Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by Gonzalito17, Nov 17, 2012.
Good widsom here.
yeah. personally, i would like to win those hard fought points but if my opponent hits a better shots and wins the points, I would cheer for him too. Not important if I win.
Yes some people just enjoy the feeling of hitting and controlling the ball. But the only way to improve really is to actually compete. It's a totally different tempo and mindset in competing than just hitting the ball back to each other, which can be fun sometimes too. But it's always more enjoyable to be the one who wins the rally or makes the opponent miss his shot, than being the one who hits the ball out or into the net.
yes sometimes it is a thrill to see the opponent hit an amazing shot. last week we had a long rally then I finally hit a slice down the line, a good hard biting slice. He was on the full run and somehow managed to rip a forehand cross court winner off the ball which was barely above his ankle height. Perfect shot, Federer-esque, all you can do is smile and applaud. and wish you could see a video replay of the point )
nice. In that situation, not only do you have to have the tennis ability but also the strategy, and mental toughness to pull through. I agree, when you play against tough opponents it's about problem solving. That's why the coaches of the top ATP pros are making the big bucks
hmm well just let me know where and I should be able to play if it is 6pm or after on weekdays. I'll split the court cost.
Well we can't even come to agree on what "fun" is, so I don't know how to answer that haha.
Errors do not kill on their own, deferential between winners and errors kills.
And the fitness. It was so tiring to play this high level tennis with so much running and hard hitting from deep behind the baseline. had to slow down between points and also started taking changover breaks after 15 points which really helped.
errors are like getting punched in the head in the boxing match. you can only allow yourself so many errors before you get knocked out of the match.
When was the last time you worked on your technique?
Sounds like the great Federer is siding with Anton:
Roger Federer and “unforced errors”
Here’s the tennis superstar on his current form in the Australian Open
“I don’t care about unforced errors,” he said. “The guys that love the statistics, they love those things. I don’t care if I make 20 or 60 unforced errors. I don’t care, as long as I’m doing the right things and staying true to my game plan and it makes sense. If I’m just making errors and I can’t hit a winner any more, then I’m in trouble, clearly.”
Ok, then you should be able to answer - how many errors can you make in best of three match and still win?
but of course, like storypeddler has said, we are not Federer
Every time I hit a ball.
Never counted. But as few as possible. Have played some sets where the opponent said after "Geez you made only two or three errors the whole set."
You see, every shot you get back over the net is like a punch landing in the fight. You try to score as many hits as possible, make your opponents deal with as many different problems as you can possibly give him.
Well maybe you should, because what you'd find is that YOU CAN'T.
You can't say how many errors it would take to lose. You can make a lot of errors and still win if you make enough winners and force enough errors.
I don't believe it.
I believe I've seen you type huge blocks like that at least three times now so just wanted to point out the readability issue since your content is good. Put some paragraph breaks in there so we can read it. It's nearly impossible to read 30+ sentences in one huge block like that! Paragraph breaks in a forum need not make sense for content -- just make it readable.
You could very easily break that up into 8 to 10 paragraphs and it will be soooooo much easier for us to read. When I saw the huge block my first instinct was to read the first couple of sentences and the last.
Please report back to us in the thread, Gonza and Anton, how the sets go. I'd like to see a few posts by both of you about your post-match thoughts. You each can talk here but ultimately someone will win on the court.
No prob - I'll even take my cam and post the highlights
Sounds like you did use the pusher strategy against this guy. There is special kind of fun to be had in feasting on your opponents errors but you could have ripped a few winners here & there...
I did Henin )
Anton, how about we play Thursday night at New Overpeck Park in Leonia NJ, it's supposed to be in the 50 or 40s temp, good lights there, free courts, hard court. 6:30 or 7?
beating him 6-0, 6-0 wasn't enough.
you should've also knocked him down and urinated on him.
it's the only way they'll bow to your superiority
haha. This is the way to do it
Alrighty, so long as we are sure they keep the lights on still.
LOL. Touche. One other thing---I would be interested in knowing how often Fed has had 60 unforced errors in a match and won.
What you say is true---as far as it goes. If you are considerably better than your opponent them you should theoretically be able to make enough winners to offset a lot of errors. In an even match between fairly evenly skilled players, however, that strategy won't work. When talent is even, consistency almost always determines the victor.
Understood. Good advice. Thank you.
Well the nature of aggressive game is more unforced errors, but also more winners.
Great...let us know guys if it's a "date" for tennis.
"...and if he cries out, I'm gona push it, push it some more..."
If I didn't have to be somewhere at 8pm on Thursday I would volunteer as line judge....
Yes the lights come on there at 5, so I'll see you on Thursday night at 6:30 New Overpeck Park just off rt 95 (NJTurnpike) in Leonia.
ok sounds good
OK ... I will be first to make a score prediction. Admittedly I know nothing about these folks other than their TT claims.
I say ... Anton wins a split decision ... He is up 6-4, 0-6, 3-0 when the lights go out ....
i don't know who is going to win but I hope Anton won't call Gonzalito a pusher if he loses
48 hours till all bluffs are called.
who ever loses buy the other guy a soda
I think Anton will win the match after losing the first set. Either way, he'll probably have more fun.
I hadn't checked this thread for a while so here's my late reply .
If you have pushing-esque strokes that doesn't necessarily make you a pusher, especially if you can control it in any way. If your game consists of that type of play then that's just how you play. I also don't think it makes you a pusher if you decide to goof around and push sometimes.
Like I said, the main thing that makes pushing pushing and makes pushing bad is when a player rallies with full strokes and variation and then when it comes to games they wont hit the same full strokes as they do in practice, it hurts them in the long run. They will win that match but they wont improve because they are not getting any practice hitting more difficult shots in a match situation.
yeah. my hitting partner was just goofing around that night. He is a terrific player who can hit super hard from both sides and is pretty lethal at the net. He doesn't practice much but he still plays better than some of us who do. It doesn't seem fair but some people have this ability
To the OP, this has happened to me also when beating an opponent a long time ago. I just played 2 or 3 rally shots before really attacking, but the problem was that my opponent would always make UEs before I could hit a winner. He didn't call me pusher, but he said I had a really defensive style. Huh? If you can't even handle a rally ball and you UE before I can hit any winners, how do you know my playing style? A well played point often begins aften the second exchange...
A soda? You cannot be serious! I suggest at least a case of Dos Equis. After all, it's the beer of choice of the most interesting man in the world. A man that even Chuck Norris will not mess with.
Tom's right. But the ante should be upped to a six-pack of the winner's choice. Tom and I shall join the actions via the live web cam spectating from our homes with Dos Equis brew in hand. Ah....
The Overpeck Park authorities were going to move this to a Monday final but the ATP opposes the move.
Win or lose Anton will have my respect if he actually drives out there. I'm sure they will become fast friends as the love of the game trumps all.
I actually originated the Wikipedia entry on Pusher (tennis) years ago after losing to one. The entry has been edited over the years. IMHO the very best pushers also use psychological warfare. Like asking for the score as you begin your service motion, talking & shouting as a hindrance and etc.
I've grown to appreciate the pusher style but they have no love for the beauty of the game which is why I got into it to begin with. They only love to compete at all costs.
A good article with insight from Jack Kramer on defensive play (aka "pushing" to many here).
Revisiting the Wisdom of Mr. Jack Kramer
It really is a different mindset.
I grew up watching too much Sampras and psychologically feel compelled to go for a winner by the 2nd time my racquet touches the ball on every point. I hit some of my best shots of the year last night, including an in-the-air swinging backhand volley cross court that hits the line... I lost the match 6-4, 6-1.
My current hitting partner is a pusher. I am learning discipline and the need to have a game plan or strategy to build a point. To set myself up for a winner, instead of forcing one.
On our drive from the match...
Relinquis: "hey, did you see that jumping backhand i pulled off in the first set?"
pusherfriend: "yeah. you should have let the ball pass you, it was going out"
I'm just driving out for some tennis - there are no lit courts here on SI and only 6 inside courts - so getting court time in the winter is PIA.
I swear I'm moving to Cali sooner or later
I think the key here is to not sacrifice smooth form for harder hitting.
Basically hit as hard as you can while maintaining relaxed arm and balance.
In my opinion, the beauty of the game is the point construction and if you are a good player, you should be able to construct enough points to beat a pusher. If not then you aren't as good of player as you thought
If you are the kind of player who would go for a winner at the first opportunity, I think a match against a very consistent player would be more interesting than match against another player who also plays first strike tennis. That matchup would produce a match with no rally and no point construction whatsoever.
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