NeutralFan
G.O.A.T.
Glat to see more people seeing the light and recognizing Sinner as a more talented player
I don't see Alcaraz as anything more than a Jim Courier level player
- Thread starter GRASScaraz
- Start date
NeutralFan
G.O.A.T.
Yeah, we should only take seriously commentary from randos on the Internet
Yes, son!
KingCarlitos
Hall of Fame
NeutralFan
G.O.A.T.
You're, time to get on Sinner train, Sinner is the main man and the real king
Keizer
Hall of Fame
There’s a difference between 18 major winner Chris Evert talking about 3 major winner Ash Barty like that and what you’re saying. How many 21 year olds in the history of tennis have won majors on all surfaces? Zero, other than Alcaraz.
As for Sinner being the better HC player - he is more consistent against lower ranked players but has only beaten Alcaraz in one big match (Miami 2023). Alcaraz beat him at USO and IW twice. In theory, Sinner should beat him more frequently now, but I don’t think it is as stark as we think.
As for hyping him too much, the guy has just won 2 slams this year and looks like the best bet to win more next year, especially on the natural surfaces. By the end of 2025 barring something extraordinary from Sinner, Djokovic, or someone else, his numbers will be Edberg/Beckeresque rather than Courier-esque. And if he were to have a career ending injury tomorrow, he would still be better than Courier because of the channel slam + slams on 3 surfaces.
grandefrankie
Semi-Pro
Well yes that is my whole point. It is FAR more ridiculous than even Courier saying Alcarez is already in another class than him, and should totally negate any commentators comment on such a thing. However if you are that desperate to be right, that you need to go on something as flawed as a commentator promoting the game saying something, then go for it.
vex
Legend
Bro… how you gonna say that
… is your Jim Courier type career cutoff … when you literally just saw Rafa Nadal dominate for two decades and win 22 slams…. despite having to fight thru Djoker/Fed…
vex
Legend
Nah he’s way better than that
NeutralFan
G.O.A.T.
We will see, i personally think he's a lesser player than Sinner
Oval_Solid
Hall of Fame
i want to see alcaraz reading a book during a change over
Keizer
Hall of Fame
It’s not like every commentator goes out of their way to say modern players are better than they were. You’re as likely to find people (ex-players and otherwise) saying that the old times were tougher. Athletes are especially prideful about their own abilities. I don’t even care that Courier said it, in fact I didn’t even know he did when I made my original post. The talent and future career of Alcaraz is already clear and will be even more clear of Courier’s by the end of next season. Only on TTW will you see people comparing Alcaraz to Courier, the rest of the world is (sensibly in this case) comparing him to Big 3.
norcal
Legend
Really? You're so hard to read!
The user made a bogus claim not too dissimilar to the moronic take that the OP is.
What a despicable, dishonest post though the other one. When cornered with his "pretty much every match" lie, he deflects.
This forum and in particular a select few individuals need group therapy at a minimum.
In fairness to Courier, it was probably a very engrossing read.
Sure if Alcaraz is a Courier, Sinner isn't even as good as a single Berdych ballsac.
Used to have two. One of them calls itself Jannik Sinner these days. Some of it spilled over still, and became Emil Ruusuvuori.
CHillTennis
Hall of Fame
The only reason this kid is winning right now is because the field is trash.
norcal
Legend
Lleytonstation
Bionic Poster
B
Bride of Alcaraz
Guest
Its too late OP, Alcaraz is already better than 21-year-old Federer and Djokovic, 4 slam titles already and back-to-back Wimbledon titles.
In fact both his Wimbledon titles were vs. Djokovic, so they are worth a lot more than 2 Wimbledons!
Clearly Sinner won't be able to stop Alcaraz at Roland Garros and Wimbledon, and on hardcourt it won't be easy either, as we saw at Indian Wells...
So looks like 2-3 slams per year for Alcaraz.
In fact both his Wimbledon titles were vs. Djokovic, so they are worth a lot more than 2 Wimbledons!
Clearly Sinner won't be able to stop Alcaraz at Roland Garros and Wimbledon, and on hardcourt it won't be easy either, as we saw at Indian Wells...
So looks like 2-3 slams per year for Alcaraz.
chjtennis
G.O.A.T.
Jim Courier was a great champion. He looked so dominant while he was no.1, albeit for only a couple of years. If anyone says certain player is as good as him, that's giving the player a huge credit for his ability.
Alcaraz is extremely different from Courier, though. Looks more naturally talented, more versatile and has many different winning shots. Courier's FH was his main weapon. The technique looked a little unorthodox, but cool in its own way. His baseball style BH motion was also his trademark, but his FH was his main weapon.
Alcaraz is extremely different from Courier, though. Looks more naturally talented, more versatile and has many different winning shots. Courier's FH was his main weapon. The technique looked a little unorthodox, but cool in its own way. His baseball style BH motion was also his trademark, but his FH was his main weapon.
a10best
Legend
Agassi winning 8 slams in the deep 90s era is the equivalent of winning 3 during Fedalovic era. Lots of respect for Murray and Wawrinka.
It's difficult to predict how many Carlos will end up with since AO and USO are challenges for him against top 5 players. Ruud and Tiafoe are not top 5, hence his victories over them at USO.
When healthy, Med and Zev have Carlos figured out on hc.
PMChambers
Hall of Fame
Tennis must be your second or third language. You don't understand it fluently.
No, just no.
BTW have you ever watched Courier or just looked up who has 4 Majors and though it was a delivery guy.
zagor
Bionic Poster
Former tennis pros are notoriously self deprecating, especially those involved in the commentary business. Their statements really shouldn't be taken at face value.
Courier was actually quite young himself when he won 4 slams and was #1. His peak was very short lived but he had some amazing performances. His 1992 FO run for example was just stacked, full of CC specialists. He only dropped one set in winning the title. Alcaraz can't win a slam without going 5 sets with every Tom, Dick and Harry on the way (2023 Wimbledon being the sole exception so far).
Is Alcaraz a more complete player? Yes and his career will definitely eclipse Courier by a good margin barring some catastrophe. However, Courier's peak level of play is very underrated and the comparison isn't nearly as insulting as people here seem to think.
Martin J
Hall of Fame
And he wasn't even a CC specialist, it's just that his game translated well to clay due to several factors (killer FH, insane stamina, patience...), which makes his runs look even more impressive.
zagor
Bionic Poster
I'd say he legit had one of the best I/O FHs of all time. 90s CC field was just brutal, ton of depth and the 16th seed system in slams.
Lleytonstation
Bionic Poster
Yeah so Carlos winning 4 in this era is really like 2.
That's how it works.
The latest result sets the agenda for the day.
It's all about the tone imo. Even the now poorly aged Hewitt comparisons with Carlos weren't nearly as insulting as it was implied/weaponized to be.
Berdych himself a great player fwiw, isn't a bad player to get compared to for Sinner. But it is weaponized and used for ridicule to counter some of the larpers above in this thread with those "hehe glad ppl realise Sinner more talent, next fedr" posts
Unironically I don't particularly subscribe to wholly weak eras either if we are being utterly serious. All pros deserve respect but there's a very cheap, fun thrill to be had trolling around!
Paul, Medvedev, De Minaur, Zverev/ Tiafoe.
Can Sinner do it?
zagor
Bionic Poster
Yep, agreed. Honestly a couple of pros like Berdych, Tsonga and Sodderling were stuck in the ringer with the big 3 because their primes overlapped.
Berdych was a great ballstriker and deserves respect.
It's usually not as simple as weak or strong but I do firmly believe that 90s for example had a couple of factors that made ridiculously long term dominance the big 3 displayed all but impossible.
But people want simple x player > y player answers all the time.
Lleytonstation
Bionic Poster
Keeping those kids in line.Before Alcaraz's rise
TTW: Alcaraz is another next gen OVERHYPED mug that won't win anything LOOOOOOL
After Alcaraz's rise:
TTW: Why hasn't he won 50 slams and 10 CYGS yet? Jim Courier level AT BEST
I didn't watch the game in the 90s. Too young for that. But retroactively I became a Petegassi fan and I'll die on the hill that as far as calibre goes they aren't inherently different from the Big 3.
Your point on the draws is spot on. It's credit to the system change that I believe the Big 3 have the numbers that the 90s greats couldn't. One factor anyway.
NeutralFan
G.O.A.T.
True!! It was impossible to win 20+ slams in 90s , i remember how much respect players earned for winning just 6 slams back then. Condition were vastly different from slams to slams back then plus players didn't have luxury to play at close to their best till 36-37 in conditions tailored for their game . Imo it's stupid to compare players unless they overlapped a lot or played in same era.
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NeutralFan
G.O.A.T.
Yes
B
Bride of Alcaraz
Guest
I wonder if Sinner will win as many slams as Courier...
Sinner was very lucky to win that AO, only won it because Medvedev played 6 more hours.
Medvedev led 2-sets-to-love and then lost 10km on his forehand in the 3rd set and started grunting with exhaustion.
And Sinner's AO win over Djokovic was meaningless, as Djokovic said “I was, in a way, shocked with my level, you know, in a bad way. There was not much I was doing right in the first two sets. I guess this is one of the worst Grand Slam matches I've ever played. At least that I remember."
So if we're betting on who will win the same number of slams as Courier, obviously Alcaraz already has won 4 and headed for way more, while Sinner may take 10 years to win 4!
Sinner was very lucky to win that AO, only won it because Medvedev played 6 more hours.
Medvedev led 2-sets-to-love and then lost 10km on his forehand in the 3rd set and started grunting with exhaustion.
And Sinner's AO win over Djokovic was meaningless, as Djokovic said “I was, in a way, shocked with my level, you know, in a bad way. There was not much I was doing right in the first two sets. I guess this is one of the worst Grand Slam matches I've ever played. At least that I remember."
So if we're betting on who will win the same number of slams as Courier, obviously Alcaraz already has won 4 and headed for way more, while Sinner may take 10 years to win 4!
vex
Legend
How can you possibly look at a 21 y/o who has had the fastest start to winning majors we’ve seen since … what Rafa? … and think he’s gonna win less than 10-12 on the low end?
Tallawah Tennis
Professional
Man, this tripe. Carlitos WILL do this, he WON'T do that, he shouldn't even TRY as this is a weak era, so ANYTHING he does will be worthless. Does this apply to all of the current tour, or is Carlitos the ONLY one? HE is a SHEEP/ his fans are SHEEP/ and for what? Just to be a NOBODY.
The above and its like repeated over and over, passing for great wit and incisive analysis. Even the biggest elephant on the planet won't produce more sh$t than this constant drivel.
On topic, seeking to limit an active young player who is (by all assessment by those that know their stuff ) a remarkable talent, to achievements of a player long retired, is obtuse. Carlitos may not win another title. He might win a few. He might win lots of them. No one, and certainly not the self appointed geniuses on this forum can know.
The above and its like repeated over and over, passing for great wit and incisive analysis. Even the biggest elephant on the planet won't produce more sh$t than this constant drivel.
On topic, seeking to limit an active young player who is (by all assessment by those that know their stuff ) a remarkable talent, to achievements of a player long retired, is obtuse. Carlitos may not win another title. He might win a few. He might win lots of them. No one, and certainly not the self appointed geniuses on this forum can know.
Man, you giving facts to the obtuse?
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Lleytonstation
Bionic Poster
roysid
Legend
Courier had a great run of 2.5 years from 91-93 but that's it. During this period he got 4 slams and used to beat Edberg and Agassi regularly.
But that's it. He fizzled out. The fundamental defect in his game play..i.e fh dependent was exposed and that's it. Everyone started to dominate against him..even a old Boris. Come to think of it, his game was like Roddick and he has his Federer too in Sampras who owned him.
In terms of results, Alcaraz is also at 4 slams but there is no signs of him being dominated by Sinner, Djoker, Meddy, Zverev etc in the future. He will be much better
But that's it. He fizzled out. The fundamental defect in his game play..i.e fh dependent was exposed and that's it. Everyone started to dominate against him..even a old Boris. Come to think of it, his game was like Roddick and he has his Federer too in Sampras who owned him.
In terms of results, Alcaraz is also at 4 slams but there is no signs of him being dominated by Sinner, Djoker, Meddy, Zverev etc in the future. He will be much better
