I already know how Head can launch the Djokovic mold at retail.

[Break To Win]

Make the current Head Speed Pro, be a Head Speed Tour (100 18 x 20).

And the Head Pro would be a 95, 18 x 19 string pattern, 22 mm beam width, just like the current Serbian mold, but in a different layup for retail.

I think it would be a racquet with good sales

 

[guilhermefdc]

And 1/5th the SW + half the weight — I think that the major limitation sales wise is that it’s not even a ”5.0 friendly” frame and most D1 players would have a lot of trouble using it.
IF Head decides to release the frame, it might be safer to release a separate “Nole-black” edition or something, similar to the Aero Origin rather than to the RF97 (which is the only somewhat amateur-friendly of the GOAT’s racquets)

 

[dr325i]

Make the current Head Speed Pro, be a Head Speed Tour (100 18 x 20).

And the Head Pro would be a 95, 18 x 19 string pattern, 22 mm beam width, just like the current Serbian mold, but in a different layup for retail.

I think it would be a racquet with good sales

yeah, that would go really well with the rest of the Head approach and naming
I have an idea how you can benefit from totally wasting your time on these boards -- stop posting threads like these!
400 posts in 3 weeks is just...not healthy

 

[heavyD]

It just would sell poorly just like the Rafa Origin racquet. Frames that are difficult to use even for advanced players tend not to be volume sellers.

 

[Break To Win]

It just would sell poorly just like the Rafa Origin racquet. Frames that are difficult to use even for advanced players tend not to be volume sellers.

Well, it could be a 310 gram version without strings. Something customizable, with just the mold of Djokovic's racquet available to the public. I don't see anything wrong with that.

 

[oldmanyellingatcloud]

this topic has been discussed ad nauseam, but kudos for continuing to advocate for a retail TK346. Head hasn't released it simply because they don't want to. the naming convention excuse is a new one though

I personally can't wait until 20 years from now when a Radical Classic 2.0 is released and we're discussing whether the mold is 113, 231, 260, or finally 346...

 

[Break To Win]

this topic has been discussed ad nauseam, but kudos for continuing to advocate for a retail TK346. Head hasn't released it simply because they don't want to. the naming convention excuse is a new one though

I personally can't wait until 20 years from now when a Radical Classic 2.0 is released and we're discussing whether the mold is 113, 231, 260, or finally 346...

I don't know why this is a reason for some to be nervous. It's just an assumption. I just wanted to know if it's a good idea or not. That simple. I don't know why my topics displease some on the Forum. I just wanted to talk about things about tennis, when in Brazil, that's not possible, because most people who like tennis just want to know about Djokovic and nothing else. Which isn't so different around here. But here, there are a variety of interesting topics to comment on.

 

[dr325i]

I don't know why this is a reason for some to be nervous. It's just an assumption. I just wanted to know if it's a good idea or not. That simple. I don't know why my topics displease some on the Forum. I just wanted to talk about things about tennis, when in Brazil, that's not possible, because most people who like tennis just want to know about Djokovic and nothing else. Which isn't so different around here. But here, there are a variety of interesting topics to comment on.

I have many friends from Brazil that are vivid tennis players and everything you are saying is totally baseless…just like your threads.

Some of your topics, like this one, are complete waste of time because:
a) they make no sense
b) they have been discussed many times

 

[dr325i]

Well, it could be a 310 gram version without strings. Something customizable, with just the mold of Djokovic's racquet available to the public. I don't see anything wrong with that.

So…what would the TK346 mold with a random, lighter layup do for you?? How would you market it????
Hey, for many years Djokovic was actually using this one (for all of you 99.8% of tennis population), and guess what, this one looks like his frame but has nothing else in common with what he’s using. It is harder to use than any other retail speed out there.
From the business perspective, what is that going to do for Head and their investment into sending molds to China (impossible as we have seen with the PC2.0), random layup development and test (takes a year+) and marketing investment.

 

[oldmanyellingatcloud]

I don't know why this is a reason for some to be nervous. It's just an assumption. I just wanted to know if it's a good idea or not. That simple. I don't know why my topics displease some on the Forum. I just wanted to talk about things about tennis, when in Brazil, that's not possible, because most people who like tennis just want to know about Djokovic and nothing else. Which isn't so different around here. But here, there are a variety of interesting topics to comment on.

maybe "nervous" is a translation issue. it's just been discussed since 2009. it's a touchy issue because it came to a head a few years ago. sorry if I don't remember how long you've been lurking.

people with unprecedented access and knowledge still have limited "political capital" and have to make decisions on what projects they advocate for.

but I agree, if we removed thought experiments and speculation from here, then we would have a husk of a forum left.

 

[oldmanyellingatcloud]

So…what would the TK346 mold with a random, lighter layup do for you?? How would you market it????
Hey, for many years Djokovic was actually using this one (for all of you 99.8% of tennis population), and guess what, this one looks like his frame but has nothing else in common with what he’s using. It is harder to use than any other retail speed out there.
From the business perspective, what is that going to do for Head and their investment into sending molds to China (impossible as we have seen with the PC2.0), random layup development and test (takes a year+) and marketing investment.

Not coming to debate, just to dispute some characterizations. Head spent how much time on R&D and marketing on MxG and Crossbow? This is easy money in comparison.

1. Good thing we have the Wayback Machine. A snippet from the Tennis Warehouse Microgel Radical MP page circa January 2008 (their emphasis):
"Players with developed strokes will find moderate power, but with a heavy emphasis on control and feel. A solid choice for 4.5+ level players looking for a plush feeling racquet offering solid all court performance." You don't need to reinvent the wheel. Lest we forget, but like the current Speed MP, the flexible Radicals of old were used by players of all levels of tennis.

2. In terms of marketing, how brilliant would it be for them to say, here's the Djokovic's racquet you've all been asking for but in a user friendly and modern package? This accords with a lot of the PC2.0 marketing outside of the Prestigiousness of it all.

 

[dr325i]

Not coming to debate, just to dispute some characterizations. Head spent how much time on R&D and marketing on MxG and Crossbow? This is easy money in comparison.

1. Good thing we have the Wayback Machine. A snippet from the Tennis Warehouse Microgel Radical MP page circa January 2008 (their emphasis):
"Players with developed strokes will find moderate power, but with a heavy emphasis on control and feel. A solid choice for 4.5+ level players looking for a plush feeling racquet offering solid all court performance." You don't need to reinvent the wheel. Lest we forget, but like the current Speed MP, the flexible Radicals of old were used by players of all levels of tennis.

2. In terms of marketing, how brilliant would it be for them to say, here's the Djokovic's racquet you've all been asking for but in a user friendly and modern package? This accords with a lot of the PC2.0 marketing outside of the Prestigiousness of it all.

Again, read above.
1) TK346 mold is in Austria since only PT346.x use it. There are probably not more than 1 or 2 casts of the mold available. That is nowhere close to support the retail release as it takes ~20-30 min to bake each of the rackets. That means - investment in more molds/casts. They are expensive.
Closest ones that are made in China would be TK231 (flexpoint and LM both have hole/ridges) and guess what - that is a different mold from the 113/346.

1a) every retail frame would require manufacturing space (line) and that would mean something else would have to be shifted/repurposed. It is ok for a limited run like the PC2.0 or PT2.0, but not for a new silo.

2) the MxG was something they developed from scratch, as an idea/investment. They learned from their mistakes. Head is a very conservative company.

3) there is absolutely no room for a 95 sq in “Speed” in the speed line - totally does not go with the rest of the line. A marketing nightmare.

4) to your last point, and my point above - 99% of tennis population believes the Speed Pro IS what Djokovic is using and is not “asking” for the “real Djokovic frame”. It is a handful number of people on this board.

Now, given 1-4 above, if you were a Head decision maker on this, would you invest heavy $$ into new molds, would you lower production of other frames to squeeze this one, invest in a totally different marketing strategy with your best selling line and all of that for a small number of potential buyers that were whining about $259 price tag on the legendary PC2.0 issue???

 

[oldmanyellingatcloud]

Again, read above.
1) TK346 mold is in Austria since only PT346.x use it. There are probably not more than 1 or 2 casts of the mold available. That is nowhere close to support the retail release as it takes ~20-30 min to bake each of the rackets. That means - investment in more molds/casts. They are expensive.
Closest ones that are made in China would be TK231 (flexpoint and LM both have hole/ridges) and guess what - that is a different mold from the 113/346.

1a) every retail frame would require manufacturing space (line) and that would mean something else would have to be shifted/repurposed. It is ok for a limited run like the PC2.0 or PT2.0, but not for a new silo.

2) the MxG was something they developed from scratch, as an idea/investment. They learned from their mistakes. Head is a very conservative company.

3) there is absolutely no room for a 95 sq in “Speed” in the speed line - totally does not go with the rest of the line. A marketing nightmare.

4) to your last point, and my point above - 99% of tennis population believes the Speed Pro IS what Djokovic is using and is not “asking” for the “real Djokovic frame”. It is a handful number of people on this board.

Now, given 1-4 above, if you were a Head decision maker on this, would you invest heavy $$ into new molds, would you lower production of other frames to squeeze this one, invest in a totally different marketing strategy with your best selling line and all of that for a small number of potential buyers that were whining about $259 price tag on the legendary PC2.0 issue???

thanks as always for the insight and clarity on the matter. I know you have discussed it many times and you and I have butted heads as well, so I appreciate it.

1. I had no idea we were talking about single digit casts here. I'm probably in the minority who would be okay, even happy, with a 231 or 260 re-release. it'd probably be wise to stock up on grommets for my 113 and 231s because there can't be much inventory left.

1a. with how prevalent the 351 is on tour --- in Futures, specifically --- I hope that Head doesn't let the Radical silo fall by the wayside. newish molds nonwithstanding, it does feel like it gets neglected. it's worth lauding how much of an improvement 351 was over 307, though.

2. I do get the feeling they are very conservative. Boom must have been a big leap of faith from them too.

4. they did American consumers a disservice when they tried to hide the IG Speed Pro by making it Europe-exclusive. it did make the MPs that much more popular here which probably helped to the consolidate the Gravity silo, so it's not all bad.

5. I asked the question on the Racquets forum, so I'll ask directly here: should I just give up on chasing the feeling of flexible, twintube Radicals? a friend of mine plays the Touch Radical Pro and it got me thinking with Cuevas switching to 352, maybe there's something there and the classic feeling of iPrestige. while it's not twintube, the stiffness might be reminiscent enough of my 113A...

 

[dr325i]

thanks as always for the insight and clarity on the matter. I know you have discussed it many times and you and I have butted heads as well, so I appreciate it.

1. I had no idea we were talking about single digit casts here. I'm probably in the minority who would be okay, even happy, with a 231 or 260 re-release. it'd probably be wise to stock up on grommets for my 113 and 231s because there can't be much inventory left.

1a. with how prevalent the 351 is on tour --- in Futures, specifically --- I hope that Head doesn't let the Radical silo fall by the wayside. newish molds nonwithstanding, it does feel like it gets neglected. it's worth lauding how much of an improvement 351 was over 307, though.

2. I do get the feeling they are very conservative. Boom must have been a big leap of faith from them too.

4. they did American consumers a disservice when they tried to hide the IG Speed Pro by making it Europe-exclusive. it did make the MPs that much more popular here which probably helped to the consolidate the Gravity silo, so it's not all bad.

5. I asked the question on the Racquets forum, so I'll ask directly here: should I just give up on chasing the feeling of flexible, twintube Radicals? a friend of mine plays the Touch Radical Pro and it got me thinking with Cuevas switching to 352, maybe there's something there and the classic feeling of iPrestige. while it's not twintube, the stiffness might be reminiscent enough of my 113A...

5) i suggest to wait for the Auxetic 2.0 Radical Pro

 

[mpournaras]

Bro they are saving a retail Djoko Pro for when he nears retirement.