning. Now this argument has devolved into dribble because instead of bringing facts and proper arguments to the table, you've used ad hominem. Have fun living in your little bubble.
Ha. You just used an ad hominem when I never did, then accused me of it. Enjoy your own bubble.

Btw, I'm a fan of all good tennis. Not just Fed. The problem with Rafa is his fans, people like you.
 

ADuck

Hall of Fame
Ha. You just used an ad hominem when I never did, then accused me of it. Enjoy your own bubble.

Btw, I'm a fan of all good tennis. Not just Fed. The problem with Rafa is his fans, people like you.
"Ad hominem attacks can take the form of overtly attacking somebody, or more subtly casting doubt on their character or personal attributes as a way to discredit their argument. The result of an ad hom attack can be to undermine someone's case without actually having to engage with it. "

So you bringing up me being a "rafa fanatic" was ad hominem.
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
"Ad hominem attacks can take the form of overtly attacking somebody, or more subtly casting doubt on their character or personal attributes as a way to discredit their argument. The result of an ad hom attack can be to undermine someone's case without actually having to engage with it. "

So you bringing up me being a "rafa fanatic" was ad hominem.
Well you got me there.

I didn't intend "Rafa fanatic" as an insult, but considering it encompasses people like yourself I see now how it can be construed as much.
 

ADuck

Hall of Fame
Well you got me there.

I didn't intend "Rafa fanatic" as an insult, but considering it encompasses people like yourself I see now how it can be construed as much.
Dude, this is just low-quality posting from you. Try harder or something because you missed the point. I don't take you calling me a rafa fanatic as an insult, but using it as ad hominem is something I will call out.
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
Dude, this is just low-quality posting from you. Try harder or something because you missed the point. I don't take you calling me a rafa fanatic as an insult, but using it as ad hominem is something I will call out.
You literally just called me "stupid" in response to simply calling you a Rafa fanatic, (which you are). Insecure much?
 

ADuck

Hall of Fame
You literally just called me "stupid" in response to simply calling you a Rafa fanatic, (which you are). Insecure much?
Yes, you were stupid to use that as an argument as I said here:
And you're a massive Fed fanatic. The same argument applies both ways here, but you're too stupid to realize it.
If not, then why don't we end all arguments the same way. I'll call anyone who disagrees with me a fed fanatic, and you call anyone who disagrees with you a rafa fanatic. How open-minded.
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
Yes, you were stupid to use that as an argument as I said here:
If not, then why don't we end all arguments the same way. I'll call anyone who disagrees with me a fed fanatic, and you call anyone who disagrees with you a rafa fanatic. How open-minded.
I think you're more of a Rafa fanatic than I am a Fed fanatic. Seems like 90% of the posts I see from you are knocking down Feds achievements to elevate Rafa.
 

ADuck

Hall of Fame
I think you're more of a Rafa fanatic than I am a Fed fanatic. Seems like 90% of the posts I see from you are knocking down Feds achievements to elevate Rafa.
Well, this has nothing to do with WTF anymore, but now I'm curious. Show me these posts where I'm knocking down Fed because I don't remember doing that.
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
Well, this has nothing to do with WTF anymore, but now I'm curious. Show me these posts where I'm knocking down Fed because I don't remember doing that.
I don't have them bookmarked man. You stand out though as heavily anti Fed and trying to skew everything toward Rafa. You also stand out to me as one of the more negative posters I read on here. Just my impression in general, not trying to be insulting.
 

ADuck

Hall of Fame
I don't have them bookmarked man. You stand out though as heavily anti Fed and trying to skew everything toward Rafa. You also stand out to me as one of the more negative posters I read on here. Just my impression in general, not trying to be insulting.
Lmao. Okay man. If 90% of my posts are knocking on Fed, they should be pretty easy to find. The problem for you is I don't actually knock Fed down, but in one rare instance where I can remember where I did, it was to show the hypocrisy this board has in regards to knocking down Rafa.
But, I do like to praise and defend Rafa, which I will not apologize about, since I am a Rafa fan. If Federer fans do it with their guy, so can I.
 

zuluzazu

Rookie
Dude you're a massive Rafa fanatic and everything I've ever seen you write is pro Rafa, anti Fed.

He's never gonna win the WTF which is the 5th biggest tournament of the year. Accept that and move along with your life.
Be careful what you say. Rafa just defended a non clay title, reached uso final and one day when he wins WTF what would fed fans say? Nadal may equal fed at uso too. I think what nadal has achieved outside clay is very good.
 

Tennis_Hands

Talk Tennis Guru
Probably even less. WTF arguably has a weaker field than a Masters 1000 due to it only taking the top 8 players of the year. The problem is the top 8 players have earnt points on a variety of different surfaces/conditions so it doesn't guarantee they will be the best 8 players at that event. Think of any masters 1000 recently, how many times are the best 8 players in the event the top 8 players in the world at that given moment? Not many times.
Quoting this for the posterity. Please continue.

:cool:
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
Lmao. Okay man. If 90% of my posts are knocking on Fed, they should be pretty easy to find. The problem for you is I don't actually knock Fed down, but in one rare instance where I can remember where I did, it was to show the hypocrisy this board has in regards to knocking down Rafa.
But, I do like to praise and defend Rafa, which I will not apologize about, since I am a Rafa fan. If Federer fans do it with their guy, so can I.
That's fine...support your man. I feel the same way about Rafa fans...many insult Fed and try to take away from what he's done. At the end of the day they're all great champs and itll be fun to see what records Rafa, Fed and Djoker end up with when the dust settles.
 

LETitBE

Hall of Fame
Probably even less. WTF arguably has a weaker field than a Masters 1000 due to it only taking the top 8 players of the year. The problem is the top 8 players have earnt points on a variety of different surfaces/conditions so it doesn't guarantee they will be the best 8 players at that event. Think of any masters 1000 recently, how many times are the best 8 players in the event the top 8 players in the world at that given moment? Not many times.
you sir...are an idiot! LOL
 

Xemi666

Professional
Fed zealots still trying to put WTF at the same level as the slams? :-D:-D

Sorry guys, that will never happen no matter how much you ***** and moan.
 
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