Hyper-G soft and Cyclone Tour

[PRChicago]

Hi,

I have used Cyclone Tour at 17 and 18g on Yonex EZone 100. When it's right I'm very happy with power, comfort and control but that level of performance only exists a very short period of time (I guess the TW stats on tension maintenance supports this problem). Comfort has been a top priority due to sore arm. I've seen some discussions saying 16g for Cyclone Tour is much better in terms playability duration (TW sting data doesn't show that to be the case but stats are stats not personal experience). Do people see big advantage to the 16g specially without making it too uncomfortable and still having good spin ? If I choose to try switching, is Hyper-G Soft a good replacement ? Again, by TW string database stats, Hyper-G Soft would seem to be a game changer improvement in terms of low stiffness, high tension maintenance, pretty high spin. The "shaping" of Hyper-G soft seems pretty subtle compared to lots of other strings. Not sure it would grab that much more than a round string. Interested in peoples thoughts on CT improvement at lower gauge and Hyper-G soft as a replacement.

 

[John Z.]

VCT 16g (1.30) is among the softest poly, a tad too powerful for my taste but keeps tension reasonably well. Very good spin potential imo, at same 16g has more spin than any round poly by some margin, but not quite as predictable and control oriented as round polys such as hawk, alu power etc... which matters most to relatively advanced players (4.5+).

would also like to read comparison between VCT and HGS (both 16g) especially on power and softness level.

 

[str33tspirit]

VCT is much softer and has a strange rubber band feel. I couldn't connect with it. I did get the 1.30mm which felt kinda heavy/clunky. HGS is actually very similar to HG but a bit softer, maybe even more muted and is not that much more powerful. HGS is much more predictable and better if you play with a lot of spin. With VCT, I felt I had to play flatter to get something out of it. And I was losing my spin on my kick serve. I thought they played completely differently.

 

[PRChicago]

I think it's all about what your are used to. I haven't found VCT to be rubbery, maybe after hours of play once it's stretches out or if strung in 40s pound range. To anyone using a traditional poly (used to use ALU before arm trouble), any soft poly probably feels 'rubbery". The comments I've seen about cyclone tour being heavy (I've seen that before in the forum) is odd to me. I haven't tried enough strings to notice heavy. Certainly 16g has to be heavier than 17 or 18 but noticeably ? I wonder if I desire to get longer playing duration out of the string, if going to Cyclone a good path (vs. Hyper-G soft) but I worry about shock to my arm.

 

[socallefty]

I tried VCT18 crosses with VS17 mains once and my usual cross string these days is HyperG soft (moved from HyperG). VCT has less power/higher control, seemed to make my sweet-spot smaller at the same tension and had less spin than HyperG and HyperG Soft. I was OK hitting ground strokes with it as I can adjust my swing to add more spin, but much prefer HyperG and HyperG soft for serves. Tension maintenance seems best for HG Soft which is better than HyperG which is better than VCT. That‘s my experience in a gut/poly hybrid - YMMV.

 

[Louis33]

VCT 16g tension maintenance is pretty poor. It has a high initial stretch similar to a multifilament when stringing. The first couple hours it will lose a good amount of tension and then settle to play relatively consistent. I string multifilament mains at 55-60 lbs and VCT at 62-64 lbs to help compensate for the high tension loss.

 

[blai212]

VCT 16g does feel heavy as a string for me too which is why I’d only use it in mains with a thin copoly cross that provides good tension maintenance. HGS could be a good cross for VCT mains in that regard. HGS is much more similar to regular cyclone in regards to power level and feel (low powered, semi deadish) which is why they are meant to be strung lower or better suited for power oriented racquets. I would NEVER use VCT 17/18 in cross since the tension maintenance is atrocious. Hybrids are designed to mix two strings to bring the best of both worlds. Mains provide the majority of the feel, hence gut/poly setups are pretty popular but a soft spinny poly would also work great VCT 16, dunlop black widow, HGS. Usually these softer mains dont have great tension maintenance which is why when choosing a cross string, you want something that provides good tension maintenance/playability duration so that you get the most out of your string bed til the mains die or snap. I’d rate the following for VCT 16g, black widow 16g, HGS 16L (rated from highest to lowest)
Power: VCT -> BW -> HGS
Spin: BW -> HGS -> VCT
Tension maintenance: HGS -> BW -> VCT
Ball pocketing: VCT -> BW -> HGS
Control: HGS -> BW -> VCT

 

[PRChicago]

I'm actually using Cyclone Tour now in a hybrid with NXT Duramax as the cross. I know this sounds like a crazy combo (expensive cross with questionable durability against a shaped poly) but 1) I had the NXT Duramax already and 2) I wanted to do the best job of muting the shock of a poly. I think I mentioned comfort but still maintaining spin was my priority so I haven't abandoned polys just yet. The results so far is promising. This is much more comfortable than VCT alone and much more comfortable than last hybrid I tried with VCT. I feel I can bring the tension up a bit on the VCT a couple pounds into low 50's (from 49) since NXT has absorbed so much of the shock. As I feared however, I am thinking the Duramax outer layer will not hold up to VCT sliding. May try Hyper-G soft and replace VCT in this set-up as will reduce power, may add control, should maintain tension longer and may play nicer on a nylon string given square shape (eventually hope to go to a syn gut like one of the Gosen AKs in hope of getting better durability on the cross while still soft and not have to shell out $20 for a cross string). Other option I'm thinking about is a soft round poly ( have heard Yonex Poly Tour Pro absorbs a lot of the shock even though its stillness rating isn't nearly as a good as a VCT or Hyper-G soft.

 

[blai212]

Yeah i like YPTP 1.20/SPPP 1.18 as a cross with VCT mains strung at appropriate low tension (38/36 for me) in my dense control oriented vcp97 310. You could also consider restringing just the crosses with hyperG soft at appropriate low tension (perhaps 40 lbs?) once the outer layer of the NXT wears out because string bed will start locking up from the friction but the VCT might still be good if the spiral texture hasnt worn smooth yet and/or it still feels playable. HGS has much less power than VCT so Id string it a few lbs lower for adequate power. Non poly crosses just don’t work well for me because outer coating wears off within 1-2 hrs and then the string bed starts snaking. (Have to adjust strings after every rally). I believe full bed soft copoly at appropriate low tension is best way to go. As low as you can go while still keeping the ball in. Just need to brush the ball to utilize spin to keep the ball in. The lower u go, the less flat you can hit without the ball sailing but then it just comes down to skill to orient the racquet face correctly to keep the ball in...this technique is much more pronounced in ping pong with such a small table but top level players able to hit hard and still keep the ball in via spin.

 

[PRChicago]

I tried VCT in low 40s. Very comfy but not the sort of control I need for a solid top spin oriented baseline singles game. I haven't been happy with it below 49 lbs. At 49, it's good for a 2 or 3 matches then too much tension loss. I love it at 52 for performance but that's where I was at with the arm trouble.

I don't really understand benefits of a poly/poly hybrid specially if I'm already sensitive to the shock from impact on my arm. I read so many combinations people are trying. I can see where maybe a shaped main and slick poly cross might make sense to max on spin but certainly not soften impact. Maybe mixing with something like Iso Cream would be useful to soften the impact without the problems mentioned using a nylon cross (shredding the surface) but that has been described in the forum as just a very different sort of string like a poly rubberband.

I agree. Ideally I would not be using a hybrid but I think that would take me out of polys and out of a great spin game (Techifibre Triax is on my eventual list if I can't make a poly or poly+nylon hybrid work.)

 

[landcookie]

I find VCT 1.3 and HG 1.3 to be completely opposite strings except for the fact both give lots of spin.

VCT has lots of power (too much for me), feels pingy, loads of ball pocketing, lowish launch angle, loses tension fast.

HG is low powered, feels muted, high launch angle, maintains tension well.

I personally don't mind either - prefer feel of vct but vct loses playability too quickly and has too much power.

 

[blai212]

I find VCT 1.3 and HG 1.3 to be completely opposite strings except for the fact both give lots of spin.

VCT has lots of power (too much for me), feels pingy, loads of ball pocketing, lowish launch angle, loses tension fast.

HG is low powered, feels muted, high launch angle, maintains tension well.

I personally don't mind either - prefer feel of vct but vct loses playability too quickly and has too much power.

yes that is why i would hybrid VCT 16g mains with smooth round cross with good tension maintenance whereas hyperG mains would benefit from softer cross that still provides good tension maintenance such as ghostwire

 

[FlamingCheeto]

I actually think Solinco Confidential is superior to both, full bed at 55LBS 16 is truly a heavenly string set up

 

[blai212]

I actually think Solinco Confidential is superior to both, full bed at 55LBS 16 is truly a heavenly string set up

i tried it in a used racquet i bought and it felt too crisp/harsh and low powered for me :-/

 

[landcookie]

I actually think Solinco Confidential is superior to both, full bed at 55LBS 16 is truly a heavenly string set up

How would you say it compares to HG 16? Mind if i also ask your playing level ?

 

[FlamingCheeto]

How would you say it compares to HG 16? Mind if i also ask your playing level ?

I like it much better than HG AND HG Soft 16, I feel it has less power with more control, the spin potential might be a little less but the control makes up for it. I'm a 4.5 baseliner and just had a great match today using it.

 

[landcookie]

Whoops double post

 

[landcookie]

I like it much better than HG AND HG Soft 16, I feel it has less power with more control, the spin potential might be a little less but the control makes up for it. I'm a 4.5 baseliner and just had a great match today using it.

How about feel? Does it feel like hyper g or something different?

 

[FlamingCheeto]

How about feel? Does it feel like hyper g or something different?

Feels super crisp and very dampened, which I like. I liked the extra spin and bite of hyper G, but confidential is pretty comparable and the added control and crisp feel makes it one of my favorite strings right now, along with:

Luxilon ALU power spin
prince vortex triad
weiss cannon firestroke

 

[PRChicago]

I find VCT 1.3 and HG 1.3 to be completely opposite strings except for the fact both give lots of spin.

VCT has lots of power (too much for me), feels pingy, loads of ball pocketing, lowish launch angle, loses tension fast.

HG is low powered, feels muted, high launch angle, maintains tension well.

I personally don't mind either - prefer feel of vct but vct loses playability too quickly and has too much power.

your description of HG is exactly what I'm going after. I need to string at lower tension so I need something at lower power than VCT. VCT at pretty low tension launches too much and the tension maintenance is very poor. When you say "HG" are you referencing Hyper-g or the new Hyper-G Soft (original topic of this thread).

 

[landcookie]

your description of HG is exactly what I'm going after. I need to string at lower tension so I need something at lower power than VCT. VCT at pretty low tension launches too much and the tension maintenance is very poor. When you say "HG" are you referencing Hyper-g or the new Hyper-G Soft (original topic of this thread).

Hyper g. No HGS where I live, unfortunately. From what people are saying though, both strings seem to be very similar.

I hit with HG 1.6 at 48/46 in a 100 sq inch with an open 16x19 and the power was just right.

 

[blai212]

another option to soften HG is to use a soft round copoly w good tension maintenance such as ghostwire

 

[PRChicago]

Hyper g. No HGS where I live, unfortunately. From what people are saying though, both strings seem to be very similar.

I hit with HG 1.6 at 48/46 in a 100 sq inch with an open 16x19 and the power was just right.

Yah. That's my target too 48 on the mains with 100 sq in, 16x19 on a Yonex Ezone 100. Am guessing "soft" will have a bit more power but not nearly what VCT has.

 

[landcookie]

Yah. That's my target too 48 on the mains with 100 sq in, 16x19 on a Yonex Ezone 100. Am guessing "soft" will have a bit more power but not nearly what VCT has.

HGS/ HG worth a shot then! Let us know how you go. VCT waaay too powerful even at 55.

 

[John Z.]

I find VCT 1.3 and HG 1.3 to be completely opposite strings except for the fact both give lots of spin.

VCT has lots of power (too much for me), feels pingy, loads of ball pocketing, lowish launch angle, loses tension fast.

HG is low powered, feels muted, high launch angle, maintains tension well.

I personally don't mind either - prefer feel of vct but vct loses playability too quickly and has too much power.

@landcookie which one you think is most arm friendly, vct 16g or hgs 16g ?

 

[g4driver]

Funny, I watched four 4.5 guys hitting in a USTA match today.. three different courts. I string for them and wanted to know how the guy using the VS Gut / Triax like the setup before stringing more of his frames. The guy playing singles uses HG/Head Hawk in a Blade 93 18x20. Two of them playing together both appealed down from 5.0 after their 2019 ratings came out at 5.0 and both have been using VCT for quite some time now. The other 4.5 was playing with a 72 year former ATP player. The 72-year-old looks maybe 55 and was the best player on the court IMO. The 4.5A guys both use VCT 1.30 in an APD and Pure Strike 16x19 Project One 7

Strings are a personal choice. Just try them and stick with what makes you a better player. After winning in straight sets, one of the 4.5 guys using VCT hands me a pack of 1.25mm HG and 1.25mm Confidential and says " A pro gave these to me, but I love the strings I am using so use these for someone else"

HGS 1.30mm is definitely stiffer than VCT 1.30mm. I have played with VCT for 8 years, but keep going back to HGS 1.25mm/Ghostwire 1.22mm. The HGS/GW is a great setup for my game but isn't for everyone.

 

[g4driver]

HGS/ HG worth a shot then! Let us know how you go. VCT waaay too powerful even at 55.

55lbs is the exact tension one of those 4.5A guys in the Pure Strike 16x19. The other guy uses VCT at 58M/54X. @winchestervatennis your team has played against these two guys in the Men's 4.5 SC Championship in the not too distant past.

I see tensions from 46 lbs HG/GW from a 5.0C to the 58M/54X in the 4.5A guy mentioned above.

 

[landcookie]

55lbs is the exact tension one of those 4.5A guys in the Pure Strike 16x19. The other guy uses VCT at 58M/54X. @winchestervatennis your team has played against these two guys in the Men's 4.5 SC Championship in the not too distant past.

I see tensions from 46 lbs HG/GW from a 5.0C to the 58M/54X in the 4.5A guy mentioned above.

I hit with a Angell tc 100 16x19 which could explain why I find the vct hard to control. I'm a big hitter and serve+fh can trouble atp guys and former 7.0s if they're not dialed in (I am far from their level however).

I also noticed vct 1.30 is noticeably thinner than other 1.30 strings.

After 2 weeks with vct I had to get it restrung because it was getting too trampoliney. Tension had dropped from 55 to 44 as measured by my stringer.

I haven't hit with hgs before, but would string hg 1.30 at 48/46.

The further i progress, the more i prefer the predictability of round strings as I don't need help from strings in either spin or power these days.Tension predictability, feel, and control have become my key criteria now. So I agree, to each their own!

 

[PRChicago]

I have played now for 5 hours in a hybrid of HGS on the mains with a multi on the cross. It replaced the exact same set up with VCT in previous stringing. Both were 48 lbs on the mains. As others have said, VCT and HGS are not very similar. HGS is lower power, more stiff, better spin , better control. I really like the way it plays with my game. Comfort is lacking. Given my current experiment, I would try HGS at even lower tension (46 lbs for instance) to get it softer on the arm. I think that will work since power is low on HGS. VCT needs to be strung tighter as it gets too much trampoline effect. Arguably the 48 lb is too loose for VCT ( I like it's playability at 52 lbs much better). I think HGS should go down in tension with success. As for tension maintenance, we'll see. In first 5 hours, it has definitely changed less than VCT changes. I'd also be inclined to go to smaller gauge in future if I stick with HGS. The 120 mm on VCT just stretches out too fast. I'll also go to syn gut for the cross. The multi's coating just can stand up to a shaped poly (as also discussed in numerous postings). The HGS so dominates the feel of the hybrid, I doubt it will matter if I use a multi or syn gut on overall softness anyway. If you have concern for comfort, I don't think I'd even consider a full bed of HGS.

 

[PRChicago]

So after about 14 hours of tennis using HGS (3 weeks), I'd say I really like Hyper-G Soft a lot. Given some recent history with arm soreness and tennis elbow, I gladly will trade off crisp in favor of muted specially with the level of control I still have. I think this far into a hybrid with VCT, I'd be really experiencing the cross string more than VCT as its tension would be down too much. HGS also softened up quite a bit after the first 5 hours. I attribute that partially to the string bed unlocking as the soft surface of the NXT Duramax finally let go of the HGS after wearing down some and letting the HGS move. The NXT, though really nice right now in the hybrid, is just not a good cross with a shaped poly (as others have stated). The Duramax surface might be great for NXT on NXT string movement but not effective in this hybrid until it wears down.

 

[g4driver]

I find no discernable difference in my level of play with a)VCT 1.30mm, b)HGS 1.25mm / GW 1.25mm, or c)Firewire 1.25mm / Ghostwire 1.22mm. Played twice Saturday and Sunday, using all three setups. 6 sets of doubles and 2 sets of singles. Never dropped a set. But then again I am not playing former 7.0 players or ATP players like some of the posters in this thread. I strung my frames with GW crosses at the same tension 55M/53X, and only 1lb higher for the VCT only frame 56M/54X

VCT is the softest of the three setups, with Firewire/GW the stiffest.

 

[franks]

I find no discernable difference in my level of play with a)VCT 1.30mm, b)HGS 1.25mm / GW 1.25mm, or c)Firewire 1.25mm / Ghostwire 1.22mm. Played twice Saturday and Sunday, using all three setups. 6 sets of doubles and 2 sets of singles. Never dropped a set. But then again I am not playing former 7.0 players or ATP players like some of the posters in this thread. I strung my frames with GW crosses at the same tension 55M/53X, and only 1lb higher for the VCT only frame 56M/54X

VCT is the softest of the three setups, with Firewire/GW the stiffest.

EXCELLENT response, TEN thumps up.
KEEP UP the good work. I love your posts, very informative.