How to beat a 4.5-5.0+ Left-handed player?

Best play against a lefty?

  • Total voters
    28
PURETENNISsense

PURETENNISsense

Professional
I played college tennis, competed for 4 years in Men's open and Futures qualies across the nation and was in the 11.7-12.0 UTR range.

Currently trying to get back to competing and am likely a 10.75 UTR at the moment trying to make my way back into the 11 range.

I always had a gameplan against Lefty players since they were ones I struggled with a lot back in the day. I wanted to see if anyone had suggestions that I might be missing besides the basics:

1) BH dtl
2) Slice serve wide on the Deuce
3) FH crosscourt

Any suggestions?
 
PURETENNISsense said:
I played college tennis, competed for 4 years in Men's open and Futures qualies across the nation and was in the 11.7-12.0 UTR range.

Currently trying to get back to competing and am likely a 10.75 UTR at the moment trying to make my way back into the 11 range.

I always had a gameplan against Lefty players since they were ones I struggled with a lot back in the day. I wanted to see if anyone had suggestions that I might be missing besides the basics:

1) BH dtl
2) Slice serve wide on the Deuce
3) FH crosscourt

Any suggestions?
Click to expand...

This isn't necessarily apropos to your high level but just in general: play more lefties.

All of the supposed advantages that lefties have [ie wide slice serve on the Ad court], righties have the same [wide slice serve on the Deuce court].

The difference is that lefties play a lot of righties but righties don't play a lot of lefties. Heck, even lefties don't like playing lefties for the same reason as righties.

My doubles group has more lefties than normal [one time I was the only righty on the court] and thus I get a lot of return practice against lefties. The return is probably the biggest adjustment for me, especially the lefty kick, which I frequently hit wide when I attempt an IO FH from the Ad.

In general, I try to hit more BHs DTL, especially the slice. Beyond that and the return, I don't spend too much energy worrying about it. I'm not at a high enough level [currently UTR ~7.5] where such small adjustments would matter; I'm more concerned about missing neutral balls or a low 1st serve %.
 
As a lefty myself, the slice serve out wide never bothers me much. I always cheat a long way on it because I know that I can cover a lot with my forehand, and if they try and go down the T consistently in the deuce court it’s going to be pretty low percentage. A good body serve that jams my forehand is often harder to deal with.

Likewise, a righty hitting backhand down the line is good for me. My backhand is almost certainly better than his (because lefties get a lot of backhand practice) and he’s giving me a lot of open court to work with. The next shot may not win me the point, but it often lets me take control of the rally. It’s definitely an essential tool for switching the direction of the rally, but try and use it sparingly - especially if he has a one-hander.

Often the oldest tactics are the best. Hammering my backhand cross-court as much as possible is low risk for you, and inevitably going to pay dividends. Most lefties haves solid backhands, but it will still break down when pitted against a good forehand.

In terms of other things not mentioned, I would definitely experiment with various tactics that test his forehand (e.g. hit a forehand DTL and see what it’s like on the run). A lot of lefties have below-average forehands because of all the time they have to spend shoring up their backhand.

Often working out how to draw a weak forehand is the key to exposing and attacking the backhand (a tactic that doesn’t just work on lefties).
 
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Cashman said:
Likewise, a righty hitting backhand down the line is good for me. My backhand is almost certainly better than his (because lefties get a lot of backhand practice)
Click to expand...

I think lefty Ian at ET made the same point: that he got to be pretty good at hitting BHs [especially DTL to a righty's BH].
 
The only lefties I've played singles against more than once are simply better than I am [one is a 5.0 and the other, Josh [the video I posted recently], appears to be close to it] so I'm not so sure these ideas are as applicable since a lot of the time I'm just trying to keep my head above water; they're more applicable in a match between peers.
 
I used to "crush," a word players like to use but I don't, left handed players because I had a really good backhand. I could open the court with it and hit the thing just about anywhere on the court.

Ya wanna beat left handed players, develop a better backhand. This would be a good start. Also, there's been a bunch of chatter about the kick serve. Placement is important, mix it up but serve to his backhand side mostly.
 
Cashman said:
As a lefty myself, the slice serve out wide never bothers me much. I always cheat a long way on it because I know that I can cover a lot with my forehand, and if they try and go down the T consistently in the deuce court it’s going to be pretty low percentage. A good body serve that jams my forehand is often harder to deal with.

Likewise, a righty hitting backhand down the line is good for me. My backhand is almost certainly better than his (because lefties get a lot of backhand practice) and he’s giving me a lot of open court to work with. The next shot may not win me the point, but it often lets me take control of the rally. It’s definitely an essential tool for switching the direction of the rally, but try and use it sparingly - especially if he has a one-hander.

Often the oldest tactics are the best. Hammering my backhand cross-court as much as possible is low risk for you, and inevitably going to pay dividends. Most lefties haves solid backhands, but it will still break down when pitted against a good forehand.

In terms of other things not mentioned, I would definitely experiment with various tactics that test his forehand (e.g. hit a forehand DTL and see what it’s like on the run). A lot of lefties have below-average forehands because of all the time they have to spend shoring up their backhand.

Often working out how to draw a weak forehand is the key to exposing and attacking the backhand (a tactic that doesn’t just work on lefties).
Click to expand...
As a fellow lefty I have to say Cashman has us dead to rights! Why you givin' up all our secrets, bro? :happydevil: Gonna report you at the next meeting!
 
S&V-not_dead_yet said:
This isn't necessarily apropos to your high level but just in general: play more lefties.

All of the supposed advantages that lefties have [ie wide slice serve on the Ad court], righties have the same [wide slice serve on the Deuce court].

The difference is that lefties play a lot of righties but righties don't play a lot of lefties. Heck, even lefties don't like playing lefties for the same reason as righties.

My doubles group has more lefties than normal [one time I was the only righty on the court] and thus I get a lot of return practice against lefties. The return is probably the biggest adjustment for me, especially the lefty kick, which I frequently hit wide when I attempt an IO FH from the Ad.

In general, I try to hit more BHs DTL, especially the slice. Beyond that and the return, I don't spend too much energy worrying about it. I'm not at a high enough level [currently UTR ~7.5] where such small adjustments would matter; I'm more concerned about missing neutral balls or a low 1st serve %.
Click to expand...
I agree with that. Earlier this summer I had 2 guys I hit with each week who were both lefties with contrasting styles. I did start to feel better when returning their typical patterns that I don't see when playing a righty. Backhand DTL naturally started getting better at that time of the year too. Quanity in that case sounds right.

Thank you!
 
PURETENNISsense said:
I played college tennis, competed for 4 years in Men's open and Futures qualies across the nation and was in the 11.7-12.0 UTR range.

Currently trying to get back to competing and am likely a 10.75 UTR at the moment trying to make my way back into the 11 range.

I always had a gameplan against Lefty players since they were ones I struggled with a lot back in the day. I wanted to see if anyone had suggestions that I might be missing besides the basics:

1) BH dtl
2) Slice serve wide on the Deuce
3) FH crosscourt

Any suggestions?
Click to expand...

Here's how NOT to do it from yours truly:

 
S&V-not_dead_yet said:
All of the supposed advantages that lefties have [ie wide slice serve on the Ad court], righties have the same [wide slice serve on the Deuce court].

The difference is that lefties play a lot of righties but righties don't play a lot of lefties. Heck, even lefties don't like playing lefties for the same reason as righties.
Click to expand...

I think one of the biggest advantages (aside from there not being a lot of lefties to practice against to get used to them), is that their wide slice serve is on the Ad court instead of the deuce. The only way to win a game that goes to deuce is on the ad court, where the left has the advantage of having an easier time reaching the opponent's backhand.

To make it fair, either the receiver or server should be able to choose to return/serve on the deuce or ad side. Until this rule change happens, the lefty will always have an advantage for games that go to deuce.
 
onehandbh said:
The only way to win a game that goes to deuce is on the ad court
Click to expand...
The only way to win a game that goes to deuce is to win two points in a row, one on either side of the court.

The idea that lefties have a systemic advantage because they are good in the ad court is a total myth. Over the course of a match, more points will be decided by serves to the deuce court.
 
I'm sure you're statistically right on that, Cashman, 'cause you sound pretty smart. But as a big server, that easy angle into my opponent's backhand on the ad court has gifted me many a free game; at least that's how it feels. (Now, stop telling everyone how to beat us! :censored:) Everyone, these are not the droids you are looking for...
 
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I am a lefty and I would advise that you practice against lefties whenever you get the chance so that you get used to the lefty serve especially wide on the ad court. Otherwise, treat lefties like every other 4.5+ player you play and analyze what strengths and weaknesses they have in the first few games of your first match against them. Don‘t go into a match with too many stereotypes of how a lefty will play as you are likely to run into as much variety as you would with a righty. Some will have a strong FH, some will have a stronger BH, some will like the net, some will be pushers, some will hit flat, some will hit heavy topspin, some will have a nasty kick, most will have a nasty slice serve, some will be slicers/junk ballers etc.

The one predictable thing about most lefties is that when it is a big point on ad, they will like the point pattern of serving a lefty slice wide and they will do it at least 70% of the time. Otherwise, forget the stereotypes and just read and play the player in front of you. You might run into the 4.5+ version of Nadal, Lopez, M Zverev, Shapovalov, Mannarino or Humbert - as you know, they are all very different players with very different styles.
 
You probably already know this but lefty serve on the ad side is definitely one thing to watch out for. I'm a lefty so I know my options and what works what doesn't work.

There is no best play against lefty, just like there is no best play for lefty against righty, it all depends on the player and the mindset they are in.

I would say that for a lefty to win against a righty, the best strategy is to hit a good lefty serve to get short ball then kill. So T serve on ad side sometimes you need to watch out for if the lefty has a good serving day.
 
I'm no 4.5, but lefties offer a different look than playing a right handed player. Posts above have already discussed the ad-court wide serve, but this can be dealt with by awareness and positioning. And while a wide serve can set up angles for the serve, it can also set up angles for the returner, although on the BH side.

It does change the dynamic of crosscourt rallies. Instead of exchanging forehands or backhands, you will be exchanging different strokes. If the lefty gets to dictate which crosscourt to rally on, they often like to use their FH vs your BH. Of course, you can also set up your FH vs their BH.

This of course, depends on the individual player and how they play and their strokes. In my leagues, I tend to do well against lefties because on most days I have an above average to excellent backhand, that when it's working, I like to attack with as much as with my forehand. So, this can set up a nice dynamic for me.

In terms of your poll, I think it depends on what shots you feel good about. The BH down the line is only a good shot if you use it at the right times, it's consistent and reliable, and you can put enough pace and depth on it to put your opponent on the defensive. In this, it's just like against any other player.
 
onehandbh said:
More points or more games?
Click to expand...

every game starts with a point to the deuce.
but not every game ends to the point to ad, some games end with a point to deuce as well.

so purely statistically, in the "worst" case for a righty vs lefty match, there will be same amount of points played to deuce and to ad.
but in real life, more points are played to deuce.

so, if you can control the deuce side, all your lefty opponent can do, is try to level up the score on the ad side.
but 1 single mistake, and the righty has advantage.
it's of course as well true that 1 single mistake to the deuce side, and the lefty has advantage.
 
I play with good 4.5 lefty players in tournaments and practice sets- few observations
1) Cross court forehand to their backhand is always a good play irrespective of how good their backhand is. If it's weak, they'll give you a short ball which you can drive deep and approach net or hit an inside out FH winner. If they have decent backhand, you can break it down with heavy topspin FHs.
2) #1 holds good only if the lefty player is not running around their BH and hitting inside-out rafa FHs. It's tiring to do all match but recently I came across a player who consistently did that. Then you might've to mix it up and drive your forehand down the line and close out the point again they don't have a Rafa's banana passing shot.
3) I always found bringing lefty players to the net risky proposition- since most of them hit their approach shot crosscourt to righty's BH and it's low percentage for hitting lob/passing shot down the line as going crosscourt will likely end up on lefty's forehand side.
 
onehandbh said:
The lefty slice actually does not bother me that much. It's the left twist/kick serve that kills me because I am not used to it and out of habit I keep make the wrong adjustments because I am used to returning righty kick serves. It takes me awhile to get used to lefties since I rarely play them.
Click to expand...
I found it interesting to start returning with a chip/slice for thr high backhand returns on the Ad. It wasn't a driving return for sure but it did create a weird position to the lefty as they have to pickup a low ball as their +1 instead of a weaker return or sitter in the mid-court range. It took a couple practices to work on and a week or two of point play to try it out but worked well after a little while.
 
TEZ555 said:
#1 holds good only if the lefty player is not running around their BH and hitting inside-out rafa FHs. It's tiring to do all match but recently I came across a player who consistently did that. Then you might've to mix it up and drive your forehand down the line and close out the point again they don't have a Rafa's banana passing shot.
Click to expand...
I always have to resort to lots of body serves when playing lefties. Especially when I'm serving on the Deuce side. It seems to help as long as its accurate enough to jam them. Otherwise yes, if they run around it, its right in the wheel house.
 
Crazy Finn said:
I'm no 4.5, but lefties offer a different look than playing a right handed player. Posts above have already discussed the ad-court wide serve, but this can be dealt with by awareness and positioning. And while a wide serve can set up angles for the serve, it can also set up angles for the returner, although on the BH side.

It does change the dynamic of crosscourt rallies. Instead of exchanging forehands or backhands, you will be exchanging different strokes. If the lefty gets to dictate which crosscourt to rally on, they often like to use their FH vs your BH. Of course, you can also set up your FH vs their BH.

This of course, depends on the individual player and how they play and their strokes. In my leagues, I tend to do well against lefties because on most days I have an above average to excellent backhand, that when it's working, I like to attack with as much as with my forehand. So, this can set up a nice dynamic for me.

In terms of your poll, I think it depends on what shots you feel good about. The BH down the line is only a good shot if you use it at the right times, it's consistent and reliable, and you can put enough pace and depth on it to put your opponent on the defensive. In this, it's just like against any other player.
Click to expand...
Well said, I completely agree. It does depend on each person and what they are comfortable hitting. The bh dtl definitely needs to be used at the right moments.

Do you do anything differnt on return position?
 
PURETENNISsense said:
Well said, I completely agree. It does depend on each person and what they are comfortable hitting. The bh dtl definitely needs to be used at the right moments.

Do you do anything differnt on return position?
Click to expand...
It depends on where they are standing and how they serve. But, sometimes if they really like the wide serve and can't attack the T, I'll shade pretty heavily toward the wide. It's harder to hit a BH on the move and stretch than a forehand.

Also, I play a lot of doubles, returning is different there, because a big part of returning is avoiding a potential poach as well as setting up your partner at the net.
 
Crazy Finn said:
It depends on where they are standing and how they serve. But, sometimes if they really like the wide serve and can't attack the T, I'll shade pretty heavily toward the wide. It's harder to hit a BH on the move and stretch than a forehand.

Also, I play a lot of doubles, returning is different there, because a big part of returning is avoiding a potential poach as well as setting up your partner at the net.
Click to expand...
I was always told in juniors to move half to one step to the left to protect against their slice serve. Worked back then but now I feel like it too easy to read that against higher level players.
 
pencilcheck said:
You probably already know this but lefty serve on the ad side is definitely one thing to watch out for. I'm a lefty so I know my options and what works what doesn't work.

There is no best play against lefty, just like there is no best play for lefty against righty, it all depends on the player and the mindset they are in.

I would say that for a lefty to win against a righty, the best strategy is to hit a good lefty serve to get short ball then kill. So T serve on ad side sometimes you need to watch out for if the lefty has a good serving day.
Click to expand...
Not many lefties I played in my life has big kick serves. Which I wonder about....

The lefty slice is something that can be adjusted too since there is pace and I can manage to get behind it and drive the backhand through. The kick however is very difficult to counter. I've had very little success with that in the first set. Second set it settles down but ita super difficult to read and get a clean racket on.

If I was a lefty I would definitely develop a very solid moving kick serve. I feel that would be super annoying to righties.
 
PURETENNISsense said:
Not many lefties I played in my life has big kick serves. Which I wonder about....

The lefty slice is something that can be adjusted too since there is pace and I can manage to get behind it and drive the backhand through. The kick however is very difficult to counter. I've had very little success with that in the first set. Second set it settles down but ita super difficult to read and get a clean racket on.

If I was a lefty I would definitely develop a very solid moving kick serve. I feel that would be super annoying to righties.
Click to expand...

Since the lefty slice and top-slice serves go to the righty BH and most lower-level players have weak BHs, most lefties use those for first and second serves particularly on the ad court. Some might also have a flat serve to serve wide on the deuce court.

However, at 4.5+ levels, BHs get stronger and you start seeing lefties with good kick serves that they use as their primary second serve. In general, I don’t see too many good kick serves on hard courts in California below the 4.5 level. If someone has a good kick serve, it usually means they got coached when they were a junior player and the rest of their game is pretty good too. Those who learn tennis late in life after their twenties generally avoid learning the kick serve as it requires more back flexibility.
 
Every strategy that lefties use against righties also works vice versa (slice serve to BH, FH cross into BH..), the only advantage the lefty has is that he has a lot more experience using those tactics because he faces righties all the time.

So best is watch some good lefties playing righties and Analyse the strategy they use.

What player you watch depends on your style of course, some would watch nadal and others Mac.

If you look at nadal for example he loves to play CC FH to BH, so from left of the middle he plays mostly CC. If a player tries to turn that around by aiming to nadals BH nadal will often hit a DTL BH daring the opponent to hit CC backhand into his open BH but obviously you need to have some wheels for that strategy.

So hit CC FH if you can and of course use the slice serve a lot like a lefty does, basically just copy him.

BTW I'm a lefty so I have some experience:)
 
BTW an interesting new strategy Rafa used against novaks CC forehand was a short and low DTL slice. Wouldn't use that all the time but sometimes this can hurt the opponent as he has to come forward across all the court, so if he is not comfortable at the net you could use that.
 
Hit deep down the middle. Lefties love angles, so don't give them any. Then when you get short ball you can attack. Be aware of the lefty spin jamming you on forehand (create more space) and moving away from backhand (move closer)
 
Agree with playing down the middle strategy. Many players need the space to move into. Experiment with hitting at them down the middle and also just slightly over to each side and see if there is a side they mess up on more often. Or if they make the shot but hit the ball a little weaker. Then you can pick on that. The other thing is to check how high your backhand cross-court is clearing the net. If the lefty has a big forehand, under pressure, a lot of players start scooping the backhand and/or chipping too much. At higher levels it is subtle but if you find you're chipping too much and/or the ball is getting too high over the net and isn't penetrating the court you can do drills to work on it.
 
Change your return position (up, back, cheat to the left..) just to throw him off or make him think about it more or to get him to try to hit harder or make him change his mind...also it'll hopefully get him off his rhythm. 1. Try to move forward close to the bounce and take it early, and go down the line and approach... 2. If you don't take it early and you're quick enough, move out wide and hit open stance backhand and go high and deep middle or crosscourt. Just give him different looks. He's supposed to win his serve so don't get frustrated and don't be afraid to try new things and change things up.
 
Just watched the video. Do more of what you did on the point starting at 3:00- High and deep down the middle. Had him on his back foot and he left some balls short. That's your best chance strategy. Trying to overpower him is just not in the cards
 
TennisTroll said:
On a serious note, how do you counter an outwide slice on the ad side that will bounce and hit the side fence? Even if you cheat and hit an amazing backhand return from the doubles ally, the lefty has the entire court open.
Click to expand...

similar question.
on a serious note, how is a lefty supposed to counter an outwide slice on the deuce side that will bounce and hit the side fence? Even if the lefty opponent cheats and hits an amazing backhand return from the doubles ally, the righty has the entire court open.
 
blablavla said:
similar question.
on a serious note, how is a lefty supposed to counter an outwide slice on the deuce side that will bounce and hit the side fence? Even if the lefty opponent cheats and hits an amazing backhand return from the doubles ally, the righty has the entire court open.
Click to expand...
I find that righties are usually not as practiced at hitting a wide serve, because most of the time they are playing another righty and trying to avoid feeding his forehand too much in the deuce court.

As a result, when they do hit a wide slice serve, it usually lacks the vicious can-opener break that most lefties spend a lot of time perfecting.

The trade-off is that usually righties have a tougher/more accurate flat serve and (often) a better kicker than lefties - who often rely on their slice an awful lot. I used to be really weak serving to the deuce court until I made a real effort to learn a solid kicker.

These are all generalisations from my own experience though.
 
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S&V-not_dead_yet said:
I've played him 4 times [and once in doubles]; lost every time. The first 2 were 3rd set TBs and it went downhill from there.

I'm plotting my strategy for the next encounter!
Click to expand...
Have you tried to hit some loopy topspin rollers at him? From what I saw, he likes to be aggressive and take the ball early. This may disrupt his on the rise and controlled-baseline timing.
 
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dominikk1985 said:
BTW an interesting new strategy Rafa used against novaks CC forehand was a short and low DTL slice. Wouldn't use that all the time but sometimes this can hurt the opponent as he has to come forward across all the court, so if he is not comfortable at the net you could use that.
Click to expand...
Thats a great point. I think this is a significant play. It's not worked on often but definitely a good option to test out, thank you!
 
TennisTroll said:
In future, I’ll save my energy and forfeit if I see a lefty like D1 with ATP Points in the other side of the net.
On a serious note, how do you counter an outwide slice on the ad side that will bounce and hit the side fence? Even if you cheat and hit an amazing backhand return from the doubles ally, the lefty has the entire court open.
Click to expand...
I think there are 3 choices for this.

1) step in/diagonally to cut off the angle and make sure the left hand is really driving through the backhand.
2) move way back and let the spin subside, take it after the apex, on its way down to the 2nd bounce. (Better hope they don't start to serve and volley otherwise this plan is toast.)
3) slice it through the court and deep in the center.

Testing out which method gives success can work. Or doing all 2-3 in variation may be the key as well. Depends on the lefty you plan and how well you can hit each type of return.
 
r2473 said:
There is exactly nobody on this site qualified to give you any worthwhile advice.
Click to expand...
If we’re just having a general discussion of the challenges of playing lefties at 4.5+, I reckon that’s something quite a few people on this site can speak to from experience.

I agree that anyone who has had a UTR pushing 12 is unlikely to learn much from the discussion though.
 
Damotuky said:
Change your return position (up, back, cheat to the left..) just to throw him off or make him think about it more or to get him to try to hit harder or make him change his mind...also it'll hopefully get him off his rhythm. 1. Try to move forward close to the bounce and take it early, and go down the line and approach... 2. If you don't take it early and you're quick enough, move out wide and hit open stance backhand and go high and deep middle or crosscourt. Just give him different looks. He's supposed to win his serve so don't get frustrated and don't be afraid to try new things and change things up.
Click to expand...

Changing return positions is key!! Making them have different looks at where you are when they serve will definitely have at least a little effect. You must be a very methodical tennis player judging by your post content.
 
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