How to close the racquet head on impact?

[Taita87]

Hi, i have good mechanics, nice fluid strokes, i have been playing tennis for 13 years in my youth. I started again After a stop of 12 years, now from 2 months.

I am trying to correct my forehand in a Federer way (not that my previous foreh was bad, Just a bit old School). It takes some time.

My forehand was my absolutely strong stroke, now i'm playing One handed backand stronger (i corrected that too).
The problem is that i hit lots of forehands out, sometimes mixing my previous mechanics with the new, sometimes doing it right. Training is a Little better, but i 'm losing matches cause of tons of forehand going out (probably during competitions its easier to mix the mechanics).


One thing that i saw though, watching training video of myself, is that i tend to impact the ball with a perpendicular racquet head relative to floor. I don't close it by 5-10 degrees like you should.

Do you have any tip to re-work this aspect?

 

[golden chicken]

If it's a consistent problem, and your mechanics are otherwise good, I'd suggest a slight grip change.

 

[tennisreflectslife]

check this out:

I think what he says works, and makes sense to me. Especially when I feel I am not putting enough spin. Overall I would say remember to keep a relaxed forearm and use bigger muscle groups whenever your are trying to work on ur technique. Because these two are very necessary for any forehand technique to work.

 

[tennisreflectslife]

delete post

 

[iChen]

What I was having issue with was contact point and timing, not really closing racquet per say but when I hit.

 

[Attila_the_gorilla]

What I was having issue with was contact point and timing, not really closing racquet per say but when I hit.

Yeah, most likely that's his issue too. Contact point not in front enough.

 

[styksnstryngs]

Grip?

 

[Taita87]

Grip 3, but i have small hands, i would prefer almost for sure a 2

I'am posting a video sample.

 

[golden chicken]

I think he meant like, eastern, semiwestern, or western.

 

[Pete Player]

Where exactly is ”out”? Wide on fh side, long or wide on bh side?

Without knowing that, guessing, you are late.


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[Taita87]

A bunch of random strokes, not the best ones nor the worst.
Parallel face to the net and no closing in the First 20cm

 

[styksnstryngs]

You're taking your racquet back too late and running out of time, forcing you to twist your racquet face up so you don't hit the ball into the ground.

 

[Attila_the_gorilla]

Doesn't seem to be too late to me. It's just too much of a low to high swing, not enough forward momentum.

 

[Taita87]

Where exactly is ”out”? Wide on fh side, long or wide on bh side?

Without knowing that, guessing, you are late.


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IT's random, like there s something wrong in basic stroke

 

[Raul_SJ]

Hi, i have good mechanics, nice fluid strokes, i have been playing tennis for 13 years in my youth. I started again After a stop of 12 years, now from 2 months.

I am trying to correct my forehand in a Federer way (not that my previous foreh was bad, Just a bit old School). It takes some time.
...

One thing that i saw though, watching training video of myself, is that i tend to impact the ball with a perpendicular racquet head relative to floor. I don't close it by 5-10 degrees like you should.

Do you have any tip to re-work this aspect?

I try to focus on a consistent contact point out in front and a consistent swing path. I believe my face is approximately vertical or slightly tilted closed but I don't think club players are good enough to consciously and consistently manipulate face angle with 5 degrees of precision -- the contact angle is a function of correct setup, swing path an contact point.

That said, I don't think anyone has answered your OP question on tips to ensure the 10 degree closed angle. Would be interested to hear tips, if there are any, regarding that specific issue of contact angle.

 

[Taita87]

I think he meant like, eastern, semiwestern, or western.

Eastern throughout my career


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[Attila_the_gorilla]

I try to focus on a consistent contact point out in front and a consistent swing path. I believe my face is approximately vertical or slightly tilted closed but I don't think club players are good enough to consciously and consistently manipulate face angle with 5 degrees of precision -- the contact angle is a function of correct setup, swing path an contact point.

That said, I don't think anyone has answered your OP question on tips to ensure the 10 degree closed angle. Would be interested to hear tips, if there are any, regarding that specific issue of contact angle.

Nobody on earth focuses on a specific closed racket angle. They simply have a full swing, make contact out in front and adjust the racket face to get the required trajectory. If the ball keeps going into the net, open the face a bit. If it keeps going too high and long, close it a bit. If it's not completely sub-conscious, you should find another hobby.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

A bunch of random strokes, not the best ones nor the worst.
Parallel face to the net and no closing in the First 20cm

Imo you're not dropping your hand low enough below the contact point.

You're relying completely on the wrist to drop the racquet head below the contact point,

But when you're late (is. Head is not below the contact point), you naturally open your racquet face to compensate.

It's almost as if you spent a lot of time working on generating topspin via an exaggerated windshield, vs focusing on solid contact with a flatter, less wristy, stroke.

Try mini tennis where you're swinging almost from contact,... but focus on getting your hand below the contact

My $0.02


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[Taita87]

Uhm, now that you point it out it seems to me that i could be a little late on contact point...
I am for sure not at Nadal impact point position.

And yes, i am probably using my wrist to lead the stroke too much. That, however, is due to me trying to "modernize" my forehand as i was used to hit it with almost no top spin from wrist whippiness. (you Can see my wrist is somehow tight still now, Watch a Federer video and you will see the difference).

This is a video of me 2 months ago, 0 spin from wrist:

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[FiReFTW]

Uhm, now that you point it out it seems to me that i could be a little late on contact point...
I am for sure not at Nadal impact point position.

And yes, i am probably using my wrist to lead the stroke too much. That, however, is due to me trying to "modernize" my forehand as i was used to hit it with almost no top spin from wrist whippiness. (you Can see my wrist is somehow tight still now, Watch a Federer video and you will see the difference).

This is a video of me 2 months ago, 0 spin from wrist:

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You seem to be under the impression that topspin is created via wrist, that is completely false.
Top spin is created from a low to high swingpath, and if you use ur kinetic chain properly and racquet drop bellow the ball, the racquet rotation around that you might mistake for a wrist snap is a natural side effect of pre streched muscles being released into the shot.
Its nothing close to being an active wrist rotation or wrist snap, the only thing similar to that might be sometimes on a shorter ball where you want to take away some pace so then you use less penetration but add some active rotation around but with ur shoudler and forearm not so much ur wrist, or very slightly, thats a good thing on shorter balls where you want more topspin and less penetration, but completely useless on normal groundstrokes, you have nothing on those shots.

 

[Taita87]

You seem to be under the impression that topspin is created via wrist, that is completely false.
Top spin is created from a low to high swingpath, and if you use ur kinetic chain properly and racquet drop bellow the ball, the racquet rotation around that you might mistake for a wrist snap is a natural side effect of pre streched muscles being released into the shot.
Its nothing close to being an active wrist rotation or wrist snap, the only thing similar to that might be sometimes on a shorter ball where you want to take away some pace so then you use less penetration but add some active rotation around but with ur shoudler and forearm not so much ur wrist, or very slightly.

We agree with that, don't take me wrong.
What I mean is that I was swinging with tight muscles resulting in a non moving wrist and a racquet head almost parallel to the net throughout the stroke (till the final too).

I know where spin comes from, I exaggerated the concept because I was doing the opposite till one month ago: kinetic chain stopping at the elbow caused by tight forearm muscles


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[Deleted member 23235]

Uhm, now that you point it out it seems to me that i could be a little late on contact point...
I am for sure not at Nadal impact point position.

And yes, i am probably using my wrist to lead the stroke too much. That, however, is due to me trying to "modernize" my forehand as i was used to hit it with almost no top spin from wrist whippiness. (you Can see my wrist is somehow tight still now, Watch a Federer video and you will see the difference).

This is a video of me 2 months ago, 0 spin from wrist:

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ironically this vid looks 100x better than the first vid.
in the first vid, if you say you're not getting enough topspin,...
get under the ball more and close your racquet face slightly more.... think about driving the top edge of the racquet into the bottom of the ball...

if you're looking at "modernizing" by "adding" more "lag and snap", do so by adding that to your first-vid-stroke.
and accomplish that by gradually loosening your grip.
IMO, at your current phase of stroke development, just get your hand under the contact point more, and close y our racquet face slightly more.

my $0.02

 

[FiReFTW]

We agree with that, don't take me wrong.
What I mean is that I was swinging with tight muscles resulting in a non moving wrist and a racquet head almost parallel to the net throughout the stroke (till the final too).

I know where spin comes from, I exaggerated the concept because I was doing the opposite till one month ago: kinetic chain stopping at the elbow caused by tight forearm muscles


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I think ur going about it wrong tho, look at this comparison with Roger


Here is your forehand, look at the swing path of your forehand, the red is after these frames ( didn't wanna use too many pics), its the shape of your swing:

Now look at one forehand from Roger, where he drops the racquet similarly lower than the ball as you do:

As you can see he is swinging MUCH more THROUGH the ball than you do, so his forehand is much heavier and has much more pace on it than yours

Now here is one example of a forehand where Roger wants to add more spin to it and make it possible a bigger arc but most importantly more spin:

As you can see he drops the racquet much more bellow the ball here than you do, but his overall swingpath is much more THROUGH the ball still than yours is

The point is, u don't have any drive on your forehands, its only spin that you are producing mostly, with no drive and penetration.

Now its not like your forehand is WRONG, it is not, however for baseline hitting it is WRONG, because your shots will lack penetration and heavyness and will be more loopy and sure have decent topspin but very loopy and not enough on them.

Your forehand is a good one to use sometimes on shorter balls where you want more spin and control and less plow through to not hit it long, tho even for those short balls you might hit it with a bit more forward swingpath and more closed racquet face as opposed to such an extreme upward swing.

Its also a decent technique to use on balls ur late and have a late contact and maybe stretched outside the baseline, so you add alot of spin and take away pace to get the ball in with a late contact and also give urself more time to get back to the "middle" of the baseline.
Tho in cases where ur not so stretched and dont want to give urself more time a buggy whip followthrough might be a better option as it gives you the possibility of more drive and pace sometimes when you want to be more aggressive.

But most importantly stop forcing this wrist snap, if you drop the racquet lower enough and swing upward AND forward, it will happen naturaly if you use ur kinetic chain well AND your arm is relaxed and not TIGHT.

 

[Taita87]

I think ur going about it wrong tho, look at this comparison with Roger


Here is your forehand, look at the swing path of your forehand, the red is after these frames ( didn't wanna use too many pics), its the shape of your swing:

Now look at one forehand from Roger, where he drops the racquet similarly lower than the ball as you do:

As you can see he is swinging MUCH more THROUGH the ball than you do, so his forehand is much heavier and has much more pace on it than yours

Now here is one example of a forehand where Roger wants to add more spin to it and make it possible a bigger arc but most importantly more spin:

As you can see he drops the racquet much more bellow the ball here than you do, but his overall swingpath is much more THROUGH the ball still than yours is

The point is, u don't have any drive on your forehands, its only spin that you are producing mostly, with no drive and penetration.

Now its not like your forehand is WRONG, it is not, however for baseline hitting it is WRONG, because your shots will lack penetration and heavyness and will be more loopy and sure have decent topspin but very loopy and not enough on them.

Your forehand is a good one to use sometimes on shorter balls where you want more spin and control and less plow through to not hit it long, tho even for those short balls you might hit it with a bit more forward swingpath and more closed racquet face as opposed to such an extreme upward swing.

Its also a decent technique to use on balls ur late and have a late contact and maybe stretched outside the baseline, so you add alot of spin and take away pace to get the ball in with a late contact and also give urself more time to get back to the "middle" of the baseline.
Tho in cases where ur not so stretched and dont want to give urself more time a buggy whip followthrough might be a better option as it gives you the possibility of more drive and pace sometimes when you want to be more aggressive.

But most importantly stop forcing this wrist snap, if you drop the racquet lower enough and swing upward AND forward, it will happen naturaly if you use ur kinetic chain well AND your arm is relaxed and not TIGHT.

I don't know, it seems to me quite the contrary, or to be more specific I agree with you on the general line but regarding my forehands going out I think the problem is in the racquet head open... Even if I follow a steeper path with the racquet, the ball will fly, think of it using a opened head of-5, -10 degrees.

How many things there are to learn...

Now that you all wrote your thoughts I think it's a mixed problem of hitting not sufficiently in front of me - my inherited wrist stiffness that's forcing me to"intentionally" snap without solving the problem - kinetic adjustments


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[Taita87]

ironically this vid looks 100x better than the first vid.
in the first vid, if you say you're not getting enough topspin,...
get under the ball more and close your racquet face slightly more.... think about driving the top edge of the racquet into the bottom of the ball...

if you're looking at "modernizing" by "adding" more "lag and snap", do so by adding that to your first-vid-stroke.
and accomplish that by gradually loosening your grip.
IMO, at your current phase of stroke development, just get your hand under the contact point more, and close y our racquet face slightly more.

my $0.02

Also to me... But I had the same problem with that old stroke, flying long. Consider that you're seeing a slow motion versus a real speed video, too. And also, I chose strokes where it's evident the error.
I always sucked at backhand, and now it's better then my forehand.
I hit a good back every 3 (consistency and timing not up yet) but when it happens it's 10 times better, in my opinion because I have a loose arm and no problem of stiffness


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[FiReFTW]

Most certainly the racquet face is the problem like you say, but like @nytennisaddict said already, simply close the face slightly and keep adjusting it till the trajectory is right and the ball does not go long, sometimes people are not very aware how their face is at contact, they think its flat or slightly closed but in reality its probably even open and the shots are flying way long.
Another possibility is contact point, that could also be causing the issue.
So you just need to keep slightly adjusting these two things till you find the right balance and then focus on that.

 

[Pete Player]

Really nice movement. The only thing, I saw on the first 45 s video, was, that you were a touch late and needed to cut the drop, which was ok on the other shot in that clip. Attack angle gets parallel, and the ball releases flatter, than you’d like.

I wouldn’t change the grip though.

If you have no time to drop the racket fully, try to brush up a bit more to get more spin, cause to me that looks really powerfull stroke and motion. Good job!



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[TennisCJC]

Personally, I think you should forget about closing the face. If you are consistently getting a lack of spin and a high trajectory (maybe too high) than maybe shift your FH grip a bit toward a SW. If you are getting good spin and controlling trajectory with your current stroke, I would just work on hitting through the ball a bit more while maintaining good spin and placement.

2 visuals that help with hitting through: 1. imagine your racket head being just 1 racket head width below contact at the lowest point and only 1 racket head width above contact about a foot after contact, and 2. the old envision hitting up and THRU 3 tennis balls at contact. The first visual keeps you from ascending too steeply and the 2nd visual keeps you from pulling up or across too soon.

The last thing you want to do is to try to alter the wrist angle during or near contact. Once I have started by forward swing, I think of it as a stroke and it is set along the swing path. I don't "alter" the wrist or racket face angle once forward movement is started. It is sort of like the swing path through contact and the follow thru is set at least a foot or 2 before contact and that's it. I don't lock the wrist but I don't ever think "ok, i need to change my wrist angle now that I am 6 inches before contact".

 

[golden chicken]

To me, the shape of your arm as you swing and your wrist position would again, lead me to suggest using a semiwestern grip or something closer to it than eastern. Your second video is way better looking to me too.

 

[iChen]

I think Tomaz did say once you should rep slowly and repeat until you find that “correct” contact point and angle for you.

 

[Taita87]

To me, the shape of your arm as you swing and your wrist position would again, lead me to suggest using a semiwestern grip or something closer to it than eastern. Your second video is way better looking to me too.

Lol we are three now !
It's probably due to me not being confident with the changes I made.
Anyway the more I look at those video the more I think it's a problem of being late.
I use a eastern no doubt.


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[Taita87]

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[Taita87]

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[tennisreflectslife]

A bunch of random strokes, not the best ones nor the worst.
Parallel face to the net and no closing in the First 20cm

I feel your wrist release is happening later than it should (it should happen during the shot/contact). This can be fixed by starting ur swing early, meeting the ball more in front. You can try with someone (or urself) throwing the ball from behind you and then you reach for the ball to hit it. This can help with getting the fell of hitting the ball out in front. But eventually its just about you finding the timing. Your stroke looks a bit tense due to off timing too, but i suspect it will smoother once u fix that. Hope this helps!

 

[tennisreflectslife]

delete

 

[tennisreflectslife]

delete

 

[tennisreflectslife]

delete

 

[esgee48]

Someone told me they lead with the top edge of the racquet. That forces then to close the face of their racquet before contact.

 

[kramer woodie]

We agree with that, don't take me wrong.
What I mean is that I was swinging with tight muscles resulting in a non moving wrist and a racquet head almost parallel to the net throughout the stroke (till the final too).

I know where spin comes from, I exaggerated the concept because I was doing the opposite till one month ago: kinetic chain stopping at the elbow caused by tight forearm muscles


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You can thank FiReFTW for the 3 pic enlargements. I can see immediately what the problem is. 1. You taking the racquet to far back, your
elbow is behind your side. 2. Your moving the racquet by pulling your elbow in toward your body to try and generate pace. 3. Your so-called
windshield wiper is useless.

Now look at FiReFtw's stills of Federer. The arm is straight, the release of the racquet comes from the shoulder muscles, not the elbow
or the wrist. Now find some slow motion of Federer and you will see the elbow stays about even with his right hip. The so called take back
is just the racquet, hand, and elbow straighten. The upper arm does not move back much more at all. The elbow and arm are up and away
from the body out to his side, not behind him. The releases caused by his rear leg straightening and pushing forward. The wrist lag is
created by this. The arm will be straight with the wrist back and the string bed pointing towards the ground. The shoulder then fires the
racquet with the butt cap moving forward first, starting a throwing motion. The racquet head will accelerate to keep up with the butt
cap. Pure physics. Throw the racquet out away from your body and relax your arm, wrist and grip. Your natural body physics knows how
to do it, instead your trying to think out the motion.

Relax, quit thinking so hard, and just throw the racquet out at the ball. You will find the follow through will occur naturally. Get your
elbow up and away from your body and don't try to create pace pulling the elbow into your stomach. Good Luck/Have Fun!!!

Aloha

 

[Dragy]

Extra to what’s said by guys above, I came to a conclusion that bent arm/tucked in elbow compromises racquet angle with easternish grips. You either work on better spacing, which enables you to really reach out and forward for the contact, or you settle with bent arm (Nole, Stan, Nishikori) technique, but turn your grip to SW to get naturally proper racquet position by contact.

 

[SinjinCooper]

Extra to what’s said by guys above, I came to a conclusion that bent arm/tucked in elbow compromises racquet angle with easternish grips. You either work on better spacing, which enables you to really reach out and forward for the contact, or you settle with bent arm (Nole, Stan, Nishikori) technique, but turn your grip to SW to get naturally proper racquet position by contact.

No.

The bent arm is the natural swing for all forehands, and eastern is the most basic of them all, putting the hand in the strongest position to support the racquet and redirect the ball. It's simply not an ultra-modern swing, and isn't overly focused on certain elements of modern technique. "Pat the dog" pretty much disappears. Not that lag isn't created - it's simply that the wrist and hand fall into position such that the racquet doesn't naturally fall at that angle, but rather hinges backward. You don't have to travel backwards in time very far to see it as the dominant stroke in all of tennis. Sampras, Lendl, Wilander et al. Still works great today, and is far, far far, far, far, far, far, FAR, far, far easier for most people to develop facility with.

What's more, the path to mastery of more advanced forehand techniques comes much easier if you work to understand the classic eastern first. Learning how it works is to the forehand what learning to throw is for the serve: a building block. It's THE simplest way to mastery of hitting forehands without arming them. (A skill most players never develop precisely because they want to skip the essential building blocks.)

Not that there's anything wrong with a straight arm eastern. It's an excellent stroke, and in many ways better suited to the modern game. But it's a forced hitting structure that requires manipulation of the body (and an enhanced understanding of what the body is doing) rather than simple obedience to biomechanics. The Sampras eastern is pure obedience to biomechanics in the same way the Feliciano Lopez serve is. Makes them ideal templates for learning in ways that, e.g., a Roddick serve or a Kyrgios forehand can not be.

If you want to progress from zero to Kyrgios on the FH, going through Sampras is a far faster route than trying to go straight there.

 

[Dragy]

No.

The bent arm is the natural swing for all forehands, and eastern is the most basic of them all, putting the hand in the strongest position to support the racquet and redirect the ball. It's simply not an ultra-modern swing, and isn't overly focused on certain elements of modern technique. "Pat the dog" pretty much disappears. Not that lag isn't created - it's simply that the wrist and hand fall into position such that the racquet doesn't naturally fall at that angle, but rather hinges backward. You don't have to travel backwards in time very far to see it as the dominant stroke in all of tennis. Sampras, Lendl, Wilander et al. Still works great today, and is far, far far, far, far, far, far, FAR, far, far easier for most people to develop facility with.

What's more, the path to mastery of more advanced forehand techniques comes much easier if you work to understand the classic eastern first. Learning how it works is to the forehand what learning to throw is for the serve: a building block. It's THE simplest way to mastery of hitting forehands without arming them. (A skill most players never develop precisely because they want to skip the essential building blocks.)

Not that there's anything wrong with a straight arm eastern. It's an excellent stroke, and in many ways better suited to the modern game. But it's a forced hitting structure that requires manipulation of the body (and an enhanced understanding of what the body is doing) rather than simple obedience to biomechanics. The Sampras eastern is pure obedience to biomechanics in the same way the Feliciano Lopez serve is. Makes them ideal templates for learning in ways that, e.g., a Roddick serve or a Kyrgios forehand can not be.

If you want to progress from zero to Kyrgios on the FH, going through Sampras is a far faster route than trying to go straight there.

Classical eastern forehand has contact point in different location. You can have naturally vertical racquet face with conti as well - if you male contact level with your body. I ended with Sampras-like FH at some point - bent tucked arm and torso not rotated to face the target by contact.

Can you provide an example of a current ATP pro hitting bent arm with eastern grip? I’m not claiming I’m 100% true with my claims, but my experience is that I need to manipulate my wrist having strong eastern grip to ensure racquet not opening up whenever I fail to get enough spacing for a straightish-arm swing. When my arm is straighter, and contact farther away to the side, my ISR is natural for both keeping the racquet face vertical-to-slightly-closed and still laid back enough to not hook the shot to the left.

 

[Steve Williams]

Hi, i have good mechanics, nice fluid strokes, i have been playing tennis for 13 years in my youth. I started again After a stop of 12 years, now from 2 months.

I am trying to correct my forehand in a Federer way (not that my previous foreh was bad, Just a bit old School). It takes some time.

My forehand was my absolutely strong stroke, now i'm playing One handed backand stronger (i corrected that too).
The problem is that i hit lots of forehands out, sometimes mixing my previous mechanics with the new, sometimes doing it right. Training is a Little better, but i 'm losing matches cause of tons of forehand going out (probably during competitions its easier to mix the mechanics).


One thing that i saw though, watching training video of myself, is that i tend to impact the ball with a perpendicular racquet head relative to floor. I don't close it by 5-10 degrees like you should.

Do you have any tip to re-work this aspect?

I have the same problem and I'm trying to correct it. Sometimes I over-do it and hit into the net. The worst of both worlds

I found that when I opened the face of the racket too much I also finished out in front like with the old eastern grip I used to have. I carried on over the shoulder but it was more an after-the-fact adjustment rather than a completely natural finish. For me, it helps to concentrate on swinging from the start so my right wrist comes around and hits my left shoulder without deviation. If that happens, the racket face generally stays at about the right angle throughout the swing. Also I try come onto the ball and not lean back.

 

[Attila_the_gorilla]

Maybe you could post a real speed video of your experimentation, slow motion makes it hard to get a feel for dynamics.
Your original forehand is great, no need to change it.
If your launch angle is too high, you may simply just need to increase the string tension a little.

 

[Taita87]

Today it went a lot better, I tried to impose not to open the face at all.
It's a compromise between my ex forehand and the modified one, I think I have to work again and again: I lost the compact coil, going back to a full stroke and sometimes I found myself hitting not sufficiently further causing the arm to be bent again.

Anyway, it was definitely better and I finally saw consistency and heaviness.

 

[dominikk1985]

Closing the racket to create spin is a myth, spin is created by the rackets vertical acceleration. Federer has a flat arm path but the racket still goes up due to the arm rotation. The racket also doesn't further close, it closes if you hit below center and opens if you hit above center
This video here shows that pretty good

Pros still hit with a slightly closed racket head but that is mostly to counter the incoming spin and prevent the ball from going high but you want to maintain that angle before, at and after contact.

Btw I don't agree with the guy in the video that top pros intentionally hit the ball below center

 

[FiReFTW]

Closing the racket to create spin is a myth, spin is created by the rackets vertical acceleration. Federer has a flat arm path but the racket still goes up due to the arm rotation. The racket also doesn't further close, it closes if you hit below center and opens if you hit above center
This video here shows that pretty good

Pros still hit with a slightly closed racket head but that is mostly to counter the incoming spin and prevent the ball from going high but you want to maintain that angle before, at and after contact.

Btw I don't agree with the guy in the video that top pros intentionally hit the ball below center

Nope

 

[RetroSpin]

Today it went a lot better, I tried to impose not to open the face at all.
It's a compromise between my ex forehand and the modified one, I think I have to work again and again: I lost the compact coil, going back to a full stroke and sometimes I found myself hitting not sufficiently further causing the arm to be bent again.

Anyway, it was definitely better and I finally saw consistency and heaviness.

First off, most of the advice you have received here is either nonsense or useless. You have a nice looking stroke that is better than most of the people offering critiques. Stick with Pete Player and you won't go wrong however.

I see a few things, FWIW. The first thing is, you definitely have a hybrid old/new stroke. You do not get the racquet head laid back when you start the forward swing, which is pretty much the hallmark of the modern technique. The good news is plenty of people play high level tennis using your technique.

I agree with some others that your contact point is late. This is due in part to your wrist not being laid back enough. Compare the racquet/forearm angle at impact you achieve with Fed or Nadal.

Lack of lag coming into impact means you are compromised in generating power by pulling your hand across. So instead you have to swing your arm fast, which means all your timing becomes more critical.

It looks to me like you are not focusing on the ball through impact. Modern technique involves holding as much lag as possible as late as possible then releasing it by pulling your hand across and up. If you are not seeing the ball through impact, the timing of this becomes impossible and you will end up reaching for the ball.

Topspin is achieved largely through a tilted racquet face and somewhat by an upward path and the windshield wiper move. To get the proper balance, it is useful to hit drop feeds.

In summary, there is nothing wrong with your current technique, although I would not classify it as modern technique. You can work on tweaking it or you can go full bore on developing a modern stroke. Your choice and neither one is clearly right or wrong. Here is a great model for a modern ATP FH. You can see how he pulls his hand across and accelerates the face upward on a constant plane.

 

[Pete Player]

Pros still hit with a slightly closed racket head but that is mostly to counter the incoming spin and prevent the ball from going high but you want to maintain that angle before, at and after contact.

Btw I don't agree with the guy in the video that top pros intentionally hit the ball below center

Second very much the last paragraph.

The hit is either in the sweet spot or a touch beneath the center. The visible closing and the racket turning over the ball is not something for example Federer does. The culprit for it to happen is a relaxed wrist and to some extent also the loose forearm.

There are physical truths, which are present in everything humans do. And in this case the impuls of the contact flips the racket head over. Not even Houdini would be able to close the racket head as fast as it does, when Fede misshits half an inch the sweat spot.





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[Taita87]

First off, most of the advice you have received here is either nonsense or useless. You have a nice looking stroke that is better than most of the people offering critiques. Stick with Pete Player and you won't go wrong however.

I see a few things, FWIW. The first thing is, you definitely have a hybrid old/new stroke. You do not get the racquet head laid back when you start the forward swing, which is pretty much the hallmark of the modern technique. The good news is plenty of people play high level tennis using your technique.

I agree with some others that your contact point is late. This is due in part to your wrist not being laid back enough. Compare the racquet/forearm angle at impact you achieve with Fed or Nadal.

Lack of lag coming into impact means you are compromised in generating power by pulling your hand across. So instead you have to swing your arm fast, which means all your timing becomes more critical.

It looks to me like you are not focusing on the ball through impact. Modern technique involves holding as much lag as possible as late as possible then releasing it by pulling your hand across and up. If you are not seeing the ball through impact, the timing of this becomes impossible and you will end up reaching for the ball.

Topspin is achieved largely through a tilted racquet face and somewhat by an upward path and the windshield wiper move. To get the proper balance, it is useful to hit drop feeds.

In summary, there is nothing wrong with your current technique, although I would not classify it as modern technique. You can work on tweaking it or you can go full bore on developing a modern stroke. Your choice and neither one is clearly right or wrong. Here is a great model for a modern ATP FH. You can see how he pulls his hand across and accelerates the face upward on a constant plane.

I think the"problem" is the lag, now that you pointed that out.
I am used to hold the racquet tight, and in the last video I did it again. That s why it was similar to my first video of two months ago, before trying to insert the lag.

I'll work on that aspect, guess it will take some time to get accustomed to it, resulting in a transition period of that crap movement I'm doing when I change the mechanics.

And yes, I'm not following the ball through impact with eyes.


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