How to follow up on a strong first serve

[ActualTennisPlayer]

Hi everybody,

If I hit a flat first serve against the opponents at my level (around 4.0 or 4.5 I think), the returns always land very short.
I then often make a mistake while going towards the net (missed volley, missed forehand or backhand, weak forehand or backhand from me so I subsequently get easily passed when I’m at the net).

What can I do so that I win those points?

It’s getting so frustrating that I only do second serves in matches so that I can win from the baseline.

Thanks

Edit: the question is following up on short balls after serves. This gets especially bad in matches and especially when I’m fatigued. So in practice with serves I make 60% of those (which is bad already), but then in matches it drops to 30% and in matches with fatigue it drops to like 10%.

I don’t have this problem with short balls in general. I also don’t have this problem with short ball drills. There I can “put them in the corner with authority”.

 

[Pass750]

Become a better tennis player. You need the ability to put those short balls away or at least put your opponent at a disadvantage so you win the point on their return.The way you describe yourself you are not a 4.0 or 4.5

 

[Dragy]

Practice short balls. Get a coach/friend feed you dozens of short balls in a row and learn to put them to corners with authority. Fine tune your pace, spin and shape to have it consistent yet strong.

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

Just to be clear: the problem isn’t short ball per se. I can handle short balls in a tennis match easily.

The problem is short balls or volleys after serve. So how to follow up after a good first serve. Especially during matches (in practice I have less of an issue).

And yes the level is 4.0 and maybe even 4.5.

 

[Dragy]

Just to be clear: the problem isn’t short ball per se. I can handle short balls in a tennis match easily.

The problem is short balls or volleys after serve. So how to follow up after a good first serve. Especially during matches (in practices I don’t usually have that issue).

And yes the level is 4.0 and maybe even 4.5.

Are you aware what you do right after serve? How you recover? Do you actually recover based on where you served, do you splitstep as opponent makes contact returning?

Common issue is getting stuck admiring how good your serve was. Hence late reaction on the return.
Next most common issue is getting too exited or hurry to finish in one shot. +1 shot after serve is very important, but it shouldn't be winner-or-nothing. Take control, put him on the run, approach the net - all good as long as you develop your advantage.

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

Are you aware what you do right after serve? How you recover? Do you actually recover based on where you served, do you splitstep as opponent makes contact returning?

Common issue is getting stuck admiring how good your serve was. Hence late reaction on the return.
Next most common issue is getting too exited or hurry to finish in one shot. +1 shot after serve is very important, but it shouldn't be winner-or-nothing. Take control, put him on the run, approach the net - all good as long as you develop your advantage.

Thanks. I think that is the problem.
No I’m not too aware. If I hit a good first serve I already start going forward to the net (unless I play somebody much better than me because they won’t return my balls short) - no split step I think. if I hit a second serve, I split step behind the baseline.

I can imagine my footwork is really messed up after the first serve. Are there any detailed instructions on that?

And yes I am probably too excited for the +1. Not sure how I can improve that though.

 

[Dragy]

If I hit a good first serve I already start going forward to the net

It is generally accepted that you follow your serve to the net by pre-serve decision. Or you don't but you do when you see him really stretched far back and sending a high slow ball, maybe. When you first evaluate your serve, is it good, then decide to go to the net, you usually end up late.

So if you expect a floaty return, you serve, make 2 steps inward, splitstep somewhere in front of service line as he makes contact, then proceed for the first volley.

If you don't go to the net, you can still expect short ball, hence recover right on top of the baseline or just inside, split step, and then attack a short ball off the ground, or possibly with a drive volley, if it's a deep looper. But you also remember there might be a good firm deep return to your feet which most likely restores neutrality for your opponent, accept it.

Generally if you get a return which bounces around the T or service boxes, and you split stepping with good timing, you can take it as a FH inside the baseline and hit to the open court (after wide serve), behind the back (if he's fast running back), or putting the ball to either corner. In any of these cases you are in a winning position, go to net, expect a volley or OH to finish.

 

[MyFearHand]

Hi everybody,

If I hit a flat first serve against the opponents at my level (around 4.0 or 4.5 I think), the returns always land very short.
I then often make a mistake while going towards the net (missed volley, missed forehand or backhand, weak forehand or backhand from me so I subsequently get easily passed when I’m at the net).

What can I do so that I win those points?

It’s getting so frustrating that I only do second serves in matches so that I can win from the baseline.

Thanks

Edit: the question is following up on short balls after serves. This gets especially bad in matches and especially when I’m fatigued. So in practice with serves I make 60% of those (which is bad already), but then in matches it drops to 30% and in matches with fatigue it drops to like 10%.

I don’t have this problem with short balls in general. I also don’t have this problem with short ball drills. There I can “put them in the corner with authority”.

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

It is generally accepted that you follow your serve to the net by pre-serve decision. Or you don't but you do when you see him really stretched far back and sending a high slow ball, maybe. When you first evaluate your serve, is it good, then decide to go to the net, you usually end up late.

So if you expect a floaty return, you serve, make 2 steps inward, splitstep somewhere in front of service line as he makes contact, then proceed for the first volley.

If you don't go to the net, you can still expect short ball, hence recover right on top of the baseline or just inside, split step, and then attack a short ball off the ground, or possibly with a drive volley, if it's a deep looper. But you also remember there might be a good firm deep return to your feet which most likely restores neutrality for your opponent, accept it.

Generally if you get a return which bounces around the T or service boxes, and you split stepping with good timing, you can take it as a FH inside the baseline and hit to the open court (after wide serve), behind the back (if he's fast running back), or putting the ball to either corner. In any of these cases you are in a winning position, go to net, expect a volley or OH to finish.

Thanks that’s a lot to digest. I will surely practice all that

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

Wow this is epic. I am bit annoyed that I never had a coach practice that with me.

 

[johnmccabe]

Hi everybody,

If I hit a flat first serve against the opponents at my level (around 4.0 or 4.5 I think), the returns always land very short.
I then often make a mistake while going towards the net (missed volley, missed forehand or backhand, weak forehand or backhand from me so I subsequently get easily passed when I’m at the net).

What can I do so that I win those points?

It’s getting so frustrating that I only do second serves in matches so that I can win from the baseline.

Thanks

Edit: the question is following up on short balls after serves. This gets especially bad in matches and especially when I’m fatigued. So in practice with serves I make 60% of those (which is bad already), but then in matches it drops to 30% and in matches with fatigue it drops to like 10%.

I don’t have this problem with short balls in general. I also don’t have this problem with short ball drills. There I can “put them in the corner with authority”.

Sounds like the problem is quick reading and finding the right set up position to execute the shot to put pressure on opponent

 

[MyFearHand]

Wow this is epic. I am bit annoyed that I never had a coach practice that with me.

Yeah if you’re taking lessons do something like this with your coach. If you’re not then try to find a willing practice partner to switch off with you like I did in the video!

 

[socallefty]

You should do serve+1 and return+1 drills. You might be falling off to your left after your serve and get off balance which then takes more time to recover before you can move towards the net. You might need to fix that.

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

Yeah if you’re taking lessons do something like this with your coach. If you’re not then try to find a willing practice partner to switch off with you like I did in the video!

Yes. I am wondering though why no coach ever proposed to me to do those drills in the first place. These seem like one of the most important exercises.

 

[Dragy]

Another great thing about this serve + 1 practice - you get out of habit of looking how good your serve is going to be and if it misses. Because that's what happens when you just serve baskets. You serve, and you then think what you did well/wrong based on outcome.

Here you need to immediately refocus on next ball, and that's what actually happens in matchplay. Great stuff man.

 

[MyFearHand]

Yes. I am wondering though why no coach ever proposed to me to do those drills in the first place. These seem like one of the most important exercises.

It’s just cause it’s “boring”, people like to rally. And also if you watch a highlight video of pro tennis you see all the long rallies. It gives a skewed perspective on what wins matches. Luckily people like Craig O’Shannessey started digging into the data and realized that most points are short. So winning a tennis match almost always comes down to how well you do in the 0-4 shot category.

So I think it’s a combination of this information not being widely disseminated, people thinking rallying is more fun and oftentimes people being more worried about hitting pretty strokes than winning. (Which by the way is fine, if people derive their joy in tennis from getting prettier strokes that’s great!)

 

[Morch Us]

the question is following up on short balls after serves.

I don’t have this problem with short balls in general.

There are some good feedbacks above from other tt-ers, especially regarding practicing serve+1 specifically.

But I want to point out one additional thing specifically, balance/recovery after serve. Believe me when I say that, pros, does not serve at their "fastest possible" speed most of the time, because that will lead to unbalanced landing and less optimal recovery and less efficient first ball handling. You maybe trying to hit your serve fastest possible and may be landing off-balance and maybe taking too much time to recover and put yourself ready to attack the weak returns. Instead, find the sweet-spot of "dynamic recovery" along with "optimal pace/placement" on your first serve, especially if you are not "Isner" (meaning, not frequently acing the oppenent, enough to disregard recovery/balance).

Since you mentioned you don't really have a problem with attacking short balls during ground strokes, I do think there is a serious problem on recovery/balance right after serve, and you may want to fix that. Of course you are starting with an offensive shot (first serve), so you can compromise a bit on recovery, which is why used the term "dynamic recovery". Meaning you may still find yourself unbalanced on facing a great return, but that is a trade off you are willing to accept to gain more attacking options on majority of the returns (weak or neutral returns).

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

There are some good feedbacks above from other tt-ers, especially regarding practicing serve+1 specifically.

But I want to point out one additional thing specifically, balance/recovery after serve. Believe me when I say that, pros, does not serve at their "fastest possible" speed most of the time, because that will lead to unbalanced landing and less optimal recovery and less efficient first ball handling. You maybe trying to hit your serve fastest possible and may be landing off-balance and maybe taking too much time to recover and put yourself ready to attack the weak returns. Instead, find the sweet-spot of "dynamic recovery" along with "optimal pace/placement" on your first serve, especially if you are not "Isner" (meaning, not frequently acing the oppenent, enough to disregard recovery/balance).

Since you mentioned you don't really have a problem with attacking short balls during ground strokes, I do think there is a serious problem on recovery/balance right after serve, and you may want to fix that. Of course you are starting with an offensive shot (first serve), so you can compromise a bit on recovery, which is why used the term "dynamic recovery". Meaning you may still find yourself unbalanced on facing a great return, but that is a trade off you are willing to accept to gain more attacking options on majority of the returns (weak or neutral returns).

Thanks. I will look into that.

 

[Cashman]

4.5 who can’t hit a put away, okay

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

4.5 who can’t hit a put away, okay

The what level debate… yawn.
I don’t live in the US so I don’t know the exact ranking.
In any case I said it’s more likely 4.0 than 4.5 in my two posts…

 

[Cashman]

I don’t live in the US

lol then it's nothing

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

lol then it's nothing

What level do you think is this (it’s not me)

 

[Curious]

In some countries in the old days coaches used to beat kids if they had more than 3cm gap between their elbow and torso when they hit a forehand. Where’s the blue shirt guy from?

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

In some countries in the old days coaches used to beat kids if they had more than 3cm gap between their elbow and torso when they hit a forehand. Where’s the blue shirt guy from?

I don’t know them but it’s Tennis in Switzerland. One person has an Italian sounding surname - but could very well be from ticino (an Italian speaking region in Switzerland)

 

[Curious]

I don’t know them but it’s Tennis in Switzerland. One person has an Italian sounding surname - but could very well be from ticino (an Italian speaking region in Switzerland)

Ok

 

[Cashman]

What level do you think is this (it’s not me)

i don't know, what does their NTRP computer rating say? what USTA league do they play in?

if they don't have a rating then the discussion is pointless

but if we are just making stuff up I estimate I am ATP Top 100 based on some YouTube video I watched once

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

i don't know, what does their computer ranking say?

if they don't have a computer ranking then they are nothing

if we are just making stuff up I am an ATP Top 100 but you won't find me on the website because I don't play on tour, it's just my estimate based on some video I watched once

Their computer ranking is R6 in Switzerland. They don’t play in the US.

The problem is that conversion system to the US is heavily flawed https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/league-differences-between-us-and-europe.348874/

 

[Cashman]

Their computer ranking is R6 in Switzerland. They don’t play in the US.

The problem is that conversion system to the US is heavily flawed https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/league-differences-between-us-and-europe.348874/

ya so going around saying you’re a 4.0 or a 4.5 when you’re not even American is very misleading

I am not going around saying I am a Swiss R6 or L5 or purple monkey dishwasher because how would I know? I have never played in the Swiss system

 

[Happi]

ya so going around saying you’re a 4.0 or a 4.5 when you’re not even American is very misleading

I am not going around saying I am a Swiss R6 or L5 or purple monkey dishwasher because how would I know? I have never played in the Swiss system

Come on, this is totally legit. We could use UTR instead. They are UTR 7 thats about a strong 4.5 for you Americans

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

ya so going around saying you’re a 4.0 or a 4.5 when you’re not even American is very misleading

I am not going around saying I am a Swiss R6 or L5 or purple monkey dishwasher because how would I know? I have never played in the Swiss system

I think this adds important context for the other posters to help me with my questions. I am glad that they have done so in a constructive way.

In contrast, I don’t understand why you are so hurt about me giving an estimate of the level (and I clearly added that I think that is the level).

 

[Happi]

I think this adds important context for the other posters to help me with my questions. I am glad that they have done so in a constructive way.

In contrast, I don’t understand why you are so hurt about me giving an estimate of the level (and I clearly added that I think that is the level).

Dont worry about it, you are just fine. There will always be these kind of posters around, if persistant just hit ignore.

 

[Jono123]

If you have a good flat serve resulting in a short ball then your subsequent shot should be anything but weak.

I can only surmise you're late coming forward. I'd suggest practising stepping in immediately after your serve in one fluid motion.

 

[nyta2]

Hi everybody,

If I hit a flat first serve against the opponents at my level (around 4.0 or 4.5 I think), the returns always land very short.

after serve recovery always need to be looking for the short ball to attack
the better your serve/approach/aggressive baseline shot is, the more often you're going to get a short ball/ugly shank/etc...

I then often make a mistake while going towards the net (missed volley, missed forehand or backhand, weak forehand or backhand from me so I subsequently get easily passed when I’m at the net).

practice s&v... or more doubles with s&v and c&c.... because the mid court ball is never going to be nicely in your strikezone... will always be at an awkward height, varying spin/depth/etc....
forcing myself to s&v was how i practiced approach shots and the awkward midcourt shots

What can I do so that I win those points?

It’s getting so frustrating that I only do second serves in matches so that I can win from the baseline.

you're currently a baseliner that likes to just hit balls at waist2shoulder height... and probaby win by attrition... but anyone good will recognize that you're not good in the forecourt, and will draw you in intentionally

Thanks

Edit: the question is following up on short balls after serves. This gets especially bad in matches and especially when I’m fatigued. So in practice with serves I make 60% of those (which is bad already), but then in matches it drops to 30% and in matches with fatigue it drops to like 10%.

get in shape. coming to net is an explosive endeavor, very demanding of precise (active!)
if you're a good baseliner, you can almost walk to the recovery position and not have to run that much.
of if you're playing other bashers that can't put away the ball, just use their pace, without much effort.

I don’t have this problem with short balls in general. I also don’t have this problem with short ball drills. There I can “put them in the corner with authority”.

it's not just about "hitting short balls with authority"... because not all short ball will be attackable like that... (eg. shoulder height/above the net flatter drive into the corner)... they will often be odd shanks/mishits that are slightly too low to rip, but very good opportunity to approach and win with volley/overhead

 

[LuckyR]

Work on hitting from first volley position (not second volley position).

 

[ChaelAZ]

Unfortunately too often I just stand there thinking it isn’t coming back, and lose the point. But the. Bolster my ego telling myself what an awesome serve it was and they just got lucky.

 

[LuckyR]

Unfortunately too often I just stand there thinking it isn’t coming back, and lose the point. But the. Bolster my ego telling myself what an awesome serve it was and they just got lucky.

You mean: hoping it isn't coming back.