Tennis_Bum
Professional
Is the draw posted yet? I don't see it.
How to contact Patrick McEnroe??
- Thread starter Milan
- Start date
Is the draw posted yet? I don't see it.
Here is from the above NY times article, real nice article around US open last year.
Critics See Drop in Talent as U.S.T.A. Grapples With Player Development
By SAM TANENHAUS
Published: September 11, 2011 Recommend
Share
Only the best juniors — 64 boys and 64 girls — compete in the junior Open. And they come from all over the world. Most are full-time players, and a fair number have met in other high-profile tournaments.
Their struggle to reach the professional ranks reflects the gladiatorial nature of tennis, its head-to-head matchups and its unforgiving rankings. At the junior level, the players scramble not for glory or riches, but for training and attention, and in the case of the Americans, the limited subsidies dispensed by the player development program of the United States Tennis Association.
A large number of the most promising youngsters, starting at 11 or 12, are being groomed at the U.S.T.A.’s 19 regional centers, all established since 2008. The elite — like Christina McHale and Sloane Stephens, who made a splash in the first week of this year’s Open — are recruited for one of the three main centers in Boca Raton, Fla., and Carson, Calif., and at the Billie Jean King National Tennis Center in Queens. Grace Min, who trains at Boca Raton, won the girls tournament at the Open on Sunday, beating top-seeded Caroline Garcia of France.
“We started working with 16-year-old kids three years ago,” said Martin Blackman, who heads talent identification and development for the U.S.T.A., a program created to help American players catch up with those in other countries.
For decades, American fans were used to waves of fresh-faced stars, many of them teenagers: Jimmy Connors and Chris Evert in the 1970s; John McEnroe in the ’80s; Andre Agassi, Pete Sampras, Jim Courier, Michael Chang and Jennifer Capriati in the ’90s; Andy Roddick and the Williams sisters in the 2000s. Most were taught by private coaches.
But that approach no longer seems to be working, especially now that other nations have developed comprehensive programs.
“Without a system, you’re at the mercy of prodigies and private programs,” Blackman said. “The expense of developing a world-class player from age 10 to 20 is astronomical — training, traveling, equipment.”
Some question the U.S.T.A.’s results. Three years into the program, only four American men and three women are ranked among the world’s top 50, and none are younger than 25.
“American tennis is in the sorriest state it has ever been,” said Tim Mayotte, a former top-10 player.
Mayotte resigned as the head of a program in Flushing over what he called “very openly spoken reservations” about the U.S.T.A.’s approach. In a recent interview, he criticized “antiquated coaching methods” that emphasize long hours swatting balls rather than learning technique and movement.
Mayotte also said the U.S.T.A. was too insular, opportunistically luring talented players and putting them under the tutelage of inexperienced staff. He favors the approach of the French tennis federation, which identifies and supports independent coaches who do good work.
The U.S.T.A. will earn an estimated $200 million from the Open this year, and a good deal of it will go into player development, as it has since 2008.
“I can’t tell you the overall figure,” Blackman said. “Our regional training centers receive anywhere from $8,000 to $100,000 a year depending on the program and players. I don’t know how that compares to programs overseas.”
For the juniors, first-round play began Sept. 4 on the outer courts at the National Tennis Center. A handful of spectators were sprinkled in the bleachers, including coaches, parents and other players. Yet the excitement was palpable. A good showing could lead to an invitation to a summer camp or a training session or even result in a wild-card spot in the qualifying tournament for next year’s main draw.
Jack Sock, 18, who won last year’s junior Open and the national junior tournament in July in Kalamazoo, Mich., earned a wild card to this year’s Open draw. He reached the second round, losing to Andy Roddick, and won the mixed doubles title with another American teenager, 19-year-old Melanie Oudin.
Another American, Bjorn Fratangelo, 18, won the junior French Open in May, the first American to capture the title since John McEnroe in 1977. Fratangelo also played in the qualifying tournament for the United States Open’s main draw but was dismissed in the first round by a brawny journeyman, Fritz Wolmarans of South Africa.
“There was no way he had a chance against that guy,” said Mario Fratangelo, Bjorn’s father, who named him for his idol Bjorn Borg. “He was 6-3, big shoulders, just too strong.”
That match, played on the outer courts at the National Tennis Center, possibly fed Fratangelo’s doubts about turning professional.
“I’ll take the next year to turn to think it over,” he said.
Yet Fratangelo receives considerable money and encouragement from the U.S.T.A. With his father as his main coach, he trains intermittently in Boca Raton.
“I like playing the kids there,” said Fratangelo, who added that the coaches “put me in practices and drills.”
He also does “whatever they think I should do: running, sprinting, not a lot of weights. “
Fratangelo may need to rethink weight training. A shade under 6 feet, with a wiry build, he could have trouble holding his own in an increasingly physical game.
On the men’s circuit, players like the 6-9 John Isner and the 6-7 Kevin Anderson are no longer exceptions, and Jo-Wilfried Tsonga, at 6-2 and 200 pounds, covers the court with catlike grace. Even the women are taller. Compared with the 6-2 Maria Sharapova, Caroline Wozniacki, at 5-10, seems merely average .
“Being tall is one big component,” said Mark Kovacs, a sports scientist in charge of fitness at the Boca Raton facility. “Also being extremely fast.”
This makes it hard to assess players ages 11 to 14, Kovacs said, when their bodies are still forming. Clues can be found in a player’s lineage — the height of parents, grandparents, even uncles and aunts. Then the monitoring begins.
“Monthly height measurements are important,” Kovacs said. “Seated-height measurements are important.”
Players who enter the U.S.T.A. program are also screened for muscle imbalances and weaknesses that could hamper their progress. High-tech rackets and strings enable players to hit the ball harder and with more spin while keeping it in play.
“Tennis is now all about defense,” Kovacs said. “It’s about lateral movement. And this in turn requires foot speed, along with power in the hips and core.”
The dominant players of the moment are not creative shot makers like McEnroe and Roger Federer, who end points quickly, but counterpunchers like Rafael Nadal and Novak Djokovic, highly athletic versions of the “grinders” from the past. They hit with power from all angles and wear down opponents through superior strength and speed.
These attributes mattered less when Boris Becker and Chang won Grand Slam titles at 17. Today, success at such an early age is unheard of. Players peak later, sometimes in their mid-20s.
This means longer, and costlier, apprenticeships. And if they top off physically, they can go the way of Oudin, a sensation at 17 at the 2009 Open who has since attained middling results in singles, or Donald Young, a prodigy at 15 who lacks the size of many other pros. Young, now 22, finally made a strong run at the United States Open, reaching the fourth round.
In perhaps the most exciting first-round junior match, Alexios Halebian, a 17-year-old from Glendale, Calif., pulled out a three-set victory over fourth-seeded Thiago Moura Monteiro of Brazil.
Halebian’s mother, Asmik, and his brother Edmund were among the small gathering in the bleachers, quietly applauding.
“We give him all the support we can,” Asmik Halebian said. “Many years, many thousands of dollars. More than I can count.”
She is a cake designer, and her husband is a baker. The couple emigrated from Armenia more than 20 years ago. She enrolled her sons in tennis lessons. Alexios’s talent soon emerged.
“The teacher said one day he will be playing here,” she said, gesturing toward the court. When Alexios was 13, the Halebians entrusted him to the U.S.T.A.
Now 17, he has been living at the Boca Raton center for four years, executing on-court drills, building strength through the fitness regimens devised by Kovacs and playing tournaments. He also attends school there.
“We see him sometimes,”Asmik Halebian said. “At Thanksgiving and Christmas. All the time he travels. The U.S.T.A. covers his expenses. We cover ours,” including airfare to the Open.
Jay Berger, the U.S.T.A.’s head men’s coach, who watched the third set, assessed Halebian’s tools.
“Good serve, moves well, good intangibles,” he said. “He needs to solidify the rest of his game — his ground strokes.”
A college scholarship could someday come, but Halebian chose another route: the lower rungs of the pro tour.
It was clear he had developed the demeanor of a pro. After defeating Monteiro, Halebian peeled off his sweaty shirt, autographed tennis balls for a couple of fans and accepted the good-natured teasing from some star-struck teenage boys.
Critics See Drop in Talent as U.S.T.A. Grapples With Player Development
By SAM TANENHAUS
Published: September 11, 2011 Recommend
Share
Only the best juniors — 64 boys and 64 girls — compete in the junior Open. And they come from all over the world. Most are full-time players, and a fair number have met in other high-profile tournaments.
Their struggle to reach the professional ranks reflects the gladiatorial nature of tennis, its head-to-head matchups and its unforgiving rankings. At the junior level, the players scramble not for glory or riches, but for training and attention, and in the case of the Americans, the limited subsidies dispensed by the player development program of the United States Tennis Association.
A large number of the most promising youngsters, starting at 11 or 12, are being groomed at the U.S.T.A.’s 19 regional centers, all established since 2008. The elite — like Christina McHale and Sloane Stephens, who made a splash in the first week of this year’s Open — are recruited for one of the three main centers in Boca Raton, Fla., and Carson, Calif., and at the Billie Jean King National Tennis Center in Queens. Grace Min, who trains at Boca Raton, won the girls tournament at the Open on Sunday, beating top-seeded Caroline Garcia of France.
“We started working with 16-year-old kids three years ago,” said Martin Blackman, who heads talent identification and development for the U.S.T.A., a program created to help American players catch up with those in other countries.
For decades, American fans were used to waves of fresh-faced stars, many of them teenagers: Jimmy Connors and Chris Evert in the 1970s; John McEnroe in the ’80s; Andre Agassi, Pete Sampras, Jim Courier, Michael Chang and Jennifer Capriati in the ’90s; Andy Roddick and the Williams sisters in the 2000s. Most were taught by private coaches.
But that approach no longer seems to be working, especially now that other nations have developed comprehensive programs.
“Without a system, you’re at the mercy of prodigies and private programs,” Blackman said. “The expense of developing a world-class player from age 10 to 20 is astronomical — training, traveling, equipment.”
Some question the U.S.T.A.’s results. Three years into the program, only four American men and three women are ranked among the world’s top 50, and none are younger than 25.
“American tennis is in the sorriest state it has ever been,” said Tim Mayotte, a former top-10 player.
Mayotte resigned as the head of a program in Flushing over what he called “very openly spoken reservations” about the U.S.T.A.’s approach. In a recent interview, he criticized “antiquated coaching methods” that emphasize long hours swatting balls rather than learning technique and movement.
Mayotte also said the U.S.T.A. was too insular, opportunistically luring talented players and putting them under the tutelage of inexperienced staff. He favors the approach of the French tennis federation, which identifies and supports independent coaches who do good work.
The U.S.T.A. will earn an estimated $200 million from the Open this year, and a good deal of it will go into player development, as it has since 2008.
“I can’t tell you the overall figure,” Blackman said. “Our regional training centers receive anywhere from $8,000 to $100,000 a year depending on the program and players. I don’t know how that compares to programs overseas.”
For the juniors, first-round play began Sept. 4 on the outer courts at the National Tennis Center. A handful of spectators were sprinkled in the bleachers, including coaches, parents and other players. Yet the excitement was palpable. A good showing could lead to an invitation to a summer camp or a training session or even result in a wild-card spot in the qualifying tournament for next year’s main draw.
Jack Sock, 18, who won last year’s junior Open and the national junior tournament in July in Kalamazoo, Mich., earned a wild card to this year’s Open draw. He reached the second round, losing to Andy Roddick, and won the mixed doubles title with another American teenager, 19-year-old Melanie Oudin.
Another American, Bjorn Fratangelo, 18, won the junior French Open in May, the first American to capture the title since John McEnroe in 1977. Fratangelo also played in the qualifying tournament for the United States Open’s main draw but was dismissed in the first round by a brawny journeyman, Fritz Wolmarans of South Africa.
“There was no way he had a chance against that guy,” said Mario Fratangelo, Bjorn’s father, who named him for his idol Bjorn Borg. “He was 6-3, big shoulders, just too strong.”
That match, played on the outer courts at the National Tennis Center, possibly fed Fratangelo’s doubts about turning professional.
“I’ll take the next year to turn to think it over,” he said.
Yet Fratangelo receives considerable money and encouragement from the U.S.T.A. With his father as his main coach, he trains intermittently in Boca Raton.
“I like playing the kids there,” said Fratangelo, who added that the coaches “put me in practices and drills.”
He also does “whatever they think I should do: running, sprinting, not a lot of weights. “
Fratangelo may need to rethink weight training. A shade under 6 feet, with a wiry build, he could have trouble holding his own in an increasingly physical game.
On the men’s circuit, players like the 6-9 John Isner and the 6-7 Kevin Anderson are no longer exceptions, and Jo-Wilfried Tsonga, at 6-2 and 200 pounds, covers the court with catlike grace. Even the women are taller. Compared with the 6-2 Maria Sharapova, Caroline Wozniacki, at 5-10, seems merely average .
“Being tall is one big component,” said Mark Kovacs, a sports scientist in charge of fitness at the Boca Raton facility. “Also being extremely fast.”
This makes it hard to assess players ages 11 to 14, Kovacs said, when their bodies are still forming. Clues can be found in a player’s lineage — the height of parents, grandparents, even uncles and aunts. Then the monitoring begins.
“Monthly height measurements are important,” Kovacs said. “Seated-height measurements are important.”
Players who enter the U.S.T.A. program are also screened for muscle imbalances and weaknesses that could hamper their progress. High-tech rackets and strings enable players to hit the ball harder and with more spin while keeping it in play.
“Tennis is now all about defense,” Kovacs said. “It’s about lateral movement. And this in turn requires foot speed, along with power in the hips and core.”
The dominant players of the moment are not creative shot makers like McEnroe and Roger Federer, who end points quickly, but counterpunchers like Rafael Nadal and Novak Djokovic, highly athletic versions of the “grinders” from the past. They hit with power from all angles and wear down opponents through superior strength and speed.
These attributes mattered less when Boris Becker and Chang won Grand Slam titles at 17. Today, success at such an early age is unheard of. Players peak later, sometimes in their mid-20s.
This means longer, and costlier, apprenticeships. And if they top off physically, they can go the way of Oudin, a sensation at 17 at the 2009 Open who has since attained middling results in singles, or Donald Young, a prodigy at 15 who lacks the size of many other pros. Young, now 22, finally made a strong run at the United States Open, reaching the fourth round.
In perhaps the most exciting first-round junior match, Alexios Halebian, a 17-year-old from Glendale, Calif., pulled out a three-set victory over fourth-seeded Thiago Moura Monteiro of Brazil.
Halebian’s mother, Asmik, and his brother Edmund were among the small gathering in the bleachers, quietly applauding.
“We give him all the support we can,” Asmik Halebian said. “Many years, many thousands of dollars. More than I can count.”
She is a cake designer, and her husband is a baker. The couple emigrated from Armenia more than 20 years ago. She enrolled her sons in tennis lessons. Alexios’s talent soon emerged.
“The teacher said one day he will be playing here,” she said, gesturing toward the court. When Alexios was 13, the Halebians entrusted him to the U.S.T.A.
Now 17, he has been living at the Boca Raton center for four years, executing on-court drills, building strength through the fitness regimens devised by Kovacs and playing tournaments. He also attends school there.
“We see him sometimes,”Asmik Halebian said. “At Thanksgiving and Christmas. All the time he travels. The U.S.T.A. covers his expenses. We cover ours,” including airfare to the Open.
Jay Berger, the U.S.T.A.’s head men’s coach, who watched the third set, assessed Halebian’s tools.
“Good serve, moves well, good intangibles,” he said. “He needs to solidify the rest of his game — his ground strokes.”
A college scholarship could someday come, but Halebian chose another route: the lower rungs of the pro tour.
It was clear he had developed the demeanor of a pro. After defeating Monteiro, Halebian peeled off his sweaty shirt, autographed tennis balls for a couple of fans and accepted the good-natured teasing from some star-struck teenage boys.
jigglypuff
Rookie
It is? ........
Last edited:
Number1Coach
Banned
Where were my facts wrong ? A misspelled name ? Robert is a better coach then all the USTA coaches combined "Thats a fact" ? Or are you here to promote your great academy?
Tennis_Bum
Professional
Brad, when is your kid playing?
Tennis_Bum
Professional
Of course I know how to look at the draw, Einstein. I believe the draws were recently posted. I don't care what he's wearing; I'll leave that to you. Now I have the draws, I can watch the matches to see how some kids have developed so far, including Brad's kid. The tournament is 5 minutes from me so I'll just stop by to watch.
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
Sounds like a 70s cliche to me. It's just not that simple.
Number1Coach
Banned
Babys are born , talent is spotted ,then and athlete is built and that becomes a Champion.
^^^ I don't know about talent... it's all hard work, a bit of luck and doing some right stuff on the way ... when Sampras and Davenport started tennis,their parents didn't dream that they would be tennis champions .. they were lucky to be around Robert L., he had a good thing back then and he disciplines the kids to do everything right.. only Tracy Austin was bred to be a tennis champion(same with A.A.) , it was all a bit of 'brain-washing' and hard work.. just like the Williams sister and Tiger Woods.. their parents told them everyday that they were to become great champions and they all bought it,believed it,and work hard on a singular goal... same thing now is going on with Deit B. .. keep working hard and have the inner belief that ''you can do it" and it will be done.. just keep looking up and don't let people drag you down... keep going bro..
Matt H.
Professional
here's my biggest problem, from that article a few posts up
at 100k for all 19 facilities, that's 1.9 mil. US Open alone generating 200 mil means less than 1% of that money is in player development.
USTA is a fraud. Yet again a fat cat bankster in disguise as a "non profit" friendly program.
Can we get a list of the all the huge bonuses the USTA paid out?
at 100k for all 19 facilities, that's 1.9 mil. US Open alone generating 200 mil means less than 1% of that money is in player development.
USTA is a fraud. Yet again a fat cat bankster in disguise as a "non profit" friendly program.
Can we get a list of the all the huge bonuses the USTA paid out?
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
Completely agree.
Plans for $500 million renovations to Billy Jean King National Tennis Center does not include roof for Arthur Ashe Stadium
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/m...de-roof-arthur-ashe-stadium-article-1.1096145
Rather than spend $500 Million renovating it, they could buy up TV time on Saturdays and get young people interested in tennis again. Look at Texas Hold 'Em, put it on TV enough times and people become interested in it.
This isn't the "Field of Dreams" where if you build it they will come.
Better yet, have more Futures and Challenger events and actually have big enough paydays that players can actually make some money.
Right now if a player wins a $15,000 Futures event they get $1,950 for the week. By the time you get a hotel, flight, food, transportation, strings, laundry, shoes, etc. you are lucky to break even. If you make it to the quarters you get a whopping $435.
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/m...de-roof-arthur-ashe-stadium-article-1.1096145
Rather than spend $500 Million renovating it, they could buy up TV time on Saturdays and get young people interested in tennis again. Look at Texas Hold 'Em, put it on TV enough times and people become interested in it.
This isn't the "Field of Dreams" where if you build it they will come.
Better yet, have more Futures and Challenger events and actually have big enough paydays that players can actually make some money.
Right now if a player wins a $15,000 Futures event they get $1,950 for the week. By the time you get a hotel, flight, food, transportation, strings, laundry, shoes, etc. you are lucky to break even. If you make it to the quarters you get a whopping $435.
tennis_balla
Hall of Fame
You never break even at a Futures event, unless you're sleeping 4 to a room or manage to find a family that'll house you for the week. Its pretty bad. $500mill to renovate a centre that was brand new back in 1998? No comment.
I totally agree.
Hope College just built this 12 court complex for $2.1259 million.
http://www.hope.edu/pr/campusdev/tennisnine.html
Just imagine, the USTA could build 235 of these for the same price as the $500 million in renovations at the US Open. I wonder which would gain more long term exposure?
There are just so many better ways to spend money to grow the sport than they are doing.
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
^^^
Build 235 of them and then what? Watch 95% of them bleed to death?
Build 235 of them and then what? Watch 95% of them bleed to death?
Number1Coach
Banned
Thanx for the encouragement and insight few can see , will keep up the on the road few want to travel but in the end its all good. Hope all is well and if you talk to JW (Slice an Dice) have him call DB about hitting this summer .
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
Well whatever you read here about the USTA must be the absolute truth...100% factual, no opinions.
Number1Coach
Banned
So what was your conclusion ?
Mitch Bridge
Rookie
Having more tennis players doesn't lead to more champions. The USTA PD money should go to just those players that are trying to make it professionally. Fund ITF traveling teams with players mostly 15 and up, 14 for the girls. Have the top teams play ATP/WTA events as well. We would dominate the ITF rankings and the players can receive the professional coaching input they need at the right time, on the road playing matches.
Players will learn to love the life or not, and excel or fall off accordingly.
If you going to put money into kids' tennis, then go to the poor areas and recruit some of the best future athletes in the world into tennis. This may be our only way to have US players become world champions in today's athletic tennis arena.
Players will learn to love the life or not, and excel or fall off accordingly.
If you going to put money into kids' tennis, then go to the poor areas and recruit some of the best future athletes in the world into tennis. This may be our only way to have US players become world champions in today's athletic tennis arena.
Tennis_Bum
Professional
I like what I see, but he's too defensive for his size though. That is how I see it objectively. But I thought with his size, he would have a more aggressive game. Yes, he hits the ball hard, etc. But his game is not offensive minded. Mostly he spun his serve in. Once in a blue moon he hits a first serve, but mostly 3/4 pace at best. I also understand that you want to save his shoulder, but if the kid is serving correctly, his shoulder should be fine. It is the smoothness of the motion, not the strength of your arm or your shoulder.
Again, don't get all defensive because I made a comment about your son. Is the yelling and screaming at every point necessary though? The match was not even close, why not just let the tennis do the screaming and talking and save that energy for the upcoming matches.
I'll try to be out there again today. There were some kids I wanted to see too but I didn't see them. But I'll will at least see him again before the torney is over.
Also Brad, I would focus on variety and his serve right now. The kid that your son played, was a terrible returner. I let the ball jumped up and didn't step in to take a cut at the ball. That was why your son got away with that spinning serve. At a higher level, he would be in deep sh*t.
That would be how I would approach it. Again, to each his own.
If you are not too busy talking to people about who sponsor your son etc. then I'll stop by to chat with you when I see you.
I agree in funding promising would-be pros, but disagree that "having more tennis players doesn't lead to more champions". From an organizational level, the goal of the USTA should be, and is, to grow the game at all levels. More tennis fans and rec players mean more parents will have their kids play. More kids playing means more talent can be spotted and nurtured and more chances for a kid with that something special to choose tennis instead of another sport. Putting all the resources into only a few top prospects is too many eggs in one basket and an inefficient spend. In a perfect world, both should be done.
The last big generation of US champions followed a huge growth in tennis popularity (i.e., their parents generation). I don't think that was an accident. Maybe this can happen again. One (hopeful) theory I have is that with all the attention on head-trauma in football, maybe more of those youth athletes might try tennis. Well... one can hope.
Mitch Bridge
Rookie
I was only talking about Player Development money. Of course the game needs to be develop and grow to help the industry thrive and make more USTA members. This part of the USTA is going well. The PD money needs to have a more direct effect on professional success. When 90% of the kids being trained don't really want to be pros, you are being ineffective with the pro goal. Boca seems to be working well.
Thanks for clarifying. I had heard they put a lot of money towards players with a college goal, or at least pre-pro college goal. Is that true? I think college would be a great place to mature and develop if the tennis competition were like basketball, but the Futures and Challenger tour seem to be the place where serious would-be ATP pros start.
^^^Would it be fair to have PD kids/parents sign an agreement accepting the fact that USTA/PD investing into develping the talents into pro tennis career and (hopefully) to be the next American champion(s).
If it will turn out that junior accept college scholarship and never turn pro within 4 years of college, junior or the family has to pay PD back the money(even low as 50%).
This might help prevent PD pouring money into a wrong candidate or youth/family abusing the privilege.
Might upset some people currently in PD but just a suggestion.
If it will turn out that junior accept college scholarship and never turn pro within 4 years of college, junior or the family has to pay PD back the money(even low as 50%).
This might help prevent PD pouring money into a wrong candidate or youth/family abusing the privilege.
Might upset some people currently in PD but just a suggestion.
Mdubb23
Hall of Fame
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
I don't think it's about being fair or unfair. The fact is that very few teenagers turn pro and make it. College was a great "minor league" for Isner. Should every academy that invests in a player make a parent sign the same agreement?
Don't know the answer but how Nick could get someone like Sharapova and Shishkina.
Maybe have a kid accepting commercial sponsorship at a young age will guarantee a pro path?
Mitch Bridge
Rookie
Most of the academies that are pouring tens of thousands of dollars in a player do have them sign a contract. It will cost up to a million dollars to completely develop a champion, and the sponsor of that champion should benefit directly from that relationship as well. Spending $150,000 per year at Boca to develop an excellent college player is a poor investment if the goal is pro development for the US.
Isner is 6'9" so please stop bringing up his name as a flag-bearer for the college graduate professional. Not that it is not possible, but right now there is one college graduate in the men's top 100 singles ATP. You can't teach 6'9".
In the future when the average age continues to become older, the 4 year college option will become more viable. The average age will become older as depth grows in our sport, and athletes remain healthier and have longer careers.
Isner is 6'9" so please stop bringing up his name as a flag-bearer for the college graduate professional. Not that it is not possible, but right now there is one college graduate in the men's top 100 singles ATP. You can't teach 6'9".
In the future when the average age continues to become older, the 4 year college option will become more viable. The average age will become older as depth grows in our sport, and athletes remain healthier and have longer careers.
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
I'll drop Isner as the college poster child if you stop playing the height card. Height alone does not make one a great tennis player. College is the best path for 99.99999% of the kids.
The reason Isner is ranked where he is, and has had the results he's had, is because of his serve, which is because of his height, not a result of him going to college. If Isner was about 6'2"-6'3", we wouldnt be talking about him.
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
Isner is not 6'2 or 6'3 so the IF argument while convenient, is pure silliness. Besides, height does not guarantee a dominant serve nor does height guarantee that the rest of your game is in order. The reason Isner is ranked near the top is because he put the required work into his game and his fitness, he has a game plan that is built around his strengths, and he beats many of the players in front of him on the draw sheet.
Very on point. Lots of injuries with the tall kids.
Overall, though I have never seen so many stress fractures in kid's backs as of today.
Whatever. What would you consider to be Isner's most devastating shot??? Do you think that shot would be what it is if he were 5'9"'???
Nothing silly about what I said. Roddick said the same thing.
Of course you were right. Why bother, you won't get anywhere.
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
Isner's best shot is his 2nd serve on the Ad side. And your question about Isner's best shot if he were 5'9... well he's not 5'9 so it's a pointless discussion.
I don't care what Roddick said about Isner as I'm not a huge Andy fan. Sure Roddick had a nice serve but he could've had a much better career had he worked on his volleys, his backhand and his fitness earlier in his career.
It's not pointless. This started with you using Isner as an example why jrs should go to college. My pt is Isner's height has way more to do with his success than going to college. Why not use guys like Sweeting, Levine, Russell as examples of why you should go to college???
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
Excluding the rare exception of a freak of nature, juniors should go to college. The Cahill's and the Gilberts of the world are of the same mindset. College afforded John Isner, Todd Martin, John McEnroe, James Blake, etc... the opportunity to work on their games. Go ahead and use whomever you want to in your examples.
Mitch Bridge
Rookie
This point started with the USTA PD paying a fortune to train many kids who have little intention of turning pro. College tennis is an excellent option for almost all juniors, but the ones with the fire, skills, size and aptitude that are being USTA funded should go on the rode and build pro careers.
As for size, Isner's is the best on tour because of his size. Isner is a great player because of many factors.
As for size, Isner's is the best on tour because of his size. Isner is a great player because of many factors.
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
I believe the intention is there in almost all cases, however; as the kids become young men, reality sets in for many and the decision is made for them. And while it may not be the path they had hoped for, college is a wise decision to continue to learn and improve.
I agree. This isn't intended to be a college recruiting center, it is intended to build professionals. It would be much cheaper for them to just pay for the differences in their scholarships if that is what it is going to be.
It is very obvious that this should be left to the private sector. Where the best Americans that have ever played came from. When I private academy fronts all the money for a program they have a real vested interest because if it doesn't pan out they pay for it. That is why they are very picky about who gets fulls. Private academies don't send players around the world if they honestly don't think they can win. At the USTA, if one guy turns them down they go on to the next guy regardless if they think he is "pro" caliber.
In 10 years, who have they produced? At what point do you realize that you have made a poor business decision and cut it or completely change it. In 1992 Player Delevelopment moved from Princeton to Miami. http://www.usta.com/Archive/News/Community-Tennis/Volunteers/95424_USTA_History/
Here is an article where Blackman says, "Without a system, you’re at the mercy of prodigies and private programs,” Even he got fed up with how the program was being run and left. Tim Mayotte resigned at Flushing because of “antiquated coaching methods” and he said the U.S.T.A. was too insular, opportunistically luring talented players and putting them under the tutelage of inexperienced staff.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/12/sports/tennis/some-see-decline-in-us-tennis.html?pagewanted=all
chalkflewup
Hall of Fame
That's not why Blackman left and you are mistaken if you truly believe Mayotte resigned.
Thank you for bringing the subject back to what was originally being discussed.
Not all, but quite a few, are using the PD training centers as a FREE source of training to get their kid a scholarship to college...
These kids are homeschooled to begin with, how fabulous to train for free.
One of the posters had an excellent suggestion that if your kid has zero intention of going pro, ( barring an injury), then return part of the money when they embark on their college career.
As most know on this board, I am pro schooling.
But, for a very talented junior, college with classes and schoolwork and studying doesn't quite prepare a young man for the pros such as battling it out with challengers and futures ( and no distractions like a paper due on Monday)...
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