I just found I suck...alot

Ballinbob

Ballinbob

Hall of Fame
I had the most frustrating experience ever today. My friend just came back from Texas after living there for a year, and I played him today. Hes 18 and hes a 4.5. A legit 4.5. Anyway, Im 15 and consider myself a upper end 3.5 who needs to work on mental toughness and footwork to compete at the 4.0 level. Anyway, about our games so you can understand what happened.

My game-
Weapons:none
Strengths: Consistent 1hbh but cant handle deep flat shots. Consistent kick serve that kicks 5-6 feet. Not really that fast but consistent. Consistent volleys that don't really have that great of placement, but I dont miss.

The rest of my game is just average for a 3.5. Oh and weaknesses is mental toughness and footwork.

Now for his game.......
Weapons: Groundies on both sides, just huge groundies
Strengths: Ball anticipation. he pretty much knew where I was going to hit everytime. His volleys were pretty good too
Weakness: Serve. He just hit a pretty spinny slice with not much pace. Was enough to neutralize the point for him.

This is what happened. During the match I noticed he made me pay for my poor footwork. I was like alright, my footwork is bad and I've known that, whats new? Basically I wasn't really mad at this b/c I knew it was bad. Heres what me mad. I get into a cross court backhand rally with him and at first I was comfortable b/c my backhand is my best shot right? Wrong. He just blasted right through me with big topspin backhands. I was about to kill myself. My backhand, my best shot, just completely failed me right on the spot and I could do nothing about it. I take pride that my backhand is one of the only shots that I have that doesn't break down and it broke down right before my eyes. Im like what happened!!!!! The same happend for all my other shots: everything just broke down and went down the drain. When S&Ving on my serve everything went horribly..... In the end he took away every strength I had and I just started hitting hard as possible hoping to get some points here and there.

Anyway, after I calmed down I started thinking what went wrong and I had no idea. Against 3.5s and even pretty good 4.0s my backhand doesnt break down like that. What happend here? Is it my bad mental toughness or is my backhand actually horrible after all? I dont know what to say....

Comment plz
thx
 
Be glad, you just realized you have more work to do. You just got the best tennis lesson and you didn't even have to pay for it. You played a player that is better then you and exposed your weaknesses. If you go over the match in your head and analyze how you got beat then you'll figure out where you're lacking. Don't be mad, thank him as now you have a plan for what you need to work on to take your game to the next level. Try and play with players better then you more often and you'll see what you need work on. Its a never ending process at any level of play.

Edit:

Also realize the more you play with someone significantly better the better your game will become. Almost sounded to me like you don't get enough of a challenge when you play and you've become too comfortable playing with players the same level as you.
 
I actually put a curse on you when you stole my words for your signature without my permission.

This curse will last for twenty-four more years!!!!

I am so sorry.
 
tennis_balla said:
Be glad, you just realized you have more work to do. You just got the best tennis lesson and you didn't even have to pay for it. You played a player that is better then you and exposed your weaknesses. If you go over the match in your head and analyze how you got beat then you'll figure out where you're lacking. Don't be mad, thank him as now you have a plan for what you need to work on to take your game to the next level. Try and play with players better then you more often and you'll see what you need work on. Its a never ending process at any level of play.

Edit:

Also realize the more you play with someone significantly better the better your game will become. Almost sounded to me like you don't get enough of a challenge when you play and you've become too comfortable playing with players the same level as you.
Click to expand...

I see where your going with this. But what I don't get is how all my strengths just suddenly turned into weaknesses. I don't know if I just suck or what. Your right about not getting enough of a challenge. My 2 hitting partners are around my level so really I don't get that big of a challenge. The only challenges I get is in tourneys but I only do like a tourney a month or two. I guess mabye I just got alot to work on then... Seriously though that was so frustrating, never been that mad in my life.


And TokyopunK, it was too good. I had to take it before someone else did. I hope you understand:)
 
You seem surprised that someone who is a whole level above you beat you so badly. That's a huge difference in skill. What do you think would happen if Tonlars played that same 4.5? It wouldn't be pretty, let me assure you.

The only thing I can say to you is to try mixing up the pace frequently in your rallies. Don't make the mistake of letting him get in the groove by giving him the same ball over and over. Think something like topspin forehand crosscourt, backhand topspin angle (depending on if it comes to your backhand, of course, maybe high a high looper cross-court if you get a forehand), flat ball down the line once you get a weak reply (although he may not give you anything like this at his level), approach the net.

Or perhaps topspin backhand cross-court, slice backhand cross-court if he hits it back to your backhand (if not, hit a cross-court forehand angle), deep, high looper up the middle, flat ball cross-court, (depending on the strength of his reply of course), etc.

P.S. Here are a couple more videos of Tony Larson's game, in case I haven't already convinced you of how badly he would thrash said 4.5:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGR1n0Xhvvk&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRj1mV6n-VU&feature=related
 
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Ballinbob said:
I see where your going with this. But what I don't get is how all my strengths just suddenly turned into weaknesses. I don't know if I just suck or what. Your right about not getting enough of a challenge. My 2 hitting partners are around my level so really I don't get that big of a challenge. The only challenges I get is in tourneys but I only do like a tourney a month or two. I guess mabye I just got alot to work on then... Seriously though that was so frustrating, never been that mad in my life.


And TokyopunK, it was too good. I had to take it before someone else did. I hope you understand:)
Click to expand...

Its all right there in front of you.

"Im 15 and consider myself a upper end 3.5 who needs to work on mental toughness and footwork to compete at the 4.0 level."

"During the match I noticed he made me pay for my poor footwork."

So you knew your footwork wasn't the greatest but you got by with it playing against players at your level, yet when you play someone better it gets exposed. So if you know its a weakness then don't neglect it :-P Really like I said before, find someone who is better then you and who challenges you to play cleaner, faster and makes you work for every point thus making you mentally stronger in the process.
 
Djokovicfan4life i wasnt surprised at all that i was beat that bad. I just was mad that my best shots were made to look like crap and that everything crumbled right in front of me. Its not like I was hitting them any different..Thanks for the advice though. I dont change things up nearly as much as I should probably. Big baseliners like him probably love having a rythm so they can just pound on you. And Ive seen Larson's vids, I know hes a crazy good player.

And tennis balla, will playing better players really help that much? I dont know, getting thrashed like that was no fun but if it helps then I guess it helps. Is there a reason I get better when playing better players? Is it just because I learn to play at a faster pace or what? Or is it more of a push your self harder type of thing where your forced to push your self to compete?

edit again-So its normal for you to have everything break down against better players even when your hitting the same way as normal?
 
Last edited:
everybody sucks when he plays against a better player.
i know this one guy, he does not want to suck so he would only play against the lower level players.
 
I remember hearing women players like Chris Evert, who sometimes trained against men, say that she felt hitting against men caused her to get out of her game. I think, what she meant was that her time was cut short, and so she had to hit shorter strokes than she was used to, and that threw off her game.

It sounds like the guy you played against robbed you of time, and so you weren't able to get to the ball quick enough, which meant you lacked the time to set up your shot, which made your shot worse than usual. Even if you had had time to prepare (i.e., didn't have to run), I suspect you were hitting the ball a fraction late because you weren't used to the ball coming that quickly.

I assume hitting against better players would help you work on your footwork and learn how to prepare sooner so you could hit your shot more solidly.

They do say that every 0.5 you move up, your opponent is that much tougher. Thus, a 3.5 playing a 4.0 would struggle quite a bit against a 4.0, although depending on how strong a 3.5 you are, you'd fare all right, but the leap to 4.5 should mean the guy beats you almost always.

If you take any consolation, a 5.5 is likely to make your friend look just as bad as he made you look. The levels keep going up and up!
 
Ballinbob said:
So its normal for you to have everything break down against better players even when your hitting the same way as normal?
Click to expand...

Thats just it, would you play a player thats 4.5 the same as someone who's 3.5? Of course you wouldn't.
Its no fun because you're not used to it and you weren't prepared. You have to realize you gotta play this player different. Pay more attention to your first serve percentage, get your feet moving, get prepared earlier and some of the shots that worked against your regular opponents will not work against someone who's better then you. Charlzz has the right idea more or less.
 
alright.thanks guys

I dont even know why I posted this thread to be honest. Ive been mad all day and it felt better to write it out lol.

P.S-good news, i actually got some decent clips of my forehand and will post ASAP. I have no idea how to put it on to youtube but i will figure it out lol
 
Hey don't take this as a negative but as a positive. You don't suck, you're just dejected cause someone schooled you and you got a little ahead of yourself with the level of your tennis, it happens. Like I said take the positive out of this and understand what it is that you have to work on to get better. I'm sure your friend while being down in Texas got to play a lot of tennis and with some good players so he improved. Its natural, its like going to a tennis academy or clinic for a week. You're almost guaranteed to play better based on the fact that you hit so many balls and play that many more hours even if the coaches aren't that great.
 
I would look at this as a huge positve. I played a strong 4.5 several times last year. My bad luck is he has a good serve. This guy killed me. I am lucky I have pretty good power and at times (few) I could get a weak reply. I only won a few of the few. His volleys are really good.

The great this is, he is a good guy. After our match he pointed out several things I could do better and he set up some drills with me and we drilled. The best compliment I ever got I got from this guy.....He called me a fighter. I ran my a** off after every ball. He told me there was no way I couldn't improve with my attitude.

The point is, playing with better players is the fastest way to improve. And it keeps you ego in check........

I will also add, against a good 4.5, average 3.5 volleys won't work. They will pick it up and pass you or lob you or go right through you. Its quite a challenge. I would rather get beat by a 4.5 than lose to any 3.5 any day.
 
I think some of the advice on what a 3.5 should try against a 4.5 won't help. There's just too big of a gap. The 3.5 will lose by alot no matter what strategy they use. Also, be aware of this; alot of people advance from 1.0 to 3.5 quickly. But much fewer ever go on to the 4.5 level. Don't be upset. A better player beat you badly. Just as a 5.5 would have beaten him badly.
 
haha thanks puma. you guys are all right, Im looking at it the wrong way. Now at least i got a taste of the higher leveled guys and how good i have to be to compete with them
 
Ballinbob said:
haha thanks puma. you guys are all right, Im looking at it the wrong way. Now at least i got a taste of the higher leveled guys and how good i have to be to compete with them
Click to expand...

I believe this is why journeyman pros (ranked below, say, 30) look at players ranked in the top 5 with admiration. They know they're still better than almost every other player in the world, and yet they would get schooled by a Federer or Nadal or Djokovic or Murray. They might be able to get a few games, but if things got close, the top players know how to win games.

Yet, the average fan watches matches by the top pros and have no idea just how good they are. They might watch someone like Blake and Roddick and see them lose to players that aren't that highly ranked, yet not realize just how good Blake and Roddick really are. They just aren't Nadal and Federer.

You should view this as a positive experience to realize there are still levels to work up to, and that it will take some time to get there.
 
As far as the whole playing with better players goes, I think that you should look for players at the 4.0 level to play with. I don't think that getting thrashed by a 4.5 will really do anything for your game, except maybe motivate you to practice harder. By playing guys a half a level above you can play good tennis while still challenging yourself.
 
Ballinbob said:
Anyway, after I calmed down I started thinking what went wrong and I had no idea. What happend here? Is it my bad mental toughness or is my backhand actually horrible after all? I dont know what to say....

Comment plz
thx
Click to expand...

Uhmmmmm,,,,,,,, why are you searching for answers when you already gave it>>>> you are a 3.5 and you played a 4.5. end of story. Those two levels are night and day.
 
i learned that I still got a long way to go and that practicing with guys better than me will make me alot better. I also learned not to give a big hitter rythym b/c thats what they like.
 
Ballinbob said:
haha thanks puma. you guys are all right, Im looking at it the wrong way. Now at least i got a taste of the higher leveled guys and how good i have to be to compete with them
Click to expand...

That's exactly the right attitude! I love playing against players that are better than me because it pushes me to want to become a better overall player. This semester in tennis club, I met a bunch of great players and we collectively push each other to become better players. I feel that I have had the most improvement so far this school year than I have in years past and it is due to competing against better players!
 
Ballinbob said:
I had the most frustrating experience ever today. My friend just came back from Texas after living there for a year, and I played him today. Hes 18 and hes a 4.5. A legit 4.5. Anyway, Im 15 and consider myself a upper end 3.5 who needs to work on mental toughness and footwork to compete at the 4.0 level. Anyway, about our games so you can understand what happened.

My game-
Weapons:none
Strengths: Consistent 1hbh but cant handle deep flat shots. Consistent kick serve that kicks 5-6 feet. Not really that fast but consistent. Consistent volleys that don't really have that great of placement, but I dont miss.

The rest of my game is just average for a 3.5. Oh and weaknesses is mental toughness and footwork.

Now for his game.......
Weapons: Groundies on both sides, just huge groundies
Strengths: Ball anticipation. he pretty much knew where I was going to hit everytime. His volleys were pretty good too
Weakness: Serve. He just hit a pretty spinny slice with not much pace. Was enough to neutralize the point for him.

This is what happened. During the match I noticed he made me pay for my poor footwork. I was like alright, my footwork is bad and I've known that, whats new? Basically I wasn't really mad at this b/c I knew it was bad. Heres what me mad. I get into a cross court backhand rally with him and at first I was comfortable b/c my backhand is my best shot right? Wrong. He just blasted right through me with big topspin backhands. I was about to kill myself. My backhand, my best shot, just completely failed me right on the spot and I could do nothing about it. I take pride that my backhand is one of the only shots that I have that doesn't break down and it broke down right before my eyes. Im like what happened!!!!! The same happend for all my other shots: everything just broke down and went down the drain. When S&Ving on my serve everything went horribly..... In the end he took away every strength I had and I just started hitting hard as possible hoping to get some points here and there.

Anyway, after I calmed down I started thinking what went wrong and I had no idea. Against 3.5s and even pretty good 4.0s my backhand doesnt break down like that. What happend here? Is it my bad mental toughness or is my backhand actually horrible after all? I dont know what to say....

Comment plz
thx
Click to expand...

You don't suck, you're in the midst of learning progress as are the top player of the ATP chart. Don't judge your shots the way they are now, that won't bring change. Let your shots grow as you grow as a player. By thinking that you suck you actually begin to think so for real, which has a negative affect on your mental game. Just learn and enjoy the learning progress, don't feel ashamed or angry when you hit a bad shot, those things happen, even to the very best. Your shots broke down in that match because your mental game broke down. You were scared of how badly you were going to lose, there is no reason to do that. Enjoy playing and learning, every loss is a learning experience and by analyzing your game a little afterwards in a positive manner you're likely to learn more about your game.
 
So you're upset that someone faster than you, more coordinated than you, more fleet footed than you, and more tactically apt than you came out on top?


Ok
 
tennis_balla said:
Bob have you ever read the book Winning Ugly by Brad Gilbert?
Click to expand...

I have, great book. I just cant do what Gilbert does though. I'm self taught so what I did was read and read and read articles about tennis and technique so i could learn. So now I have the foundations for technique and I know how to critque myself in the middle of the match for technique because I got it engrained in my memory. However, mental toughness, I cant really read a whole bunch of articles and get it. I plan on playing a crap load of tourneys so I can get better, b/c I have a feeling that once I more tough mentally I will be able to compete with the 4.0s. I can rally with 4.0s just fine, but when I play a match I'm hotheaded, throw my racket, double fault on break points, yell at myself, argue about every line call, and well everything goes bad.The 4.5 I played, even when he made a simple mistake, didnt do anything. You couldnt tell if he was loosing 0-2 sets or up 2-0 in sets if you didnt know the level difference. I just need practice.

Thanks guys for the replies. I feel better now lol :):):)
 
just stick with it. practice, practice, practice....trust me...i used to be in the same situation.my serve was no there and my backhand was my best shot...but i would break down a bit...i also had no confidence and mental toughness. i practiced my bum off and now my serve is really consistent, and playing matches dosen't affect me. my mental toughness is the improving tremendously...just keep it up, you'll get it. =)
 
lol yeah. I'm like Gasquet in that sense. Hes my favorite player, but he can never pull it together in the important matches. Hes fun to watch and his shots are pretty, but he has horrible mental toughness.Hopefully a couple thousand tourneys will cure me lol
 
Ballinbob said:
lol yeah. I'm like Gasquet in that sense. Hes my favorite player, but he can never pull it together in the important matches. Hes fun to watch and his shots are pretty, but he has horrible mental toughness.Hopefully a couple thousand tourneys will cure me lol
Click to expand...

I don't know, you don't come back from two sets to love down against Roddick in a Wimbledon quarter final without at least a LITTLE mental toughness.
 
Djokovicfan4life said:
I don't know, you don't come back from two sets to love down against Roddick in a Wimbledon quarter final without at least a LITTLE mental toughness.
Click to expand...

Haha dude yeah, true. But overall you have to admit that's really whats holding him back. Look at this years wimby vs Murray. I cried myself to sleep after that
 
Ugh, don't remind me. Anyway, I hope he comes back strong next year. He should have very few points to defend with all the tournaments he pulled out of this year, no?

I love watching all the french players play, except Bennateau (or however you spell it). Gasquet, Llodra, and Tsonga are some of my favorite players. It's too bad that Santoro had to retire. That guy was amazing.
 
Yeah they're all pretty good. Tsonga has one hell of an ego though that I dont like.Otherwise I like all of them. Llodora is great too, I watched a match vs him and Karlovic and he showed him up with his S&V. Ldora is a real S&Ver, not Karlovic.
 
Did you see Llodra's win over Bolleli at the French Open? That was good stuff, right there. A serve and volleyer made it into the fourth round at Roland Garros. That just made my day.

What do you mean by Tsonga's ego? Are you talking about that thing he does where he points to himself after he wins the match? He has never seemed very arrogant to me.
 
weird... this is the thread i got it from : http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=230843

heres the article incase that too doesnt work:
Jo-Wilfried Tsonga blamed clueless ball kids for his opening loss at the Masters Cup in Shanghai, with the petulant French player perhaps finding excuses for his own rookie mistakes on court.

A debutant at the year-end event, the hyper-fit 23-year-old who won the Paris title a week ago said he "lost energy" waiting for hardd-working ball kids to fetch him his towel frequently between points as he went down in Gold group play to Nikolay Davydenko in three sets.

"When I ask for my towel, my towel didn't come," lamented Tsgona, "When I ask for a ball, the ball didn't come. That's it."

Tsonga, who made his move to prominence with an Australian Open final in January against Novak Djokovic, but then faded away with a knee injury, re-surfaced with a Bangkok title in September.

He claimed the last spot in the eight-man Masters Cup field with victory at Paris Bercy. But the bright new face is perhaps turning a bit "diva" as his profile rises.

"You are here and you want your towel. You say one time, two times, three times, and then you ask the other guy," said Tsonga.

"The other guy looks around, so you have to say one time, two times, three times, and the towel comes."

Tsonga claimed that he paced an extra kilometre going for his towels. "Sometimes I have to take my towel alone. So for me it's maybe ten metres more.

"But if you count at the end of the match, it's like one kilometre."

Suggestions have been made to hang a towel rack at each end of the court, with players responsible for just getting it themselves.
 
Oh, that's nothing serious, IMO. The guy was just frustrated because he was losing, it happens. The media always makes stuff like this sound worse than it really is.
 
Ballinbob said:
weird... this is the thread i got it from : http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=230843

heres the article incase that too doesnt work:
Jo-Wilfried Tsonga blamed clueless ball kids for his opening loss at the Masters Cup in Shanghai, with the petulant French player perhaps finding excuses for his own rookie mistakes on court.

A debutant at the year-end event, the hyper-fit 23-year-old who won the Paris title a week ago said he "lost energy" waiting for hardd-working ball kids to fetch him his towel frequently between points as he went down in Gold group play to Nikolay Davydenko in three sets.

"When I ask for my towel, my towel didn't come," lamented Tsgona, "When I ask for a ball, the ball didn't come. That's it."

Tsonga, who made his move to prominence with an Australian Open final in January against Novak Djokovic, but then faded away with a knee injury, re-surfaced with a Bangkok title in September.

He claimed the last spot in the eight-man Masters Cup field with victory at Paris Bercy. But the bright new face is perhaps turning a bit "diva" as his profile rises.

"You are here and you want your towel. You say one time, two times, three times, and then you ask the other guy," said Tsonga.

"The other guy looks around, so you have to say one time, two times, three times, and the towel comes."

Tsonga claimed that he paced an extra kilometre going for his towels. "Sometimes I have to take my towel alone. So for me it's maybe ten metres more.

"But if you count at the end of the match, it's like one kilometre."

Suggestions have been made to hang a towel rack at each end of the court, with players responsible for just getting it themselves.
Click to expand...

Actually, I wouldn't doubt it. It has been said that the French don't have a great attitude towards ball boys.
 
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