How much does history change if Federer converts MP against Anderson at W 2018?

[Hitman]

We know the historical implications of Djokovic asking to play his quarter final against Nishikori on Centre Court, which ultimately lead to Federer playing Anderson out on Court One.

Federer ends up losing to Anderson, which most likely doesn't happen on Centre Court.
Isner and Anderson as a result go extremely late into the day for the semi, pushing Djokodal back for a late start
Djokovic v Nadal takes place indoors during a hot summer in London, Djokovic beats Nadal
Anderson still very tired while losing the final to an inspired Djokovic, leads to a final set tie break being played after 12-12 if the fifth set for future matches
Djokovic gains confidence and goes on a tear, ultimately winning 3 slams in a row
The following year, Djokovic and Federer become the first to play that final set tie break, which leads to Djokovic defeating Federer

 

[Mustard]

Before the 2018 Wimbledon quarter finals, I seem to remember Djokovic saying that he didn't get enough time on Centre Court compared to Federer. Federer vs. Anderson was then put on Court 1. It did indeed change tennis history when Federer lost that match.

 

[MeatTornado]

Federer didn't lose because of the court. Never understood that narrative.

 

[TheGoldenEra1990’s]

Nadal and djoker were in much better form in 2018 than they were in 2019 at Wimbledon. Fed wouldn’t beat either one that year. Too old

 

[inflation_era]

Fed probably loses to Djoker in 2018, who was so lucky against Nadal.

 

[Hitman]

Federer didn't lose because of the court. Never understood that narrative.

Court one is slicker than Centre, it helps guys like Anderson more. Of course it is not the be all end all, but it played a part. The same match on Centre, and Federer will likely edge it.

 

[Mustard]

Court one is slicker than Centre, it helps guys like Anderson more. Of course it is not the be all end all, but it played a part. The same match on Centre, and Federer will likely edge it.

Federer was 1 point away on Court 1 from a routine straight sets win. Federer would have won 6-2, 7-6, 6-4 had he taken the match point. Instead, Anderson came back to win 2-6, 6-7, 7-5, 6-4, 13-11.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

One more match squandered with match points in hand and a 2-0 lead lol.
If he wins, he'd have a great shot at taking down Isner and then lose to Rafa in the final.

 

[Hitman]

Nadal and djoker were in much better form in 2018 than they were in 2019 at Wimbledon. Fed wouldn’t beat either one that year. Too old

Nadal would have had to go through in form Del Potro and in form Djokovic just to get to Federer, who if he converts that MP, probably easily gets past Isner and is much fresher. Though in this situation, Nadal plays the match outside, as match would take place in late afternoon.

Djokovic just coming back into form, does he have it in him to go back to back against Fedal straight away?

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Federer was 1 point away on Court 1 from a routine straight sets win. Federer would have won 6-2, 7-6, 6-4 had he taken the match point. Instead, Anderson came back to win 2-6, 6-7, 7-5, 6-4, 13-11.

If I recall correctly, that match point was a floating sitter to Fed with Anderson at the net like a sitting duck, asking to be passed

 

[Hitman]

Federer was 1 point away on Court 1 from a routine straight sets win. Federer would have won 6-2, 7-6, 6-4 had he taken the match point. Instead, Anderson came back to win 2-6, 6-7, 7-5, 6-4, 13-11.

Yep. That one point could have changed a lot of things.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Nadal would have had to go through in form Del Potro and in form Djokovic just to get to Federer, who if he converts that MP, probably easily gets past Isner and is much fresher. Though in this situation, Nadal plays the match outside, as match would take place in late afternoon.

Djokovic just coming back into form, does he have it in him to go back to back against Fedal straight away?

Rafa in 2018 was playing his best Grass tennis in a decade, and the roofgate took away a deserved slam win from him.
Federer otoh didn't have zip on his forehand in 2018, and without his chief weapon against Rafa in a killer form, it'd spell doom for him.

 

[Mustard]

One more match squandered with match points in hand and a 2-0 lead lol.
If he wins, he'd have a great shot at taking down Isner and then lose to Rafa in the final.

If Federer had beaten Anderson, I think it's a Federer vs. Nadal final, and they both continue their sharing of the majors dating back to the start of 2017.

 

[Hitman]

Rafa in 2018 was playing his best Grass tennis in a decade, and the roofgate took away a deserved slam win from him.
Federer otoh didn't have zip on his forehand in 2018, and without his chief weapon against Rafa in a killer form, it'd spell doom for him.

I wouldn't give Nadal any win over Federer post 2015 outside of clay, considered what happened between them outside off clay during that time. He'd have to prove me wrong, because Federer had figured him out on non-clay.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

If Federer had beaten Anderson, I think it's a Federer vs. Nadal final, and they both continue their sharing of the majors dating back to the start of 2017.

No-no-whack

 

[Hitman]

If Federer had beaten Anderson, I think it's a Federer vs. Nadal final, and they both continue their sharing of the majors dating back to the start of 2017.

The big implication is Nadal letting the genie out of the bag in that Wimbledon semi. He made that one big mistake when he could have served for the match, and basically brought Djokovic back to life, and potentially resulted in the three slam run for Novak, that may not have happened.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

I wouldn't give Nadal any win over Federer post 2015 outside of clay, considered what happened between them outside of clay during that time. He'd have to prove me wrong, because Federer had figured him out on non-clay.

Come on man, you know Rafa played way better at that tournament than Roger did.
Its like saying that you'd not give Djokovic a win over Rafa at OG 2024 match just because its court Phillipe chatrier and Rafa's been THE KING there. Form of the tournament matters.

 

[Hitman]

Come on man, you know Rafa played way better at that tournament than Roger did.
Its like saying that you'd not give Djokovic a win over Rafa at OG 2024 match just because its court Phillipe chatrier and Rafa's been THE KING there. Form of the tournament matters.

Nadal playing better doesn't mean much, he played better in Shanghai also in 2017 and Federer routed him in straights.

Look, I'm not saying Nadal cannot beat him, but the pattern at the time was that off clay, Federer had the advantage at that point. Nadal would have to show me it he could do it.

And Federer was no where close to Nadal at OGM 2024. Federer had won AO that year, and got to IW final. He wasn't playing that badly, he was a point away IMO from making the final.

 

[Mustard]

The big implication is Nadal letting the genie out of the bag in that Wimbledon semi.

I've often said that Nadal let the Djokovic genie out of the bottle at that time. It meant not only Djokovic winning 2018 Wimbledon, but changing the dynamics of the tennis world somewhat and continuing that momentum into following majors too. Nadal or Federer winning 2018 Wimbledon would have continued the 2017-spring 2018 dynamic for longer, with a frustrated Djokovic looking to get back and Nadal and Federer still ruling the tennis world. Djokovic's reaction after losing to Cecchinato at the 2018 French Open said it all. He knew what was at stake there. He could feel his chance to seriously return to the very top slipping away more.

He made that one big mistake when he could have served for the match, and basically brought Djokovic back to life, and potentially resulted in the three slam run for Novak, that may not have happened.

Yes.

 

[nolefam_2024]

Novak would have made is 4-0 op

It would not change just like ending of movie the flash

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Novak would have made is 4-0 op

It would not change just like ending of movie the flash

Novak wouldn't even make the final in that case because roofgate wouldn't have happened.

 

[Hitman]

I've often said that Nadal let the Djokovic genie out of the bottle at that time. It meant not only Djokovic winning 2018 Wimbledon, but changing the dynamics of the tennis world somewhat and continuing that momentum into following majors too. Nadal or Federer winning 2018 Wimbledon would have continued the 2017-spring 2018 dynamic for longer, with a frustrated Djokovic looking to get back and Nadal and Federer still ruling the tennis world. Djokovic's reaction after losing to Cecchinato at the 2018 French Open said it all. He knew what was at stake there. He could feel his chance to seriously return to the very top slipping away more.


Yes.

It shows that Federer and Nadal BOTH at Wimbledon 2018 needed to win just that one point in that respective matches to change the course of history. Federer with that MP against Anderson and Nadal with that BP to serve for the match against Djokovic. They know they messed it up and allowed Djokovic back in, when they could have shut the door and pulled too far ahead.

 

[Mustard]

Nadal playing better doesn't mean much, he played better in Shanghai also in 2017 and Federer routed him in straights.

Look, I'm not saying Nadal cannot beat him, but the pattern at the time was that off clay, Federer had the advantage at that point. Nadal would have to show me it he could do it.

And Federer was no where close to Nadal at OGM 2024. Federer had won AO that year, and got to IW final. He wasn't playing that badly, he was a point away IMO from making the final.

The sunny conditions at 2018 Wimbledon would have helped Nadal, i.e. higher bounce, more effective topspin. But I agree, it would be a tough match for Nadal. Those are matches he won a lot more often than not earlier in his career.

 

[Hitman]

Novak wouldn't even make the final in that case because roofgate wouldn't have happened.

There no real garantee of that, but the match was played indoors.

 

[nolefam_2024]

Novak wouldn't even make the final in that case because roofgate wouldn't have happened.

This is just excuse brigade back in form

Nole owns rafa outside clay

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Nadal playing better doesn't mean much, he played better in Shanghai also in 2017 and Federer routed him in straights.

Look, I'm not saying Nadal cannot beat him, but the pattern at the time was that off clay, Federer had the advantage at that point. Nadal would have to show me it he could do it.

And Federer was no where close to Nadal at OGM 2024. Federer had won AO that year, and got to IW final. He wasn't playing that badly, he was a point away IMO from making the final.

 

[ND-13]

Lot of things could have changed if Fed won in straights against Anderson.

It is also possible Djokovic doesn’t win any more major after 12

 

[Mustard]

This is just excuse brigade back in form

Nole owns rafa outside clay

I was very confident in Nadal's chances in the sun in that semi final. Even under the roof, Nadal blew chances for a 2-1 sets lead, and a chance to serve for the match in the fifth set.

 

[Hitman]

The sunny conditions at 2018 Wimbledon would have helped Nadal, i.e. higher bounce, more effective topspin. But I agree, it would be a tough match for Nadal. Those are matches he won a lot more often than not earlier in his career.

Exactly my point, by no means am I saying Federer would be the lock for this 9th Wimbledon title, but it being a tough match up for Nadal at that stage in their careers, plus, Nadal would have had the much tougher path with Del Potro and Djokovic, would have played a part also. But, no Djokovic around and Fedal continue their iron grip on tennis.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

There no real garantee of that, but the match was played indoors.

It was played indoors but in the circumstances that you're suggesting, it may happen outdoors. And even if not outdoors, it'd continue on the same day and Djok wouldn't have gotten one extra day of rest. He was looking gassed and tired at the end of set 3, remember?

 

[Rosstour]

Before the 2018 Wimbledon quarter finals, I seem to remember Djokovic saying that he didn't get enough time on Centre Court compared to Federer. Federer vs. Anderson was then put on Court 1. It did indeed change tennis history when Federer lost that match.

Novak is always the special boy

 

[nolefam_2024]

Butterfly effect to the extreme is coping mechanism

Nolefams go hard against it.

 

[Mustard]

Exactly my point, by no means am I saying Federer would be the lock for this 9th Wimbledon title, but it being a tough match up for Nadal at that stage in their careers, plus, Nadal would have had the much tougher path with Del Potro and Djokovic, would have played a part also. But, no Djokovic around and Fedal continue their iron grip on tennis.

If there are tennis gods, they wanted Djokovic to win 2018 Wimbledon.

 

[Rosstour]

It shows that Federer and Nadal BOTH at Wimbledon 2018 needed to win just that one point in that respective matches to change the course of history. Federer with that MP against Anderson and Nadal with that BP to serve for the match against Djokovic. They know they messed it up and allowed Djokovic back in, when they could have shut the door and pulled too far ahead.

We are talking about one Slam, Djokovic is going to finish with 26-28 Slams

One wouldn't have mattered. Fed needed 30, not 20

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

It is also possible Djokovic doesn’t win any more major after 12

Not likely. Even in this hypothetical scenario,

 

[Hitman]

It was played indoors but in the circumstances that you're suggesting, it may happen outdoors. And even if not outdoors, it'd continue on the same day and Djok wouldn't have gotten one extra day of rest. He was looking gassed and tired at the end of set 3, remember?

It would finish that very same day, because the match will take much earlier in the day. I remember what Djokovic was going through, but the break also let Nadal regroup.

There is no way of telling if the five setter against Del Potro wouldn't have played a part, and Nadal feeling it also had they continued to play without rest.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

We are talking about one Slam, Djokovic is going to finish with 26-28 Slams

One wouldn't have mattered. Fed needed 30, not 20

Actually, what Federer & Rafa NEEDED was a generational talent appearing somewhere around 2015 to stop Djokovic consistently like he stopped Fedal.
That never happened until 2023, that too, not consistently.

 

[Hitman]

If there are tennis gods, they wanted Djokovic to win 2018 Wimbledon.

Devine intervention....he was meant to win the slam race.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

If there are tennis gods, they wanted Djokovic to win 2018 Wimbledon.

You misspelt tennis demons

 

[Hitman]

We are talking about one Slam, Djokovic is going to finish with 26-28 Slams

One wouldn't have mattered. Fed needed 30, not 20

You can of course be right.

This is purely hypothetical, but an interesting one to discuss, because of the unique sequence of events that lead to a key stage in the slam race.

 

[Martin J]

Rafa in 2018 was playing his best Grass tennis in a decade, and the roofgate took away a deserved slam win from him.
Federer otoh didn't have zip on his forehand in 2018, and without his chief weapon against Rafa in a killer form, it'd spell doom for him.

Nadal barely won against Delpo who didn't have a BH, would never call it a killer form. That 2018 match, while quite dramatic, was overrated compared to previous encounters during their prime years. Djokovic's groundgame was still questionable and he played conservatively from the back court (for his standards), while Nadal's movement was obviously declined and his baseline game/timing obviously suffered.

Entertaining performance from Nadal, though, he was way more offensive than usual and wasn't shy of coming forward. But, as it usually happens on grass, a player who wins the serve/return battle, comes out victorious and that's exactly what happened, roof or no roof.

 

[nolefam_2024]

Nadal barely won against Delpo who didn't have a BH, would never call it a killer form. That 2018 match, while quite dramatic, was overrated compared to previous encounters during their prime years. Djokovic's groundgame was still questionable and he played conservatively from the back court (for his standards), while Nadal's movement was obviously declined and his baseline game/timing obviously suffered.

Entertaining performance from Nadal, though, he was way more offensive than usual and wasn't shy of coming forward. But, as it usually happens on grass, a player who wins the serve/return battle, comes out victorious and that's exactly what happened, roof or no roof.

Nole finished his last real chance of winning Wimbledon

Every non rafan should thank nole.

 

[welcome2petrkordaland]

Nadal playing better doesn't mean much, he played better in Shanghai also in 2017 and Federer routed him in straights.

Look, I'm not saying Nadal cannot beat him, but the pattern at the time was that off clay, Federer had the advantage at that point. Nadal would have to show me it he could do it.

And Federer was no where close to Nadal at OGM 2024. Federer had won AO that year, and got to IW final. He wasn't playing that badly, he was a point away IMO from making the final.

With the uncharacteristic heat of that fortnite while playing outdoors on a natural surface, Nadal gets past Federer despite how Fed flipped the script in the matchup with his neo-BH. The difference here is between natural nonclay and non-natural no clay imho. Nadal’s ball all tournament long was jumping off the court. I agree in principle that Fed off clay was owning Nadal, but this was 1.5 years after the 17 AO final that went 5 sets when Nadal-Dimitrov semi. may have gassed Nadal a bit.

 

[Third Serve]

Fed didn't lose because of the court. He was in bad form at the time and had a slight hand injury which further complicated things.

 

[Hitman]

With the uncharacteristic heat of that fortnite while playing outdoors on a natural surface, Nadal gets past Federer despite how Fed flipped the script in the matchup with his neo-BH. The difference here is between natural nonclay and non-natural no clay imho. Nadal’s ball all tournament long was jumping off the court. I agree in principle that Fed off clay was owning Nadal, but this was 1.5 years after the 17 AO final that went 5 sets when Nadal-Dimitrov semi. may have gassed Nadal a bit.

You could be right, but how much would be in Nadal's tank mentally and physically after having to go through Del Potro and Djokovic back to back, while Federer straight sets Anderson, and most likely easily beats Isner also?

 

[MeatTornado]

Court one is slicker than Centre, it helps guys like Anderson more. Of course it is not the be all end all, but it played a part. The same match on Centre, and Federer will likely edge it.

The court was slicker in the first 2 sets that Federer won too.

It really doesn't matter anyway. He was never winning Wim 2018 unless he got a complete joke draw.

 

[Hitman]

The court was slicker in the first 2 sets that Federer won too.

It really doesn't matter anyway. He was never winning Wim 2018 unless he got a complete joke draw.

Yes it was, now imagine him taking Anderson on a court that wasn't slicker?

Anderson pushed Djokovic hard in 2015 on that same court. It helps his game.

 

[Razer]

Actually, what Federer & Rafa NEEDED was a generational talent appearing somewhere around 2015 to stop Djokovic consistently like he stopped Fedal.
That never happened until 2023, that too, not consistently.

Federer himself never had a generational talent born with him or even a few years before him. Since you guys consider 5 years to be a generation, there should be 1 before Fed and 1 with Fed as well if you really want to nullify what Djokovic had before you ask for a talent to appear in 2015-2016 quickly.

 

[Sport]

Nadal playing better doesn't mean much, he played better in Shanghai also in 2017 and Federer routed him in straights.

Look, I'm not saying Nadal cannot beat him, but the pattern at the time was that off clay, Federer had the advantage at that point. Nadal would have to show me it he could do it.

And Federer was no where close to Nadal at OGM 2024. Federer had won AO that year, and got to IW final. He wasn't playing that badly, he was a point away IMO from making the final.

Nadal wasn't in better form in Shanghai 2017, in fact he got injured in the knee against Dimitrov before facing Roger.

 

[Fedeonic]

Let's say that Federer converted that MP against Kevin Anderson, he'd have played first SF at 13:00 against Isner, and he most likely wins in 3 tight sets or in 4 disbalanced sets, match should end at 16:30, then the Djokdal match starts at 16:45 approx., and providing that the match is played as it was, it should have ended past 22:00 under the roof, and let's take into account that the roof closing lasts more than half an hour.
In the end, Federer would have gone to lose the final against Nole, nothing out of this world.