How to volley
- Thread starter 10sbeast888
- Start date
K; it's a very small adjustment but makes a big difference/improvement to FH volley. Can't say it helps the BH volley but it doesn't hurt it either. However, after 6 years of volleying, it is not amazingly tough to use that grip. I'm used to continental for serve/volley/overhead so not thinking about it and even in drills/practice, it falls back to continental. It may be something that on FH volleys, when I have time and want to get a good hit on it, I make an intentional adjustment on grip...
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
I commend you for staying on topic (whenever you do). I'm not much into "conflicts" or challenging other's pov's, especially when it's a thankless job, but I find so much appeal from reading about new concepts and techniques.
Man, there's no motivator like losing.
Quick question for you guys: is it necessary for competition that one more or less has to be aggressive?
I tried to become calm and docile during match and result wasn't good.
competitiveness is somewhat built into a person's DNA... the desire to compete and win, that makes you run over broken glass to get to the next ball.... if you don't have that, you can still enjoy tennis as an exercise.
strategically, you can play defensive style fetching balls all day, or you can build tools to be aggressive... volley being one of the tools.
this is a separate topic.. a big one.
am1899
Legend
Big question.
The potential solutions depend on all kinds of factors. And there isn’t necessarily a “right” or a “wrong” answer. Here’s a few factors I would consider in that calculus:
- Yours and your opponents level of play
- Yours and your opponents playing style
- Yours and your opponents mental toughness
- Yours and your opponents fitness, athleticism, foot speed
- On that particular day, what are you able to do at a high percentage to win points and what is your opponent “giving” you?
- Surface and conditions
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
Come on… half the fun of this place is taking the uppercuts on the chin from trolls who think they can volley better than your vid.
J011yroger
Talk Tennis Guru
a10best
Legend
I have seen Med hit some terrible volleys too. USO final against Djokovic couple years back. But some days your volleys can be off.
user92626
G.O.A.T.
I've been practicing your method of squeezing the handle 2, 4 or 8/10 on contacts.
Question, so if you need more racket movements, you (1) squeeze the racket and (2) move it with the arm via the shoulder joint? The elbow angle remains more or less the same?
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
seems you are making progress, as you are asking the right questions.
the arm does move, to position the hand in the right place to squeeze. later on as you progress the arm does move forward (when you have time, usually in the 1st volley), to smooth out the squeeze.
the elbow angle, in the ready position it's bent, so the upper arm/lower arm/racket forms a big U... during the shot the arm straightens naturally. the goal is to maintain the same racket angle as long as possible (some teachers describe the sensation as having the ball stay on the strings as long as possible).. so the straightening of the arm helps that during the follow thru.
I want to emphasize that the arm move is not intentional.... the hand is the king, the rest of the body serve the king so he can be in the right place to squeeze the handle.
user92626
G.O.A.T.
Hey i just came back fr playing and I applied your squeezing method n did surprisingly well.
I guess that was the right cure for my wobbly unstable racket head. I already got most thing in place.
The logics of your method is sound. Hardening the racket also limits its movements, ie less swinging as its often taught & more stability!
Good job, TT bud!
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
nice job.. congrats!
yeah good volley is the lowest hanging fruit I urge all my buddies to get to have an immediate level up.... the amount of effort required to fix bh/fh/serve is several times higher due to the motion complexity.
how's your serve... if you have a good one enjoy sv tennis and take some names out there! if not we can work on it too... it might be the same amount of effort as groundies but actually have a bigger pay off.
I am gonna start a separate thread about playing style.
cheers.
Shroud
Talk Tennis Guru
He did one before as part of his monthly challenges.
My volley used to be my best shot. I forgot it and it sucks now. Not sure why but here was J011ys challenge
Curious
G.O.A.T.
Very nice but I don’t think you’ve earned the privilege to have a pro level loose grip on volleys yet! You’re probably getting away with it because of your huge racket weight.
Shroud
Talk Tennis Guru
Not sure what you are talking about. Not really reading this thread. I want to believe Oscar but as usual he seems off. But doubtful any of us will have anything pro level.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
The point was you’d better hold the handle firmly on volleys unless you’re McEnroe or Leander Paes or using a racket weighing 500g!
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
based on this now I know your volley is as shytty as your bh.... there is already real example of @user92626 getting good results with my method of squeezing from 1/10 to 2,4,8/10.... should be loose during prep until the last moment right before impact.
you have been absorbing so much shyt tennis info the game is beyond repairable.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
stiff like shyt, and the fh volley follow thru is wrong... you are pronation and shutting down the face, will have consistency issues. as the arm straightens it wants to pronate so the fh volley actually requres some supination to prevent the face shutting down.
watch Fed's fh volleys, the exact move that I am talking about, and the opposite of what your doing.
your so stiff you can barely move... I'd take @Shroud as my doubles partner all day.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
You’re turning from antagonistic to toxic. I’ll leave you alone and expect the same from you.
ballmachineguy
Hall of Fame
Way too far back. Most are like this. Ball machine timing will let you get away with this. Exchanging volleys at the net and you’ll be cooked.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
no worries... I am 99% non-toxic.
Shroud
Talk Tennis Guru
If I ever come back to civilization I will let you know. You can chase down the lobs…
Curious
G.O.A.T.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
that take back not necessarily an issue, actually for a 1st volley situation a big take back is common.
the diff is in the Fed pic his grip pressure is 2/10.... so he is free and flowing.
your already at 7/10, stiff like a brick.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
No point in being defensive, I’m aware of the need to avoid big back swing, supination, pronation and I’ve made a significant progress on my volleys since I made this video for @user92626 recently. I believe what I’m talking about in the video is the most crucial element of good volleying in terms of the swing mechanics. I still think grip is the firmest on volleys amongst all other strokes.
user92626
G.O.A.T.
So, hold the handle firmly all the time while you're at the net? 1 to 10 (death grip), what is firmness level?
Curious
G.O.A.T.
Not sure about numbers. Probably at least 5. Remember, you’re intercepting a much faster ball than when you’re hitting a groundstroke. This should give you an idea about return of serve grip firmness.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
funny that the spirit of this thread is to debunk the conventional teaching of 'firm grip punch out in front', and here comes @Curious volunteering to demonstrate 'how NOT to volley'...
save your breath - or keystrokes.
we've all seen the death grip volley, on all the club courts... arm chopping because the hand doesn't have it's own power.... completely useless except something medium pace right at the player.
save your breath - or keystrokes.
we've all seen the death grip volley, on all the club courts... arm chopping because the hand doesn't have it's own power.... completely useless except something medium pace right at the player.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
there is the perfect example of 'how not to volley'. starting with 5 you have almost no room to squeeze. dead hand. the arm is forced to chop to generate any power... body loses balance... zero chance to cover wide balls. can only volley easy medium pace from a ball machine.
whenever I do volley drills with students, sometimes there is regression and I actually have to remind them, dial the grip pressure back to 1.
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
The 500g method is easier.
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
Only need to squeeze firm at impact.
isn't that why most people visit this forum, to discuss minutiae? sometimes a tip may be helpful to you and maybe you'll learn something and sometimes you won't. I mean we can all go watch videos on you tube and learn the basics of how to volley.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
so what your saying is - you are young and athletic, but had closed eyes and mind.
yeah, lol.. too much indeed.
i've never been a fan of practicing volleying against a ball machine (and the setting you have is exceptionally easy... like i only get that type of shot once or twice a match), mainly because it's impossible to get the split step timing right...
i usually only practice with a partner...
but if no partner, would prefer to practice on a wall just to keep stroke short, and work on reflex volleys and face control, in a simulated all-4-at-net-fast-volley-exchange-scenario
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
I do something similar all the time.
@Curious is demonstrating 'how not to volley' as he starts with a grip pressure of 'at least 5/10'... zero chance to drill like this.
watch closely - her upper arm is barely moving... it's all in the hand squeeze.
if you can do 50 balls on the garage door your volley is good.
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if you can do 50 at her pace, you're better than me... i've tried that drill many times, never got close... she's doing 100 in <50s
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
I wish... can do at her speed, or power, but not both... here is a good one from Fed... basically varying the grip pressure between 1 and 2 to keep his wall drill going.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
Shouldn’t matter for either the fed or cara drill. On court play you will adjust.
Point of the drill is to feel the power source. And the freedom to move on the court when the hand has its own power. So the body and arm just need to get to the ball.
Shroud
Talk Tennis Guru
Thx. Not sure. All my sticks end up heavy. It might be a gamma 100 that stock had a 400 sw. Iirc.
Shroud
Talk Tennis Guru
yeah, that's about what i look like, then get frustrated, then go do somethign else
Curious
G.O.A.T.
That was a while ago when I was working on the swing only. These days I only practice volleys with people or rarely with the machine on random ball feed setting which can be very hard and tiring depending on how wide an angle you choose.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
yes only because your doing it wrong.
why don't you fix it with my method, will take only a week... by then you'd know that my tennis knowledge is legit, then your bh will also be fixed.
that is if your not trolling.
user92626
G.O.A.T.
@10sbeast888
So yesterday I spread your squeezing method to a court friend, who usually misses very stupid volleys--extremely frustrating for partners. He appeared to get it immediately. He's already got the heart for volleying, so this squeezing thing made a big impact.
We actually won a set with him. Amazing!
One huge flaw that he still can't change, no matter how many times I pointed it out, is his same FH grip for both fh and bh volleys! He knows it but simply old dog, new trick concept so whatever.
So yesterday I spread your squeezing method to a court friend, who usually misses very stupid volleys--extremely frustrating for partners. He appeared to get it immediately. He's already got the heart for volleying, so this squeezing thing made a big impact.
We actually won a set with him. Amazing!
One huge flaw that he still can't change, no matter how many times I pointed it out, is his same FH grip for both fh and bh volleys! He knows it but simply old dog, new trick concept so whatever.
10sbeast888
Hall of Fame
sounds great... and also sounds familiar... as many players never had the samurai conti grip ready position will have the strong fh volley but weak bh volley.
he can probably get by for a while as the squeeze can do ok even with that bad of a grip.
long term players want to get to the right positions... and the Cara Black drill is great for that... would be impossible to drill without the proper grip.
the transition will take time... one of my guys still is like this after 1 year. adults, tennis often is not priority 1, which is understandable.
